Coco Growers Unite!

#1Raiderfan420 said:

Why are they all in the same cup?

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>? i just like 16oz cups for clones. perfect amount of medium an size.

So, this isnt rootbound in coco? i didnt think so, these guys are only 3" and they are already covering the pot with roots AFTER 10 DAYS!
look at the pic...
I was worried since i havent been seeing that much explosive foilage growth, but i dont think i have seen as much roots with such young plants.

this is with every day water small amounts, i think at this point tho, i am gonna daily water with run off every time. im testing this on a couple to see what happens.

I am flowering in 1 gallons, but i dont wanna transplant these guys yet, i need them bigger. how much longer should i wait in solo cups guys? also i plan on vegin them in 1 gallons for 2 weeks before i flip lights, because roots dont grow much in flower? this correct???

bigbillyboy05 said:

>? i just like 16oz cups for clones. perfect amount of medium an size.

So, this isnt rootbound in coco? i didnt think so, these guys are only 3" and they are already covering the pot with roots AFTER 10 DAYS!
look at the pic...
I was worried since i havent been seeing that much explosive foilage growth, but i dont think i have seen as much roots with such young plants.

this is with every day water small amounts, i think at this point tho, i am gonna daily water with run off every time. im testing this on a couple to see what happens.

I am flowering in 1 gallons, but i dont wanna transplant these guys yet, i need them bigger. how much longer should i wait in solo cups guys? also i plan on vegin them in 1 gallons for 2 weeks before i flip lights, because roots dont grow much in flower? this correct???

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just my opinion if you are going to veg in a 1gal pot, then you should put it in a larger pot when you flower, especially since you are saying you want them bigger. i dont know what kind of room you are working with, but 2 weeks of veg, 8 to 9 weeks of flower just say 11 weeks in the same small 1gal pot. if it's looking like that in 10 days, what do you expect in 11 weeks. it will definitley be rootbound by then. now i don't know what happens when a plant gets rootbound, but i do know that everyone everywhere says it's a bad thing, so i never let it happen. that's just my opinion, ok. think about it though.


PEACE!!!
-ZEN-

#1Raiderfan420 said:

Why are they all in the same cup?

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edit:cup'S

Still not gettin the cups thing haha? no clue.

Yea, im gonna flower as soon as roots are setup.

maybe put them in 2 gallons as after 1s.

I do want roots to fill out tho, in coco, isnt it better to be a LITTLE rootbound>>?

thanks for help

bigbilly, it's good to transplant when the roots are full, I would wait a week and transplant into a three gallon container. I would transplant them now or in a week and let them grow for a week in their new bigger containers before switching your lights to 12/12. let them grow some new roots in the new container so they can absorb nutes from all over the saturated pot. But looking great, I love coco. almost every coco plant I have seen has been healthy as all hell.

growbuddy said:

bigbilly, it's good to transplant when the roots are full, I would wait a week and transplant into a three gallon container. I would transplant them now or in a week and let them grow for a week in their new bigger containers before switching your lights to 12/12. let them grow some new roots in the new container so they can absorb nutes from all over the saturated pot. But looking great, I love coco. almost every coco plant I have seen has been healthy as all hell.

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Thanks for the advice. I really gotta say, even tho i have grown in coco, i never thought they would fill the cups so fast, i wasnt exspecting to transplant for another week or 2!

I transplanted to 1 gallons, im gonna get them going in these, then onto the 2 gallons pots. this will be depending on the size i get outta the 1 gallons.

I fed them after transplant, only about 350mL of water, just keeping it moist, i figure thats enough for 3 days, and let them dry out well to really get roots going. Thats the idea right>? until they fill up the pots just keep it moist>?

Also i am doing the lucas method for coco. This is of course, 6mL every 3rd feeding, or 2ml every feeding of just flora nova bloom. I am doing the 2mL every feeding.

