Deficiency

L

LowAnkle

Well-Known Member
X6xsilverx6X said:
Well damn, so I should probably stop the extra phosphorus and hope for the best
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Are you doing in between flushes?
I'd just give it a good saturated watering, then goto a lighter feed.
I've been growing 15 years, and I haven't checked my ph in 10 lol, if you got enough "layers" in your soil you can kill the ph all together.
It'll be fine btw. Them things are hardy most of the time.
 
3rd Monkey

3rd Monkey

Well-Known Member
It's your ph of your medium.

The N tox you can see in the dark green top leaves, yet the bottoms and middle are fading, plus the claw and tacoing.

The K tox you can see in the lightening of the outer leaf with dark veins and tip and edge burn, as well as the tacoing, though that could be the N too.

The Mg you can see in the interveinal chlorosis as well as the turned up tips.

The buds are maturing way too early, yet they're stunted.

Combine all that with the amount of damage done, which is very little compared to a true def, and it comes to what looks like a lockout...

However, that lockout is from a low ph which is blocking K and Mg. The reason you know it's ph and not a salt buildup lockout, is that N tox. If it were salt buildup, it would just burn, no healthy leaves with curled tips.

That's why you're getting deficiencies with boosters.
 
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X6xsilverx6X

Well-Known Member
3rd Monkey said:
It's your ph of your medium.

The N tox you can see in the dark green top leaves, yet the bottoms and middle are fading, plus the claw and tacoing.

The K tox you can see in the lightening of the outer leaf with dark veins and tip and edge burn, as well as the tacoing, though that could be the N too.

The Mg you can see in the interveinal chlorosis as well as the turned up tips.

The buds are maturing way too early, yet they're stunted.

Combine all that with the amount of damage done, which is very little compared to a true def, and it comes to what looks like a lockout...

However, that lockout is from a low ph which is blocking K and Mg. The reason you know it's ph and not a salt buildup lockout, is that N tox. If it were salt buildup, it would just burn, no healthy leaves with curled tips.

That's why you're getting deficiencies with boosters.
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Gotcha, so how high should I take the PH? What should the runoff be for me to not end up with more problems? Any other solutions other then trashing the roots organic?
 
3rd Monkey

3rd Monkey

Well-Known Member
X6xsilverx6X said:
Gotcha, so how high should I take the PH? What should the runoff be for me to not end up with more problems? Any other solutions other then trashing the roots organic?
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Runoff would be good somewhere around 6.0 when putting in 7.0.

Your best bet is to get some microbes in there to help take away from that low ph. They'll help your plant's rootzone fix ph. Can you get some compost tea or something similar?

Beyond that... not a whole lot. It's very hard to fix medium ph during the grow, especially peat based, and especially during flower.
 
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X6xsilverx6X

Well-Known Member
3rd Monkey said:
Runoff would be good somewhere around 6.0 when putting in 7.0.

Your best bet is to get some microbes in there to help take away from that low ph. They'll help your plant's rootzone fix ph. Can you get some compost tea or something similar?

Beyond that... not a whole lot. It's very hard to fix medium ph during the grow, especially peat based, and especially during flower.
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Ok, and teas recommended over others?
As my current options if florablend vegan compost tea or get some stump tea from HTG
 
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X6xsilverx6X

Well-Known Member
Could this situation be gnats or aphids in the root system, I haven’t seen anything flying around or on the leaves... should I treat for this just Incase? Also since sm-90 is gone neem oil next best thing?
 
Aussieaceae

Aussieaceae

Well-Known Member
IME when a plant's showing multiple deficiencies, 9/10 times it's either over fertilised, or over watered.

If the ph of the media ckecks out, over fertilised, over watered, or a little of both is what i'd assume.

Imho if you haven't already, i'd check your media's ph using a slurry sample.

I'd lower the ec of your feedings for now too, and likely cut out the booster + calmag.

My thoughts are you've likely over fertilised.

Good luck, and hope they come around.

P.S. I'd double check those waste readings against a slurry sample. If it's around that 5 mark, i'd consider top dressing with some fast acting lime. :peace:
 
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X6xsilverx6X

Well-Known Member
Aussieaceae said:
IME when a plant's showing multiple deficiencies, 9/10 times it's either over fertilised, or over watered.

If the ph of the media ckecks out, over fertilised, over watered, or a little of both is what i'd assume.

Imho if you haven't already, i'd check your media's ph using a slurry sample.

I'd lower the ec of your feedings for now too, and likely cut out the booster + calmag.

My thoughts are you've likely over fertilised.

Good luck, and hope they come around.

P.S. I'd double check those waste readings against a slurry sample. If it's around that 5 mark, i'd consider top dressing with some fast acting lime. :peace:
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Slurry test shows below 4.0 on ph scale now. So fast acting lime and what else can be used to fix this ASAP
 
Aussieaceae

Aussieaceae

Well-Known Member
X6xsilverx6X said:
Slurry test shows below 4.0 on ph scale now. So fast acting lime and what else can be used to fix this ASAP
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Gotcha.

Personally, i'd top dress the lime and water it right in with plain water. Wouldn't worry about adjusting ph of your water at all, if it's above 6.5 and below about 8.

Might have to take it one step at a time. Lime and big drink plain water, dry, plain water, dry etc.

I have no experience with your media. Is it the type you can leach until your waste readings are within range, or more of a soil?
 
