Are Panda Bears Really Worth Protecting?

not to sound cruel or any thing but just hear me out. they never screw, they dont really contribute anything to there natural environment except poop and and eat a little bamboo, and they really dont have any natural survival skills what so ever. if say a tiger attacked a panda bear its a weighted coin flip match. considering all this it just seems there not just going exstinct because people are hunting them so much as just natural selection. so by protecting them from human involvement are we really just interfering with natural selection and a natural cycle of the enivroment in the chinese mountains. it's just kinda funny they are still going extinct but if you searched your damndist for a panda fur coat your not gonna find one, not even an antique one, or for that matter even so much as a picture of what it looks like. it is because of this it only seems logical they aren't being hunted anymore and weren't really being hunted that much a hundred years ago. although i haven't bothered to look for panda meat im guessing i'll be wasting my time on that too. is it just a waste and we could be focusing our efforts on more important species or for that matter bigger problems like agriculture in 3rd world countries, aids, etc... or is this really a genuine thing, if so why?
 

missnu

Well-Known Member
Well...hmmm...there has to be something they are doing...or perhaps they are just one of those animals that is in the middle of the evolutionary process of weeding out unsuited lifeforms
 

Gastanker

Well-Known Member
A good friend of mine is paid by the government to collect particular frog eggs and hatch them out. This species of frog lives in three small (<250'x250') muddy pools in the woods of Mississippi and nowhere else on earth. The frogs serve no purpose to humans, have very little local ecological impact, and are diminishing in numbers - not due to any human impact but simply due to it being a poor species.

I'm a green hippie and all that jazz but people are crazy. Really? Protect some frogs that no one but the research team will ever see? Wouldn't spending the hundreds of thousands each year to instead purchase hundreds of thousands of acres of forest, or something similar, make more sense?

But at the same time if someone offered me money to dick around with an animal in the name of 'science' I'd jump on the offer. "Wait, you want to pay me to take care of cute animals and I get to parade around like a hero who's saving the world? I'll do it!"
 

delvite

Well-Known Member
not to sound cruel or any thing but just hear me out. they never screw, they dont really contribute anything to there natural environment except poop and and eat a little bamboo, and they really dont have any natural survival skills what so ever. if say a tiger attacked a panda bear its a weighted coin flip match. considering all this it just seems there not just going exstinct because people are hunting them so much as just natural selection. so by protecting them from human involvement are we really just interfering with natural selection and a natural cycle of the enivroment in the chinese mountains. it's just kinda funny they are still going extinct but if you searched your damndist for a panda fur coat your not gonna find one, not even an antique one, or for that matter even so much as a picture of what it looks like. it is because of this it only seems logical they aren't being hunted anymore and weren't really being hunted that much a hundred years ago. although i haven't bothered to look for panda meat im guessing i'll be wasting my time on that too. is it just a waste and we could be focusing our efforts on more important species or for that matter bigger problems like agriculture in 3rd world countries, aids, etc... or is this really a genuine thing, if so why?
yes. what else are we going to eat ;)..............................cute-food-photos-epicute-panda-bento.jpg
 

Doer

Well-Known Member
We know nothing about genetic diversity, have never even come close to completely classifying the insects, much less the smaller, most important biota, like bacteria. Some use arsenic, it was just discovered. So, if humans are worth saving, then pandas are. We will need as many examples of the epi-genome as possible, to save ourselves, I imagine.

Besides, don't worry about big do-gooder ideas. China is not going to shift Panda research to 3rd world agriculture.
 

rmx

Member
I think all of our countries governments are guilty of funding far more atrocious, unconstructive things than animal conservation and preservation. The protection of a species with a dangerously low popualtion count is, to my mind, a far more worthy and noble use of funds than some of the absolute rubbish that our governments throw billions and billions of $ £ etc. into every year. Humans have been the direct cause of the extinction of hundreds, if not thousands of species over the past few centuries. I think the least we can do is set out to make sure this disturbing trend doesn't continue. Call me a hippy, but it breaks my heart. The natural world is beautiful and is absolutely worth conserving - Let's not lose touch with nature. It will be a cold, dark world when only humans, rats and cockroaches inhabit this earth.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endangered_species

