Ebay LED grow experiment

thx. Idk, I look at them, weight them if soil is dry, i measure their sizes, moved the led panel closer, watch temperatures. Killed "bugs". I will put them in bigger pots. Isnt that TLC ? :-/ If u tell me they need Mozart, i will give them Mozart Am i maybe dealing with nute burn, Pictures of others look quite similar to me.

hmm i think that Brown getting leaf and dieng is just normal, it just Looks a bit strange with its mark on it. On the bigger plant the lighter in colour getting leaves at the bottom, is that N defiency?

lax123 said:

hmm i think that Brown getting leaf and dieng is just normal, it just Looks a bit strange with its mark on it. On the bigger plant the lighter in colour getting leaves at the bottom, is that N defiency?

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In all of your pics the plants are showing classic signs of negative phototropism ==== NOT ENOUGH LIGHT(leggy,stretched, small leaves, unhealthy) increase the wattage. Also YOUR over-watering, don't need much water when their is no light get some air circulation going around your babies as well, always helps.

Thx a lot!

Im really worried now. :-/

Did u take into consideration what I wrote before that e.g. the last shown plant looked like this (attachment) from poor sunlight before I put it under leds?
Since Led it mainly grew wide and stopped getting higher.

The difference between these two pics is 13 days, is that really poor growth?
Id just increase the wattage, but as i just wrote before, - I did and one plant like died within 1 day... So im not sure if its really too low in power right now, or if it was caused by something else.

My Led fixture has 2 pc- fans 5V directed at all of the plants from two sides, they r constantly "moving forth and back".

Why do u think i am overwatering? -I just checked their weights. Comparing starting weigth -dry to when i watered them. They were all almost at their "dry -weight"

So no lack of nitrogen? In the picture before these it looks to me like that when to compared the "nutes sticky" plant problems

Your plants are dying from increasing the wattage?? Give me a refresher on the leds your using (spectrum/ ratio/lens angle)

No nitrogen def IMO......its an easy diagnosis usually.....fading/old leaves will start to yellow throughout/starts from the bottom/middle of the plant...etc

Over watering is the #1 killer under leds......uptake is reduced due to lower wattages

Thx,
Yea its was just about 85Watts for one day, idk but why did it get to like this after one day?
What might be the issue? It has the same soil combo as the other plants

In my post #22 the right picture, the oldest bottom leaves r getting "brighter" or like fading, dont u think?

Because i have no clue im weighting the pots for watering.

personally your soil looked pretty dry in the images. i think its your soil. What is it? you also look like you have some rough genetics is this bagseed? i would try to find a quick start fertilizer and feed it 1/4 strength and see how it affects your plant cause your growth is pale green. Also how high is your led and are your plants inside its coverage area?

your 85w's isn't enough to cause light damage I would think. I believe there is a lack of light penetration. put all your plants as close together as possible(with out leaves overlapping) shorter plants in the middle, taller plants successive to the perimeter. (since the light penetration is more concentrated directly under the light as oposed to the outer edges.) Therefore the shorter plants in the center will have similar PAR values to the taller plants around that perimeter. Lower your led until you have uniform luminescence over your canopy. Use the top leaves as a guide lower the light as low as possible while maintaining the brightest reflection off all the leaves. You could use this as a visual guide to the dispersion and intensity of your light. This will help you receive the most power out of the light since it isn't as powerful as it could be. I know you see alot of images with leds way up over the plants that is because they are using high quality leds with deeper penetration and high watt consumption. Put into consideration the inverse square law for light. You lose intensity over distance. your light coverage footprint is smaller but your light intensity is increased as you raise the light there is more light disposed as a consequence the intensity decreases. If you have your 85w light too high visually you can see light light dispersed across your canopy. But can you tell the intensty of PAR. No so it tricks you you think just because your plants are illuminated there ok. But that's not true they can be illuminated but not with the intensity needed for photosynthesis this could also be your problem your leaves could be pale because your plant is able to photosynthesis efficiently. I think you are growing to many plants with that light if I were you I would put into consideration there size as they grow and understand that the light you are using simply cannot cover the area you intend to take up I would buy another light so you have two, or pick your favorite plant and get rid of the rest. you would yield less with a bunch of deprived plants than one spoiled one.

