Experienced Electrician! Here to Answer Any and All Growroom Electrical Questions

IAm5toned

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
quickrip said:
so I have a question regarding 220v curcits. If you have an item that will run with 20 amps and your 220v curcit has two 15 amp breakers do you have enough to run the item or do you need two 20 amp breakers to get what is required.+rep in advance for the help.
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what you need is a 2 pole 20 amp breaker. however, simply switching the breaker out wont be enough.
THAT IS WHAT CAUSES ELECTRICAL FIRES.
YOU NEED TO BE SURE THE WIRE SIZE IS CORRECT FOR A 20 AMP LOAD
a 15 amp circuit would normally be fed with #14awg wire.*
a 20 amp circuit would normally be fed with #12 awg wire.
the #12 is bigger, because 20 amps is more power than 15 amps.

*putiing a 20 amp breaker on #14 will cause the wire to overheat and burn.

remember that when sizing electrical loads, always use wattage instead of amperage...

common continuous duty grow operation wattages based on voltage, with breaker and wire sizes. all wire sizes are based on thwn-2/thhn Cu conductors with a max run of 300'
breaker size----volts------ max wattage allowed ----smallest wire size allowed

  • 15 amp breaker @ 120v = 1440w(12 amps actual) max = #14 awg Cu wire, min
  • 20 amp breaker @ 120v = 1920w(16 amps actual) max = #12 awg Cu wire, min
  • 30 amp breaker @ 120v = 2880w(24 amps actual) max = #10 awg Cu wire, min
  • 40 amp breaker @ 120v = 3840w(32 amps actual) max = #8 awg Cu wire, min
  • 60 amp breaker @ 120v = 5760w(48 amps actual) max = #6 awg Cu wire, min
  • 100 amp breaker @ 120v = 9600w(80 amps actual) max = #3 awg Cu wire, min

  • 15 amp breaker @ 240v = 2880w(12 amps actual) max = #14 awg Cu wire, min
  • 20 amp breaker @ 240v = 3840w(16 amps actual) max = #12 awg Cu wire, min
  • 30 amp breaker @ 240v = 5760w(24 amps actual) max = #10 awg Cu wire, min
  • 40 amp breaker @ 240v = 7680w(32 amps actual) max = #8 awg Cu wire, min
  • 60 amp breaker @ 240v = 11520w(48 amps actual) max = #6 awg Cu wire, min
  • 100 amp breaker @ 240v= 19200w(80 amps actual) max = #3 awg Cu wire, min



 
IAm5toned

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
BigBudBalls said:
I've heard its the volts that kill ya, and that its the amps. Well there's 3 main aspects and all have to be right.

Take a car battery. has the potential for about 600+ amps, but I can grab the terminals and nothing.

Then there is a static electricity shock. A nice good one is about 50,000 volts.

Still alive.

Your body's resistance comes into play.

To say its just one aspect is just silly.

(This is not at you, but at this sub thread)
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its the amps.
70 milliamps across the right ventricle will kill anyone, at any voltage. its called electrical fibrillation. this phenomenon is caused by the reversal of potential of the electrical impulses sent to the heart from the brain.
this same lethal concept is used to save lives, when a person is having a heart attack, to 'reboot' the same impulses from the brain to the heart, by using a defibrillator to to apply an opposite potential to the same nerves that would normally kill you.

the only factor resistance has as far as death or injury is directly related to the amount of heat created by the amperage passing through the energized body, (ie, you) the higher the resistance of the path to opposite potential (short circuit) the more heat is generated by the current flow, at a rate directly proportionate to the amperage of the current. i say this because if you become energized, the initial inrush will kill you quicker than a shot to the head, if the current path is travelling through certain areas of the body. although these occurrences are rare, they happen on an all to regular basis.

if voltage played any other factor than the force that creates opposite potential, than people would be dropping dead from static shocks left and right... and no one would be hit by lightning and live to tell about it.

but anyway you put it, getting zapped is just a shitty thing... no one likes it.
 
