Am I watering too little?

pakist0ned

Well-Known Member
In order to not overwater my plants, I'm wondering if I'm not watering too little.

I'm growing autoflowers, in 5 gallon fabric pots, filled with BioBizz All-Mix soil.

They are ending veg (day ~35), 1 of them is already pre-flowering.

I'm watering them with 750ml of water with BioBizz feeding schedule every 3/4 days.

My idea is to water 1L when flowering, and up to 1.5L when finishing flower.

Is this enough to have an idea if I'm watering too little, or ok?
 
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LeastExpectedGrower

Well-Known Member
I can't give any idea comparatively in that soil, since I've never used it. Right now in ProMix I'm watering 5g bags to the tune of 6 liters of water every 4 days, and that gives me about 1L of runoff for each bag. Last grow I used Black Gold and was doing about 1.25g per watering (5ish liters, every 4 days).

Once my plants are big enough to be getting nutrients (salt based), I water and feed to runoff for the rest of their growth.
 

Kilbarrack

Active Member
Hi
I've used BB a lot. Ideally you should be using Light Mix for autos. But I follow their schedule & feed them 1L of water not 750ml. With BB you cant really go wrong. Here's a Q&A from someone with a BB rep. It might answer some of your questions:

Question: Everyone knows that charts are just an average and every plant is different. But let's say the values given are indeed an avarage of nutes to use and let's say we'd have a plant that has an average tolerance to nutrients. Would it be a good idea to really use all the products all together at full dose during an entire grow? Isn't using all products all together making the solution a bit too hot for the plants? Or would this actually be very beneficial? No one on forums can tell because nobody has yet used them all, not that I know.

Answer: First of all : the Grow schedule is not the bible. It is a general guideline that gives the maximum dosages and when to start using which product, or when to stop. If you would use all products at the same time you do not need to worry that much, since you are only using maximum to NPK products: Bio-grow or Fish-Mix and Bio-Bloom. All other products are stimulators that compliment the nutrients, improve assimilation, metabolism, chlorophyll production etc etc etc.
We try to give a divers menu to the plants. If you want to live healthy, you do not eat a hamburger with a hamburger and a hamburger for desert. You’d eat a hamburger, with a salad, some orange juice, a yogurt or cheese for desert and maybe a small digestive afterwards. This is the function of the stimulators: Root-juice, Bio-Heaven, Top-max, Alg-a-Mic and Acti-vera.

Try to see it like this: You use as a basis Bio-grow or Fish-Mix and Bio-Bloom. The stimulators are your tools to guide your plants into the direction you want to go, or enrich them. You make the menu for your plants, depending on the type of plants, their age, the moment in the cycle and of course the type of genetics. Here some key characters of the stimulators:

Root-juice: besides a root stimulator, it protects the roots again the most common root diseases and protects against over feeding
Alg-a-Mic: repairs damage from overfeeding, boost calcium and magnesium assimilation, boost production of chlorophyll
Top-max: improves density of the flowers and stimulates natural sugar production ( taste improvement )
Bio-heaven: accelerates flowering, boosts mineral assimilation,
Acti-Vera: improves metabolism, full of essential enzymes and amazing for seeds that have just hatched. Aloë vera rules!

Some people simply use all products at the same time. But as soon as you know your favourite genetics inside-out, you use the stimulators as supplements at the moment you think the plants need it.


Question: Presuming we would be sticking to the official chart, should we be feeding nutrients every time we water the plants or alternate water with nutes? People actually argue about how long it takes for the nutrients to become active in the soil and how long it takes for the plant to react to nutrient changes. Some say it takes up to 3 days which then implies a bit of 'thinking' ahead. If it takes that long, alternating nutes and plain water would be really counter-productive. The question is about the built up in the soil. There's lots of rumours around this as well.

Answer: We prefer you give water with Biobizz every time you water the plants. If you switch between just clear water one time and water with nutrients the second time, you’ll have every time different Ec/pH levels. Every time the plants need to adjust.

Indeed, the organic material in Biobizz products needs time to decompose inside the soil. About 30% is available immediately, the rest becomes available in 1-3 days maximum.

What you can do is this: you start with 50% of the recommended dosages and use Biobizz every time you water the plants. You stay at this percentage or slowly increase if the plants demand it. Organic gardening is all about the visual connection with your plants.

Question: Should we consider the chart as the absolute maximum of nutes to use or is it really just an average?

