Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
Your obsessive-compulsive neurosis is well noted.
Do you believe Americans who work full time should earn a living wage?
- Thread starter Padawanbater2
- Start date
NewtoMJ
Well-Known Member
I don't think that someone working 40 hrs a week as a cashier or fast food worker should get paid more than the current minimum wage, as hard as it is to raise a family on that, I dont think 15/hr for them will incentivise those workers to strive for more. I think as a country we should put more of an effort into providing higher education, so these minimum wage earners can enter higher skilled positions, and be able to earn more and further increase our competitive edge in the world.
gunnar&carey
Well-Known Member
I.can see ur point but the truth is even those ppl flipping burgers deserve a better living they also help the country they are in by providing a service, i work construction so i need fast food and if i can get it in and out those ppl providing me with that shouldnt struggle
Carolina Dream'n
Well-Known Member
Damn. I'm from the south and have dealt with some racist, but you sir are close to being offensive.
NewtoMJ
Well-Known Member
I get that, but until we address a corporations legally bound fiduciary duty to maximize profits for shareholders, then that raise in pay will get passed along to the consumer, I don't know if that will help or hurt. But if we can make education accessible, we can make it so they don't need that burger job.
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
He was being ironic, you missed his sarcasm.
However, kudos to you. Many would not have been offended.
gunnar&carey
Well-Known Member
Agreed, education for adults and keep the burger flipping for the teens. Well thought out man
NewtoMJ
Well-Known Member
Not necessarily just teens, if you're going to school, and want a little extra cash. also, maybe the decrease in the low skill labor market will drive up wages.Agreed, education for adults and keep the burger flipping for the teens. Well thought out man
gunnar&carey
Well-Known Member
Its a possibility now lets get alil off topic, say a stoners dumb now lol. If only us small ppl had a big influential voice the world would be on the right track to being United
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
thanks for not denying your abhorrent and disgusting racism, benis.Your obsessive-compulsive neurosis is well noted.
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
not really.
care to guess what the minimum wage is in denmark and what the cost of a big mac is over there?
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
that's not the point, the point is to put dignity into working for a living instead of making them stand in line for public assistance after working 40 hours.
gunnar&carey
Well-Known Member
Hahaha never gets old man
see4
Well-Known Member
I'm getting your point. However, I don't completely agree with you.
If you have a wife and child, and your wife working part time brings in $100 a week, and you are struggling to make ends meet, so badly that $40 breaks your budget, something went wrong somewhere.
Yes, I agree that minimum wage should be higher, no doubt about that. But everyone's circumstances are different. I grew up with a well to do family so it's expected of me to do well as an adult, and I have. But not everyone has had the same advantages in life. But if we take my friend, for example, he grew up in a fairly poor household, but still managed to work his way through college and work very hard to become what he is today. He has a wife and kids, makes $100,000 a year and still manages to live paycheck to paycheck. He's just dumb about his finances. I have another friend who came from a well to do family, his college was paid for, is now divorced, pays alimony, has a child, owns a home in a very nice neighborhood in north Boston area, and he pulls in $80,000 a year at best, and still manages to put money away for himself and his kid. Neither of them complain, they just work hard and know they are in charge of their own destiny.
If I knew your age and your background, I could be a better judge.
see4
Well-Known Member
I hear Chicago is really nice. I've only flown in/out for business, never got to stay. And best of all Wendy Fiore is from there.
Boston is a great city in the summer, and a fucking shit stain during the winter.
NYC will always be my city. Sao Paulo is also really amazing, and of course Paris and London.
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
"But since 2000, the real average hourly wages of young college graduates have dropped. The entry-level wages of female college graduates have dropped by more than 8 percent, and male graduates by more than 6.5 percent. To state it another way, while a college education has become a prerequisite for joining the middle class, it is no longer a sure means for gaining ground once admitted to it. That’s largely because the middle class’s share of the total economic pie continues to shrink, while the share going to the top continues to grow."
"Myth: Increasing the minimum wage is bad for the economy.
Not true: Since 1938, the federal minimum wage has been increased 22 times. For more than 75 years, real GDP per capita has steadily increased, even when the minimum wage has been raised."
http://www.dol.gov/minwage/mythbuster.htm
Fogdog
Well-Known Member
So, define "maximize profits"? Do you mean the maximize short term profits or maximize return over many years? What's going on right now is maximize short term profits at expense of long term.