IAm5toned

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
maxed said:
Hey I have a few electrical questions, mainly does my apt have enough amps to run a CAN filter 125 with 8" vortex fan and my two 1000w hps lights and other random accessories. does this setup seem to work? here's a link to my earlier forum post about what I'm planning on exactly doing with pictures of my breaker box.

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-room-design-setup/335917-new-grow-room-setup-some.html
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i lurked your thread and the answer is no, you do not have enough power available to run that equipment on any single breaker in this panel:


i would suggest running a 30 amp circuit on #10awg from the spare slot in the panel for your grows.
i have included a chart of max watts vs. breaker and wire size:

common continuous duty grow operation wattages based on voltage, with breaker and wire sizes. all wire sizes are based on thwn-2/thhn Cu conductors with a max run of 300'
breaker size----volts------ max wattage allowed ----smallest wire size allowed

  • 15 amp breaker @ 120v = 1440w(12 amps actual) max = #14 awg Cu wire, min
  • 20 amp breaker @ 120v = 1920w(16 amps actual) max = #12 awg Cu wire, min
  • 30 amp breaker @ 120v = 2880w(24 amps actual) max = #10 awg Cu wire, min
  • 40 amp breaker @ 120v = 3840w(32 amps actual) max = #8 awg Cu wire, min
  • 60 amp breaker @ 120v = 5760w(48 amps actual) max = #6 awg Cu wire, min
  • 100 amp breaker @ 120v = 9600w(80 amps actual) max = #3 awg Cu wire, min

  • 15 amp breaker @ 240v = 2880w(12 amps actual) max = #14 awg Cu wire, min
  • 20 amp breaker @ 240v = 3840w(16 amps actual) max = #12 awg Cu wire, min
  • 30 amp breaker @ 240v = 5760w(24 amps actual) max = #10 awg Cu wire, min
  • 40 amp breaker @ 240v = 7680w(32 amps actual) max = #8 awg Cu wire, min
  • 60 amp breaker @ 240v = 11520w(48 amps actual) max = #6 awg Cu wire, min
  • 100 amp breaker @ 240v= 19200w(80 amps actual) max = #3 awg Cu wire, min
 
BigBudBalls

BigBudBalls

Well-Known Member
Yep a defibrillator on a 'working' person can stop the heart instead of start them. All the (mandated) defibs in places now are smart and will sense is the victim needs a jump start or not (most of the time. I bet an grossly obese person will almost always look 'dead')

Still its all items involved and path of least resistance which maybe be along your sweaty skin or straight through your body. Kinda luck of the draw.

If resistance has no real place, how come grabbing the terminals of a big ass car battery I feel nothing? Thats 600+ amps. Of course AC does some real funky things. :)


IAm5toned said:
its the amps.
70 milliamps across the right ventricle will kill anyone, at any voltage. its called electrical fibrillation. this phenomenon is caused by the reversal of potential of the electrical impulses sent to the heart from the brain.
this same lethal concept is used to save lives, when a person is having a heart attack, to 'reboot' the same impulses from the brain to the heart, by using a defibrillator to to apply an opposite potential to the same nerves that would normally kill you.

the only factor resistance has as far as death or injury is directly related to the amount of heat created by the amperage passing through the energized body, (ie, you) the higher the resistance of the path to opposite potential (short circuit) the more heat is generated by the current flow, at a rate directly proportionate to the amperage of the current. i say this because if you become energized, the initial inrush will kill you quicker than a shot to the head, if the current path is travelling through certain areas of the body. although these occurrences are rare, they happen on an all to regular basis.

if voltage played any other factor than the force that creates opposite potential, than people would be dropping dead from static shocks left and right... and no one would be hit by lightning and live to tell about it.

but anyway you put it, getting zapped is just a shitty thing... no one likes it.
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BigBudBalls

