Bubbleponics

Im no expert , but if you havent changed the water in the 4 weeks i would prob change because they may of used up the nutes and its good to clean out your tank but if you recently changed it i would jus top up, then keep them new nutes in your tank for the first week or two of flowering then move to your flowering nutes. hope this helps

You should change your res every 2 weeks or so.You need to discard the the used up nutrients and add a new batch every res change.Do you have a ppm meter???You need to keep tabs on the strength of your nutrient solution so you know how fast your plants are using the nutrients and when to change out your nutrients.

jcdws602 said:

You should change your res every 2 weeks or so.You need to discard the the used up nutrients and add a new batch every res change.Do you have a ppm meter???You need to keep tabs on the strength of your nutrient solution so you know how fast your plants are using the nutrients and when to change out your nutrients.

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Thanks for the tip. I don't have PPM meter, but I'm hoping to get one with a digital PH tester included. Can you tell me how the PPM meter works to detect how fast my plants eat their nutrients? Thanks in advance.

lets say you fill the res and add the nutes on monday... but by wed/thurs you need to add more... lets say you lost 20% of the res water... so mix up a batch of nutes equal to the amount you need to add to top of the reservoir, in this case 20% of the reservoir size... then top off the res...

now since i read you dont have a PPM meter (which if you are using hydro of any sort you really need a ppm and ph meter.. you need to keep the ph in range and its always good to know the strength of your nute solution) you may just choose to top of the reservoir throughout the week..

now when next monday comes, you should dump out whatever you have in the res, refill and start over with fresh nutes and water for the week... you can probably get away with every 2 weeks (full change) and just add water and nutes as needed between times.. but once a week is optimal... its a pain in the ass (i have a 50 gallon res myself i do every sat/sun).. but at least you know your plants are always getting fresh water and plenty of nutes...

I found this link which sells combo meters. Does anyone know if these are good products?

http://www.horticulturesource.com/product_info.php?products_id=6005

simpsonsampson420 said:

lets say you fill the res and add the nutes on monday... but by wed/thurs you need to add more... lets say you lost 20% of the res water... so mix up a batch of nutes equal to the amount you need to add to top of the reservoir, in this case 20% of the reservoir size... then top off the res...

now since i read you dont have a PPM meter (which if you are using hydro of any sort you really need a ppm and ph meter.. you need to keep the ph in range and its always good to know the strength of your nute solution) you may just choose to top of the reservoir throughout the week..

now when next monday comes, you should dump out whatever you have in the res, refill and start over with fresh nutes and water for the week... you can probably get away with every 2 weeks (full change) and just add water and nutes as needed between times.. but once a week is optimal... its a pain in the ass (i have a 50 gallon res myself i do every sat/sun).. but at least you know your plants are always getting fresh water and plenty of nutes...

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Thanks for this information. Does the HANNA HI 98129 pH EC TDS °C Combo Tester, HI98129 test the PPMs of the water? Basically, I gather from what you are saying that I test the PPMs in the water right after I add the nutes, then I recheck it in a couple of days. If the PPMs have droped then I replace that amount of nutes to bring it back up to the org. total of PPMs from when I first added the solution? How do you know when that 20% has been replenished? You just add little by little and then keep retesting it until you get to that number? Now, will any of this cause overfeeding or nute burn? Thanks in advance.

arj1981 said:

Thanks for this information. Does the HANNA HI 98129 pH EC TDS °C Combo Tester, HI98129 test the PPMs of the water? Basically, I gather from what you are saying that I test the PPMs in the water right after I add the nutes, then I recheck it in a couple of days. If the PPMs have droped then I replace that amount of nutes to bring it back up to the org. total of PPMs from when I first added the solution? How do you know when that 20% has been replenished? You just add little by little and then keep retesting it until you get to that number? Now, will any of this cause overfeeding or nute burn? Thanks in advance.

