riddleme
Well-Known Member
yeppers, pretty much
Balls to the Wall grow, Riddleme Gets Serious
- Thread starter riddleme
- Start date
R C Glasscock
Member
Hi Riddleme, I just started my grow with my 400w CMH and all I can say is WOW! I don't have any other light to start my seedlings with so I'm using the big light all the way through. I germed the seeds 5 days ago,they are all out of the soil and the first set of leaves are already as big as the cote leaves. I'm amazed at how fast they are growing. Do you mind if I post a pic on your thread of the the little girls? I have a question I would like to ask you. Thank you
I'm using a 2 gal laundry basket with landscape fabric, you should try the agroliner bags, breathable fabric with spin-out laminate, best of both worlds! and like 3$ each for a 5 gal bag, with all your other innovations it would be the ultimate growsomeday maybe? be more inclined to do the grow bags made out of recycled jeansor make pots like Hobbes does
riddleme
Well-Known Member
no problem, post and ask away
sorry, but those experiments got changed, as you will see
will add to my list of things to check outI'm using a 2 gal laundry basket with landscape fabric, you should try the agroliner bags, breathable fabric with spin-out laminate, best of both worlds! and like 3$ each for a 5 gal bag, with all your other innovations it would be the ultimate grow
yes and yes, most lights give off IR, most all heat from lights is IR heat and there are meters for measuring it
than ks, thats what I thought. You (and many others) have said that the CMH bulbs produce less heat, so therefore less infrared? and UVB is filtered by glass/pyrex so, if using a CMH bulb in a cooltube(or glassed in reflector, I notice yours doesn't have glass, right?) adding both infrared and a UVB lamp would be beneficial to using a CMH lamp?
riddleme
Well-Known Member
well I would say yes, but would never put a CMH in a cooltube, no need, and would defeat the UVB of the bulb. And no mine is wide open, no glass
riddleme
Well-Known Member
most all of it
gumball
Well-Known Member
this got me interested so i looked into my acrylic manufacturer. so far it appears the acrylic heat shield i use, Duraplex by Plaskolite, is not s UV filter. it is UV stable so it wont break down by exposure to the sun, but it appears they have different grades that specifically filter UV. i am not saying mine doesnt filter it all, probably just not a lot. i am gonna continue to look.
EDIT: just found this, not sure what wavelength range our ladies like their UV dose in-
UV control
OPTIX clear acrylic sheet has UV transmittance of 10-20% (in the 250-400 nm wavelength range), and visible light transmittance of 92%.
well, I still think its the best full spectrum bulb, I have a 400 watt cmh coming this week and I will try it with and without the cooltube since I have a pretty good idea what kind of heat the 400 watt hps puts out. Thanks to cdripper2 you can get the bulb riddleme is using
for 35$ + 10$ shipping, from the best deals thread ( https://www.rollitup.org/grow-room-design-setup/237610-best-deals-thread-post-best-24.html#post4598171 ):
http://www.lightingsupply.com/products/product_detail.aspx?product=1343427fa4804e41b9bd353f08196e39&category=99172fa60656481fb998bfaa0944213c
discount coude "NWC10" , didnt mean to hijack your thread , just thought your "students" might be interested.
for 35$ + 10$ shipping, from the best deals thread ( https://www.rollitup.org/grow-room-design-setup/237610-best-deals-thread-post-best-24.html#post4598171 ):
http://www.lightingsupply.com/products/product_detail.aspx?product=1343427fa4804e41b9bd353f08196e39&category=99172fa60656481fb998bfaa0944213c
discount coude "NWC10" , didnt mean to hijack your thread , just thought your "students" might be interested.
reefacheefa
Active Member
happy labor day Riddle maaaaan!!!!!! hows it going over there bro?
riddleme
Well-Known Member
couldn't be better, got Metallica jammin on the stereo and gettin ready to write the clone ditty
reefacheefa
Active Member
awesome!!! re-spect - crop!!!! ill be reading your peice on cloning.
somebody rep this guy for me!!!!!! i know its not gonna let me do it...
somebody rep this guy for me!!!!!! i know its not gonna let me do it...
