cheap HPA pump

pinner420 said:

That's certainly a limiting factor. any good builds you would suggest?

Click to expand...

I've basically been figuring this out as I go along, because nobody in their right mind does aero so you don't find a lot of builds on here. The benefits don't really outweigh the risks. I don't advise anyone to follow in my footsteps. It's been a rough road so far. I'm just doing it because I like failing at things over and over and over trying to find solutions. If I just cared about producing lots of weed I'd probably just use DWC or drip tables or something like that.

LarsVegasNirvana said:

I've basically been figuring this out as I go along, because nobody in their right mind does aero so you don't find a lot of builds on here. The benefits don't really outweigh the risks. I don't advise anyone to follow in my footsteps. It's been a rough road so far. I'm just doing it because I like failing at things over and over and over trying to find solutions. If I just cared about producing lots of weed I'd probably just use DWC or drip tables or something like that.

Click to expand...

I found a 2011 thread that is quite definitive. I've heard you can run an ec of .3

freddy42 said:

you mean like in soil ? can you elaborate on that little more?

Click to expand...

You can run mothers in soil or basic hydro, the only thing i wouldnt use is coco. Chinese pumps can be virtually silent running. for example, el cheapo 24v dc RO booster pumps. They dont have huge output (0.6 - 0.8 LPM) but thats not an issue when its only being used to charge an accumulator. A pressure relief valve is a good safety feature on an automatic system. A pressure regulator allows you to maintain a desired system pressure (eg 80psi) even though the accumulator may be running from 120psi (when full) to 80psi (almost empty). Pressure variation has an effect on the mist quality and nozzle flowrate.
You`ll need bloody good ears to hear this down the street

Yeah, I'm kind of kicking myself for not using a pressure regulator. I'll put it on my todo list.

Atomizer said:

You can run mothers in soil or basic hydro, the only thing i wouldnt use is coco. Chinese pumps can be virtually silent running. for example, el cheapo 24v dc RO booster pumps. They dont have huge output (0.6 - 0.8 LPM) but thats not an issue when its only being used to charge an accumulator. A pressure relief valve is a good safety feature on an automatic system. A pressure regulator allows you to maintain a desired system pressure (eg 80psi) even though the accumulator may be running from 120psi (when full) to 80psi (almost empty). Pressure variation has an effect on the mist quality and nozzle flowrate.

Click to expand...

Why would you not run in coco? It'd grow slightly faster in coco by comparison. I prefer soilless mixes to soil in general.

Coco is a great medium but i wouldnt use it for mothers that could be around for years.

Atomizer said:

Coco is a great medium but i wouldnt use it for mothers that could be around for years.

Click to expand...

I don't understand why not. I reuse my peat/coco/pumice/perlite mix regularly, as I grow organically.

The mix of mediums and running organic is much better than running with straight coco. There is a limit on how many times you can reuse coco before it becomes more trouble than its worth. I keep mothers in simple dutch pots (with hydroton) which pretty much look after themselves..

LarsVegasNirvana said:

Who said anything about a flow meter? They're too inaccurate to use for anything useful. I don't even know what you think you'd use it for.

For the dimming function you just change the output voltage of an analog output pin on the arduino and plug that into the driver instead of a potentiometer.

I didn't say I needed the chamber 8 feet deep. I said you would need that if you wanted to grow trees. My last chamber was 1 foot deep, and my new one is 2-3 feet deep.

My idea for a root trellis is to just hot-glue some really fine mesh (like for screen printing) at the bottom of the chamber, not the top. That way if any roots make it to the bottom they won't touch any pooling water and they will maintain root hairs instead of turning into DWC roots. I haven't tried it yet because I'm waiting to see if they even reach the bottom of this new design first.

Click to expand...

