Do we need some oil?

medicineman

New Member
oil-schmoil, who said we went to war for oil?
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Oil for Sale: Iraq Study Group Recommends Privatization
The Iraq Study Group may not have a solution for how to end the war, but it does have a way for its corporate friends to make money.

In its heavily anticipated report released on Wednesday, the Iraq Study Group made at least four truly radical proposals.
The report calls for the United States to assist in privatizing Iraq's national oil industry, opening Iraq to private foreign oil and energy companies, providing direct technical assistance for the "drafting" of a new national oil law for Iraq, and assuring that all of Iraq's oil revenues accrue to the central government.
President Bush hired an employee from the U.S. consultancy firm Bearing Point Inc. over a year ago to advise the Iraq Oil Ministry on the drafting and passage of a new national oil law. As previously drafted, the law opens Iraq's nationalized oil sector to private foreign corporate investment, but stops short of full privatization. The ISG report, however, goes further, stating that "the United States should assist Iraqi leaders to reorganize the national oil industry as a commercial enterprise." In addition, the current Constitution of Iraq is ambiguous as to whether control over Iraq's oil should be shared among its regional provinces or held under the central government. The report specifically recommends the latter: "Oil revenues should accrue to the central government and be shared on the basis of population." If these proposals are followed, Iraq's national oil industry will be privatized and opened to foreign firms, and in control of all of Iraq's oil wealth.
The proposals should come as little surprise given that two authors of the report, James A. Baker III and Lawrence Eagleburger, have each spent much of their political and corporate careers in pursuit of greater access to Iraq's oil and wealth.
"Pragmatist" is the word most often used to describe Iraq Study Group co-chair James A. Baker III. It is equally appropriate for Lawrence Eagleburger. The term applies particularly well to each man's efforts to expand U.S. economic engagement with Saddam Hussein throughout the 1980s and early 1990s. Not only did their efforts enrich Hussein and U.S. corporations, particularly oil companies, it also served the interests of their own private firms.
On April 21,1990, a U.S. delegation was sent to Iraq to placate Saddam Hussein as his anti-American rhetoric and threats of a Kuwaiti invasion intensified. James A. Baker III, then President George H.W. Bush's secretary of state, personally sent a cable to the U.S embassy in Baghdad instructing the U.S. ambassador to meet with Hussein and to make clear that, "as concerned as we are about Iraq's chemical, nuclear, and missile programs, we are not in any sense preparing the way for preemptive military unilateral effort to eliminate these programs."*
Instead, Baker's interest was focused on trade, which he described as the "central factor in the U.S-Iraq relationship." From 1982, when Reagan removed Iraq from the list of countries supporting terrorism, until August 1990, when Iraq invaded Kuwait, Baker and Eagleburger worked with others in the Reagan and Bush administrations to aggressively and successfully expand this trade.
The efficacy of such a move may best be described in a memo written in 1988 by the Bush transition team arguing that the United States would have "to decide whether to treat Iraq as a distasteful dictatorship to be shunned where possible, or to recognize Iraq's present and potential power in the region and accord it relatively high priority. We strongly urge the latter view." Two reasons offered were Iraq's "vast oil reserves," which promised "a lucrative market for U.S. goods," and the fact that U.S. oil imports from Iraq were skyrocketing. Bush and Baker took the transition team's advice and ran with it.
In fact, from 1983 to 1989, annual trade between the United States and Iraq grew nearly sevenfold and was expected to double in 1990, before Iraq invaded Kuwait. In 1989, Iraq became the United States' second-largest trading partner in the Middle East: Iraq purchased $5.2 billion in U.S. exports, while the U.S. bought $5.5 billion in Iraqi petroleum. From 1987 to July 1990, U.S. imports of Iraqi oil increased from 80,000 to 1.1 million barrels per day.
For more on this go to: AlterNet: Home
__________________
Just keep trying. There is a solution, we may not know it, but it's out there!
 

ViRedd

New Member
The report calls for the United States to assist in privatizing Iraq's national oil industry, opening Iraq to private foreign oil and energy companies, providing direct technical assistance for the "drafting" of a new national oil law for Iraq, and assuring that all of Iraq's oil revenues accrue to the central government.

Something doesn't jibe there, Med. If the oil is "privatized," how do the oil revenues accrue to the central government?