BigBudBalls

Well-Known Member
You should see a legend on how to wire it. Move the wire from the old 'house wiring' to the 120 tap and *should* be good.

lono said:
I realize that you have probably answered this ? b4 but i skimmed through and caught nothing. My 1000 watt ballast is only running at about half strength i dont know what happened but ne ways I bought 6 400 watt multi tap shop ballasts that are wired for 277 how do i get them to 120's please and thanks guys
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IAm5toned

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
BigBudBalls said:
Yep a defibrillator on a 'working' person can stop the heart instead of start them. All the (mandated) defibs in places now are smart and will sense is the victim needs a jump start or not (most of the time. I bet an grossly obese person will almost always look 'dead')

Still its all items involved and path of least resistance which maybe be along your sweaty skin or straight through your body. Kinda luck of the draw.

If resistance has no real place, how come grabbing the terminals of a big ass car battery I feel nothing? Thats 600+ amps. Of course AC does some real funky things. :)
Click to expand...
:p

good point
 
$

$piceM£rchant

Active Member
Hi, i just bought a 1000w ballast, i need to wire it to my cooltube, the ballast just comes with a 16 amp eic cable coming out with a plug like this attached http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Schurter-C19-1...item334ab74b51 , the cable coming out of the cooltube is eic but not 16 amp so the cable connectors dont match. would i be fine buying a 16 amp eic cable such as this one http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=STRK:MEWAX:IT
then cutting the wire just before the male part on it and attatching it to the bulb holder in the cooltube?
thanks
 
maxed

maxed

Member
IAm5toned said:
i lurked your thread and the answer is no, you do not have enough power available to run that equipment on any single breaker in this panel:


"i would suggest running a 30 amp circuit on #10awg from the spare slot in the panel for your grows.
i have included a chart of max watts vs. breaker and wire size:"

Thanks for the reply, so since I live in an apartment building I dont think I can really go in and put a new breaker in. What does the "70" main mean, they were just switched from 2 "40" on my last electrical box. So would I have to run an extension cord with surge protector down my hall and in the kitchen plug? would that work and be best? What is possible so I dont burn down my apt?

One other option is, I do have an electrician for the building coming over to do something. He actually just redid a bunch of wiring in the building for a few empty apartments and he has to do something around my apartment, I dont know what. The landlord said she didn't know, its a test before he switches some power over - whatever that means.....so I guess my option would be to ask the electrician to put in a 30 amp ... which may raise an eyebrow or he might tell the landlord what I asked him too do. I could also say that it's cos i use photo studio lights and think it best to put a larger breaker in that room...would that excuse work?

sorry for the long drawn out spiel, but Im trying to give as much info so I can make this grow as optimum as possible.
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whiteflour

whiteflour

Well-Known Member
BigBudBalls said:
Yep a defibrillator on a 'working' person can stop the heart instead of start them. All the (mandated) defibs in places now are smart and will sense is the victim needs a jump start or not (most of the time. I bet an grossly obese person will almost always look 'dead')

Still its all items involved and path of least resistance which maybe be along your sweaty skin or straight through your body. Kinda luck of the draw.

If resistance has no real place, how come grabbing the terminals of a big ass car battery I feel nothing? Thats 600+ amps. Of course AC does some real funky things. :)
Click to expand...
Resistance definitely plays a part. That's another reason for high voltage in electric fences. Cow hide is a bit thicker than human skin and needs higher voltage to overcome. As for defibs it was the opposite. The earliest versions were only about 200v but that proved harder to stabilize and direct the amperage where needed. Both devices have a very fine range of being either ineffictively useless and effectively dangerous.

Household voltages are in a rather dangerous range period, but it is true though 110/220 lead to more deaths than any other voltage, and that higher voltages lead more serious injuries. It's a statistical fact. But one could also reasonably argue that's because we don't have as many idiots messing with high voltage, high current lines.
 
