HACKERS REVEAL!! Climate change scientists have been manipulating and fixing data

Big P

Well-Known Member
ok say what you want about the terminology... but freezing in florida? temperature in the "teens" in central texas? is that or is that NOT climate change?

clearly something is happening to our climate.. are we denying that?

:peace:
Shack

no sir i do not deny it sir

its f'in cold out side:bigjoint:



I like the cold weather tho. keeps everybody indoors so you have free rein
 

CrackerJax

New Member
No one denies that ... ever.

We just want better science. We want to move in the correct direction ... IF THERE IS ONE.

But what I've seen so far is science hijacked by TROLLS like GORE and used to wage economic redistribution of wealth.

What was/is proposed WON'T WORK, and will be monstrously EXPENSIVE.

There should be no assumption that because the weather is changing, man has done something wrong!!
 

doc111

Well-Known Member
ok say what you want about the terminology... but freezing in florida? temperature in the "teens" in central texas? is that or is that NOT climate change?

clearly something is happening to our climate.. are we denying that?

:peace:
Shack
You're missing the point I think. A brief look will show weather anomalies throughout recorded history. Even before that climatologists agree that we have had several ice ages where the globe was basically frozen solid! The point here is are we causing it? This matter has been so politicized and so many are making money off of it that it's hard to know who to trust. You can't look at one odd winter and conclude "Yep, climate's fucked up." That's so short sighted I can't even begin to tell you............:peace:
 

Shackleford.R

Well-Known Member
i don't look at that.. i also look at weather patterns as a whole... the droughts here in central texas that have gone on for 3 years now.. then you look at the increase in hurricane occurrence and intensity in the past couple years.. then you add this RIDICULOUS winter we are experiencing now. oversimplified sure, but it seems extreme climate change is underway. as far as the cause, i'm more skeptical than i was a month ago when i found this thread. i still say man has an impact... the magnitude of the impact is what should be up for debate. whereas i used to think man had 40-70% of blame, my thoughts are more like 10-20% of the blame.

so i agree, policies should reflect man's actual impact. while keeping in mind that reversing our 10-20% effect may not do much in the overall scheme of things.

this is quite the little ramble. pick it apart as you please :lol:

:peace:
Shack
 

CrackerJax

New Member
It is over simplified. It also doesn't reveal an accurate pattern.

that's what is needed. We need to take a step back, and let a real scientific community come up with a consensus, and not have the research results tethered to budget dollars as carrots. Then perhaps we can al move in the right direction.

So far, science has not been able to predict the weather patterns at all. Clues are emerging (sun, ocean currents) which may lead to a "reasonable and credible" explanation.
 

Big P

Well-Known Member
PAPER: World Misled over Himalayan Glacier Meltdown...

Computer accused of 'warm bias' by BBC weatherman...

January 17, 2010


World misled over Himalayan glacier meltdown






Jonathan Leake and Chris Hastings


Recommend? (214)

A WARNING that climate change will melt most of the Himalayan glaciers by 2035 is likely to be retracted after a series of scientific blunders by the United Nations body that issued it.

Two years ago the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) issued a benchmark report that was claimed to incorporate the latest and most detailed research into the impact of global warming. A central claim was the world's glaciers were melting so fast that those in the Himalayas could vanish by 2035.

In the past few days the scientists behind the warning have admitted that it was based on a news story in the New Scientist, a popular science journal, published eight years before the IPCC's 2007 report.
It has also emerged that the New Scientist report was itself based on a short telephone interview with Syed Hasnain, a little-known Indian scientist then based at Jawaharlal Nehru University in Delhi.


Hasnain has since admitted that the claim was "speculation" and was not supported by any formal research. If confirmed it would be one of the most serious failures yet seen in climate research. The IPCC was set up precisely to ensure that world leaders had the best possible scientific advice on climate change.