Answer: The schedule is the general guideline. With these dosages we think it is almost impossible to not get a good result. But as we stated above: try to see the guideline as an indication for maximum dosages and when to start/ stop using products. No more no less


Question: Most people, including myself do think that this is the right way to mix the nutes:
Leave the bucket with tap water for 24 hours to get the chlorine etc. evaporated.
Add all desired nutes and just feed it to the plants (in case of BioBizz soil of course)

Answer: PERFECT! ;-)


Question: After adding the nutes to the water, what to do?

Quote " BioBizz says if your ph is between 7.0 and 7.3 it's just perfect. Don't change anything! Feed it to the plants and the soil will buffer the rest. "
Ok. I believe that it works just fine like that as I was never measuring ph.
STILL the question is: what would happen if you were using organic ph-down like canna ph down or earthjuice to drop this 7.3 nutrient solution to 6.3 from the start, before feeding? Would this be counter-productive for getting the right ph or actually help the soil getting it right faster? It's hard to tell because these ph meters in soil can't always be really trusted and opinions vastly differ.

Answer: Again, a very good question. First of all: always measure the pH, measuring = knowledge. Now here is how Biobizz works:

Our soil has a pH of 6,1-6,2. This is the perfect pH for using our liquid products. When you water the plants, the Biobizz products start to decompose, with the help of the micro-life in the soil, the organic material breaks down and the pH always stay naturally at 6,1-6,2. So if the water you give has a pH of for instance 7,0-7,3, the micro-life will ensure the pH in the soil will drop to the desired 6,1-6,2. This is why you never had problems, because you let nature do it’s work.

Now, the micro-life can lower the pH to 6,1-6,2, but if you feed water with a pH lower then 6,1-6,2 you can have a problem. The micro-life can lower the pH, but not increase it. So basically: as long as your water, mixed with Biobizz is above 6,2-6,3 ( give it a bit of margin ) you are just fine. Of course, when you have tab water with a pH of 9,0 ( which happens ), you will have an issue anyway. Try to avoid the use of pH correction products. Try to rely on the micro-life to do the work.Non-organic pH products will damage the micro-life we rely on so much.
 

Old Cro

Active Member
Im in 7 gallon fabric pots use organic nutes and water 2.5 litres of water every 3-4 days. Plants are seven weeks old in flower and i dont water to run off.
 

pakist0ned

Well-Known Member
Whoa. Get that temperature way up. Those are kind of small for age
Temperature is far too low. They're not able to take anything up well.
Yeah, it was the first time I had these temps. And it was only today. It's freaking cold outside. A heater is already in place!

Also, plants have been LSTrained (just bent main stem and spread a few branches)

There is no watering schedule to carry thru a grow
Your plants look like they were overwatered and I suspect you water whether they need it or not because you want to
Ah! Very curious.. if they are overwatered, it is even stranger...
What makes you say that?

Im in 7 gallon fabric pots use organic nutes and water 2.5 litres of water every 3-4 days. Plants are seven weeks old in flower and i dont water to run off.
+/- what I'm doing then. Just in 5 gallon pots. And at that time, I plant to give them around ~1.5L
 
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Herb & Suds

Well-Known Member
Yeah, it was the first time I had these temps. And it was only today. A heater is already in place!

Also, plants have been LSTrained (just bent main stem and spread a few branches)



Ah! Very curious.. if they are overwatered, it is even stranger...
What makes you say that?


+/- what I'm doing then. Just in 5 gallon pots. And at that time, I plant to give them around ~1.5L
Because you have poorly developed plants for their age which tells me you have a sad looking root ball
Probably heat related
 

pakist0ned

Well-Known Member
Because you have poorly developed plants for their age which tells me you have a sad looking root ball
Probably heat related
I don't think is a heat problem. Temps have been stable ~24C until today.
Overwatering is a possibility, but.. is it possible they only consume 750ml in like 5/6 days?
 

calvin.m16

Well-Known Member
According to the manufacturer you want to let that soil dry out between waterings, that being said let it dry back and then water it and record how many ML it takes before the plants drain out the bottom, that's your golden number. SOme plants may drink more than others though so water and track accordingly.

750 ml for 5 gallons of soil sounds way too little of water. I'm giving 2 gallon plants in coco 1000 ml (1 liter) every day.. I understand coco dries out faster but you should be initially at least giving them around 2 liters (2000 ml) in that size pot.

How to use it?
When using All·Mix for the first time, moisten it with water and leave to stand for 36 hours. This gives the Pre·Mix active fertilizer and microorganisms inside the substrate a chance to start working their magic before the plants goes in.
Keep the soil slightly warm at all times – if it’s too cool, the microbial activity slows down, which makes it more difficult for the plants to grow. You also want to allow the soil to dry out between each watering. Because, as the All·Mix substrate dries out, fresh air gets in, which helps the soil to breathe.
The letting it stand for 3 days before planting part isn't necessary. That is some weird advice.
 

pakist0ned

Well-Known Member
According to the manufacturer you want to let that soil dry out between waterings, that being said let it dry back and then water it and record how many ML it takes before the plants drain out the bottom, that's your golden number. SOme plants may drink more than others though so water and track accordingly.