Critically endangered: faces an extremely high risk of extinction in the immediate future. Examples: Mountain Gorilla, Chinese Giant Salamander, Bactrian Camel, Ethiopian Wolf, Saiga, Takhi, Iberian Lynx, Kakapo, Arakan Forest Turtle, Sumatran Rhinoceros, Javan Rhino, Brazilian Merganser, Axolotl, Leatherback Sea Turtle, Northern White Rhinoceros (maybe extinct in the wild), Gharial, Vaquita, Philippine Eagle, Brown Spider Monkey, California Condor, Island Fox, Chinese Alligator, Sumatran Orangutan, Asiatic Cheetah, African Wild Ass, Hawaiian Monk Seal, Mediterranean Monk Seal, Red Wolf, Amur Leopard, Spix's Macaw (maybe extinct in the wild), Siamese Crocodile, Addax, Baiji





Edit: Sorry to derail from pandas, but can you believe that the blue whale is near extinction? I don't know any kid at school who wasn't absolutely fascinated by learning about these gigantic, beautiful mammals. They definitely captivate the imagination. Now as an adult, I love to listen to the meditative sounds of the sea and whale song. It's eerily beautiful. Depressing to think they're on the verge of being lost forever. What a sad time we live in.
 

jdillinger

Active Member
No, they're just a symbol for environmentalists to argue for detailing our economies and distracting where funding should be going.
 

MysticMorris

Active Member
How can the human race have the balls to kill of all these different species of animal, systematically and almost without mercy, and then say the remainder of a given population of bear is not worth saving?!?!?

One day, when we have destroyed the earth as we know it including ourselves, the other animals will finally have their planet back.
 

lokie

Well-Known Member
How can the human race have the balls to kill of all these different species of animal, systematically and almost without mercy, and then say the remainder of a given population of bear is not worth saving?!?!?

One day, when we have destroyed the earth as we know it including ourselves, the other animals will finally have their planet back.
As humans we are damn lucky we have not extincted ourselves.
 

Gastanker

Well-Known Member
There are over 700 insects on the endangered species list, all of which play a more important ecological role than the panda. Humans are so animal biased.

Without the ants the world as we know it would end - they are keystone animals. But no one cares that these little guys are going extinct?



Too small, don't care, give the $ to the panda people



Hehe, nothing against pandas, but lets be environmental about it all.
 

hardknox72

Active Member
Every species plays an integral part of our ecosystem. That's why its a chain, Maybe some more than others. save em all!
 

mellokitty

Moderatrix of Journals
are they worth it? yes. here's why:

pandas, elephants, tigers, snow leopards etc. -- the "iconic" species in need of help/conservation efforts, usually also happen to be "umbrella" species: ie. if you save them, you save a lot of things that live with or around them. in order to protect the "icons", you need to preserve their habitats, which includes other flora and fauna.

but if you went to joe public and said "i need help saving 100 species of invertebrate, 20 of which pupate into flying insects, a dozen species of frog, 6 kinds of grass, and maybe 4 rodent species," you probably wouldn't get a lot of response. BUT, if went to the same joe public and said "i need to conserve this forest because it's the habitat of *this* iconic beast (which in turn would result in the conservation of all of the above)", it garners a lot more attention.
 

Carne Seca

Well-Known Member
hmm.. If Pandas were an evolutionary "mistake" they wouldn't be here sharing the earth with us today. The Panda isn't facing extinction because they're an evolutionary dead end. They're facing extinction because WE, the most wasteful, intrusive species on earth, have destroyed their habitation. They would continue to live and breed if it wasn't for us.
 

