DIY EC Fan controller?

Can anyone confirm whether 0-10v pwm is the standard for EC fan speed control?

I'm in the market for an EC fan. Probably go with a Mountain Air 8in, as that's what's best available locally. It comes with a basic speed controller, but I'd like to craft up something with more flexibility.

I haven't had a reply from the manufacturer.

I prefer variacs because they don't chop up the sine wave causing the fan motor to groan.

What are you trying to accomplish?

If I wanted a speed controller that would speed the fan up when the temp hit a certain level I would use an inkbird temperature controller and have that flip a DPDT relay that would switch the fan between two variac different outputs, one variac being set to high speed and one being set to a slower speed.

Might seem sorta crude but it provides a clean sine wave output for the fan motor.

EC fans are DC power not AC, therefore don't require variable voltage to be speed adjusted. Think along the lines of the Infinity fans.

I'm essentially looking to build a custom fan controller similar to that of the Can Fan Q Max controller. Using a microcontroller id be able to adjust the fan relative to environmental measurements and cues such as doors opening, regulators opening etc. I would integrate this with my current custom control system.

I'm just not sure how to measure the voltage of the PWM signal without cutting the existing wires or an oscilloscope.

Well a PWM signal is a pulsating DC voltage, always 5 volts. The width of the pulse is the key so an oscilloscope would be the best device to measure a PWM signal.

Here is a chart showing what I am talking about.

Auber makes some PID controllers that have PWM output. They usually have several modes of programmable output, from dry contacts, 12vDC alarm, PWM, etc.
Input is usually several different types of temp probes, but a 0-3vDC analog input/o-10vDC output model can do humidity with the right probe.

Rhino in UK, i think, makes a Variac with temp and humidity controls built in, really nice.

I have two fans that I control with a pwm signal, an AC Infinity Cloudline S4 and a Sensdar SE-A100. Both get their power from an ac socket but their speed is controlled by a 0-10V signal.

The S4 produces a solid +10V supply, which I feed to a 2-channel optoisolator. This optoisolator also receives the pwm signals from a raspberry pi. The outputs of the optoisolator goes to the fans.

It works awesome.

What could be done to make a custom PWM controller is use an Arduino, that could be setup with sensors for temperature or humidity, even light sensor to see if it's day or night... Run it with something like a Cytron MD10C motor driver for like 12 bucks and will take way more amperes than you need (30A).

One could build a very intelligent controller with some coding and like $100 bucks or less depending on what you have laying around like a box, wires and shit and it sounds like you are the kinda guy that has a lot of that stuff laying around.

This guy has something that will explain the principals on the motor driver side.

I've got a 2 amp rhino hybrid.temp controller but prefer my variac wired through a relay and switches between idle speed and variable speed, instead of two variacs I've taken taps of the rail for pre set idle speed, you can make one for around $80, all you need is a variac, a stc 1000 dual relay, a 4 gang selector switch for 3 pre set + off.
I've no electrical experience it's pretty easy if you're confident with electricity.

I just want to plug something into something else, like AC blower for that Rhino controller, or PWM controller for an EC fan, and go to bed.
I keep looking at a center tap transformer, PID controllers, or variac lobotomy, and decided to wait a couple years, keep it manual.

shimbob said:

I have two fans that I control with a pwm signal, an AC Infinity Cloudline S4 and a Sensdar SE-A100. Both get their power from an ac socket but their speed is controlled by a 0-10V signal.

The S4 produces a solid +10V supply, which I feed to a 2-channel optoisolator. This optoisolator also receives the pwm signals from a raspberry pi. The outputs of the optoisolator goes to the fans.

It works awesome.

Click to expand...

Shimbobs got the right idea. So you've replaced the standard controller that comes with your circuit? And your just running your PWM signal from the PI to the isolator?

I'm well versed with microcontrollers and PI, I just wasn't sure if 0-10v PWM was the standard for these fans.

For everyone else, variacs etc will not work with these fans. They receive AC current, but the motor itself is a DC motor. The EC stands for electronically controllable. Controllers for these fans need to specifically for EC fans, as they send a PWM signal to the fan to control its speed. The speed is not controlled by variable voltage as conventional fans far. It is similar to using an arduino to control dimming on a Meanwell LED driver.

As above, the reason I wish to have greater control over my fans is for 1) temperature based speed variability, and 2) motion detection.

For the later i intend on having my main fan kick on to full speed when I open the door, as well as a scrubber kick on in my entry/lung room. This is to keep excess noise and power consumption down while I'm not around, but to prevent odor leaks when I am around. Shimbobs solution with probably set me back about 10usd.

Cheers everyone!

lazaah said:

Shimbobs got the right idea. So you've replaced the standard controller that comes with your circuit? And your just running your PWM signal from the PI to the isolator?

Click to expand...

Nope, not using the remotes that came with the fans. Pi gpio pin to the led side of the optoisolator. I use two SparkFun 2-channel optoisolator breakout boards for 2 fans, one meanwell driver, and probably another driver in the future. The pinout of the remote for the S4 was conveniently labelled, I had to probe around with the voltmeter to reverse-engineer the pinout of the se-a100 remote. The se-a100 is reversed, it stops at 10V and full speed at 0V.