750 ml for 5 gallons of soil sounds way too little of water. I'm giving 2 gallon plants in coco 1000 ml (1 liter) every day.. I understand coco dries out faster but you should be initially at least giving them around 2 liters (2000 ml) in that size pot.



The letting it stand for 3 days before planting part isn't necessary. That is some weird advice.
Yeah, I'm letting it dry out. But I'll do that next watering. Watering until I see a good run off so I can get a measure on what they take.
 

pakist0ned

Well-Known Member
The droopy leaves say overwater if anything...i water when my pots feel light weight. To no runoff
I read it can also be wind stress. It's not happening in the whole plant. And only in 1 plant. So I'm thinking it can be that... Will put it further away from the fan to test it out.
 

pakist0ned

Well-Known Member
[WIP]

Risking overwatering my plants, in sake of knowledge and learning, I decided to run a test regarding watering to see what these pots can handle.

Both plants are on day 37 from seed. Although plant #2 took 7 days to germinate and sprout.

Plant #1:
She started flower, so it was the first flower feeding for her. She is a Sativa dominant, with stretchy and thin stems. She is 29cm now, althought I've bent her.

Pot was very light. I watered her with 2L and had 0.5L run off (25%). It just seemed too much for her. Like 1.5L would seem ideal.

Plant #2:
She is still in veg, she's a Slow autoflower according to Dutch Passion. She is also a Sativa dominant, although her structure reminds a more Indica plant. She's 18cm now, but also bent.

Pot was light, but not as light as Plant #1. I watered 2L, and had basically no run off. So I watered 1 more litre. And the total run off was like 0.1L.

Results (WIP):
These results confuse me a bit. The taller plant (#1), which is also in a more advanced state, seems to need less water than the shorter plant (#2). Although Plant #2 seems sturdier (advertised as a XXL yielder), so, it can be that.

Next step:
I will let this water sink for 1 or 2 hours, and then I'll try to put more water in Plant #1 to make sure how much she handles. Since the soil could be too dry and just drained water instead of running through the whole pot.
For Plant #2 I will also water a bit more, since there was not much run off.

First conclusions:
This still seems a bit off of what I've read from others. A lot of people saying they would start with 1 gallon (~3.7L) and some even said 2.5 gallon (~9.5L) in the end flowering phase. But I might change my mind in a few hours after giving them a bit more water.

But for me, it definitely seems I was underwatering.

Ending this report with a picture of them right after this test. Thank for all your help so far!

IMG_20220110_121858.jpg
Testing setup :bigjoint:
IMG_20220110_111809.jpg
 
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Hollatchaboy

Well-Known Member
[WIP]

Risking overwatering my plants, in sake of knowledge and learning, I decided to run a test regarding watering to see what these pots can handle.

Plant #1:
She started flower, so it was the first flower feeding for her. She is a Sativa dominant, with stretchy and thin stems. She is 29cm now, althought I've bent her.

Pot was very light. I watered her with 2L and had 0.5L run off (25%). It just seemed too much for her. Like 1.5L would seem ideal.

Plant #2:
She is still in veg, she's a Slow autoflower according to Dutch Passion. She is also a Sativa dominant, although her structure reminds a more Indica plant. She's 18cm now, but also bent.

Pot was light, but not as light as Plant #1. I watered 2L, and had basically no run off. So I watered 1 more litre. And the total run off was like 0.1L.

Results (WIP):
These results confuse me a bit. The taller plant (#1), which is also in a more advanced state, seems to need less water than the shorter plant (#2). Although Plant #2 seems sturdier (advertised as a XXL yielder), so, it can be that.

Next step:
I will let this water sink for 1 or 2 hours, and then I'll try to put more water in Plant #1 to make sure how much she handles. Since the soil could be too dry and just drained water instead of running through the whole pot.
For Plant #2 I will also water a bit more, since there was not much run off.

First conclusions:
This still seems a bit off of what I've read from others. A lot of people saying they would start with 1 gallon (~3.7L) and some even said 2.5 gallon (~9.5L) in the end flowering phase. But I might change my mind in a few hours after giving them a bit more water.

But for me, it definitely seems I was underwatering.

Ending this report with a picture of them right after this test. Thank for all your help so far!

View attachment 5063947
Testing setup :bigjoint:
View attachment 5063948
Still looks overwatered to me.
 
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