Gastanker

Well-Known Member
are they worth it? yes. here's why:

pandas, elephants, tigers, snow leopards etc. -- the "iconic" species in need of help/conservation efforts, usually also happen to be "umbrella" species: ie. if you save them, you save a lot of things that live with or around them. in order to protect the "icons", you need to preserve their habitats, which includes other flora and fauna.

but if you went to joe public and said "i need help saving 100 species of invertebrate, 20 of which pupate into flying insects, a dozen species of frog, 6 kinds of grass, and maybe 4 rodent species," you probably wouldn't get a lot of response. BUT, if went to the same joe public and said "i need to conserve this forest because it's the habitat of *this* iconic beast (which in turn would result in the conservation of all of the above)", it garners a lot more attention.
Brilliant point. :clap:
 

delvite

Well-Known Member
The tiger has topped the World Wide Fund for Nature's list of species most at threat of extinction.


1. Tiger

New studies indicate that there may be as few as 3,200 tigers (Panthera tigris) left in the wild. Tigers occupy less than seven per cent of their original range, which has decreased by 40 percent over the past ten years. Continuing deforestation and rampant poaching could push some tiger populations to the same fate as its now-extinct Javan and Balinese relatives in other parts of Asia. Tigers are poached for their body parts, which are used in traditional Asian medicine, while skins are also highly prized. Additionally, sea level rise, due to climate change, threatens the mangrove habitat of a key tiger population in Bangladesh&#8217;s and India&#8217;s Sundarbans. The upcoming Chinese Year of the Tiger, starting in February 2010, will mark an important year for conservation efforts to save wild tigers, with WWF continuing to play a vital role in implementing bold new strategies to save this magnificent Asian big cat.

2. Polar Bear
The Arctic&#8217;s polar bears (Ursus maritimus) have become the iconic symbol of early victims of climate-induced habitat loss. Designated a threatened species for protection by the Endangered Species Act in the US, many polar bear populations will be vulnerable to extinction within the next century if warming trends in the Arctic continue at the current pace. WWF is supporting field research to better understand how climate change will affect polar bears and to develop adaptation strategies. WWF also works to protect critical polar bear habitat by working with governments and industry to reduce threats from shipping and oil and gas development in the region and with local communities to reduce human-bear conflict in areas where bears are already stranded on land for longer periods of time due to lack of ice.


3. Pacific Walrus
The Arctic&#8217;s Bering and Chukchi Seas are home to the Pacific walrus (Odobenus rosmarus divergens), one of the latest victims of climate change. In September of this year, up to 200 dead walruses were spotted on the shore of the Chukchi Sea on Alaska's northwest coast. These animals use floating ice for resting, birthing and nursing calves, and protection from predators. With Arctic ice melting, the Pacific walrus is experiencing habitat loss to the extent that in September 2009, the US Fish and Wildlife Service announced that adding the walrus to the Endangered Species Act may be warranted.


4. Magellanic Penguin
Once threatened primarily by oil spills, Magellanic penguins (Spheniscus magellanicus), now face a larger threat as fish are displaced by warming ocean currents, forcing the birds to swim farther to find food. Last year hundreds of Magellanic penguins washed up on beaches around Rio de Janeiro, many emaciated or dead. Scientists have speculated that changes in ocean currents or temperatures, which may be related to climate change, could have been responsible for their movement more than a thousand miles north of their traditional nesting area in the southern tip of Argentina. Twelve out of the 17 penguin species are currently experiencing rapid population decline.


5. Leatherback Turtle
The largest marine turtle and one of the largest living reptiles, the leatherback turtle, (Dermochelys coriaceathe) has survived for more than a hundred million years, but is now facing extinction. Recent estimates of numbers show that this species is declining, particularly in the Pacific where as few as 2,300 adult females now remain, making the Pacific leatherback the world's most endangered marine turtle population. Atlantic turtle populations are more stable but scientists predict a decline due to the large numbers of adults being caught as bycatch and killed accidentally by fishing fleets. Additionally, rising sea levels and higher temperatures on Atlantic beaches pose a new threat to turtles and their offspring. Nest temperature strongly determines the sex of offspring, and a nest warming trend is reducing the number of male turtles. WWF aims to conserve leatherback turtle migratory pathways - by working with fisheries to decrease bycatch, by protecting critical nesting beaches, and by raising awareness so that local communities will protect turtles and their nests.