It was kind of a dumb question I just got misleaded by post from another forum.
So solenoids for each 10-14nozzles 1 solenoid +temp/humidity sensor, waterproof thermometer (for every chamber) right ? how much of those
ADS1115 Module 16 Bit I2C ADC 4 channel Converters would I need? + how much solide state relays?
arduino uno r3 ?
Im still trying to figure out If you connected power outlets to arduino to make it use as timer too or If you figured it out by that potenciometer or some other way like mechanical/digital separate timers.
I know that I have kind of noobie questions but better than making unwanted mistakes.
Btw those nozzles you have, some people are talking buying them in bulk but most of them didnt worked, whats your opinion on that man ? maybe they didnt used RO water or something ? @LarsVegasNirvana

@Atomizer how much el cheapo pump cost you ? I havent heard anything only slight buzzing. :O

I have used coco and I must agree there is limitation on how many times it can be reused,it killed my beautiful 2 big lst'd motherplantsso you are running hydro for your mothers?
one more question do you think that rockwool cubes and drip is a bad idea for mother plants? I had serious pest issues before, so I try to keep rootzone easily accessible and pest free. I would be thankful for savings on power bill so I would rather than would run drip/rockwool or dwc for mothers. got this unused air pump with 6 outlets capable of running 220gph at max is that usable ? Probably you get faster growth than in soil, I must compare lpa, drip and dwc for motherplants and find out which is faster.

I would go for what you feel most comfortable with, if you need a lot of cuts run several mothers and alternate to gain time.
El cheapo` pumps where i am can be had for around £45 including 24v transformer and delivery. Without an accumulator they are only good for a smallish system as the flowrate limits the number of nozzles you can run. I used to think my hardware shopping lists were pretty extravagant but you guys seem to be going all out on the tech

You mean running them in soil or soiless, this is what I stumbled upon., I dont know what way to choose, but Im thinking drip and big rockwool cubes, how do you run your mamacitas? . Thats a good price indeed, are you from UK? This is starting to feel like a little interview lol, Back to that pump so with accumulator/pressure tank it can be used for mid setup ? Where did you bought your nozzles from? I checked out your video as utube suggestion, they seems to create pretty fine mist. If you compare possible, maybe previous setups, besides the control, do hpa offered you gains in terms of faster flowering development?
@Atomizer

I use dutch pots, which are top drip hydroton. If you like RW and drip give it a go
Aye, in the uk where the price of everything magically doubles. I ran a 56 cubic foot hpa chamber on an dinky aquatec cdp 6800 coupled to an accumulator, i wouldnt recommend it but it can be done. I use a variety of nozzles as the mist pattern and throw is geared to the chamber and planting layout. The ones in the vid are prolly netafims, i bought them years ago (2011 or 12) so the firm may have gone.
I find hpa one of the easiest methods, good growth rates coupled with minimal maintenance and no medium to lug about. Drain to waste hpa is pretty much fill the accumulator and come back when its time to fill it again, which leaves me more time to play with the AA.

The only thing with these rockwool cubes is that they wear off, I mean they loose their structure due the root mass, and I dont want the mommas die just like they did in coco ( when the root mass become really big they overgrow the coco and die, they were in airpots btw. I dont know if this was the exact reason why they died, but I think so. Does the hydroton get overgrown too ? I bet when the roots get longer, the possibility is to trim the roots? That dutch bucket system seems really smart, I can get access to perlite for cheap, but I would need some bag to put it in, some people use paint strainers for buckets, but I cannot find one, maybe I didnt got lucky enough. How many buckets and what pump do you use ? Totally B if not even tripled when you want to order some aquatec stuff. So elcheapo was aquatec right ? I can see why it was so quiet did you bought it from states? I wanted to buy whole set from multiponics, but the tax/vat would be astronomical I think. Thats a pitty for me with those nozzles, which ones would you suggest as alternative?
@Atomizer

I keep my mothers in a mix of 40% perlite 60% miracle grow moisture control soil. The perlite keeps it from compacting as the soil breaks down.