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the meter you said will tell you the ppm... but its not ppm, its EC/TDS.. ec is the most accurate reading.. ec stands for electrical conductivity... it is universal.. PPMs can change from meter to meter... here is a link to a chart that will help explain it a little more http://www.gardenscure.com/420/hydroponics/96521-printable-ec-ppm-cf-conversion-chart.html but yeah you have the right idea.. add your nutes to your water and check ec... this will give you the PPM if you use the chart... adjust as needed.. if its to high add some water to thin it out.. if its too low add some more nutes to raise it... but get the water/nute solution to where you want it in the res...

now as water evaporates from the res you will need to add more water.. but also as the water evaporates the ec will rise as it concentrates the nutes more.. so you may not have to add any nutes when topping it off... if you notice that it is dropping out of the range you want then just mix a batch of nutes up to add to the res... now it shouldnt take a full strength batch of nutes.. maybe 1/2 strength.. if you need them at all...

ill tell you my situation as an example just cause it will illustrate what i mean a little more..

i fill my res up on sundays... i know exactly how much water to add and how much of each nute to use because i have written it down each res change.. this helps me save time and helps me ensure that i start out each res change with the target EC i want to hit... i use a truncheon, so using the chart i linked you to, at the ec i target (1., it means my ppm is about 1200

my plants average about 5 gallons of water useage a day... but even as the water level decreases the ec will remain about the same.. it might flucuate .1/.2 lower... so the next day i check it (i check it everyday) and its about the same..

usually by day 3 after the res change i think about adding water... they've drank about 15 gallons or so by then.. so i add about 10 gallons of water... not quite the full 15 they drank... mostly because i dont want to make more than 1 trip with water buckets... after adding the 10 gallons of water, my ec might drop and stay at .2/.4 lower than the orginal ec... so my ppm might drop from the original 1200ish ppm to around 800 to1000 ppm...

then over the next few days it stays around that ppm... even as the plants continue to drink the 5 gallons a day of water they do... this takes me up to about the time i need to do a res change and it starts all over...

i have the nutes and water usage my plants need down.. just from documenting it... but lets say i was going to add anymore nutes to the batch.. i would only add about a 1/4 strength or 1/2 strength batch... just to give the solution a boost...

depending on the nutes you use it could be different.. its all about the consumption of your plants.. if you notice that you start off day one at 1200ppm and by day 3 or 4 you are down to 500ppm, then you know when you top it off you need to add more... the thing is until you know what your plants needs are you wont really know how much to top off with.. and whether to use just water or nutes...

its acceptable to flucuate the ppms... the 800 to 1200 range is prefectly fine... its not really possible to burn the plants if you keep a steady ppm by replacing the old nutes.. but it is a waste of nutes since your plant wont use them all before the next res change.... so part of whether to add nutes will also depend on how often you change your res... if you plan on every 2 weeks you will definatly need to add some to make it through.. how much will depend on your plants... if you plan on changing weekly tho, adding nutes between changes is less important because you want them to use as much as they can so you waste as little as possible.. although some waste is unavoidable..

simpsonsampson420 said:

the meter you said will tell you the ppm... but its not ppm, its EC/TDS.. ec is the most accurate reading.. ec stands for electrical conductivity... it is universal.. PPMs can change from meter to meter... here is a link to a chart that will help explain it a little more http://www.gardenscure.com/420/hydroponics/96521-printable-ec-ppm-cf-conversion-chart.html but yeah you have the right idea.. add your nutes to your water and check ec... this will give you the PPM if you use the chart... adjust as needed.. if its to high add some water to thin it out.. if its too low add some more nutes to raise it... but get the water/nute solution to where you want it in the res...

now as water evaporates from the res you will need to add more water.. but also as the water evaporates the ec will rise as it concentrates the nutes more.. so you may not have to add any nutes when topping it off... if you notice that it is dropping out of the range you want then just mix a batch of nutes up to add to the res... now it shouldnt take a full strength batch of nutes.. maybe 1/2 strength.. if you need them at all...

ill tell you my situation as an example just cause it will illustrate what i mean a little more..

i fill my res up on sundays... i know exactly how much water to add and how much of each nute to use because i have written it down each res change.. this helps me save time and helps me ensure that i start out each res change with the target EC i want to hit... i use a truncheon, so using the chart i linked you to, at the ec i target (1., it means my ppm is about 1200

my plants average about 5 gallons of water useage a day... but even as the water level decreases the ec will remain about the same.. it might flucuate .1/.2 lower... so the next day i check it (i check it everyday) and its about the same..