I plan on feeding 1x a day in veg and 2x a day in flower.

i am thinking about going about 150mL every day to start in veg, watered over about 10mins(drip), after the lights comon. This low amount is so every day it gets wet, then moist.

TELL ME IM WRONG AND IM AN IDIOT, eat me up guys. ill get more pics tommarow.

i wouldnt let them dry out "well" even when your trying to get the roots to grow,

i would give them very small amounts of water and let them dry out just slightly.... coco is hydro, so you should never allow it to dry out completely or too much.

if the container is getting light (has lost close to half its water weight), then it is time to water, even if the coco still appears moist.

my 2cents

jberry said:

i wouldnt let them dry out "well" even when your trying to get the roots to grow,

i would give them very small amounts of water and let them dry out just slightly.... coco is hydro, so you should never allow it to dry out completely or too much.

if the container is getting light (has lost close to half its water weight), then it is time to water, even if the coco still appears moist.

my 2cents

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thanks for the advice j berry. i actually was weighing my clones for watering, found out givem about 35mL a day was perfect, got crazy roots. ill have to see how wet the coco is tommarow night. I need to setup my drippers, and im gonna try to keep the coco a little more moist then dry, taking j berrys advice, maybe 200mL a day.

2mL of floranova bloom every feeding.

would 200mL be better at 1 time feed in the morning, or say 100mL in the morning, 100ml at lunch?

has anyone here used lucas meth in coco?
THANKS GUYS

https://www.rollitup.org/indoor-growing/264764-canna-coco-drip-feed-1-a-3.html
(my journal)

twice at a 100ml would be better but only if it has lost the weight, and once your cutting has become a established you should shoot for a average of 15-20 % of total run-off over the total length of the grow, you dont have to get all technical about it but keep it in mind...
if your run off drains into a bucket it is easy to see the amount... and if you keep track of how much water is used it is easy to find your run-off average.

I never heard of the lucas formula with coco...it may not have enough calcium for growing coco (coco holds/steals calcium very well), and there could be problems with K as well, but im no expert on lucas and i could be wrong.

jberry said:

twice at a 100ml would be better but only if it has lost the weight, and once your cutting has become a established you should shoot for a average of 15-20 % of total run-off over the total length of the grow, you dont have to get all technical about it but keep it in mind...
if your run off drains into a bucket it is easy to see the amount... and if you keep track of how much water is used it is easy to find your run-off average.

I never heard of the lucas formula with coco...it may not have enough calcium for growing coco (coco holds/steals calcium very well), and there could be problems with K as well, but im no expert on lucas and i could be wrong.

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yea i am skeptical about lucas, but i found this post in ICmag.com:
2ml/gal FNB every irrigation, or 6ml every 3rd irrigation
> much FloraNovaBloom is needed to equal Canna's Coco Bloom forumula?

anyone else doing something similiar, any more excellent advice?
I APPRECIATE EVERYONE A TON! a thousand thank u's.

about 2ml/gallon of FNB

> I just don't want to run into silly deficiencies... (btw - I am making the switch to B'Cuzz coco mix)

Canna is notorious for Mg deficiency, and the recommend adding epsom. FNB will not be Mg deficient.

disclaimer
coco has issues with locking up P and K , canna coco comes preloaded with extra P and K, I dont know if BCuzz is different in that regard

but, yes, you can feed with 2ml/gal of FNB at EVERY irrigation,and it will not cause deficiency (or you can water with plain water every 2 irrigations, then on the 3rd watering use 6ml/gal FNB

there may be other coco specific problems related to overwatering, but, you can certainly use FNB with Coco

Lucas

I dunno tho, im not seeing exsplosive growth and they are kind of lime looking. the new growth is doing better tho, i see a perfect green coming in.

It says on GH website, for grow use 10ml a gallon for grow stage, 12.5 for aggressive growth. It continues to say for soiless mediums(coco), use full strength every 3rd feeding or use 1/4 strength every feeding. so their grow forumla is 10ml a gallon every 3rd water or 2.2mL every water. i am using floranova bloom tho thru whole cycle, not any grow.

