experienced advice needed

Quick and to the point. Indoor snow white grow, wanted to do 2 flood tables 8x4, 100 count each, sog, room is 10x10. 2200 watts, fox farm trio, sealed enviorment, co2 supp. but clone count is a concern, atleast starting out from seed its impossible, or is it? My starting line up is ten tiny seedlings. Shameless is my defense lol. Now I'm rethinking as usual, work my way to this by the next harvest, until then, do a soil, (12) 20 gallon pots or (40) 5 gallons??? Nothings set in stone... This much soil seems to be a pain in the ass, watering a concern also. Veg time is of no concern, yeild means much more. I was told that two tables would produce 5+ in these conditions easily. Now, what is the best way for me to go about this goal, working my way to it by which means, or stick to it, usings all extra growth to increase count, or veg these ten large, using them to create one table right before flower, removing several for my queen bee roster..?

I need fresh input, I probably sound insane by this point lol

If your going use 2k ish watts, I'd just use one 4x8 table.

5+ from 2200 watts, not going to happen on your first grow.

- Jiji

So from you post should I assume you have nothing yet and have $10k and a 10x10 room?

If you are going to do big flood tables you need to get cloning down and have a small veg room/closet to go with your 10x10 room. You will want at least 4 decent sized mom's to support taking 200+ cuttings for each grow. If you don't already have that, I would start with building your mom room, something like a 3x3 with a 400-600 MH should be all you need. Get your mom's going.

In the mom box, you need a space on one side with a big cloner or multiple cloners, enough for 110+ plants (a few extra for the rare fails, one table at a time.)

For your tables I would recommend 2x 600w HPS (without CO2, 2x1000w with CO2) per table plus supplemental UVB lighting (I use tanning bulbs powered by a workhorse ballast.) If you get dimable 1000w fixtures you can start without CO2 (which has little chance of helping you on the first grow anyway.)

I got everything I posted above, as well as a ac, heater, inlines, carbon filters, reverse osmosis (which isnt set up), dehumidifier, the list goes on and on. Now, I've done several cfl, aluminum foil lined boxes in my teen years, but this I'm taking much more serious. I have ppm, ec meters, anything I could think of to be honest. Just no patience lol. I have a friend who sold me most of this equipment for $500. I got a steel. The only thing I haven't gotten yet is the table, hydroton and net pots. $300 each from my local hydro store. Now I must say, I didn't think it was going to be so slow, what scares me even more, is how long will it be until I've established good sized mothers??? Two months? Three from seed? Im going to put on the breaks, finish up this closet, which is almost done and pick my three or four besties, but will they have to veg for 3 months before they can support 25-50 clones each on a skirt trimming? That's scary. But a good foundation is nessacary I guess...also, I was told I'm quite knowledgeable, book smart on this subject, but experience is the best teacher. I was expecting .75 gpw minimum this time around. A friend of mine gets nearly 1.4!!?? Is this reasonable?

Any input is appreciate.

I hope we get to see pictures of your set-up....sounds impressive. If you're a fairly new grower, you certainly are taking a lot on right away.

Personally, I would grow out about 20 mothers on your tables just to get a feel for how things work before planting 200 clones and finding out you're making mistakes....costly mistakes. You can grow some other's in soil as a back-up too as soil is much more forgiving to beginner mistakes than hydro.

That was kinda my plan. I've got a lot of effort into it so far, I'll post some pics real soon. Once I finish my setup. For now I only got ten 2gallon nursery pots, I'm gonna go for the tables, establish good mothers and try to be patient. It bothers me that most say 1gpw is out of the question on first harvest. With the right equipment, information and time, I don't think it's really an issue is it??? Also, the time its gonna take to establish mommas seems much longer than I expected, is two months fair???

Put 2 1000s or 3 600s over each one of those 4x8s if you want anything close to that 5lb yield. If you have the space in veg, have you thought about not keeping mothers, vegging 50% more plants than u need, pick the best ones for flower, veg the rest out for a week, 2 max to get your next round of clones.
Let's you save money on power and do "selective breeding" because you will always have some slackers in SOG.

jonjon777 said:

I got everything I posted above, as well as a ac, heater, inlines, carbon filters, reverse osmosis (which isnt set up), dehumidifier, the list goes on and on. Now, I've done several cfl, aluminum foil lined boxes in my teen years, but this I'm taking much more serious. I have ppm, ec meters, anything I could think of to be honest. Just no patience lol. I have a friend who sold me most of this equipment for $500. I got a steel. The only thing I haven't gotten yet is the table, hydroton and net pots. $300 each from my local hydro store. Now I must say, I didn't think it was going to be so slow, what scares me even more, is how long will it be until I've established good sized mothers??? Two months? Three from seed? Im going to put on the breaks, finish up this closet, which is almost done and pick my three or four besties, but will they have to veg for 3 months before they can support 25-50 clones each on a skirt trimming? That's scary. But a good foundation is nessacary I guess...also, I was told I'm quite knowledgeable, book smart on this subject, but experience is the best teacher. I was expecting .75 gpw minimum this time around. A friend of mine gets nearly 1.4!!?? Is this reasonable?

Any input is appreciate.

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Get clones from your friend for your first grow. I'm sure he will need to trim or top something soon. If you get a few cuttings of the same plant you can grow them for 2-3 weeks and and take more cuttings to get enough for your first run. I would run the moms in DWC since you will need so many.

Is there some desire to reach felony numbers of plants?

Not at all, thats why I'm looking into other options, trying to get opinions... I know there's many people out there with (12) 20 gallon pot trees. Hows the yeild for my situation???

Also, no clones. He stopped. Somebody found out, he ripped it all out. Brought it to me... Hence, I'm not going to even hint to anyone about clones. I don't need the issues.

Anyhoo, I got this perpetual table idea. Gonna try to work out the kinks in my head.

Fuck perpetual dude. That is a PIA. Especially with a table.

How you going to adjust nuts for plants in different stages on the same table? You are not

I'm just gonna stop thinking about it. It'll come naturally. I'll keep y'all posted

Hey..... throw 50 seeds in- hope for 20-25 females, clone your females and then flower them (1 1/2 month veg), keep everything labeled so you can keep track of your phenotypes. 1 1/2 month veg should allow for between 5-10 great clones from each mother. The space will become available that you need for flowering the seeds as the males are culled out. As the plants flower you will be able to select your favorites, or keepers, and then keep their healthiest and most promising 1st generation clones as mothers for future generations, then flower out the rest of your first generation of clones.
Once you have finished those two flower cycles you will have narrowed down and dialed in your strains, growing methods, and have the two styles of growing to compare- fewer larger plants in the first run, and a bunch of smaller plants in the second.
You can use 2400k to run that space- 4 600W's- or two 1000s on movers and a center stationary 400.
My personal recommendation would be to continue the 1 1/2 month veg cycle on your clones, as this gives them time to root, become established, and have more growth for higher yield- while the mothers are in flower (cant flower them till the moms are done right?). Naturally the clones will be a bit smaller because of root time, transplant adjustments, and they are clones and dont retain quite the same of vigor as their seedmothers, most of the time anyways.
Anyways- doing this brings yields faster, 3 1/2 months compared to 5 if you mother and take cuts before flower- 2 yields in roughly the same timeframe doing it this way and along the way you narrow down your growing method. Hydro, DWC, Soil, doesn't matter, schedule lighting etc would be about the same.
Just make sure you have a really nice climate control system going on- whether by automation or by having a balanced and consistent run- your humidity will spike running sealed room ops like this, air flow is key, make sure you keep on top of that, and air exchange.
Personally I would do soil, that's just me- makes all phases of transition easier and a bit more predictable. Best of luck, I too would like to see it as you complete it.... am throwing around some flowering room options myself....

I hate soil. Just ordered dwc materials. Them bubble buckets seem easy. Anyways, bought more lighting also. I'm now up to 3600. Having problems getting size down on these ladies tho! Progression is slow...

jonjon777 said:

I hate soil. Just ordered dwc materials. Them bubble buckets seem easy. Anyways, bought more lighting also. I'm now up to 3600. Having problems getting size down on these ladies tho! Progression is slow...

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soil, dwc, hydro, dtw..... doesn't matter you can cycle everything the same using any of those methods.

legallyflying said:

Is there some desire to reach felony numbers of plants?

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If the state allows it the Feds can't do anything about counts.

Do 32 plants per table. Real easy. Sorry your afraid of soil. Of you make mistakes DWC is very unforgiving. Soil lets you mess up and still stay alive. DWC you can kill a room in hours.. Soil takes days and recovers faster. I do perpetual. It's not as hard as they make it out to be.

Let me tell you something, I have a friend in federal prison for growing with all his stat3 ducks in a row.

News flash, you end up in a federal court state laws mean nothing, absolutly nothing