SickSadLittleWorld
Well-Known Member
Werd, that's where I found the dr I went to see. He's the one affiliated with Medicinal Gardens on Mulberry and Howes and charges $120 for a recommendation. He usually sees patients on Tues/Thurs.
Colorado Med Growers, Unite
- Thread starter riddleme
- Start date
rambo trees
Member
Hi everyone, I'm from Colorado Springs and have been growing for personal use for 6 months or so.I was wondering what I would have to do to grow medically? I'm taking a growing class a a local dispesery(starts next week), but so far I haven't got much info from the place.I don't have a med lisence*, but I live with someone who does......Anyway....More questions.....How is supply and demand?Is this still very profitable?what is a good price to ask for a gram of homegrown?what are people looking for?...I guess,how does this work?....I'm going to keep reading all these post, it seems like this thread has been going for a while...Thank you....More questions to follow.
Pipe Dream
Well-Known Member
Okay 10 years ago if you grew mj in colorado I would say you were making a killing. 100$ a 1/4 for any kb 120$ easily if you had fire and honestly I only ever bought an 1/8 at that price on the streets. Now with all the relaxed laws MJ should fall in value but whats funny is now the dispensaries are selling it at 60$ an 1/8 and its like WTF? The whole reason it was so expensive is because of the risk involved in my honest opinion weed should be a lot cheaper and it will be very soon. In fact, I bet there's going to be more bud being produced here than we need and it will probablly be dirt cheap for common stuff. High quality med, and I mean the best of the best, will always be in high demand and will still be very expensive but that's the way it works.
If your trying to grow for profit I think that your going to be dissappointed unless you really know what your doing. Standing out from the competition is what you should strive for by having the best genetics and finished product. I plan on growing for lots of profit.....about 300-350$ a month I would have otherwise spent. That's the only way to come out ahead IMHO. What it ultimately boils down to is Do you want to have the potential of making lots of $ but face going to prison and losing everything or grow MJ for the love of it? I'm sure there are commercial pot growers out there who don't want MJ to be legalized and rightfully so it takes money out of their pocket but on the other hand this limbo between legal and illegal is complicated and confusing and I think that's the reason for the high prices.
If your trying to grow for profit I think that your going to be dissappointed unless you really know what your doing. Standing out from the competition is what you should strive for by having the best genetics and finished product. I plan on growing for lots of profit.....about 300-350$ a month I would have otherwise spent. That's the only way to come out ahead IMHO. What it ultimately boils down to is Do you want to have the potential of making lots of $ but face going to prison and losing everything or grow MJ for the love of it? I'm sure there are commercial pot growers out there who don't want MJ to be legalized and rightfully so it takes money out of their pocket but on the other hand this limbo between legal and illegal is complicated and confusing and I think that's the reason for the high prices.
Generally speakin I think you're right. I think there may be a small window for growers with previous experience cultivating to get back into it for a very modest profit. In 6 months or a year it could be a totally different ballgame and has already begun to evolve. I could see how if you havent done your homework or had experience you could give up on growing pretty quickly.
My personal goal is to make a very modest supplement to my current income. If I make my money back in 3 months after additional utilities, equipment and other expenses invested I'll be fine with that knowing the market just isnt there.
What I'm most curious about is whether it's so saturated on the supply end, behind the dispensaries, that a loss is inevitable? I'm not sure theres any way to predict.
For the time being, I'm going for it, but again, I have a very modest income in mind and certainly dont need it to survive. In short, I'm doing it for the 'love' you could say, with the added benefit of a few bucks.
So, how has everyones experiece here been in selling their extra meds? Have the dispensaries been particularly discerning in terms of quality? What kinds of amounts are you able to sell? IS there really a lot of trash out there already?
EdGreyfox
Well-Known Member
NCA,
If you can grow the same quality and can sell for less then the dispensaries then you will have customers, period. Those people that grow small amounts in their homes and aren't greedy shouldn't have any trouble being able to undercut the dispensary prices for quite a while because they don't have the same sort of overhead costs for labor, office rental, etc. Think about it this way- If you sold top shelf grade MMJ for $300/oz you would be undercutting the price at most dispensaries by at least 1/3, and I'd be willing to bet that you'd be making at least $150 worth of profit off the deal even after you figured in the cost of your labor. Frankly, I don't see the dispensaries/large growers being able to make small scale growing/ selling unprofitable until they start selling for less then $100/oz. If they get it down to $50/oz then a lot of people would even stop growing their own, but I don't see that happening anytime soon.