One of the factors in the hollowing out of this country is that low wages give people much incentive to leave a company and destroys incentive to give extra effort. Just extra hours isn't what I'm getting at.
I worked for a company that had a profit sharing program, it was also a top performing company and well respected. Some of the profit was plowed into a pension plan some payed out every six months. Company does well, more is put into the pension, better payout. It was common for workers at all levels to say something like: that's going to cut into profit sharing when they saw waste and they did something about it. Later on, when Wall Street sharpies got control of the Board, they eliminated profit sharing altogether. Along with abusive layoffs and cuts in wages and along with increased bonuses to the CEO, the attitude of employees dropped. Fuckem was the mantra when we saw waste. We weren't going to do anything about it, we already working our asses off just to keep our jobs. At the end of 10 years, this company is stagnant. Workforce has turned over and none of the old spirit remains. It's on its way down and nobody cares, not the shareholders, not the management and especially not the workers. About three years ago, I tendered my resignation. My boss panicked and sought to get me to change my mind. He offered a 10% increase if I'd stay another year...10% was more than I'd seen in total increases over 5 previous years. My reply: "what about don't want to work here and don't need the money don't you understand?". Companies aren't just financial entities to be managed like banks. People work there, good people at all levels. Real managers like the ones I worked for before the change empowered workers and rewarded them. They also treated firings like the plague. The result was a creative, committed workforce that gave the company what it really needed -- they gave the company everything including their creativity and desire to succeed.
This idea of people's right to a living wage isn't going away. It's going to be debated in several ways. The right tends to simplify the argument, like it always does. Their argument -- if everybody received a living wage, nobody would have an incentive to work hard -- bullshit. If management treated people like they were more than a nuisance, they would get more than their body during the time at work. The people in Germany have pretty strong unions, a strong medical system, a good pension. Those workers are damn good at what they do and they compete about as well as anybody anywhere. They are proud of their company, their work and their country. Pay at least a living wage and find incentives that give people something more to work for than the incentive to find a better paying job elsewhere and you'll see good results in this country.
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panhead
Well-Known Member
Now your just being silly with the $16 an hour ice cream scooper , even big mac land , the sad thing is adults are seeking jobs that were historically reserved for school kids & 18 yr olds .
The kinda jobs im speaking of are manufacturing & construction workers like Gunner&cary , i have a Journeymans card in his field & know for a fact he is being underpaid by atleast 30% as high as 50% ,his union wage would be around $30 an hour for the same work .
My career as a project site Superintendent opened my eyes big time to corporate greed , im talking about $500 million dollar projects won or lost over $50,000 on a regular basis .
Ive compared bids from non union companys that are allways within 1% or less than the union companys bids , how can this be when the non union contractors pay their men 30% to 50% less per hour ? All other costs are hard nailed by the architects material specifications , the only variable is labor & the union shop i worked for was able to pay $30 to $70 an hour wages & still rank 9th in the world for profitability vs volume of work .
Where is all the money going from the companys that charge the same yet pay workers 50% less ?
My bosses were sickeningly rich with houses all over the world , they live like tycoons & are able to pay fair wages & line the investors pockets heavily at the same time .
I'd bet money most here who think corporate America pays its blue collar workers fairly are pencil pushers , well the modern version which is keyboard pokers & do not perform physical labor for a living .
The dirty guy is stupid so fuck him right ?
Dont worry though im used to it , even though i spent over 10 yrs in school learning my 3 trades my schooling dont mean shit on the pay scale compared to 4 yr school suit & tie pencil necks , manual labor means ignorance nowdays .
gunnar&carey
Well-Known Member
Well check it out me and my lady come from poverty poor ass white trash familys and together we pull in 55k a year she makes slightly less then me but understandable since i work construction we are both 22 yrs old tho so for us its great, being from a poor ass family and me being a ex dope head addict convict im very happy to have what i do have, my girl makes alil over min wage and she dosent bitch at all she works harder to to get raises. So honestly id say ur background has no pertaining knowledge to where u end up in life its all about how bad u want to live better, u work more u will get payed more u work hard u can be payed better. Minimum wage is fucked up but if u want more u will get it.