I am not saying im not willing to up the dosage(because by any means, I WANT TO!) especially if its gona get things going.

But right now when im not getting runoff, i wanna keep the salt build up to a minimum, hence using less nutes right now. Whats everyones thoughts on Flora Nova Bloom in Canna coco 100%??? I am on a drip setup, and im sorry but i refuse to go feed, water, water, feed, water, water.thats why i got the drippers. MUAHAH

i just realize from past 2 grows, nutrients do build up in medium, especially when your not getting runoff(when their young and after transplant), so whats the tricks??

I just water my plants when the coco is very dry on top and a little wet at the bottom

So what I do is mix my nutes with 2 gal of water according to canna.com grow guide.

usually between 700-900ppm

and once I have the nute mixtured ph correct I water them by hand till it is all used and a about 10 % of the nutes mix comes out the drain holes.

That is all ok right?

growbuddy said:

I just water my plants when the coco is very dry on top and a little wet at the bottom

So what I do is mix my nutes with 2 gal of water according to canna.com grow guide.

usually between 700-900ppm

and once I have the nute mixtured ph correct I water them by hand till it is all used and a about 10 % of the nutes mix comes out the drain holes.

That is all ok right?

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Those are some gangster ass plants dude. props!

2mL of floranova + my 160ppm tap water=700ppm
this is what i have been using

I think im gonna go with a stronger solution from here on im thinking 4ml a gallon. seems that fatman, jberry, and you say bump it up. thanks guys.

Lucas is one smart cookie but you should not run plain water through coco...

As far as salt build up and run off.... the run off is how you keep the salts from building up. If you are worried about salt build up due to high EC (probably nothin 2 worry about) then try bumping it up to 1000 ppm or so, and then the next water go back to 800 ppm.... you can keep doing this until you are comfortable sticking to the higher ppm (1100-1200?).... the last week or 2, drop the ppm back down to 800.

jberry said:

Lucas is one smart cookie but you should not run plain water through coco...

As far as salt build up and run off.... the run off is how you keep the salts from building up. If you are worried about salt build up due to high EC (probably nothin 2 worry about) then try bumping it up to 1000 ppm or so, and then the next water go back to 800 ppm.... you can keep doing this until you are comfortable sticking to the higher ppm (1100-1200?).... the last week or 2, drop the ppm back down to 800.

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I think thats what i am gonna do, keep a close eye, if anything goes wrong, ill let ya know : ). i got the dream team it seems haha

YOU GUYS ARE AWESOME THANKS FOR YOUR TIME.

as for running water through coco, this is surprising me.

Lucas method for coco AND people at the hydro store said the same thing. The only difference in tactic was hydro store said FULL STRENGTH every other water, while lucas says full every 3rd water.

I pretty much am getting that salt build up isnt a problem as long as you get proper runoff (and not using high PPMs)

What i am more concerned with tho, is the build up WHILE I AM NOT GETTING RUNOFF. transplanting and freshly rooted clones, from what i gather, should no get runoff for 1st week, then water every other day or so with runoff(watever works in my situation.

By not getting runoff in my solo cups with clones, i tested 1 of the 15, my ph was perfect 5.9, but my PPMS were 1400.

Definitly got some build up in the cups with no run off.