IMO.

thx a lot youngbuzz.

Weigthing the pots "told me to" so I watered them yesterday and now all leaves r raised to the light, except the lower leaves of the biggest plan shown in the pics before.

Temperature is about 27°C / Hum 26

Modified wardrobe.
"Grow area" is about 55x49 cm. H about 1,3m.
The space the plants r currently taking in their pots is 20x 30 cm.
The light was 25cm above stem coming out of soil. I moved it yesterday to 32cm, when i switched to 85W. So i guess i will move it back to 25 (there its like 10cm from the top leaves of the biggest plant)
Yesterday i gave the bigger plant some 7-3-6 fertilizer.
Leds r spread on about 28x28cm 68pcs @ 650mA about 125W in total. CW x9, WW x 15,B x 3,R630 x 20,R660 x 21
Fresh air gets sucked in by exhausting via active carbon filter + regulated bath-fan

A friend wanted to give me clones but then his "mother" looked very stressed so he gave me KC36 bagseed
The smaller plants r some bagseed of unkown origin, only thing i know they r atleast 2years old lol. (like 9 days to germ)
5x mj, tomato and bean for fun as long as they dont interfere.

I have 60° lenses coming.

I fear the percentage of males...and how many i will kill with my poor skills in the process, so i think having more is better

I have about 30W of cree WW and NW on a heatsink, i planned to use for a mother compartment, i guess u would recommend me to use those for the "main" light

Sometimes Im wondering if i just should buy some better seeds an start over...on the other hand im thinking im probably doing so much wrong that it would be a waste.

I appreciate anything that could help me.

Another picture slightly different bulb light, r u sure it looks too pale?

lax123 said:

Thx a lot!

Im really worried now. :-/

Did u take into consideration what I wrote before that e.g. the last shown plant looked like this (attachment) from poor sunlight before I put it under leds?
Since Led it mainly grew wide and stopped getting higher.

The difference between these two pics is 13 days, is that really poor growth?
Id just increase the wattage, but as i just wrote before, - I did and one plant like died within 1 day... So im not sure if its really too low in power right now, or if it was caused by something else.

My Led fixture has 2 pc- fans 5V directed at all of the plants from two sides, they r constantly "moving forth and back".

Why do u think i am overwatering? -I just checked their weights. Comparing starting weigth -dry to when i watered them. They were all almost at their "dry -weight"

So no lack of nitrogen? In the picture before these it looks to me like that when to compared the "nutes sticky" plant problems

Click to expand...

Plants that young don't need nutes.

Before you water your plants, check to make sure the top layer (about 1/2-1 inch) of soil is dry. I don't mean damp, I mean dry. The pot should also feel significantly lighter when it's time to re-water. At that stage of growth, I'd probably water every 4 days or so.... maybe even 5.... but keep checking the top layer of soil!

It the leaves are turning brown/yellow it could be burning - have you given them any nutes? What soil are they in? Is it hot soil, meaning, it comes pre-loaded with nutrients? If so, I can almost guarantee it's got too much food for those little plants, and they're burning up. For seedlings, I use straight black topsoil with nothing in it as far as food is concerned. They get straight water, for at least 4 weeks.

Nitrogen def is a very gradual yellowing, and doesn't typically happen in young, young plants. If you're seeing brown, it's safe to say they're burning, IMO....

Pretty sure I saw it mentioned here too, but if they're turning pale - it could be lack of light as well. Move the light closer, and back off with any food.