If you can grow the same quality and can sell for less then the dispensaries then you will have customers, period. Those people that grow small amounts in their homes and aren't greedy shouldn't have any trouble being able to undercut the dispensary prices for quite a while because they don't have the same sort of overhead costs for labor, office rental, etc. Think about it this way- If you sold top shelf grade MMJ for $300/oz you would be undercutting the price at most dispensaries by at least 1/3, and I'd be willing to bet that you'd be making at least $150 worth of profit off the deal even after you figured in the cost of your labor. Frankly, I don't see the dispensaries/large growers being able to make small scale growing/ selling unprofitable until they start selling for less then $100/oz. If they get it down to $50/oz then a lot of people would even stop growing their own, but I don't see that happening anytime soon.
Thanks Ed.
I'm looking at Nirvana genetics. Any ideas on what strains patients are looking for? Are hybrids always in demand, or are people tending toward sativa or indica doms?
I may play it safe and go with something like an AK48 and Snow White as they both are recommended for medicinal use and look like good indoor producers. Thoughts?
I'd like to get some unique genetics into the scene here. Is the Haze varieties played out at this point?
dakin3d
Well-Known Member
Thanks doog... I appreciate it.
THanks for the addtl info, bro.
doogleef
Well-Known Member
An Urgent Plea For Help From Brian Vicente,
Executive Director, Sensible Colorado
Please consider this message an urgent plea for help. As accurately noted by Vince Carroll in Saturday's Denver Post, we are in serious jeopardy of losing the dispensary model in Colorado. See Post article here.
Now is the time to come together. Whether you have worked on this issue for 15 years or 15 days, we must put aside our differences and work together towards the common goal of protecting safe access in Colorado.
Our enemy is powerful. Law enforcement will stop at nothing to re-establish the 5 patient cap and destroy dispensaries. If we are going to protect patient access, we must organize as a movement.
What you can do:
(1) Forward this message. Let every patient, supporter, caregiver, and family member know that this is THE crucial time to get involved in the movement to protect safe access.
(2) Attend a meeting. We have formed a coalition of diverse patient and dispensary groups called the "Sensible Patient and Provider Coalition". The coalition group CMMR, is holding regular meetings to organize our movement. Sign up for email alerts, donate, and learn about meetings here.
(3) Contact your state representative today and let them know that patients need dispensaries. Find out who your representative is here.
(4) Support Sensible Colorado and other reform groups. The staff at Sensible Colorado has twice lead the movement to beat back the 5 patient cap. With your help we can do it again. Click here.
Thank you for your past and future efforts. This is an urgent time. Please act now.
Brian Vicente, Executive Director
Sensible Colorado
P.O. Box 18768, Denver, CO 80218
Ph# 720 890 4247
Fax# 303 861 0915
Executive Director, Sensible Colorado
Please consider this message an urgent plea for help. As accurately noted by Vince Carroll in Saturday's Denver Post, we are in serious jeopardy of losing the dispensary model in Colorado. See Post article here.
Now is the time to come together. Whether you have worked on this issue for 15 years or 15 days, we must put aside our differences and work together towards the common goal of protecting safe access in Colorado.
Our enemy is powerful. Law enforcement will stop at nothing to re-establish the 5 patient cap and destroy dispensaries. If we are going to protect patient access, we must organize as a movement.
What you can do:
(1) Forward this message. Let every patient, supporter, caregiver, and family member know that this is THE crucial time to get involved in the movement to protect safe access.
(2) Attend a meeting. We have formed a coalition of diverse patient and dispensary groups called the "Sensible Patient and Provider Coalition". The coalition group CMMR, is holding regular meetings to organize our movement. Sign up for email alerts, donate, and learn about meetings here.
(3) Contact your state representative today and let them know that patients need dispensaries. Find out who your representative is here.
(4) Support Sensible Colorado and other reform groups. The staff at Sensible Colorado has twice lead the movement to beat back the 5 patient cap. With your help we can do it again. Click here.
Thank you for your past and future efforts. This is an urgent time. Please act now.