But i also shouldve been watering with runoff wayyyyyy earlier. I didnt realize how much rootmass they had until yesterday!

plain water stunts the micro biology growth in your coco and messes with any buffers the company may have added.

if you email Canna (the world leaders in cocoponic research) they will tell you to never run plain water through coco, i believe them over anyone. Just use a super diluted mix if you want to flush (unless it is the final pre harvest flush)

runoff isnt necessary its just the way most peeps do it. i water by hand just enough each day, no run off and so far no problems

Don Gin and Ton said:

runoff isnt necessary its just the way most peeps do it. i water by hand just enough each day, no run off and so far no problems

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what kinda nutes and feeding sched DON?

canna A+B from start to finish
humbold county's own purple max foliar feed maybe 2 or 3 times a week~ ongoing
humbold county's own purple max 1 ml per L for a couple of feeds around week 4
canna PK 13/14 at full strength week 6 & 7 sometimes double strength strain depending.
humbold county's own gravity for the last week (if i need them finished for tent space)
flush for a couple of days if ive been feeding heavy right up to the end ill use some final phase AN

ive never flushed midway through the grow seems pointless unless your hydro? i hear talk of salt buildup and this n that but i generally just do a weaker feed n let the plant tell me if im feeding to much by looking for burn. i dont even use a ph pen. tho i recently got an ec meter, for what i dont know i used it last night and it said 2.4. means nothin to me.

Don Gin and Ton said:

canna A+B from start to finish
humbold county's own purple max foliar feed maybe 2 or 3 times a week~ ongoing
humbold county's own purple max 1 ml per L for a couple of feeds around week 4
canna PK 13/14 at full strength week 6 & 7 sometimes double strength strain depending.
humbold county's own gravity for the last week (if i need them finished for tent space)
flush for a couple of days if ive been feeding heavy right up to the end ill use some final phase AN

ive never flushed midway through the grow seems pointless unless your hydro? i hear talk of salt buildup and this n that but i generally just do a weaker feed n let the plant tell me if im feeding to much by looking for burn. i dont even use a ph pen. tho i recently got an ec meter, for what i dont know i used it last night and it said 2.4. means nothin to me.

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canna coco a+b nutrient profile max strength, is same as floranova bloom, id you dilute 8ml 2/3rds.

correct.? which is about 2.7mL of FNB per gallon, i have been going 2mL right now.
note the Canna Coco Bloom recipe profile, it is about a 33% dilution of the 8ml GH Micro, plus 16 ml per gallon of GH Bloom formula.. (but with more Nitrogen).. Maybe medium based nutes are intentionally weak, so they accumulate in the pot?

8ml GH Micro 16 ml GH Bloom, is my guru pH's baseline bloom formula (pH is a person) derived from the Mel Frank targets, which suggest a 100-100-200-60 goal for NPKMG values in bloom Both GH Flora series nutes and the Flora Nova series, achieve Mel Franks targets without additives. Here is a link to Mel's specs http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/fou...s/profiles.htm
pH's "Lucas Formula" values for 8ml micro, 16ml bloom
n 130
p 106
k 183
Mg 73

8 Flora Nova grow. Flora Nova is the one bottle solution to nutrients, note this mix is almost identical to Canna Aqua Vega, and GrowGreen's Nute Recipe
n 217
p 54
k 257
Mg 46

8 fnBloom
n 124
p 108
k 180
Mg 62

GH's baseline Flora Series, the 3 bottles, green purple and red, (different from Flora Nova series) veg formula
GH 15grow, 10micro, 5bloom
211
46
263
40

and GH 3 part bloom formula
GH 5grow, 10micro, 15bloom
159
92
219
66


canna coco 5.7a plus 5.7b (this is their baseline 3ml per liter formula), the highest dosage they recommend is 14ml/gal of canna coco A plus 14 of B). This mix (5.7ml/gal) is less than 1/3 strength of GH Flora Nova Bloom @8ml per gallon on the P, K and Mg..
N 87
P 30
K 43
Mg 17


canna coco 8/a and 8/b
121
42
60
24

Here is canna coco's strongest bloom mix, before the pk14 boost. it resembles the GH FloraNovaGrow recipe in its Nitrogen level
canna coco 14/a and 14/b
212
74
106
42

big bill, just because the different brands have the same values when it comes to NPK doesnt mean that they are the same.... sometimes it does but so many products have unlisted ingredients theses days.




don, 2.4 EC is pretty high for coco, you could go a little higher b4 maxing out at 2.8