day 13 into flowering, Sharksbreath having trouble

OK, first off I think I know what happened, but I'm not 100% sure. I'm doing a hydroponic scrog with DNA sharksbreath in a 2x2 box under a 250w HPS.

A couple days ago, the water started smelling odd, so I flushed half the water and replaced with fresh water. Then a day or two later, it smelt like a pickled solution. As a precaution, I took some cuttings just in case things were about to go bad.

Well, one day after the cuttings, the state of the plant changed overnight. The leaves looked droopy so I checked everything out and I had a hole in the diaphragm of my Hagen airpump, so it looks like a lack of oxygen to the roots maybe. Replaced the pump (why don't they sell replacement diaphragms damnit), cleaned the container out and put just fresh water (ph 5.5) in with a little B1 and fulvic.

Water temps have always been around 20-22c and the roots look healthy, but they have a dyed appearance from the SensiBloom nutes.

Took a picture so you guys can see it's current state. My guess is lack of oxygen combined with shock from taking cuttings.

Is there anything else that can be done? Will it recover?

Here is what I have on hand at the moment:
Advanced Nutrients Sensibloom, Bud Candy, Fulvic, Big Bud, Bud Blood, Voodoo Juice, Carboload, and Thiamine Mono-nitrate (b1).

I will give rep to anyone who posts useful info/help.

well not much change, except more fanleaves have turned yellow and the smell seems to have disappeared, replaced with something almost soil like. Near the top, the leaves are still green, but droopy.

Any help guys? I need to decide here whether or not to cut it down and start over with one of the clones.

Is light getting into your res?

It sounds like you are fighting root root now. Get some H2O2 (hydrogen peroxide) if you get the 35% stuff it is 3-5ml a gallon. Once they perk back up switch to Hygrozyme and you will be fine.

StreetRider said:

Is light getting into your res?
It sounds like you are fighting root root now. Get some H2O2 (hydrogen peroxide) if you get the 35% stuff it is 3-5ml a gallon. Once they perk back up switch to Hygrozyme and you will be fine.

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No light gets into the res. Using thick 5 gallon black buckets with aluminum foil on the outside. Only time light gets in is when I put more water or hydrogen peroxide in, and that's a brief minute or so.

I'm already using hydrogen peroxide daily, but the 3% concentration version at 5ml/L (60ml in a 12L solution). Were do you get 35% from. Every drug store I've gone to only has 3%

I've been thinking of adding a small amount of voodoo juice to the res in the hopes it would help the roots recover if that's the case. Everything looked alright up until the cuttings.

I've now got 3 working hagen airpumps that put out 3500cc of air per minute, one already in the tank. Think the extra oxygen would help anything?

Some hydro stores carry 25% H2O2 but you can order 35% online. Becareful, thou. It will oxidize you skin.

In DWC more air is better.

McDooBiE1249 said:

No light gets into the res. Using thick 5 gallon black buckets with aluminum foil on the outside. Only time light gets in is when I put more water or hydrogen peroxide in, and that's a brief minute or so.

I'm already using hydrogen peroxide daily, but the 3% concentration version at 5ml/L (60ml in a 12L solution). Were do you get 35% from. Every drug store I've gone to only has 3%

I've been thinking of adding a small amount of voodoo juice to the res in the hopes it would help the roots recover if that's the case. Everything looked alright up until the cuttings.

I've now got 3 working hagen airpumps that put out 3500cc of air per minute, one already in the tank. Think the extra oxygen would help anything?

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the voodoo juice might work, and if the H2O2 is strong enough for you (not sure I'd be comfortbale going any higher...), see how that goes and then report back, okay?

Good luck!

Wholelottasmoke said:

the voodoo juice might work, and if the H2O2 is strong enough for you (not sure I'd be comfortbale going any higher...), see how that goes and then report back, okay?
Good luck!

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Well, I cannot use Voodoo Juice and H202 together, the hydrogen peroxide will kill the beneficial bacteria. It's one or the other. I've been considering doubling or even tripling the H202 doses from 5ml/L to 10-15ml/L, but I'm not 100% sure if that would be safe.

Looked at the res today and it appears like there is massive new root growth coming in, however the main root in the res appears to have some rotting stems around it. Not sure if I should do some emergency surgery and cut some roots or not. Water looks cloudy today, as if plant material is breaking down or polluting the res. PH is also rising fast. It was around 5.5 awhile ago and it's near 6.2 now. Could be bacteria. Will be having 10500cc/per minute of oxygen being pumped into the res by 3 hagen 803 Elite pumps in a short while here, just need some new air stones that DON'T CLOG. First thing I'm doing next grow, get a industrial air pump. These rubber diaphragms in the Hagen pumps are fragile.

I'm also wondering if I should just abandon this plant. It has been stunted early in the flowering cycle and I'm not sure it's worth all the Advanced Nutrients I'd put into it to keep it going. First plant I've ever stunted so I'm not sure how it would turn out if it recovers. Will I still need to cut it down after 9 weeks (from start of flowering with stunt/recovery time included) or do I just continue the plant, disregarding the time it spent recovering and harvest when it's ready?

I also took off all the dead or dying fanleaves today. New leaves are growing in. I will try to post a current pic later today.