R C Glasscock
Member
I was just wanting to know if the leaves standing straight up like this was normal. I have 6 growing and they are all doing the same thing. Its probably nothing but just wanted to get the masters inpu
t. thank you very much for the help.
t. thank you very much for the help.
riddleme
Well-Known Member
at that stage not a problem, I would say if they don't "relax" once fully developed that there is something not properly dialed ie: to much water, lights to close, temp & humidity off
R C Glasscock
Member
I suspect the light is to close.. It at 28" I can raise it about another 18". I should have noticed that it might be a little intense on the seedlings. At least they're still green.
riddleme
Well-Known Member
I really only ever wrote a small post once explaining that I cloned in sand and how and why, it was a while back and I believe is posted in my nuggets.
But very simply put all you need to clone a plant is a proper cutting a small bit of light and water. one of the pics is of 2 cuttings that are simply sitting in a cup of water on a window sill as I want to see how long it takes, yes it takes longer this way
Everything we do is about bigger, faster, better. All the tricks and tweaks are about this, if you put a seed in dirt and water it, it will grow. But will it be all it can be?
no one is satisfied with waiting, while patience is a virtue, it is also a life/soul sucking whore and as with any subject there is an overload of info about cloning, there are so many tricks that like regular growing can easily confuse even an experienced grower. Once again what happens is you find something that works and stick with it, but that journey can be a rough one if you try to apply all of the tweaks as you won't know for sure which ones worked and which ones didn't? best to try them one at a time and be allowed to actually see the outcome.
I can tell you that if your having problems cloning, get an aerocloner, they are easy to use and they work, I have a friend that just recently started growing (has had 2 harvest) uses an aerocloner and gets great clones everytime in under 2 weeks, he never once struggled with cloning, it just works.
lets name a few of the "tricks"
use a rooting hormone
use superthrive
use bleach
use H2O2
there are several ways to use these things, I use a powder root hormone and just barely touch it to where I cut, I have learned that if I apply it liberally it eats (dissolves) the stem in just a matter of days.
I use one drop of superthrive along with 8 drops of chlorine bleach to a gallon of water to soak my cuttings in (for 30 minutes) I have leaned (by experimenting) that just 5 drops of superthrive will kill a clone (cutting) within days. and the bleach thing causes calluses to form on the stem and calluses are where the new roots grow, the soaking in bleach merely speeds up the formation of calluses, you could just use tap water if your city uses chloramine (why the cup of water in the windowsill thing works so well)
I use H2O2 in the bottom of my dome/tray as it keeps things from growing in the water and adds O2 to the humid air in the dome (not much)
then there is,
don't cut after a feeding
take cuttings after a good watering
cut at 45 degree angle
split the stem
cut directly under a node
scrape/rough the stem
fo me I just do the 45 degree thing 1/4 inch under a node and I cut the leaves at that node off 1/8 inch from the stem (leaving the knot) I don't split or scrape the stem, I do take cuttings after a good watering (rain) and before a feeding.
Then there is light,
Clones DO NOT want a lot of light, they do not want to actively photosynthesize. They want indirect light and just enough to stay alive, I already told you my light above the clones is a 15 watt T8, you'll see in the pic that at canopy level they are seeing 800 lumens (and that without the dome) it is a "blue" light or veg light. If you are using a bright light, then you must shade it. Move it far away and off center (plants not directly under it) you can use white printer paper or a paper towel to decrease the intensity or even pantyhose which is a great light difuser.
Cutting leaf tips,
This is to slow transpiration and thus slows growth but also tells the plant to beef up the root system so that it can repair the damage to allow it to transpire properly. I like to cut at least half of all but the very top leaves.
Finally there is enviroment,
Clone cuttings want very high humidity (90 to 100%) for the first 24 hours and a root zone temp between 70 and 80 degrees, I keep mine at 78, after this you can start to vent the dome to add fresh air (O2) I have a dome with adjustable holes in the top if you don't have this I advise you cut holes in the top of it, so it can breath. Or you can simply remove it several times a day for up to 10 minutes each time, this becomes a hassle, holes are best The adjustable heat mat thing helps to keep things consistant and consistancy is very important, not only for cloning but for growing as well. It also helps if the medium is known to the plants as they will readily thrive in it without stress, mine are in happy frogs at the moment, where they started and they are thriving
Finally and most important is Hardening Off,
this is a term used in gardening that simply means allowing the plant to slowly become accustomed to change rather than abruptly, it applies to any drastic change. in the case of clones we must consider weening it from the high humidity and and low light, you will see in a pic a pencil used to prop up the dome, I do this after the first week this increases the airflow and reduces the humidity in the dome. Also during the 2nd week I will take the dome off and leave it off till they start to droop (wilt) this can last for hours, when they droop I put it back without the pencil until they stand back up then I put the pencil back, I do this every day during the 2nd week. as for light I simply (as you saw) move them to a less intense light once planted, currently using cfls that are 6 inches above them, as days go by I will move the light closer, gradually increasing the amount of light they are getting.
