Gage Green Group Info Thread

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Bob Zmuda said:
Man that site is intimidating. No wonder I like my bottles. LOL.
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It's more work IMO. I won't sugar coat it. I've got it down pretty good now, but to be honest there's a pretty big learning curve. The buds that you're producing now look fantatstic. They won't be any better with organics. The plant takes up nutrients in the exact same elemental form. If anything you could add a couple aspects of organics to your soil (like pie does) and reap the benefits without going full blown organic.
 
st0wandgrow said:
It's more work IMO. I won't sugar coat it. I've got it down pretty good now, but to be honest there's a pretty big learning curve. The buds that you're producing now look fantatstic. They won't be any better with organics. The plant takes up nutrients in the exact same elemental form. If anything you could add a couple aspects of organics to your soil (like pie does) and reap the benefits without going full blown organic.
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Boom.....that's the truth,that's the experience I had..
I just started to add things to the soil,one by one,which led to less use of the bottles.

I think that is the best way to go about it.
The main thing I keep around is extreme tea compost brew(you can make your own)
Coots nutrient mix & mineral mix
EWC
Gro-kashi
Neptunes harvest (bottles)
& testing out this (bottle) kelp me kelp you(by fox farm)
I still use the dry kelp,just testing things out.

And for me,my best medium mix so far has been just FF ocean forest & light warrior
Bag per bag(costly)to a point
 
genuity said:
Boom.....that's the truth,that's the experience I had..
I just started to add things to the soil,one by one,which led to less use of the bottles.

I think that is the best way to go about it.
The main thing I keep around is extreme tea compost brew(you can make your own)
Coots nutrient mix & mineral mix
EWC
Gro-kashi
Neptunes harvest (bottles)
& testing out this (bottle) kelp me kelp you(by fox farm)
I still use the dry kelp,just testing things out.

And for me,my best medium mix so far has been just FF ocean forest & light warrior
Bag per bag(costly)to a point
Click to expand...

Yep. I had good luck using FFOF as my base too. Just tweaking it a bit.

I really think the biggest benefit of organics is the pest resistance the plants seem to develop. I don't see any reason why you couldn't incorporate a few things like neem seed meal and castings in to your soil and still use whatever nutrients you use.
 
st0wandgrow said:
Yep. I had good luck using FFOF as my base too. Just tweaking it a bit.

I really think the biggest benefit of organics is the pest resistance the plants seem to develop. I don't see any reason why you couldn't incorporate a few things like neem seed meal and castings in to your soil and still use whatever nutrients you use.
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I take a bin and fill it 3/4 of the way with promix hp. Then I add 1-2 inches of ewc on top. Mix it and just use my nutes. Spray once a week with Green cure.
 
st0wandgrow said:
Yep. I had good luck using FFOF as my base too. Just tweaking it a bit.

I really think the biggest benefit of organics is the pest resistance the plants seem to develop. I don't see any reason why you couldn't incorporate a few things like neem seed meal and castings in to your soil and still use whatever nutrients you use.
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That's one thing I have not added yet,or that insect frass..

Adding neem & karanja to my cart now
 
genuity said:
That's one thing I have not added yet,or that insect frass..

Adding neem & karanja to my cart now
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i could send you some neem on monday i got a 40 lbs bag and i am all top dressed for the season
its the ahimsa neem cake . did you mean oil?? lol

i used a bag of the build a soil mix (a freebie for coming in) its great but not really that much better than a good bagged soil you can get local. the key is the rice hulls.
coots mix alone 1/3 1/3 1/3 is working real good in the 200+ gallon pots (the one with 1/2 drainage is growing faster but losing inside leaves so it NEEDS the extra compost...
that aloe 200x really makes my plants shine:)
 
st0wandgrow said:
It's more work IMO. I won't sugar coat it. I've got it down pretty good now, but to be honest there's a pretty big learning curve. The buds that you're producing now look fantatstic. They won't be any better with organics. The plant takes up nutrients in the exact same elemental form. If anything you could add a couple aspects of organics to your soil (like pie does) and reap the benefits without going full blown organic.
Click to expand...