IAm5toned

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
maxed said:
IAm5toned said:
i lurked your thread and the answer is no, you do not have enough power available to run that equipment on any single breaker in this panel:


"i would suggest running a 30 amp circuit on #10awg from the spare slot in the panel for your grows.
i have included a chart of max watts vs. breaker and wire size:"

Thanks for the reply, so since I live in an apartment building I dont think I can really go in and put a new breaker in. What does the "70" main mean, they were just switched from 2 "40" on my last electrical box. So would I have to run an extension cord with surge protector down my hall and in the kitchen plug? would that work and be best? What is possible so I dont burn down my apt?

One other option is, I do have an electrician for the building coming over to do something. He actually just redid a bunch of wiring in the building for a few empty apartments and he has to do something around my apartment, I dont know what. The landlord said she didn't know, its a test before he switches some power over - whatever that means.....so I guess my option would be to ask the electrician to put in a 30 amp ... which may raise an eyebrow or he might tell the landlord what I asked him too do. I could also say that it's cos i use photo studio lights and think it best to put a larger breaker in that room...would that excuse work?

sorry for the long drawn out spiel, but Im trying to give as much info so I can make this grow as optimum as possible.
Click to expand...
sorry man, i was somehow under the impression that you were building this apt at your house, or something like that.
asking the maintenance man to add a plug might be the best route to go down.... and the studio lights are a good idea as an excuse, however be warned, apartments do random maintenance inspections, usually twice a year, or at least they do in my location. having an entire room in a public apt complex may be a risky endeavour!
Click to expand...
 
BigBudBalls

BigBudBalls

Well-Known Member
tunaboat said:
I want to run a relay for my lights. Will this work, im pretty confident I can wire it correctly, I just wanted to make sure.
http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Relays_-z-_Timers/15A_Electro-Mechanical_Cube_Relays/781-1C-120A
Im running ~300w of cfls.
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Yup will work. Though I, personally, would use a 2 pole relay. But thats me.
You may also want to get the socket for it too. Does make wiring it up easier.
(I like AutomationDirect. Good stuff at great prices, mostly)

But my Q is why the relay?
 
T

track

Member
Sorry for this random subject, im looking for an easy DIY link to build a 220v to 110v distribution panel.

I would like to use the 220v (dryer) socket in my bathroom that is currently not being used. All my equipment however is north american 110v. Can I safely build a distribution panel that will support my cabinet (1000w + fans)

If I can purchase everything for under 200$ that would be cool. A diagram to help me wire everything would be great


 
S

Smokej9009

Active Member
track said:
Sorry for this random subject, im looking for an easy DIY link to build a 220v to 110v distribution panel.

I would like to use the 220v (dryer) socket in my bathroom that is currently not being used. All my equipment however is north american 110v. Can I safely build a distribution panel that will support my cabinet (1000w + fans)

If I can purchase everything for under 200$ that would be cool. A diagram to help me wire everything would be great



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Here is my question, what kind of timer is that? I need a good 220 or 240 volt timer to run two 600w HPS in the subpanel I want to build. I am getting parts now........
 
T

track

Member
Smokej9009 said:
Here is my question, what kind of timer is that? I need a good 220 or 240 volt timer to run two 600w HPS in the subpanel I want to build. I am getting parts now........
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these are outdoor mechanical timers often used for swimming pools, they go for about $45 at Home Depot, Lowes, etc..
they have digital ones too!
 
purplehazin

purplehazin

Well-Known Member
Question: Im growing in a closet with no outlets. I had planned on running an extension cord from my room to the closet (high grade orange kind) and have that plug into an 8 outlet 15A surge protector. Can I hook up a 400w digital ballast, a 400CFM fan, some CFL's, some fans, etc safely? I have looked at all the equipment and it runs WELL below 15A, like only 8A or something. Will this work until I can find a better solution? The wife won't let me grow anywhere else in the house (including basement?) so I have to find a way to make this work.

Peace
 
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