usually by day 3 after the res change i think about adding water... they've drank about 15 gallons or so by then.. so i add about 10 gallons of water... not quite the full 15 they drank... mostly because i dont want to make more than 1 trip with water buckets... after adding the 10 gallons of water, my ec might drop and stay at .2/.4 lower than the orginal ec... so my ppm might drop from the original 1200ish ppm to around 800 to1000 ppm...

then over the next few days it stays around that ppm... even as the plants continue to drink the 5 gallons a day of water they do... this takes me up to about the time i need to do a res change and it starts all over...

i have the nutes and water usage my plants need down.. just from documenting it... but lets say i was going to add anymore nutes to the batch.. i would only add about a 1/4 strength or 1/2 strength batch... just to give the solution a boost...

depending on the nutes you use it could be different.. its all about the consumption of your plants.. if you notice that you start off day one at 1200ppm and by day 3 or 4 you are down to 500ppm, then you know when you top it off you need to add more... the thing is until you know what your plants needs are you wont really know how much to top off with.. and whether to use just water or nutes...

its acceptable to flucuate the ppms... the 800 to 1200 range is prefectly fine... its not really possible to burn the plants if you keep a steady ppm by replacing the old nutes.. but it is a waste of nutes since your plant wont use them all before the next res change.... so part of whether to add nutes will also depend on how often you change your res... if you plan on every 2 weeks you will definatly need to add some to make it through.. how much will depend on your plants... if you plan on changing weekly tho, adding nutes between changes is less important because you want them to use as much as they can so you waste as little as possible.. although some waste is unavoidable..

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So you write down their meal consumption with each res. change? Good idea. Is there a guideline or journal avail for the ideal amount (PPM/PH wise) that should be supplied to the plant for each bi-weekly cycle from seedling to bud stage? All I got were the pre-measured portions that come with the grow kit. Thanks in advance.

Right now, I can't afford a digital meter but I'll be able to purchase one in a week or so. For the time being, I'm using the API pH Test Kit for freshwater aquariums. Will that give me accurate results for my bubbleponics system? The test strips that came from SealthHydro don't seem to be doing that good of a job. I can't read those sticks bc the colors don't match up with the chart on the back of the box and the colors smudge. Thanks in advance.

arj1981 said:

So you write down their meal consumption with each res. change? Good idea. Is there a guideline or journal avail for the ideal amount (PPM/PH wise) that should be supplied to the plant for each bi-weekly cycle from seedling to bud stage? All I got were the pre-measured portions that come with the grow kit. Thanks in advance.

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most nute companies have online feeding schedules available you can download for their products... you can check out the site of the manufacture to begin with.. or maybe google it and see what comes up.. but all nutes are going to be different... but a good rule of thumb is that until you see good growth stay with between 1/4 and 1/2 strength, and then when growth starts to take off or if you start seeing the beginning of a deficiency use between 1/2 and full strength... if you want a ppm range for each stage heres a good idea of them...

seedling - 250 to 350 range
mild growth - 500 to 700
solid growth - 900 to 1200

when you transition from veg to flower you want to use 1/4 strength nutes of both veg and flower until you start to see budsites, then drop the veg nutes and start increasing the flowering nutes...

just watch your plants and you'll be able to see their needs pretty quickly...

ph is a constant between all hydro systems.. you want to maintain between a 5.5 and 6.5 ph in the res... but 5.8 to 6.0 is ideal if you can keep it there... i would think that an aquarium test strip would work.. not 100% sure tho.. its a really good idea to invest in a good ph and ec/ppm meter.. if the ph is too high/low you get nute lock out.. and if the ppm is to high you get burn or too low and you get slow growth and possible deficiency problems... and with hydro style grows the problem will show a lot faster and affect the plant a lot more than it would in soil since there is no buffer zone..

if your nutes are coming premeasured then your fine and they should be right on for what the manafucature would suggest anyways..

arj1981 said:

Right now, I can't afford a digital meter but I'll be able to purchase one in a week or so. For the time being, I'm using the API pH Test Kit for freshwater aquariums. Will that give me accurate results for my bubbleponics system? The test strips that came from SealthHydro don't seem to be doing that good of a job. I can't read those sticks bc the colors don't match up with the chart on the back of the box and the colors smudge. Thanks in advance.