I agree with Beefbisquit, but i do have to disagree a little, they say you shouldn't fertilize until at least 3 weeks as a guideline. Its not always definite, but very important. Personal example.When I started to grow about 5 years ago i started with outdoor stealth grows, I was a kid and grew in a neighboring park. Transporting bags of soil was difficult so I would just gather soil from random places to fill my pots. That particular year I must of grabbed some really bad earth because my sprouts just would not grow uniform even outdoors in direct sun the would stretch and be pale in color. They showed no sign of obvious deficiency but they lacked vigor. Being a kid I got some miracle grow from my dads garage and feed those little refugees some nutrients at 1/4 strength what it said on the label. Within a week they were dark green and you could see new growth. Out of the four I had only one survive (i didn't put holes in the bottom of my 5 gal pales and they drowned lol.) but that one orange kush was a beauty. Until week before harvest someone chopped it in half taking all the nice buds. I was sad but being a teenager I was grateful it wasn't the cops and the idiot was nice enough to leave me the bottom half.

So I guess what im trying to say is I agree with what was said but there are exemptions depending on the the quality of the soil. If it is store bought it most likely is premium either nutrient infused or pulled from very fertile grounds. If it is backyard soil quality is not guaranteed the sprouts still need nutrients in the soil the 3 weeks is an approximate guideline on how long it will take before your soil is depleted from its resources and supplementation is required. If your soil is already depleted or nearly. I would recommend a LIGHT dosage. Unless its store bought soil than I agree with beefbisquit and your problem would lie else where probably in your 2 year old bagseed.

ps. based on the image of your lights I would lower it more about half of that.

Look at this picture of the afghan Kush see how close the top of the plant is to the light. If it doesnt burn the plants the closer the better.

youngbuzz101 said:

I agree with Beefbisquit, but i do have to disagree a little, they say you shouldn't fertilize until at least 3 weeks as a guideline. Its not always definite, but very important. Personal example.When I started to grow about 5 years ago i started with outdoor stealth grows, I was a kid and grew in a neighboring park. Transporting bags of soil was difficult so I would just gather soil from random places to fill my pots. That particular year I must of grabbed some really bad earth because my sprouts just would not grow uniform even outdoors in direct sun the would stretch and be pale in color. They showed no sign of obvious deficiency but they lacked vigor. Being a kid I got some miracle grow from my dads garage and feed those little refugees some nutrients at 1/4 strength what it said on the label. Within a week they were dark green and you could see new growth. Out of the four I had only one survive (i didn't put holes in the bottom of my 5 gal pales and they drowned lol.) but that one orange kush was a beauty. Until week before harvest someone chopped it in half taking all the nice buds. I was sad but being a teenager I was grateful it wasn't the cops and the idiot was nice enough to leave me the bottom half.

So I guess what im trying to say is I agree with what was said but there are exemptions depending on the the quality of the soil. If it is store bought it most likely is premium either nutrient infused or pulled from very fertile grounds. If it is backyard soil quality is not guaranteed the sprouts still need nutrients in the soil the 3 weeks is an approximate guideline on how long it will take before your soil is depleted from its resources and supplementation is required. If your soil is already depleted or nearly. I would recommend a LIGHT dosage. Unless its store bought soil than I agree with beefbisquit and your problem would lie else where probably in your 2 year old bagseed.

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RAmen, brother.

Everyone is going to have slightly different ways they treat their plants while nursing them from seedlings to small plants - but we're both pretty much saying the same thing.

Easier to recover from a gradual N def, than it is with a harsh N burn...

i can vouch for the 135w 3w leds 7 band led ebay ufo's and the bloom 135 w 3w led bloom 4 band

but all around very impressed on quality of buds both were very effective but side lighting was needed after the plant got larger even with heavy lst
one thing i will say is growing auto's on 24/0 i have yet to have a led burn out the 7 band has been on 24/0 for 5-6 months i added a 400w hps cheapo apollo digital and cooltube
for a little over $100 i couldnt pass it up comes with a 3 year warranty but i didnt skimp on the bulb lumatek high par 2000k claims 60k lumens

Really, thx a lot all of u for your help!