and finally I wait untill roots are coming out of the medium before transplanting, there are pics of this, I have 2 more to plant today and I will tell you that in the tray as you can see in the pics they are setting up above the water level that is in the bottom (pots setting on jiffy pellet rack) the soil in the little peat pots is merely moist I never water it, the humidity in the dome keeps the peat pots "wet" and soft allowing the roots to come out. Having them set in the tray this way makes the roots look for the water that is in the bottom, if the soil was wet they would not do this and I want them to do this so I know when to plant em
Also in one of the pics you will see the temp probe for the heat mat just hanging out in mid air inside the dome, it is the ambient temp of the air in the dome that you want to adjust/control not the temp of the water in the bottom.
and here are a few of my favorite links on the subject
http://www.planetnatural.com/site/xdpy/kb/cloning-tips.html
http://www.cannabisculture.com/v2/articles/4478.html
https://www.rollitup.org/newbie-central/100946-what-best-fastest-cloning-method-2.html#post1213828
http://www.essortment.com/all/plantsclonesho_rvca.htm
http://glauc.us/outgrowaeroponics/mistercloner/indexhowtocloneplantstwo.html
http://www.weedsthatplease.com/cloning.htm
this one is really good,
http://books.google.com/books?id=cHT3bMm3njsC&pg=PA101&lpg=PA101&dq=best+temp+for+rooting+clones&source=bl&ots=TQv5UucAXL&sig=rTmYrhte9zGFLj1YaxhsS6Bz2fs&hl=en&ei=qKSDTMG_PJDAsAP01vWuDw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=6&ved=0CDoQ6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q&f=false
https://www.rollitup.org/general-marijuana-growing/297055-how-clone-alot-pictures-very.html
https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/210968-wecome-jungle-34.html#post3186396
Enjoy as always
But very simply put all you need to clone a plant is a proper cutting a small bit of light and water. one of the pics is of 2 cuttings that are simply sitting in a cup of water on a window sill as I want to see how long it takes, yes it takes longer this way
Everything we do is about bigger, faster, better. All the tricks and tweaks are about this, if you put a seed in dirt and water it, it will grow. But will it be all it can be?
no one is satisfied with waiting, while patience is a virtue, it is also a life/soul sucking whore and as with any subject there is an overload of info about cloning, there are so many tricks that like regular growing can easily confuse even an experienced grower. Once again what happens is you find something that works and stick with it, but that journey can be a rough one if you try to apply all of the tweaks as you won't know for sure which ones worked and which ones didn't? best to try them one at a time and be allowed to actually see the outcome.
I can tell you that if your having problems cloning, get an aerocloner, they are easy to use and they work, I have a friend that just recently started growing (has had 2 harvest) uses an aerocloner and gets great clones everytime in under 2 weeks, he never once struggled with cloning, it just works.
lets name a few of the "tricks"
use a rooting hormone
use superthrive
use bleach
use H2O2
there are several ways to use these things, I use a powder root hormone and just barely touch it to where I cut, I have learned that if I apply it liberally it eats (dissolves) the stem in just a matter of days.
I use one drop of superthrive along with 8 drops of chlorine bleach to a gallon of water to soak my cuttings in (for 30 minutes) I have leaned (by experimenting) that just 5 drops of superthrive will kill a clone (cutting) within days. and the bleach thing causes calluses to form on the stem and calluses are where the new roots grow, the soaking in bleach merely speeds up the formation of calluses, you could just use tap water if your city uses chloramine (why the cup of water in the windowsill thing works so well)
I use H2O2 in the bottom of my dome/tray as it keeps things from growing in the water and adds O2 to the humid air in the dome (not much)
then there is,
don't cut after a feeding
take cuttings after a good watering
cut at 45 degree angle
split the stem
cut directly under a node
scrape/rough the stem
fo me I just do the 45 degree thing 1/4 inch under a node and I cut the leaves at that node off 1/8 inch from the stem (leaving the knot) I don't split or scrape the stem, I do take cuttings after a good watering (rain) and before a feeding.