I bet that mountain air is 0-10V as well.

shimbob said:

Nope, not using the remotes that came with the fans. Pi gpio pin to the led side of the optoisolator. I use two SparkFun 2-channel optoisolator breakout boards for 2 fans, one meanwell driver, and probably another driver in the future. The pinout of the remote for the S4 was conveniently labelled, I had to probe around with the voltmeter to reverse-engineer the pinout of the se-a100 remote. The se-a100 is reversed, it stops at 10V and full speed at 0V.

I bet that mountain air is 0-10V as well.

Click to expand...

Dope. When I first built my leds those breakouts weren't available except of things like reef systems. Price has come down heaps!

shimbob said:

Nope, not using the remotes that came with the fans. Pi gpio pin to the led side of the optoisolator. I use two SparkFun 2-channel optoisolator breakout boards for 2 fans, one meanwell driver, and probably another driver in the future. The pinout of the remote for the S4 was conveniently labelled, I had to probe around with the voltmeter to reverse-engineer the pinout of the se-a100 remote. The se-a100 is reversed, it stops at 10V and full speed at 0V.

I bet that mountain air is 0-10V as well.

Click to expand...

Hey @shimbob I have a T6 which came with the digital display with temp/humidity. I have a feeling the fan itself is the same, likely with the same EC controller.

Could you share any pictures, a wiring diagram, or just a good explanation of how you actually wired it all up?

Does the fan supply it's own 10V source like the meanwell dimming circuit, or did you have to supply it yourself?

Thanks for any help you can provide!

Relic79 said:

Hey @shimbob I have a T6 which came with the digital display with temp/humidity. I have a feeling the fan itself is the same, likely with the same EC controller.

Could you share any pictures, a wiring diagram, or just a good explanation of how you actually wired it all up?

Does the fan supply it's own 10V source like the meanwell dimming circuit, or did you have to supply it yourself?

Thanks for any help you can provide!

Click to expand...

Sorry @shimbob I see some of my answers in the thread now.

Can you comment on which wires are which on the AC infinity fan? Im not confident in multimeter use yet. Maybe even just a picture or description of how you connected the sparkfun board to the AC infinity?

Thanks!

Steve

lazaah said:

Can anyone confirm whether 0-10v pwm is the standard for EC fan speed control?

I'm in the market for an EC fan. Probably go with a Mountain Air 8in, as that's what's best available locally. It comes with a basic speed controller, but I'd like to craft up something with more flexibility.

I haven't had a reply from the manufacturer.

Click to expand...

Have you seen the new AC infinity 67 controller. It does what your want and is very programmable ?

@Relic79, did you ever figure out the PWM specs? I'm also wanting to put in a custom microcontroller but I need to know a little bit more about the Cloudline's EC fans PWM. I'd rather not have to guess or reverse engineer the fan (Cloudline T. TerraBloom's fans on the other hand have the PWM info documented in their user manual.

drinkoldcoke said:

Have you seen the new AC infinity 67 controller. It does what your want and is very programmable ?

Click to expand...

I'm trying to replace the AC infinity 67 controller with a custom built one, and I can assure you that controller does not do what lazaah wants. As he said, he wants to include motion sensing with the logic. You can only connect one sensor to that controller (temp and humidity). The AC infinity 67 "smart fan controller" simply isn't smart enough, and it is also incapable of being controlled by automation systems like Node-Red or Home Assistant.

In my case, I want the controller to be able to take into account the temperature and humidity outdoors vs indoors. When the temperature or humidity is too high outdoors, I want air intake & exhaust flow to be low - without having to babysit the fan controller numerous times per day.

I took some measurements with a multimeter. I probed the connection between the controller and fan for the different speeds, and I've made a wire diagram and table for the PWM (attached). I think it's everything needed to build a custom fan controller. Fan was Cloudline T8 (model AI-CLT8 ), controller was U-Controller 529 (model: AC-UNC529). The meter didn't read values for the low and high fan speeds. I'm assuming it's a limitation with my meter (and have written guesses into the Estimated Duty % column). I didn't get consistent duty % for speeds 2 and 3 (checking at different times), so I wrote down both values my meter showed.

juanmaria said:

I took some measurements with a multimeter. I probed the connection between the controller and fan for the different speeds, and I've made a wire diagram and table for the PWM (attached). I think it's everything needed to build a custom fan controller. Fan was Cloudline T8 (model AI-CLT8 ), controller was U-Controller 529 (model: AC-UNC529). The meter didn't read values for the low and high fan speeds. I'm assuming it's a limitation with my meter (and have written guesses into the Estimated Duty % column). I didn't get consistent duty % for speeds 2 and 3 (checking at different times), so I wrote down both values my meter showed.

View attachment 4893220

Click to expand...

The red to black showing 8kHz pwm @ 5V differing from what others have said made me get my oscilloscope out (hantek) and run the same experiment. the pinout is: Red +10V, black GND, white no connection, yellow 10V pwm @ 5kHz

Same controller (AC-UNC529) but with a Cloudline S4 (AL-CLS4) EC fan (I have a T4 too but its inside the tent atm but i suspect its identical), here's what I got:

Speed 0, duty 0
Speed 1, duty 22%
Speed 2, duty 30.1%
Speed 3, duty 38.1%
Speed 4, duty 47.6%
Speed 5, duty 54.9%
Speed 6, duty 63%
Speed 7, duty 70.8%
Speed 8, duty 79.5%
Speed 9, duty 87.3%
Speed 10, duty 100%

Just thought I'd share the correct pinout for the newer AC infinity EC fans and my results!

Do you have any photos or diagrams??
I'm building very similar setup cross between guy ,ledg, from ledgardener