That's my thing. I'm so comfortable with what I do and I simply cannot afford to have even one tent suffer in yield or quality even for a harvest or 2. What I think I'll do is experiment with organics, compost teas etc. on my outdoor veggies. If my tomato harvest suffers I can deal. I hate tomatoes anyway. Come to think of it I don't know why I even grow them :)

Here's what I do now: Pro mix w/ myco, dyna-gro foliage pro, protekt and mag pro. In veg they get endo and ectomycorrhizal fungi and through the first half of flower they get tons of different baccillus and glomus strains of beneficial bacteria.

Is there any way for me to use the bokashi? or does it have to be ROLS?
 
Bob Zmuda said:
That's my thing. I'm so comfortable with what I do and I simply cannot afford to have even one tent suffer in yield or quality even for a harvest or 2. What I think I'll do is experiment with organics, compost teas etc. on my outdoor veggies. If my tomato harvest suffers I can deal. I hate tomatoes anyway. Come to think of it I don't know why I even grow them :)

Here's what I do now: Pro mix w/ myco, dyna-gro foliage pro, protekt and mag pro. In veg they get endo and ectomycorrhizal fungi and through the first half of flower they get tons of different baccillus and glomus strains of beneficial bacteria.

Is there any way for me to use the bokashi? or does it have to be ROLS?
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From what I understand fungi are real sensitive to synthetic nutrients, especially ones high in Phosphorous.

Here's a blurb...

"High rates of fertilizers, especially phosphorus, inhibit the formation of mycorrhizae; organic forms of fertilizers seems to have less inhibitory effect on mycorrhizae than inorganic, soluble fertilizers."

http://www.agbio-inc.com/mycorrhizae-faq.html

What I would do is add a few things to the soil that you already use. Worm castings, kelp meal, neem seed meal, and crab shell meal. Mix that up in your soil, wet it down with a compost tea, and let it sit for a few weeks. Plant your clones in there, and then use water only through veg. Once you hit flower, you can start introducing your inorganic nutrients as needed.

You will have a thriving colony of beneficial microbes, and your miccorhyzal network will be established. The plant will benefit from the organic inputs (pest resistance) and the symbiotic relationship with the microbes. Best of both worlds kinda thing without diving head first in to it.
 
st0wandgrow said:
From what I understand fungi are real sensitive to synthetic nutrients, especially ones high in Phosphorous.

Here's a blurb...

"High rates of fertilizers, especially phosphorus, inhibit the formation of mycorrhizae; organic forms of fertilizers seems to have less inhibitory effect on mycorrhizae than inorganic, soluble fertilizers."

http://www.agbio-inc.com/mycorrhizae-faq.html

What I would do is add a few things to the soil that you already use. Worm castings, kelp meal, neem seed meal, and crab shell meal. Mix that up in your soil, wet it down with a compost tea, and let it sit for a few weeks. Plant your clones in there, and then use water only through veg. Once you hit flower, you can start introducing your inorganic nutrients as needed.

You will have a thriving colony of beneficial microbes, and your miccorhyzal network will be established. The plant will benefit from the organic inputs (pest resistance) and the symbiotic relationship with the microbes. Best of both worlds kinda thing without diving head first in to it.
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ohh good post . thats a good reminder that "P" is VERY tied to root growth.... but innoculation between fertigations has been proven to help ... farmers are always screwing with microbes .
the neem meal i guess DESTROYS the microbe life to a point . but then supports fungal growth ... cap over at the farm has a thread about it ... says dont use his stuff till a month after neem seed meal application... i only add that once or 2x per season ....
 
Joedank said:
ohh good post . thats a good reminder that "P" is VERY tied to root growth.... but innoculation between fertigations has been proven to help ... farmers are always screwing with microbes .
the neem meal i guess DESTROYS the microbe life to a point . but then supports fungal growth ... cap over at the farm has a thread about it ... says dont use his stuff till a month after neem seed meal application... i only add that once or 2x per season ....
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Interesting about the neem seed meal. Kinda makes sense if you think about it I guess. I'm not very heavy handed with it though. I burned a couple plants using it as a top dress once and learned a lesson about it's strength. 1/2 cup per cubic foot is all I use.
 