Then there is light,
Clones DO NOT want a lot of light, they do not want to actively photosynthesize. They want indirect light and just enough to stay alive, I already told you my light above the clones is a 15 watt T8, you'll see in the pic that at canopy level they are seeing 800 lumens (and that without the dome) it is a "blue" light or veg light. If you are using a bright light, then you must shade it. Move it far away and off center (plants not directly under it) you can use white printer paper or a paper towel to decrease the intensity or even pantyhose which is a great light difuser.
Cutting leaf tips,
This is to slow transpiration and thus slows growth but also tells the plant to beef up the root system so that it can repair the damage to allow it to transpire properly. I like to cut at least half of all but the very top leaves.
Finally there is enviroment,
Clone cuttings want very high humidity (90 to 100%) for the first 24 hours and a root zone temp between 70 and 80 degrees, I keep mine at 78, after this you can start to vent the dome to add fresh air (O2) I have a dome with adjustable holes in the top if you don't have this I advise you cut holes in the top of it, so it can breath. Or you can simply remove it several times a day for up to 10 minutes each time, this becomes a hassle, holes are best
The adjustable heat mat thing helps to keep things consistant and consistancy is very important, not only for cloning but for growing as well. It also helps if the medium is known to the plants as they will readily thrive in it without stress, mine are in happy frogs at the moment, where they started and they are thriving Finally and most important is Hardening Off,
this is a term used in gardening that simply means allowing the plant to slowly become accustomed to change rather than abruptly, it applies to any drastic change. in the case of clones we must consider weening it from the high humidity and and low light, you will see in a pic a pencil used to prop up the dome, I do this after the first week this increases the airflow and reduces the humidity in the dome. Also during the 2nd week I will take the dome off and leave it off till they start to droop (wilt) this can last for hours, when they droop I put it back without the pencil until they stand back up then I put the pencil back, I do this every day during the 2nd week. as for light I simply (as you saw) move them to a less intense light once planted, currently using cfls that are 6 inches above them, as days go by I will move the light closer, gradually increasing the amount of light they are getting.
and finally I wait untill roots are coming out of the medium before transplanting, there are pics of this, I have 2 more to plant today
and I will tell you that in the tray as you can see in the pics they are setting up above the water level that is in the bottom (pots setting on jiffy pellet rack) the soil in the little peat pots is merely moist I never water it, the humidity in the dome keeps the peat pots "wet" and soft allowing the roots to come out. Having them set in the tray this way makes the roots look for the water that is in the bottom, if the soil was wet they would not do this and I want them to do this so I know when to plant em Also in one of the pics you will see the temp probe for the heat mat just hanging out in mid air inside the dome, it is the ambient temp of the air in the dome that you want to adjust/control not the temp of the water in the bottom.
and here are a few of my favorite links on the subject
http://www.planetnatural.com/site/xdpy/kb/cloning-tips.html
http://www.cannabisculture.com/v2/articles/4478.html
https://www.rollitup.org/newbie-central/100946-what-best-fastest-cloning-method-2.html#post1213828
http://www.essortment.com/all/plantsclonesho_rvca.htm
http://glauc.us/outgrowaeroponics/mistercloner/indexhowtocloneplantstwo.html
http://www.weedsthatplease.com/cloning.htm
this one is really good,
http://books.google.com/books?id=cHT3bMm3njsC&pg=PA101&lpg=PA101&dq=best+temp+for+rooting+clones&source=bl&ots=TQv5UucAXL&sig=rTmYrhte9zGFLj1YaxhsS6Bz2fs&hl=en&ei=qKSDTMG_PJDAsAP01vWuDw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=6&ved=0CDoQ6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q&f=false
https://www.rollitup.org/general-marijuana-growing/297055-how-clone-alot-pictures-very.html
https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/210968-wecome-jungle-34.html#post3186396
Enjoy as always
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rastadred22
Well-Known Member
usefull lesson!! love the classes u one of the best teachers here!