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STARTING NUTES
The VERY FIRST TIME, at set-up, put SIX gallons of water in the tank, and adjust the water's PH, in the tank then. (you will never adjust the pH in the tank again) Take a black magic marker and mark a line inside the tank at the 6 gallon water line level.

Start the seeds in the cubes or in a wet papertowel.

Then, a day or two later, you pH test it, and add pH UP or DOWN to a half gallon of water and add that half of gallon of water to the tank. Then remove a half gallon, leaving 6 gallons.

When your seeds have germinated or sprouted or cracked, or been added to the tank,
then about a week later, 6 to 7 days, you will have your first node of leaves.
Add 1/4 packet or 1/4 dose of nutes (Grow and Micro nutes) to a gallon of water, pH adjust that one gallon and add it to the tank. If you are way over 6 gallons, remove some water. Babies are hungry, but not ready for a full meal deal.

Once a day, every day, you check the water level and pH. It will be 2, maybe 3 weeks before they start drinking a half gallon a day, that needs to be replaced.

As they grow, about every other day to every 2 or 3 days, you add another 1/4 packet, until you have used a full dose or full packet of nutes.

After ten to 14 days, drain it, and add one gallon at a time, that is pH balanced, adding 5 gallons. In the 6th gallon, add one full packet of GROW and MICRO nutes, shake and stir it good, before adding it.

After 2 or 3 weeks, they will start drinking one gallon a day.

Every 7 to ten days, you DRAIN AND REPLINISH.

FEEDING IF YOU DO NOT HAVE A PPM METER.
You will daily add one gallon of pH water TO REPLACE THE ONE GALLON MISSING. If the water in the tank tests a pH of 7.0 (too high for example) and you know you want it lower, make one gallon of 5.0 water, (or 5.6, or 5.7, or 5.8,) and it will make the tank about 6.0 or in that neighborhood. ALSO, in that one gallon of water added daily, add 1/6 packet or dose of new nutes.
If they drank 1/6 of the tank's water, they ate 1/6 of the nutes, so you need to replace that 1/6 that was consumed.
IF the grow area is VERY HOT, add back a little less than 1/6 nutes, the plant is just drinking and needing lots of water.
If the grow room is cool, or NOT VERY HOT, use the full 1/6 dose.


DRAINING AND REPLINISHING

First two grows I did, I syphoned the water out into a 5 gallon bucket with an Aquarium syphon hose. That was really a chore!

Then I learned to prop the lid open about three or 4 inches, STILL LEAVING THE LID ON THE TANK, BUT PROPPED UP ON ONE END and reach in and take the Irrigation Hub off of the pump, and with a 1/2 inch hose, use my fist as a coupling, sit my fist on the upward pump tube with the hose half way in my fist, on top of the pump, and let the pump.....pump the water out into a 5 gallon bucket. It works good for me.

You can also use a WET-VAC, or a small pump to drain it.

A drill pump (you attach it to an electric drill) is $10 at Lowes.

Let me add here, that Roots love the AIR BATH they
get during a Drain and Replinish. This is a very important step. The more often you can do it, the faster the plants will grow.


Remember what I am telling you here.

Pot plants sprout with two round leaves, called
cotyledons . Do NOT count those as leaves, they are really the inside of the seed.
AFTER 4 full leaves appear, use 1/4 dose of nutes.

When you start a new grow, and AFTER the seeds have sprouted, and you ahve done one feeding, you do a Drain and Replinish at 10 to 14 days, then every 7 to 10 days.

AFTER the first week, the water is still fresh, and you may have only added 1/4 packet of nutes or 1/4 dose of nutes, to the tank at the end of the first week IF you saw two full leaves, besides those FIRST two round ones,

During the 2nd week, you probably added 1/4 DOSE OF NUTES 2 more times 3 or 4 days apart.

AFTER 14 days from germination, you do the first DRAIN AND REPLINISH. Then, again, every 7 to ten days you DRAIN AND REPLINISH. I do a complete DRAIN AND REPLINISH every Saturday afternoon.
BUT, every Wednesday, half way through the week, I drain the tank into a bucket, pH test the bucket and adjust it, and then, after ten minutes of having an empty tank AND LETTING THE ROOTS GET AN AIR BATH, I add it right back to the tank. That way I did not use ANY extra NUTES OR too many nutes, but I did give the roots an air bath.
You will see a RAPID GROWTH SPURT the very next day.