The look like they're underwatered.. what type of medium are you using and how does it feel? PH could probably be around 5.8-6. There are other safer supplements you can use to condition your roots as opposed ot H202.

oh and you shouldn't take cuttings during flowering..

your plants look a little heat stressed to me, but still are growing great.

you keep saying everything was alright before the cuttings.... did you clean you cutting utensil before you used it? Maybe you infected the plant with something on it? But I am just guessing you sound pretty experienced with all the nute you got....

besides that they really do not look so bad... in fact they look pretty damn ok to me

Sealion said:

oh and you shouldn't take cuttings during flowering..

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1st Sealion....doing DWC....underwatering isn't possible. Problem was most likely lack of oxygen in the water due to a clogged airstone (and popped air pump diaphragm) combined with shot from cutting/trimming under the screen.
The water level is adequate and PH floats between 5.3-6.2.

I didn't exactly take cuttings. Whenever I scrog, I always trim whatever is below the net that will not get sufficient light to actually become bigger than a popcorn nut. I do it so more of the energy gets focused on the big nugs above. I believe most term this practice "lollipopping". Usually only do it week 1 in flowering, then trim fanleaves in week 3 to give more light to bottom nugs, but I decided for the Sharksbreath I would do the same on weeks 2 & 4 respectively. Lollipopping helped my Alaskan Ice get a heavy yield last crop. Got approx 5.75oz (166g) dry under the 250w hps. Should have taken pics but I was way too baked to care.
Some of what I took off below the net just happened to be good enough to clone. 11/12 rooting so far.

Oh, and Biggun, I always clean the "utensil" before I cut anything. I let the blade soak in 99% isopropyl alcohol for a couple minutes.

Updated with current condition pics w/ last picture being before I cut the dead/dying leaves (REMOVED RECENTLY). You can see in the first picture that I left some leaves that had maybe 10-20% damage. I don't want the plant to waste energy trying to keep leaves alive that are already doomed. Pisses me off so much this happened. It used to look like a beautiful lush green forest with no gaps.

Got a picture of the roots in the tank (notice murky water, could just be sensibloom washing off roots) and the new root growth. Before anyone says it looks like root rot, AN Sensi Bloom dyes the roots a red/brown color. Will be flushing the res tomorrow and depending on how things look on Thursday, I will be resuming feeding lightly, probably giving around 1200ppm to start things back up again.

So what do you guys think, keep it going? Not sure what to do since this is my first stunted plant and I have no clue how this is going to affect the yield/potency in the end. Still considering abandoning and starting over with a clone.

You can learn alot on this sick little lady. Keep working on her and learn.

Root rot would make your roots mushy. It is not so much the color.

Hygrozyme is a good product for root health. A warning thou. Mix at 8 ml a gallon no more. And for the first week you may want to change the water daily if you ph keeps climbing.

You either have root issues or some sort of nasty growing in your system. (The cloudy water). If you have the air pumps running try to stop using the H2O2 and try Hygrozyme or one of the other enzyme products. They work by digesting dead plant matter and roots and converting them into nutes.

Also, make sure your res is staying at 68 or so. You are blocking the light, you are using H2O2, so you are doing the right stuff.

Best of luck.

you do have root rot the pickle smell was a dead giveaway peroxide helps but if they are fully infected with that smell you are fucked i have the same problem i have multiple plants so i tried alot of thingsn that should have worked but didnt wait till the new roots are enough to make the plant servive and cut the infected roots as soon as you can they remain slightly functional for awhile but you dont want them infecting new healthy growth also youre plant will start showing the whole specrum of nutrient def. that is what is happening now its not heat stress or nutrient def youre plants dont have enough roots and could die by cutting roots but trying to nurse them along will leave you with alot of work for plants that will not produce great pot for lack of nutrients

j420man said:

you do have root rot the pickle smell was a dead giveaway peroxide helps but if they are fully infected with that smell you are fucked i have the same problem i have multiple plants so i tried alot of thingsn that should have worked but didnt wait till the new roots are enough to make the plant servive and cut the infected roots as soon as you can they remain slightly functional for awhile but you dont want them infecting new healthy growth also youre plant will start showing the whole specrum of nutrient def. that is what is happening now its not heat stress or nutrient def youre plants dont have enough roots and could die by cutting roots but trying to nurse them along will leave you with alot of work for plants that will not produce great pot for lack of nutrients

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Something murky has been supplemented with something foamy white. Bacterial likely, even though it's been getting a dose of 8ml/L of 3% H202. New root growth has nearly tripled since the other day though.

Too bad I ran out of SensiZym 2 weeks ago . Seems to always be the one product I run out of the fastest, Grandmas F1 being a distant second.
I always order my nutes online for the anonymity. Yes walking into a hydro store is better, but the prices are close to double what I pay. Even if I ordered them today, it won't arrive in time at this point of the year. I will probably get hygrozyme because Sensizyms organic parts would probably be harmed shipping in this cold weather. I'd likely get whatever I order now in January because of the christmas shipping frenzy so it won't help this plant in time.

Will see what happens tomorrow. I've been thinking exactly what I've highlighted in the quote above, but I should note it's all ONE PLANT (SCROG). Even if everything recovers, it won't recover back to it's full potential at this stage, and I will have a quasi-great crop at harvest to show for all the hard work and expensive nutes it will take to nurse/feed this plant. I have to cut a lot of stems near the main, or even the main stem itself by the looks of the roots. If nothing improves foam wise, I will likely abandon the plant, sterilize everything with chlorine, H202, Metabisulphite and start over with the best growing clone.


ps. How do I remove pics I upload to the site? Cannot edit the first post to remove pic for some reason. Rep'd most of you guys.

it looks like it is hot and very humid in the pic. hows your airflow in there?