post 1 of 2 ;)









 

delvite

Well-Known Member
post 2 of 2

6. Bluefin Tuna


The Atlantic bluefin tuna (Thunnus thynnus) is a large migratory fish found in the western and eastern Atlantic and the Mediterranean Sea. Bluefin tuna is the source of highest grade sushi. Bluefin tuna fisheries are near collapse and the species at serious risk of extinction if unsustainable fishing practices in the Eastern Atlantic and Mediterranean are not stopped. A temporary ban on the global trade of bluefin tuna would allow the overexploited species to recover. WWF is encouraging restaurants, chefs, retailers, and consumers to stop serving, buying, selling, and eating endangered bluefin tuna until this amazing species shows signs of recovery.



7. Mountain Gorilla
Scientists consider mountain gorillas (Gorilla beringei beringei) to be a critically endangered gorilla subspecies, with about 720 surviving in the wild. More than 200 live in the Virunga National Park, located in the eastern part of the Democratic Republic of Congo, bordering Rwanda and Uganda. War has been waged in areas around the park, with gorillas subject to related threats such as poaching and loss of habitat. Conservation efforts have led to an increase in the Virunga population by 14 per cent in the last 12 years, while the mountain gorillas other home, the Bwindi Impenetrable Forest in Uganda, has experienced population increases of 12 per cent over the past decade. Despite this success, the mountain gorillas status remains fragile, and WWF is working to save the great ape’s forest habitat in the mountains of the heart of Africa


8. Monarch Butterfly
Every year millions of delicate monarch butterflies (Danaus plexippus) migrate from North America to their winter habitat in Mexico. A well conserved and protected high-altitude pine and fir forest in Mexico is essential for the survival of the overwintering of monarchs, which has been recognized as an endangered biological phenomenon. The protection of its reproductive habitats in the United States and Canada is also crucial to saving this species migration, one of the most remarkable natural phenomena on the planet. WWF, in collaboration with the Mexican Fund for the Conservation of Nature, has designed an innovative conservation strategy to protect and restore the Monarch butterflies wintering habitat in Mexico, so butterflies are protected from extremes weather and other threats. WWF is also supporting local communities to establish trees nurseries that are reintroduced to the monarch butterfly reserve, creating at the same time new sources of income for the owners of the monarch forests.



9. Javan Rhinoceros
Listed as Critically Endangered on the IUCN Red List (2009), the Javan rhino (Rhinoceros sondaicus) is considered to be one of the most endangered large mammals in the world with only two populations existing in the wild, for a total number of less than 60 animals. Highly prized as a commodity in traditional Asian medicine, Javan rhinos have also been brought to the verge of extinction by the conversion of forest habitat to farmland. WWF has been involved in protection and conservation of the Javan rhino since 1998, supporting forest rangers to undertake increased patrolling and protection activities, conducting surveys of the rhino population, raising awareness of the importance of the rhinos to local communities, and supporting park management. Last month, highly trained sniffer dogs were used to search for traces of the extremely rare and endangered Vietnamese Javan Rhinoceros, of which no more than a dozen are thought to exist. These samples will be analysed to better understand the gender mix and whether this small population has a chance of survival.



10. Giant Panda
An international symbol of conservation since WWF’s founding in 1961, the giant panda (Ailuropoda melanoleuca) which numbers around 1,600 in the wild, faces an uncertain future. Its forest habitat in the mountainous areas of southwest China has become fragmented, creating a number of small and isolated populations. WWF has been active in giant panda conservation for nearly three decades by working working with the Chinese government to protect habitats through the creation of reserves and to help local communities become less dependent on forest resources. Over half of the habitat where pandas live is now protected, and corridors are being established to connect key panda populations. But the 1,600 remaining wild pandas are still living in over 20 geographically separate areas, and infratructure development is on the increase, so there’s still much more to be done.

where oh where do we start :)






 
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