Professor Murari Lal, who oversaw the chapter on glaciers in the IPCC report, said he would recommend that the claim about glaciers be dropped: "If Hasnain says officially that he never asserted this, or that it is a wrong presumption, than I will recommend that the assertion about Himalayan glaciers be removed from future IPCC assessments."

The IPCC's reliance on Hasnain's 1999 interview has been highlighted by Fred Pearce, the journalist who carried out the original interview for the New Scientist. Pearce said he rang Hasnain in India in 1999 after spotting his claims in an Indian magazine. Pearce said: "Hasnain told me then that he was bringing a report containing those numbers to Britain. The report had not been peer reviewed or formally published in a scientific journal and it had no formal status so I reported his work on that basis.

"Since then I have obtained a copy and it does not say what Hasnain said. In other words it does not mention 2035 as a date by which any Himalayan glaciers will melt. However, he did make clear that his comments related only to part of the Himalayan glaciers. not the whole massif."

The New Scientist report was apparently forgotten until 2005 when WWF cited it in a report called An Overview of Glaciers, Glacier Retreat, and Subsequent Impacts in Nepal, India and China. The report credited Hasnain's 1999 interview with the New Scientist. But it was a campaigning report rather than an academic paper so it was not subjected to any formal scientific review. Despite this it rapidly became a key source for the IPCC when Lal and his colleagues came to write the section on the Himalayas.

When finally published, the IPCC report did give its source as the WWF study but went further, suggesting the likelihood of the glaciers melting was "very high". The IPCC defines this as having a probability of greater than 90%.

The report read: "Glaciers in the Himalaya are receding faster than in any other part of the world and, if the present rate continues, the likelihood of them disappearing by the year 2035 and perhaps sooner is very high if the Earth keeps warming at the current rate."

However, glaciologists find such figures inherently ludicrous, pointing out that most Himalayan glaciers are hundreds of feet thick and could not melt fast enough to vanish by 2035 unless there was a huge global temperature rise. The maximum rate of decline in thickness seen in glaciers at the moment is 2-3 feet a year and most are far lower.

Professor Julian Dowdeswell, director of the Scott Polar Research Institute at Cambridge University, said: "Even a small glacier such as the Dokriani glacier is up to 120 metres [394ft] thick. A big one would be several hundred metres thick and tens of kilometres long. The average is 300 metres thick so to melt one even at 5 metres a year would take 60 years. That is a lot faster than anything we are seeing now so the idea of losing it all by 2035 is unrealistically high.”

Some scientists have questioned how the IPCC could have allowed such a mistake into print. Perhaps the most likely reason was lack of expertise. Lal himself admits he knows little about glaciers. "I am not an expert on glaciers.and I have not visited the region so I have to rely on credible published research. The comments in the WWF report were made by a respected Indian scientist and it was reasonable to assume he knew what he was talking about," he said.

Rajendra Pachauri, the IPCC chairman, has previously dismissed criticism of the Himalayas claim as "voodoo science".

Last week the IPCC refused to comment so it has yet to explain how someone who admits to little expertise on glaciers was overseeing such a report. Perhaps its one consolation is that the blunder was spotted by climate scientists who quickly made it public.


The lead role in that process was played by Graham Cogley, a geographer from Trent University in Ontario, Canada, who had long been unhappy with the IPCC's finding.

He traced the IPCC claim back to the New Scientist and then contacted Pearce. Pearce then re-interviewed Hasnain, who confirmed that his 1999 comments had been "speculative", and published the update in the New Scientist.

Cogley said: "The reality, that the glaciers are wasting away, is bad enough. But they are not wasting away at the rate suggested by this speculative remark and the IPCC report. The problem is that nobody who studied this material bothered chasing the trail back to the original point when the claim first arose. It is ultimately a trail that leads back to a magazine article and that is not the sort of thing you want to end up in an IPCC report.”