LarsVegasNirvana said:

I keep my mothers in a mix of 40% perlite 60% miracle grow moisture control soil. The perlite keeps it from compacting as the soil breaks down.

Click to expand...

nice to hear that I think I will try that bucket system, Im curious if that arduino buying list of mine is complete enough, what do you think? and also can you please elaborate on if you use the arduino as timer for the lights too ? how it is connected, if the connection of dimming port is also used for shuting it down or if I would need some kind of outlet socket. Thank you very much @LarsVegasNirvana

freddy42 said:

It was kind of a dumb question I just got misleaded by post from another forum.
So solenoids for each 10-14nozzles 1 solenoid +temp/humidity sensor, waterproof thermometer (for every chamber) right ? how much of those
ADS1115 Module 16 Bit I2C ADC 4 channel Converters would I need? + how much solide state relays?
arduino uno r3 ?
Im still trying to figure out If you connected power outlets to arduino to make it use as timer too or If you figured it out by that potenciometer or some other way like mechanical/digital separate timers.
I know that I have kind of noobie questions but better than making unwanted mistakes.
Btw those nozzles you have, some people are talking buying them in bulk but most of them didnt worked, whats your opinion on that man ? maybe they didnt used RO water or something ? @LarsVegasNirvana

Click to expand...

It's pretty clear you have no idea what you're doing. I can't teach you all of this. You need to go learn arduino on your own.

You don't need an ADC because the sensors I just described are digital. The leaf sensor would need that, but you don't need a leaf sensor at all, ESPECIALLY since you have no idea what you're doing. You really should just use an arduino to fire the servos and thats it. Or better yet buy a commercial interval timer.

I don't use an arduino to turn the lights on and off. I would probably still use a mechanical timer, and then use some kind of light sensor to tell the arduino when the lights come on. You could just keep it dimmed and then when you detect that it's on you can slowly turn it up. Then when the lights turn off you don't really need any dimming. You just detect that they are off and then turn the dimmer back down to prepare for morning.

Solid state relays are like $10. You can get them for $5 from china probably.

I bought 25 nozzles and I haven't run out of nozzles yet. So far I've only had one go bad. No big deal. You can and should use new nozzles for every grow. They're cheap as hell so there's no reason not to.

Those 24v pumps seem like they're much quieter than my pump (plus I can run them on a couple of batteries instead of 120v AC) but they cost twice as much as the espresso pump I'm using. I think those booster pumps are gear pumps? I looked into ordering a smaller one from a pump manufacturer, but there are SO MANY kinds, you need to call a salesman up at the company and figure out which one to order. It just seemed like a lot of work.

I also have no idea if you can turn it off with the dimming function. It's your ballast not mine.

You got a point on that, but Im willing to learn I know it would be more valuable for me if I choose to learn all of it on my own. I guess I will start just with a simple timer setup and dimming knob and then work the things up slowly to arduino. If I download the script you wanna upload on github and put it in the arduino, would it be very hard to set and edit timer settings for nozzles ? Thank you for your input about the nozzles. The ballast is protected so it wouldnt be possible to take it all the way down.
@LarsVegasNirvana

El cheapo`s are diaphragm pumps the same as aquatecs.El cheapo is not aquatec brand. its made in china not the usa I have a 6800 and an 8800 which are mainly used for backup and the odd experiment these days. 8800`s can be found in the uk but they`re not cheap at £107 ($136)
http://www.windowcleaningwarehouse.co.uk/aquatec-24v-booster-pump.html
I have a beefy propump dp-160 (160psi) 12v pump for the big accumulator. Its pretty noisy but only runs to charge the tank and then its disconnected (no pressure switch or relief valve required).
Everything else runs on compressed air supplied by a homebrew 1.5hp silent compressor and a commercial bambi bb24v (0.5hp) which is also silent running but transmits almost no vibration to the floor which makes a difference when its stood on upstairs floorboards not a solid floor.