IF you do not have a ppm meter...........
and you do a DRAIN and REPLINISH........Try to think in term of SIXTHS. You got 6 plants, and 6 gallons of water in the tank. AFTER ABOUT the first two weeks, you are going to come home from work one day and find the plants drank half a gallon of water, and need to add half a gallon of water back. Half a gallon is half a SIXTH, so add back half a sixth of a packet of nutes back and half gallon of pH adjusted water.

Later, AFTER about three or 4 weeks, you will check the plants and they will have drank one whole gallon of water in one day. ONE gallon is 1/6 of the tank's water, and if 1/6 of the water is gone, then 1/6 of the nutes are gone, so add back one gallon of pH adjusted water and 1/6 does of nutes.
AFTER 3 or 4 weeks, you will find they drank two gallons in one day. Then add two gallons of water, (1/3 of the tank's water) so also add 1/3 packet of nutes.

if THE ROOM IS VERY HOT, USE A LITTLE LESS NUTES WHEN REPLINISHNG NUTES.


IF you got the drain plugs, (little black faucets for the tank) make sure you use some plumbers glue or they will leak. The problem with using the DRAIN PLUGS is most of us have to sit our tanks on the floor, making it very difficult to drain the tank that way.

I'm often asked do I drain it out 100%? NO, I don't, I always leave about 1 inch of water or half a gallon. I'm too lazy to get it all, and ti doesn't seem to matter.
I'm often ask do I clean the tank when I drain it?
No, I don't let it get dirty to start with. I do not use nutes that color the water or roots, until about the last few weeks, i do use some Liquid Karma. But I still do not let trash or any thing foreign into the tank to clean out.

pH CONTROL

I've done a lot of research on pH Control and I 'd like to offer some advice and my opinion.
NEW growers worry about it too too much, and the biggest mistake they make is trying for a perfect contstant same pH.
You will do better, to just try to keep it between 5.6 and 6.8 without changing it often. Plants eat more nitrogen at 5.7 to 5.9 than at 6.7 to 6.9. But they eat more iron and magnisum at 6.5 to 6.8. You need a flucuating pH level for your plants to absorb different nutes at different levels.
When you get your water, add nutes and pH test it, no matter what the results, if it is between 5.6 and 6.4, leave it alone or only adjsut it by .1 to .2 down.
DO NOT PLAY the pH Game.
Do NOT ride the pH Roller Coaster.

Drastic or FAST adjustments really mess up the entire system.
Adjust gradually, and slowly.
__________________

BTW, those instructions for feeding and using the nutes, that came with the nutes, I wrote that. I'm a technical writer for SH.

Roseman said:

BTW, those instructions for feeding and using the nutes, that came with the nutes, I wrote that. I'm a technical writer for SH.

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Yep, I spotted that in another thread. Thanks for responding.

What's the exact measurement of 1/6 of the nutes from those pre-packaged bags?

Roseman, when you say add 1/6 of the nutes to the tank... in the veg state is that 1/6 of micro/grow combined? Or 1/6 of the micro pack and 1/6 of the grow pack combined?

arj1981 said:

Roseman, when you say add 1/6 of the nutes to the tank... in the veg state is that 1/6 of micro/grow combined? Or 1/6 of the micro pack and 1/6 of the grow pack combined?

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1/6 of each, from each packet. Just eyeball it, guess at it.

Now, I'm noticing I'm getting small holes/tears in the fan leaves of my plants. My system is in a grow tent and I'm using the foliage spray 5-6 times a day. I don't see any infestations or bugs. Does anyone have any idea what this could be? Thanks in advance.

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arj1981 said:

Now, I'm noticing I'm getting small holes/tears in the fan leaves of my plants. My system is in a grow tent and I'm using the foliage spray 5-6 times a day. I don't see any infestations or bugs. Does anyone have any idea what this could be? Thanks in advance.

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probably a deficiency, if you haven't been feeding it for four weeks and havent changed the water I'm sure they're Starving.