Pearce said the IPCC's reliance on the WWF was "immensely lazy" and the organisation need to explain itself or back up its prediction with another scientific source. Hasnain could not be reached for comment.
The revelation is the latest crack to appear in the scientific concensus over climate change. It follows the so-called climate-gate scandal, where British scientists apparently tried to prevent other researchers from accessing key date. Last week another row broke out when the Met Office criticised suggestions that sea levels were likely to rise 1.9m by 2100, suggesting much lower increases were likely.
 

CrackerJax

New Member
So let's see ... a report taken as gospel which was lifted from a report published 8 years previously, which was based upon a phone call interview with one scientist who was speculating with absolutely no research to back up his speculation.

Now that's what I call science!! :lol:
 

CrackerJax

New Member
A U.S. ClimateGate?

Posted 01/22/2010 07:33 PM ET

Hoaxes: Climate researchers and the Weather Channel's founder accuse NASA of the same data manipulation as Britain's Climate Research Unit. Were weather stations cherry-picked to hide the temperature drop?
We recently commented on how our space agency for two years refused Freedom of Information requests on why it has had to repeatedly correct its climate figures.
In a report on global warming on KUSI television by Weather Channel founder and iconic TV weatherman John Coleman, that reticence has been traced to the deliberate manipulation and distortion of climate data by NASA.
As Coleman noted in a KUSI press release, NASA's two primary climate centers, the National Climatic Data Center (NCDC) in Asheville, N.C., and the Goddard Institute for Space Studies at Columbia University in New York City, are accused of "creating a strong bias toward warmer temperatures through a system that dramatically trimmed the number and cherry-picked the locations of weather observation stations they use to produce the data set on which temperature record reports are based."
Joseph D'Aleo, of Icecap.us, said the analysis found NASA "systematically eliminated 75% of the world's stations with a clear bias toward removing higher-latitude, high-altitude and rural locations." The number of actual weather stations used to calculate average global temperatures was reduced from about 6,000 in the 1970s to about 1,500 today. The number of reporting stations in Canada dropped from 600 to 35.
E. Michael Smith, a computer programming expert who worked with D'Aleo, said he found "patterns in the input data from NCDC that looked liked dramatic and selective deletions of thermometers from cold locations." The more he looked, the more he found "patterns of deletion that could not be accidental."
Stations in places such as the Andes and Bolivia have virtually vanished, meaning, according to D'Aleo, temperatures from these areas are now "determined by interpolation from stations hundreds of miles away on the coast or in the Amazon." He says it's as if Minneapolis stopped reporting and its average temperature was extrapolated from readings in St. Louis and Kansas City.
Smith argues that the decrease in stations used and the selectivity of locations make NASA's data and conclusions suspect. D'Aleo goes further, saying such cherry-picking and data manipulation are a "scientific travesty" committed by activist scientists to advance the global warming agenda.
To us, it looks like just another example of ideologically driven climate deceit following the Climate Research Unit scandal and the fraudulent claim by the U.N.'s Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change that Himalayan glaciers would soon vanish.
 

Woodstock.Hippie

New Member
There really is no correlation between human activity and climate change.
Gaia loves what she's gonna do with the extra energy that will soon erupt from gas hydrates.
more methane than oil she can fart.
Believe us not?
Hold your nose.

HS was responsible for one of the greatest dyings.

[youtube]DKjlhSbiTA8&NR[/youtube]

:peace:
 

Big P

Well-Known Member
India to 'pull out' of UN 'global warming' panel because it 'cannot rely' on UN...


India forms new climate change body

The Indian government has established its own body to monitor the effects of global warming because it “cannot rely” on the United Nations’ Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, the group headed by its own Nobel prize-winning scientist Dr R.K Pachauri.



By Dean Nelson in New Delhi
Published: 3:47PM GMT 04 Feb 2010


The move is a significant snub to both the IPCC and Dr Pachauri as he battles to defend his reputation following the revelation that his most recent climate change report included false claims that most of the Himalayan glaciers would melt away by 2035. Scientists believe it could take more than 300 years for the glaciers to disappear.
The body and its chairman have faced growing criticism ever since as questions have been raised on the credibility of their work and the rigour with which climate change claims are assessed.