Vi

 

Dankdude

Well-Known Member
Question
The Moody Blues (written by Justin Hayward)

Why do we never get an answer
When we're knocking at the door
With a thousand million questions
About hate and death and war?
'Cos when we stop and look around us,
There is nothing that we need,
In a world of persecution
That is burning in its greed.

Why do we never get an answer
When we're knocking at the door
Because the truth is hard to swallow
That's what the war of love is for

It's not the way that you say it
When you do those things to me
It's more the way that you mean it
When you tell me what will be

And when you stop and think about it
You won't believe it's true
That all the love you've been giving
Has all been meant for you.

I'm looking for someone to change my life,
I'm looking for a miracle in my life
And if you could see what it's done to me,
To lose the love I knew
Could safely lead me through.

Between the silence of the mountains,
And the crashing of the sea,
There lies a land I once lived in,
And she's waiting there for me,
But in the grey of the morning,
My mind becomes confused,
Between the dead and the sleeping,
And the road that I must choose.

I'm looking for someone to change my life,
I'm looking for a miracle in my life
And if you could see what it's done to me,
To lose the love I knew,
Could safely lead me to
The land that I once knew,
To learn as we grow old
The secrets of our soul.

It's not the way that you say it
When you do those things to me
It's more the way you really mean it
When you tell me what will be

Why do we never get an answer
When we're knocking at the door
With a thousand million questions
About hate and death and war?
'Cos when we stop and look around us,
There is nothing that we need,
In a world of persecution
That is burning in its greed.
 

medicineman

New Member
Something doesn't jibe there, Med. If the oil is "privatized," how do the oil revenues accrue to the central government?

I'm pretty sure they get the leavings, like say 15-25 dollars a barrel while Exxon, Chevron, BP, Mobil, etc get the oil and sell it at 55-80+++ a barrel, you know damn well we didn't go through all this to walk away from the oil, I'm pretty sure oil was the real reason 3,000 Americans have died and 22,000+++ Have been maimed, and, What now is the revised figure of Iraqis dead and wounded, (600,000++). When we are driving our gas guzzlers, I hope someone thanks the American soldier, for he has been doing the dying for the corporate Gods! BTW. here's a scenario, A foreign army comes to California, kills 600,000+++ Californians, Blows up 90% of the infrastructure, sets the Mexicans up against all the other races, gives them guns, and sets up a program to steal all the resourses. Now ya wouldn't want that would ya? And yeah Nevadans and Oregonians, and arizonians would probably come to help the Californians, anything Familiar here?
 

bigballin007

New Member
Yep the USA are the real terrorist!! 600,000 Innocent people died for what oil!


USA=terrorists
Oil=USA
War for oil= terrorists
The US should be nuked.

I completely support Iran's nuclear program. Who are we to tell someone else they can't develope nuclear energy. Maybe Iran should oust the federal government of the USA since our country also has a nuclear program.
I can no longer support any part of what this pitiful nation represents. I am waiting for the world to act in the same way we Americans act, and go to war with us, the USA, and nuke us the way we have.
Then maybe our government will truly act for the people and by the people!
 

DankyDank

Well-Known Member
Yep the USA are the real terrorist!! 600,000 Innocent people died for what oil!


USA=terrorists
Oil=USA
War for oil= terrorists
The US should be nuked.

I completely support Iran's nuclear program. Who are we to tell someone else they can't develope nuclear energy. Maybe Iran should oust the federal government of the USA since our country also has a nuclear program.
I can no longer support any part of what this pitiful nation represents. I am waiting for the world to act in the same way we Americans act, and go to war with us, the USA, and nuke us the way we have.
Then maybe our government will truly act for the people and by the people!
You have reached the zenith of mongoloid reasoning.
 

DankyDank

Well-Known Member
The whole "we went to war for oil" thing kind of pisses me off, because it is so clearly UNTRUE, coupled with the fact that it SHOULD BE.

Where is all the cheap gas we were supposed to get by going to war for oil?

I don't think we should have gone into Iraq to begin with, but WE ARE THERE. The people of iraq are clearly primitive fucks who couldn't organize a rape in a whorehouse, and like the man said, it's immoral to let a sucker keep his money. We got people dying over there, we ought to at least get some cheap gas out of the deal.
 

medicineman

New Member
We got people dying over there, we ought to at least get some cheap gas out of the deal. I guess you don't get the fact that we'll never see cheap oil again. The main reason we went to Iraq is the zenith of the Military-Industrial complex. They finally got everything in place (Ala Cheney and his cohorts) to privatize war ,with the exception of the dying, they left that to our sons and daughters, and had to have a war so all the players could get rich! Heres a little known fact: Rumsfeld owns a major position in the Bird flu vaccine. Do you think we're not going to have an epidemic, it's on the way. When you have to cough up a 100 dollar bill for the antidote or die, think about what I've posted here and then tell me I'm a conspiracy nut. Some big players are going to get very rich off of this epidemic!
 