Brian Vicente, Executive Director
Sensible Colorado
P.O. Box 18768, Denver, CO 80218
Ph# 720 890 4247
Fax# 303 861 0915
dakin3d
Well-Known Member
How does everyone feel, in general, about obtaining a license for it's intended purposes? For personal use, as well as for care-taking around 5-15 individuals. Does everyone have a license? Are you getting one, if not? If your not going to obtain a license at all, why? I'm just curious to hear everyone's response/input. I, like many, am interested in growing a small amount (ie, pound every 3 weeks) for myself and my close friends. I'm not looking to get rich, I already have a 'group' of individuals that would purchase from only myself. I just want to use meds for free and provide for my friends. Why would it be in my best/worst interest to get a license? Also, does anyone see a situation where individual growers of a comparable caliber will start getting raided for whatever reason? THanks in advance, dak
NewGrowth
Well-Known Member
We try to always charge less than $45 (usually cheaper) an 1/8 to our patients, the prices you are talking about should be reserved to the black market. Out goal is to produce ALL of our own meds so that we can pass the savings onto the patients and provide the highest quality consistentmeds. I wish we could meet in person ed because you seem to have A LOT of misconceptions about the medical community, dispensaries, and growing.
The problem with buying meds from all these little closet growers is the product is never consistent, usually improperly cured, and in too small a quantity.
When we have a surplus of meds they are sold to other dispensaries @ about $3000 a pound simply because it is the HIGHEST quality meds but I've seen them pay the same amount and even more for WET bud!!
The other thing that we do is work closely with our patients to help them grow, their own meds too. Most still come back for our stuff to supplement what they can grow.
My goal is always patient care before profits and when I see these places charging $65 an 1/8 it makes me want to stand out front and hand out free meds to the poor saps that pay that . . . .
NewGrowth
Well-Known Member
There is no such thing as a "growers license" this is a common misconception. ANYONE can grow as long as at least one patient designates them as a caregiver. Be sure to shop around for a good caregiver, one that goes above and beyond. They should also be giving you some free meds on the regular. I give my patients 1/4 oz a month as well as edibles, hash, tincture, ect. Usually with every order comes some type of freebie
EdGreyfox
Well-Known Member
New Growth.
I'm sorry if it offends you, but as far as I'm concerned anyone thats charging more then 20% over cost is ripping people off, period. Most of the factors that effect the quality are not exactly high priced, so the quality doesn't add that much to your cost per unit to produce. I make my living as a cost accountant, and I know darn well that as the size of the grow increases your price per unit drops. So, big growers should be able to produce a quality product at such a low cost that nobody would bother to grow their own eventually. At this point I know the laws are making it a bit difficult for anyone to want to invest what they would need to set up their grow using true economies of scale, but it's going to happen sooner or later. Dispensaries are a bit of a different story, since they have to price based on their costs to acquire the merchandise plus their overhead to store and sell it. Even so, 20% over cost is about as far as you can push your margin without me feeling like you are gouging people.
I'd love to sit down with some people from the local growing/pharmacy community and see their numbers, because if your books show anywhere near the cost estimates I've run for small grows then you are either: A) Being overcharged by the growers for your products, B) Not controlling your own costs very well, or C) Making a profit margin of at least 40%. If it's A or B then having someone like me look at the books and suggest some ways to save money is a good idea anyway. If it's C, not such a good idea.
I'm sorry if it offends you, but as far as I'm concerned anyone thats charging more then 20% over cost is ripping people off, period. Most of the factors that effect the quality are not exactly high priced, so the quality doesn't add that much to your cost per unit to produce. I make my living as a cost accountant, and I know darn well that as the size of the grow increases your price per unit drops. So, big growers should be able to produce a quality product at such a low cost that nobody would bother to grow their own eventually. At this point I know the laws are making it a bit difficult for anyone to want to invest what they would need to set up their grow using true economies of scale, but it's going to happen sooner or later. Dispensaries are a bit of a different story, since they have to price based on their costs to acquire the merchandise plus their overhead to store and sell it. Even so, 20% over cost is about as far as you can push your margin without me feeling like you are gouging people.
I'd love to sit down with some people from the local growing/pharmacy community and see their numbers, because if your books show anywhere near the cost estimates I've run for small grows then you are either: A) Being overcharged by the growers for your products, B) Not controlling your own costs very well, or C) Making a profit margin of at least 40%. If it's A or B then having someone like me look at the books and suggest some ways to save money is a good idea anyway. If it's C, not such a good idea.
NewGrowth
Well-Known Member
I don't know what land you are from Ed but hydro equipment and electricity is not cheap. You are right if we were able to produce on such a grand scale price would drop. Have you ever grown marijuana on a commercial scale?
A cost accountant and a grower are two VERY different professions. I feel you lack respect for growers because good ones are in shorter supply than you realize . . .