They started in jiffies then i put them in soil 60% compost 10% perlite 30%
The soil is made in a plant where u can bring like all of your gardens waste. Its sold as "universal gardening soil".
I mixed it a bit with compost i made from my garden and perlite.
I have difficulity understanding the part sometimes where i need so many nutes in contrast to not needing nutes outdoors at all for other stuff. I grow in that plain soil without adding new nutes all kinds of nice tasty and big vegteables. Is mj so much more demanding then 1m high tomatoes with a lot of fruits? So it seems to me that good soil is either rather unusual or people think it means "dirt without anything", not to me, so maybe thats my mistake, or i still dont get it

I think those brown tips on my plants r pretty "old" so saying nuteburn would make a lot of sense to me, from when they were younger and even less robust. On the other hand I grow plenty of stuff in that soil from seed without any burning what so ever, maybe that small addition of compost?

I lowered the lights, does that look good now?
But now the temperature at the highest spot of the plant is about 30°C. Is that really ok?
Should i raise the little ones further by putting them on something? Problem, is my fixture is on chains and i cant lower it not as much as i maybe should.

Today i put the biggest plant in a bigger pot.
When i put it out of the pot i saw its roots grew only in like 3/5 on the bottom part of the pot. They were dense but wont they expand also in top direction?
I ask -Because of the very long stem, I put it almost as deep as possible in the next pot and covered it with soil, but if the roots like only grow downwards that would be quite bad.


If its not nute burn or defiency, on the 2nd Picture, why could be the lower leaves brighter then the leaves above it, or is that normal? As i read N def beginns with the older leaves transporting stuff away needed elsewhere more (so making them "brighter"). And those r the oldest leaves.

Also i could add 30W WW/NW cree, which i wanted to use as veg for a mother, if u d say that would be neccessary.

Thx again.

Interesting thread buzz, I got a couple of Chinese lights a few weeks back and they're doing fine, the fan on the big one is abit loud but they haven't killed the plants yet. I got them pretty cheap to 6 days shipping from the Shenzhen factory ain't bad either. The seller seems to do auctions a lot and let all sorts of lights go for a good price if you want a link send me a message or if you wanna see how they're performing there's a grow in my sig

Really? My 2 ladies drank about a gallon each a day under my 180 watt led light. That's 2 gallons of water everyday fro about a month. Im getting ready to harvest. I used 2 different sub par seeds and one of my ladies is over 5' and half feet tall the other is about 5 ft tall and bushy. I'm also running a DWC hydro system. The ladies where not supposed to get over 3 feet according to their strain specs and I barely used any nutes. This is also my first grow and I was surprised how good LEDs work. I bought a boot leg Advanced LED 200W diamond series. So far works great and has a switch for veg and flower.

- BLAKSMITH thank you, I figured there is probably so many people with the Chinese LED's and no where to talk or relate experiences because, for the majority of the led public is made up of prejudices *NO OFFENCE INTENDED* I know it's based on the mentality that the best is best. Understandable, but we cannot all afford such luxuries. So i decided to make this forum and educated people in the potencial of ebay led's. Therefore, from personal experience and the experience of our peers in RIU we can create certain theories and practices concerning ebay led's which will result in a better understanding and usage of these eastern LED's. Oh, and i also ordered my 300w from shenzhen factory good to hear it only took six days hopefully mine will be here soon.

-ibjack, sounds like you found yourself quite a deal there, I also agree with the amount of water your plant is uptaking my buddies 200w causes his plant to take about the same. Two jugs of water also DWC method.

Oh no, i put it in a bigger pot and lowered the fixture, and now this is what happend withing one day.
Or should I put it in plant problems, but then i would have to explain 1000things all over again.

If i had one attempt for a guess id say light burn .....or heat stress?!