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X6xsilverx6X

Well-Known Member
It’s more of a soil I don’t really like the roots organic 707, I feel that it holds onto the water to much.

My local options are grow more dolomite lime, and oyster shell powder. Or whatever else I can get at htgsupply, other hydro places in town or amazon
 
Aussieaceae

Aussieaceae

Well-Known Member
X6xsilverx6X said:
It’s more of a soil I don’t really like the roots organic 707, I feel that it holds onto the water to much.

My local options are grow more dolomite lime, and oyster shell powder. Or whatever else I can get at htgsupply, other hydro places in town or amazon
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Dolomite might be a bit slow, though if ground or in a powdered form should activate faster. I personally haven't used oyster shell powder, should dissolve fairly fast in powder form though. I'd be choosing garden lime myself, tbh lime and dolomite is all i ever use, i can't comment on the oyster shell flour.

Maybe a combination? Regardless, you're likely looking at a week or two before seeing obvious signs of change.

Where did you take the slurry sample from? Assuming the top, it's likely only the first few inches that are that low, further down is likely better. With that considered, i think the lime or oyster shell will work just fine.

For a 5gal pot, i'd probably start at around 2 or 3 tblsp of lime, then wait and see how they respond. You can always add a little more later.

Good luck, and wish you all the best. Keep us all updated.
 
Hydro4life

Hydro4life

Well-Known Member
3rd Monkey said:
It's your ph of your medium.

The N tox you can see in the dark green top leaves, yet the bottoms and middle are fading, plus the claw and tacoing.

The K tox you can see in the lightening of the outer leaf with dark veins and tip and edge burn, as well as the tacoing, though that could be the N too.

The Mg you can see in the interveinal chlorosis as well as the turned up tips.

The buds are maturing way too early, yet they're stunted.

Combine all that with the amount of damage done, which is very little compared to a true def, and it comes to what looks like a lockout...

However, that lockout is from a low ph which is blocking K and Mg. The reason you know it's ph and not a salt buildup lockout, is that N tox. If it were salt buildup, it would just burn, no healthy leaves with curled tips.

That's why you're getting deficiencies with boosters.
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Howzit 3rMonkey!!?
I think you’ve hit the nail on the head there with the low ph. If you also have a look at the leaves on the 2nd photo, (not the Mg deficiency) but the general dull, unhappy colour to them, that’s what my plants look like when I use my highly chlorinated tap water lol. Not sure the extent chlorine can have on soil grown plants? But I would imagine it wouldn’t be good for the good beneficial bacteria that soil Offers!?
Might help if x6 tries some RO or purified water also!?
 
Hydro4life

Hydro4life

Well-Known Member
X6xsilverx6X said:
Could this situation be gnats or aphids in the root system, I haven’t seen anything flying around or on the leaves... should I treat for this just Incase? Also since sm-90 is gone neem oil next best thing?
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I’ve had a bad infestation of fungus gnats before x6! Pretty much stopped the plants from growing. My understanding of them is they eat all the good bacteria in your soil, once the bennies are gone they start eating your roots! As 3rdMonkey pointed out, the buds are maturing too quickly and has stunted growth. Which is, from my experience the plant knowing that it’s not going to make it through it’s full cycle so is trying to finish quickly, reproducing is their no.1 goal!
Lay down some yellow sticky traps and check the sticky traps the next day. If you have little tiny black bugs with wings, than more than likely fungus gnats.
These little bastards are one of the reasons I switched to hydro :cool:
Hopefully it is just low ph but better to be safe than sorry!!
 
X

X6xsilverx6X

Well-Known Member
Ok so now with the lime and the oyster shell powder as a top dressing. I am worried that I now have a ton of nutrients and salts built up in the soil. And would flushing fix this or should I repot plants?
I already harvested 4 plants early as they werent growing anymore and the single leaves on the buds were starting to turn yellow...
 
Aussieaceae

Aussieaceae

Well-Known Member
I'm not sure a repot is the best option. Leaching them a little might help, and it'll help aid the lime too. Tbh i don't think there's really any quick fix if the WHC is high, watering too often won't help it either imho. Get a pic or two if you can, it'll help out a lot.

When you took the sample of your media, how far down did you go? It's likely only the first few inches that the ph is that low. I'd find out if that's the case (the ph of your waste was considerably higher than the top sample).

Have you a means of testing your ec? If you do, i'd check your waste next watering / feeding.
 
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X6xsilverx6X

Well-Known Member
Took two samples, one from the top and one from about 3 inches down and got some roots with it just to make sure. The top sample was the worst way below 3. And the lower sample was closer to 4.
No means of testing EC atm. But I’ll look at some testers. Plants look about the same except the purple edges are now on almost all the leaves
Also local tap water contains 2ppm of chloramine
 

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Aussieaceae

Aussieaceae

Well-Known Member
X6xsilverx6X said:
Took two samples, one from the top and one from about 3 inches down and got some roots with it just to make sure. The top sample was the worst way below 3. And the lower sample was closer to 4.
No means of testing EC atm. But I’ll look at some testers. Plants look about the same except the purple edges are now on almost all the leaves
Also local tap water contains 2ppm of chloramine
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Are they in flower too?

The ph in the top has to be what's giving you trouble.

What size are your pots, and what stage are your plants in?

Is it feasible to take some of the top media away, or you think it'll be too rough on them?
 
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