You simply CAN NOT calculate crop failures, costs to move ops all the time, transport costs, and so many other acts of god that we are stricken with.
Get off you high horse an go try to grow some pot man then come back an tell me we are charging too much
And this is the PROBLEM we have accountants and pencil pushers trying to write legislation for the people and the patients end up getting screwed.
Now put this into you calculator
EdGreyfox
Well-Known Member
New,
Bull. Every one of those items you mentioned is simple to figure the cost on in advance. Anybody can calculate their electrical usage to the penny if they are willing to take a couple of minutes to do the math, and I don't see any reason why you should have all kinds of costs to move around in the first place. As for lost harvests, agricultural accounting allows you to treat a certain percentage of each crops costs as a loss until a profit is actually realized on it for that very reason. You're just ducking the issue and throwing fake costs at me to try and hide the fact that you run profit margins that are far higher then in any other industry.
I have plenty of respect for growers, just not for the ones that pretend that they are doing us a favor when they sell us an 1/8th for $45 when their own cost was less then $25. And yes, i do know what it costs to grow commercially- I do my caregivers books for him. Thanks. You can dislike me all you want, but you better start paying attention and learn how the real business world works or someone like me is going to come along and put you out of business.
Bull. Every one of those items you mentioned is simple to figure the cost on in advance. Anybody can calculate their electrical usage to the penny if they are willing to take a couple of minutes to do the math, and I don't see any reason why you should have all kinds of costs to move around in the first place. As for lost harvests, agricultural accounting allows you to treat a certain percentage of each crops costs as a loss until a profit is actually realized on it for that very reason. You're just ducking the issue and throwing fake costs at me to try and hide the fact that you run profit margins that are far higher then in any other industry.
I have plenty of respect for growers, just not for the ones that pretend that they are doing us a favor when they sell us an 1/8th for $45 when their own cost was less then $25. And yes, i do know what it costs to grow commercially- I do my caregivers books for him. Thanks. You can dislike me all you want, but you better start paying attention and learn how the real business world works or someone like me is going to come along and put you out of business.
T
THseaman
Guest
$3000 a lb is ridiculously low for top quality meds in CO. Unless you have a scratch my back relationship in effect with the dispensary you are wholesaling it to, you should probably charge more, as you are undercutting the market. I doubt the dispensaries that are buying your meds are selling it to the patients for any less than if you charged them $4400, which is what I get, religiously
Ignore people like Ed. They are clueless, self-righteous, know-it-alls(know nothings) and wont learn no matter what type of logic you present them with.
Ignore people like Ed. They are clueless, self-righteous, know-it-alls(know nothings) and wont learn no matter what type of logic you present them with.
NewGrowth
Well-Known Member
$4400 is about right but we usually retail through our own store so we can give away meds to those in the most need and offer lower prices to everyone else.
YoungOneDaHungOne
Member
hello to all. I am a student in Florida and I will be moving to Denver asap to be apart of the marijuana community of growers in the area. I have my bachelors in horticulture science and I am ready to do everything by the books for the right reasons. If anyone in range of this message can give me advice on certification, most productive grow setup, and prices i am open to any and all advice and pointers from those who have experience in this field. Please reply with any insight to either this profile or my personal email [email protected] thank you
doogleef
Well-Known Member
http://www.kdvr.com/news/kdvr-xgr-medical-marijuana-020110,0,3279125.story It passed the state Senate today.
NewGrowth
Well-Known Member
Damn WTF 34-1!?
I don't know what land you are from Ed but hydro equipment and electricity is not cheap. You are right if we were able to produce on such a grand scale price would drop. Have you ever grown marijuana on a commercial scale?
A cost accountant and a grower are two VERY different professions. I feel you lack respect for growers because good ones are in shorter supply than you realize . . .
You simply CAN NOT calculate crop failures, costs to move ops all the time, transport costs, and so many other acts of god that we are stricken with.
Get off you high horse an go try to grow some pot man then come back an tell me we are charging too much
And this is the PROBLEM we have accountants and pencil pushers trying to write legislation for the people and the patients end up getting screwed.
Now put this into you calculator
Dude, you sound like you're about 17. You're telling Ed to get off his 'high horse' when you're making all the egregious and arrogant statements.
If you're 'medicine' is so good you have nothing to worry about in terms of competition with these 'little closet growers' as you put it, right?
All I'm saying is that the free market will decide. Is the model you present any more sustainable than the 'closet growers'? I dont necessarily think so.