Friends are trying to get me to consider dropping

gogrow said:

what's the whole obsession with "if its natural its okay"??? why does this only ever apply to recreational drugs?? do you people that think man-made drugs are bad apply this same mentality when seeking medical treatment?

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Very very true, gogrow. I'm sure most people who wave the 'natural' flag see their MD, rather than an ND, as their philosophy suggests.

You've got me thinking now, gogrow.. Even the more natural psilocybin, mescaline and hell, even cannabis can unearth psychological problems in susceptible individuals. In some studies cannabis use was actually linked to triggering schizophrenia and psychosis in teens. And while not the same as LSD obviously, shrooms and mescaline can equally cause mental problems in people who abuse them or are prone to imbalances. Whether a substance is god-given or man-made, it has no bearing on its safety. There's always risk when ingesting any psychoactive.

LSD is 100% AwesomeNessTastic.. i've read if you have a current mental illness, or a hereditary mental illness in your family your not diagnosed with, it can bring it out as kinda a permanent state..

-but a bad tab in high school is a bit far out there. im not saying its not true, but how do you know he didnt take acid and get hit by a car while trippin, or dive into an empty pool and somehow get brain damage..

i personaly know someone who got in an 80mph head on collision coming down Big Bear Mnt, had to be re-taught how to tie his shoes at 26 years old.. he seems "out there" now after the accident

i could easily pin LSD on him, and people would believe it. how do you know you weren't getting subconsciously molded to be afraid of LSD..?

me and Lucy get along great

gogrow said:

what's the whole obsession with "if its natural its okay"??? why does this only ever apply to recreational drugs?? do you people that think man-made drugs are bad apply this same mentality when seeking medical treatment?

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gogrow said:

taken from elsewhere....

LSD is a very potent drug, but is physically quite safe and non-toxic. The dangers are purely psychological in nature. The experience while on acid may release latent psychosis or provoke depression, leading to irrational behavior. The so-called LSD psychosis has been linked to forms of schizophrenia, and thus to some physiological disorders; therefore, it appears to be dependent on the user, and not on the drug. On the contrary, the drug offers a great potential for spiritual contact, self-exploration, and conscious expansion of the mind. LSD dissolves boundaries which form the construct of our reality. These boundaries are erected as a result of socially inherent and egocentric views of the universe around us. For one to be able to see beyond the social man-made distinctions imposed upon us in our everyday physical existence, and to question the nature of one’s own mind, is, as far as I’m concerned, the greatest vision imaginable to human comprehension.


here's the link to the full text for you guys that have no clue about this drug...
http://www.gaianxaos.com/lsd.htm

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Thannnnnk you.





And fuzzbutter, I actually thought you were being sarcastic in your posts at first.... Check your facts, and give us some sources to your arguments.

Fuzzbutter said:

I'm just saying that if it's not natural, it's something you shouldn't ingest.

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Ever take an aspirin? anti biotic? vaccinations?

Most medicine being developed today is synthetic.

As far as LSD goes its one of the most studied SAFEST psychedelic substances.

i havent done L S crazy in a long time but i know its not like it used to be in the 70s

preach that shit Sr Verde. lsd is one of the most studied and widely used psychedlics in history. and just cause its not natural doesnt mean its not any good. think about, its like fake tits man. they might feel a little different but they serve the same purpose and can still always get the job done. haha

k2daalvin said:

LSD is 100% AwesomeNessTastic.. i've read if you have a current mental illness, or a hereditary mental illness in your family your not diagnosed with, it can bring it out as kinda a permanent state..

-but a bad tab in high school is a bit far out there. im not saying its not true, but how do you know he didnt take acid and get hit by a car while trippin, or dive into an empty pool and somehow get brain damage..

i personaly know someone who got in an 80mph head on collision coming down Big Bear Mnt, had to be re-taught how to tie his shoes at 26 years old.. he seems "out there" now after the accident

i could easily pin LSD on him, and people would believe it. how do you know you weren't getting subconsciously molded to be afraid of LSD..?

me and Lucy get along great

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From what i was told, it wasnt the pure tab and that has been my point the whole time. Its not like weed where we can just assume by the visual quality where it came from unless you know other wise. If you get some Mexican brick weed its obvious, but if you dont get a quality tab how would you even know cause it looks like any other tab with the exception of the picture or color on the front but they are all just tabs of paper. The guy in my neighborhood took whatever dose he did which im assuming inst much cause he was in high school. Whatever happened it permanently effected his conscious state. Im sure if their son got the brain damage from something else they wouldn't mention that he took acid.

mescalinebandit420 said:

preach that shit Sr Verde. lsd is one of the most studied and widely used psychedlics in history. and just cause its not natural doesnt mean its not any good. think about, its like fake tits man. they might feel a little different but they serve the same purpose and can still always get the job done. haha

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Can i just make a observation here. In those studies the drug is severely regulated and made in a lab. Buying it off of your local guy does not guarantee that quality, just like any other drugs weed cocaine its about money (Why do you think were seeing the true colors of growers who belong to the anti prop 19 crowd) . To Doctors it is not about the money its about the science. Now im not saying the acid off the street came from a meth lab lol, but im saying you have to be careful because people like to take shortcuts.

Well, then if you watched the news over the last year you would have noticed the man in charge of research into drugs in the UK for the government, as well as a few other doctors quit.
They did this because government were making laws that contradict the medical evidence on the ground, LSD is less harmfull than alcohol for example is stated in the report.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/world_at_one/programme_highlights/1158385.stm

Just a lil quick science....

LSD psychosis or LSD-induced schizophrenia? A multimethod inquiry.