Bob Zmuda said:
Interesting stuff. Yeah I thought the microbes were sensitive to synthetics. When I innoculate it's only with pure water, so I kinda use it in between nutes if that makes sense. I would stop using them but the roots I get using them are inarguable. So I'm hoping some of them are staying alive at least!
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the promix has a pretty much unkillable strain mix with it being "bound" to the peat. the glomus ird. are not to easy to kill as the osmotic pressure required would kill a plant .... will insert citaion when i dig it up.
from wiki:
In numerous scientific studies G. intraradices has been shown to increase phosphorus uptake in multiple plants as well as improve soil aggregation due to hyphae.[13]

Because of these qualities, G. intraradices is commonly found in mycorrhizal based fertilizers.

In a recent study, G. intraradices was found to be the only arbuscular mycorrhizal fungi that was able to control nutrient uptake amounts by individual hyphae depending on differing phosphorus levels in the surrounding soil.[9]


so it just waits till low phos and helps take up more .... but it also helps with "salinity stress " in plants i.e. over fertigation...
"Arbuscular mycorrhizal fungi (AMF) form an integral component of the soil biota and their colonization of host plants improves plant tolerance to salinity stress by preventing ionic toxicity and hyperosmotic stress (Evelin et al. 2009; Porcel et al. 2012). In doing so, AMF improve nutrient acquisition, ionic balance, water uptake, and osmoregulation and prevent ultrastructural damage in plants under saline stress (Garg and Manchanda 2009; Hajiboland et al. 2010; Abdel Latef and Chaoxing 2011; Evelin et al. 2012, 2013). A few studies have demonstrated that AMF inoculation can prevent/limit saltinduced oxidative stress in host plants (ZhongQun et al. 2007; Garg and Manchanda 2009; Hajiboland et al. 2010; Wu et al. 2010; Manchanda and Garg 2011; Estrada et al. 201
 
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Bob Zmuda said:
And once again, thank you all for the very valuable info. As I understand it the EWC is mainly a nitrogen source? Is it seabird guano that has the high P,K? Or anything else that boosts these?
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i use a fish bone meal 5-20-0 . and comfrey , , calendula , nettle, alfalfa . to stimulate diffrent plant growth cycles (listed backwards ...lol) a product called sul po mag is also in my mix 0-0-50... mined minerals and local stuff like pumice help as well as gypsum for sulfur
 
Bob Zmuda said:
And once again, thank you all for the very valuable info. As I understand it the EWC is mainly a nitrogen source? Is it seabird guano that has the high P,K? Or anything else that boosts these?
Click to expand...

EWC will bring some nutrients to your soil, but it's mainly used because it's loaded with beneficial microbes. Those microbes are needed to break down the organic inputs that you add like kelp meal, neem seed meal, etc. The little critters process the organic goodies and make them available to the plant.
 
Joedank said:
i could send you some neem on monday i got a 40 lbs bag and i am all top dressed for the season
its the ahimsa neem cake . did you mean oil?? lol

i used a bag of the build a soil mix (a freebie for coming in) its great but not really that much better than a good bagged soil you can get local. the key is the rice hulls.
coots mix alone 1/3 1/3 1/3 is working real good in the 200+ gallon pots (the one with 1/2 drainage is growing faster but losing inside leaves so it NEEDS the extra compost...
that aloe 200x really makes my plants shine:)
Click to expand...

Neem cake is some good shit and it's in my mix, along with alfalfa, compost, EWC and a lil bokashi. Then water with aloe and some freeze dried coconut powder. :)
 
There are spring tails in my local EWC. When I am nearing the second half of flower I usually see them popping on the surface of the water. That's the larva. At first I freaked out. lol

There are a few species of Collembola that feed on live plant material, but most are beneficial to plants. Some feed primarily around the roots of plants and keep harmful bacteria and fungi from building to toxic levels that would kill the plant. These springtails also help to transport good fungi and bacteria to the area around the plant. Springtails contribute nutrients to soil because they speed up the process of decay and deposit nutrient rich feces back into the earth.
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image-jpg.3465503

results . since none of yall come to my threa but Gen
 
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