ViRedd

New Member
Well I'm sure you can afford the 100 bucks, maybe thats a good way to cull, just let the poor die so we don't have to worry about them, Brilliant!
If government is the answer to poverty, why, after spending Six Trillion in tax dollars on the War on Poverty since LBJ's administration do we still have poverty?

Could the reason be the same as the great success story of Nixon's War on Drugs?

Vi
 

medicineman

New Member
If government is the answer to poverty, why, after spending Six Trillion in tax dollars on the War on Poverty since LBJ's administration do we still have poverty?

Could the reason be the same as the great success story of Nixon's War on Drugs?

Vi
You answer questions with questions. Just what are your brilliant plans for the majority of people in this country that are not rich besides "let them eat shit". I'm pretty sure you could care less as long as they leave you alone. "let them eat cake" I believe was the french queens phrase, but a lot of these people can't afford cake! Class Warfare yeppers
 

ViRedd

New Member
"let them eat cake"

You continue to fail in addressing anything I post in a rational manner, Med.

Do you honestly think that an "investment" of over SIX TRILLION DOLLARS since the beginning of LBJ's War on Poverty is a "let them eat cake" attitude? Again, how much is enough to prove that government doesn't do what it promises to do? Divide six trillion by the number of "poor" people in the country, Med and see what you come up with in a dollar amount per head.

Vi
 

Wavels

Well-Known Member
But of course, Vi is most correct.
Hey med, IMO most of the so called poor are so largely by choice! In the society you so glibly trash, there is unprecedented opportunity, which you somehow totally ignore with your bumper sticker responses.
 

medicineman

New Member
But of course, Vi is most correct.
Hey med, IMO most of the so called poor are so largely by choice! In the society you so glibly trash, there is unprecedented opportunity, which you somehow totally ignore with your bumper sticker responses.[/quote]Yeah I'm sure people choose to be poor. when they wake up in the ghetto they say, "you know what, I've seen those rich guys driving mercedes and I don't want any part of that"
Are you two guys sleepin together, Vi is right, wavels is right, geeze get a room and quit pattin each other on the back. Look I know you two hate my posts, you both try and make it seem like I'm some ignorant ass. Well fuck all. I'll post as long as they let me. and if you don't agree, thats fine, just don't make it personal. Instead of saying that's a stupid post, how about countering with an opposing post or not. Believe me when I say, your not discouraging me from posting, but if you want to get personal, then it's on. Vi is right Wavels is right Dank is right, I guess so. Your so far right the people in the middle can't even see you any more. The only thing further right than you guys is the Devil
 

Wavels

Well-Known Member
Med, you once again misconstrue the point of my posts. I don't hate your posts!
I can't speak for Vi, but the last thing I would like to accomplish is to in any way discourage your posts!
Post away, this forum would not be the same without you.
Why not let us know your perception of the opportunities afforded anyone in the USA?
Do you truly think that there is not upward mobility percolating thru this nation?
 

medicineman

New Member
Do you truly think that there is not upward mobility percolating thru this nation? Yes there is, I'll agree to that. The thing is, you and Vi both seem to think that all one has to do is have a desire to be rich and Viola they're rich, But it is not the realm of the world. Most rich guys are by nature, Pricks. they all think they are better than everyone that has less, and love to throw it in their faces, like look, I just bought a villa in france, what do you have? To those I say, You can eat out of my ass! I've paid my dues and don't need schooling from rich spoiled assholes, especially ones that are calling me a commie or other demeaning names!
 

Wavels

Well-Known Member
Interesting post, med.
Did you ever think of starting your own business?
IMO, with the advent of internet commerce....more people than ever have the potential go for it!


I think that your tendency to generalize and paint with a broad brush, the imperfect aspects of US society/economy is the crux of my philosophic disagreement with you. I prefer to accentuate the positive, in order to "expand" it.
The idea is to try and fill the “glass” up as much as possible….this benefits the most people. (The glass can never be totally full.)
 
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