Vardy MM, Kay SR.
Abstract

We studied whether patients hospitalized for LSD psychosis are clinically separable from acute schizophrenics. The family histories, manifest symptoms, premorbid adjustment, and profiles on an extensive test battery were analyzed for 52 LSD psychotics and 29 matched first-break schizophrenics. The LSD patients did not differ from schizophrenics in incidence of psychosis or suicide among the parents. However, the rate of parental alcoholism for LSD psychotics far exceeded that for schizophrenics and the general population. The two groups were distinguished on some clinical features but were equivalent in premorbid adjustment, on most cognitive measures when initially hospitalized or reassessed three to five years later, and in number of subsequent rehospitalizations. Thus, in most respects the LSD psychotics were fundamentally similar to schizophrenics in geneaology, phenomenology, and course of illness. The findings supported a model of LSD psychosis as a drug-induced schizophreniform reaction in persons vulnerable to both substance abuse and psychosis.

one more for fun....

In a survey of five-thousand individuals who had used LSD a total of twenty-five-thousand times, Cohen (1960) found 1.8 psychotic episodes per thousand ingestions, 1.2 attempted suicides, and 0.4 completed suicides -- figures consistent with the those of the general population.

Where was the Acid being supplied from in the studies though.

LSD is trash. if you wanna really have a nice clean trip do some mescaline, my second choice would be shrooms, but acid is some dirty nasty shit.

I've always wanted to try L. I've never been able to find it in my little circle, but then again I don't really look for it. I would have to meet an entirely new connect and that's kind tricky. The one thing about LSD that scares me is that there's a small amount of arsenic or rat poison (one of those heavy metal poisons. I'm not even sure that's entirely true). Buuuuut..... if I ran into it, I wouldn't have to think about it that's for sure. How much does that stuff cost generally anyways?

the first time I did mushrooms, I took a eighth (or maybe a quarter, $30 bucks) myself and had an awesome trip. I was alone and my mind tends to run also, so literally, I had to remind myself that nothing was different except that I'm high. None of this is real (like triggers that can set off a bad trip). Idk, idk how much control over your emotions you have. You have to know, remember, and constantly remind yourself that you are safe. Don't let your mind take over what you know is real.

Honestly, I'd probably do LSD by myself for the first time too. I wouldn't trust my friends as much as myself and plus if they have a bad trip they can draw you in.

dbkick said:

LSD is trash. if you wanna really have a nice clean trip do some mescaline, my second choice would be shrooms, but acid is some dirty nasty shit.

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I wouldn't put it as harshly, but yes, I aggree mescaline is what LSD wanted to be when it grew up.

ThatGuy113 said:

Where was the Acid being supplied from in the studies though.

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Most likely it came from Hoffman's lab, Sandoz Laboratories, since it still held the patent on delysid until 1963.

CaNNaBiZ CaNucK said:

Most likely it came from Hoffman's lab, Sandoz Laboratories, since it still held the patent on delysid until 1963.

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Well thats a big difference in control and quality of the substance. For the average person attempting to obtain some acid it is 1. Hard to do unless you already know someone 2. Still cant find any cause the guy never has it 3. When he does have it you have literally no idea where its coming from or how much quality was a factor when it was made.

ThatGuy113 said:

Where was the Acid being supplied from in the studies though.

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from the way I read it, it seems that the acid was not supplied at all, hence the "who had used..." statement. Should the acid have been supplied, there would be at least a brief overview of the methods/doses and controls.... so this was random "street acid" that the people had obtained on their own with no knowledge of their future involvement in a study, not and experiment

gogrow said:

from the way I read it, it seems that the acid was not supplied at all, hence the "who had used..." statement. Should the acid have been supplied, there would be at least a brief overview of the methods/doses and controls.... so this was random "street acid" that the people had obtained on their own with no knowledge of their future involvement in a study, not and experiment

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While it's true that it was probably LSD acquired on the street, it was still most likely Sandoz acid that was being circulated. The first recorded 'underground lab' was not assembled until Bernard Roseman did so in 1962.

Edit: But this is no proof however of any tampering that may have occurred when delysid ended up in the hands of the blackmarket. Just as it occurs today, it doesn't matter how pure the product is when it leaves any lab, it comes down to the distributor's means of doing so.

You need yo know what the f your doing before you do it. if can you handle it? and are you old enongh to wipe your on ass????????????????????????Back way back when I had a guy who told his parents and freaked the fuck out bad scane. the dude could not handle it . we wre 17 at the time. I don`t mean to be mean.Ijust don`t think the youth of today ever really think before thay act. so ask your parents????????what thay think................................

Considering the study is from 1960 as the one quote you used noted. The production of acid was a lot more concentrated due to demand and ideology of society at the time. I mean you could probably walk around the Haight Ashbury when the counter culture was in control of that section of San Fransisco and find acid easily. The quality was prob a lot higher even though it was mass produced. They werent motivated 100% by money but more the feeling of making it for the community to enjoy. I mean look at the acid tests of the time most drugs were free or cheap and always readily available even if you didnt "know a guy". Now that those days are over and the War On Drugs has taken into effect LSD is a lot harder to get your hands on. So production has gone even more underground, no one ever knowing where it originated from. This makes prices higher and greed ensues, there is not more lsd should be for everyone whenever they want. The feeling today is yea there is still some people with pride who make the tabs and disperse them, but there are a lot of people looking for easy money. Why would a dealer cut cocaine with something else? Because its more money for them by saving that much more product. Like i mentioned earlier you cannot tell a perfectly mixed tab from a tab that was made with little quality. Im not attacking the drug itself. I have said that at least 3 times, In a perfect world where there was absolutely no chance of any repercussion, i would try acid (With the exception of my other dilemma about fighting stereotypes for the sake of weed).