Related Articles

In India the false claims have heightened tensions between Dr Pachauri and the government, which had earlier questioned his glacial melting claims. In Autumn, its environment minister Mr Jairam Ramesh said while glacial melting in the Himalayas was a real concern, there was evidence that some were actually advancing despite global warming.
Dr Pachauri had dismissed challenges like these as based on “voodoo science”, but last night Mr Ramesh effectively marginalized the IPC chairman even further.

He announced the Indian government will established a separate National Institute of Himalayan Glaciology to monitor the effects of climate change on the world’s ‘third ice cap’, and an ‘Indian IPCC’ to use ‘climate science’ to assess the impact of global warming throughout the country.

“There is a fine line between climate science and climate evangelism. I am for climate science. I think people misused [the] IPCC report, [the] IPCC doesn’t do the original research which is one of the weaknesses… they just take published literature and then they derive assessments, so we had goof-ups on Amazon forest, glaciers, snow peaks.

“I respect the IPCC but India is a very large country and cannot depend only on [the] IPCC and so we have launched the Indian Network on Comprehensive Climate Change Assessment (INCCA),” he said.
It will bring together 125 research institutions throughout India, work with international bodies and operate as a “sort of Indian IPCC,” he added.
The body, which he said will not rival the UN’s panel, will publish its own climate assessment in November this year, with reports on the Himalayas, India’s long coastline, the Western Ghat highlands and the north-eastern region close to the borders with Bangladesh, Burma, China and Nepal. “Through these we will demonstrate our commitment to climate science,” he said.

The UN panel’s claims of glcial meltdown by 2035 “was clearly out of place and didn’t have any scientific basis,” he said, while stressing the government remained concerned about the health of the Himalayan ice flows. “Most glaciers are melting, they are retreating, some glaciers, like the Siachen glacier, are advancing. But overall one can say

incontrovertibly that the debris on our glaciers is very high the snow balance is very low. We have to be very cautious because of the water security particularly in north India which depends on the health of the Himalayan glaciers,” he added.

The new National Institute of Himalayan Glaciology will be based in Dehradun, in Uttarakhand, and will monitor glacial changes and compare results with those from glciers in Pakistan, Nepal and Bhutan.
 

Justcallmedude

Well-Known Member
I love how the thread says Climate change is a hoax and then people like jeffchr start throwing facts at you, that after all are falsified facts. Dude, hackers are freedom fighter's not nut bags, not dickhead bureaucrats trying to con you into "dronedom" with their "global warming" and Jihad mula's that hate freedom. Man i have never met one nigger that didn't like freedom.:bigjoint: Keep it stokee~~~ Dude
 

CrackerJax

New Member
I luv it!!! There's always that one person on the way down in a plane crash that insists everything is fine, nothing is wrong. Fascinating..... a psychological curiosity.
 

Big P

Well-Known Member
i would say if i was the only living thing on earth and I took a truck worth of coal and burned it


obviously it would affect the nature of the climate in some way no matter how finite it may be I have made some sort of effect


but it could be akin to the microbes on your forhead eating your dead skin which are harmless to your overall body,


or rather, is it a massive flesh eating virus that is destroying your legs as they are trying to say?



im guessing the answer maybe in the middle,


sure maybe we do effect the climate some what, but if we effcet the climate say at 0.5% and natural factors can effect it up to 100%


why would we crash our economies and throw all our money into fixing the 0.5% that we effect when 99.5% is our of our control?

or maybe we could try to control it if we started concentrating on the natural 99.5% of the problem rather than our own tiny contribution.


The UN lied and Global Warming Died



Hey I guess bush was right about Global warming being BS, after all his initials are GWB, Global Warming is Bullshit:hump:








:hug:
 
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