Ac question please!

Diesel0889

Diesel0889

Well-Known Member
14,000btu active air duel hose ac/dehumidifier, 1205 watts.

I have a dedicated 20amp circut currently running 2 wall fans, good size dehumidifier and my inline/carbon combo. Due to recent heat issues I've decided to install ac/dehumidifier instead to battle it. I only have 2 options to hook it up. Build a stand 3'tall that will fit a 5 gallon bucket under in to drain into. It will plug in or a 3' appliance extension cord of 12g or 10g if I HAVE TO.

OR hook up 15' from plug (running a 9 or 10') extention + the 6' of actual cord from ac. At least 12 gauge etc. And ducting it out the wall into rest of basement.

To not use extention I need to duct from basement window and custom frame in plywood after removing window. (Prob safest option). To run it on the other wall I'd need need the extention. The manufacturer says no extension etc but it's prob based of most people not understanding electronics and possible fire. No need to extend duct its only the cord in question.

What option should I go with. Is the extension cord thing a big deal if it's the proper guage wire and the shortest run possible? Id like to get it installed tomorrow so please give opinion! Thanks and happy growing!


Here is a half ass layout of my room. The basement window is right above the fan closest to the 20amp circut. Also the ac (1 spot) would be where existing dehumidifier is. Also where no extention or very short one depending how it goes (3')20210719_113615.jpg
 
Lordhooha

Lordhooha

Well-Known Member
Diesel0889 said:
14,000btu active air duel hose ac/dehumidifier, 1205 watts.

I have a dedicated 20amp circut currently running 2 wall fans, good size dehumidifier and my inline/carbon combo. Due to recent heat issues I've decided to install ac/dehumidifier instead to battle it. I only have 2 options to hook it up. Build a stand 3'tall that will fit a 5 gallon bucket under in to drain into. It will plug in or a 3' appliance extension cord of 12g or 10g if I HAVE TO.

OR hook up 15' from plug (running a 9 or 10') extention + the 6' of actual cord from ac. At least 12 gauge etc. And ducting it out the wall into rest of basement.

To not use extention I need to duct from basement window and custom frame in plywood after removing window. (Prob safest option). To run it on the other wall I'd need need the extention. The manufacturer says no extension etc but it's prob based of most people not understanding electronics and possible fire. No need to extend duct its only the cord in question.

What option should I go with. Is the extension cord thing a big deal if it's the proper guage wire and the shortest run possible? Id like to get it installed tomorrow so please give opinion! Thanks and happy growing!


Here is a half ass layout of my room. The basement window is right above the fan closest to the 20amp circut. Also the ac (1 spot) would be where existing dehumidifier is. Also where no extention or very short one depending how it goes (3')View attachment 4947991
Click to expand...
Is everything on the same 20 amps?
 
G

GOF

Member
First, you can buy a length of good "SO cable," a DECENT plug for it, "Like a Leviton industrial series plug that's RATED for 20 amps, AND is tough), and just terminate it into a "quad box" with two double "Edison Style" receptacles and a metal "workshop environment type" cover to mount the receptacles. (The kind they use in residential garages and un-finished INTERIOR areas like basements and attics)

Purests will say you HAVE to run 20 amp receptacles, but I say, "That's only if you are going to plug anything in that has a 20 amp plug on it" - ie: one of the two "regular" prongs is SIDEWAYS, not straight "up and down," hence the reason 20 amp Edison style receptacles have that sideways slot added. You can plug a 15 amp item into a 20 amp receptacle, but can not plug a 20 amp plug into a 15 amp "outlet" or "receptacle." (Same thing - just "home gamer terms" vs "Industry Terms." I know - it drives me batty, too.

This short - very heavy duty cord is not going to "go stale in the next 10 years," so it's a pretty worth-while investment that will give you the freedom to do whatever the heck you need to, AND change your mind - your locations - or whatever. (Serve well for many many years. Buy once - cry once.

Now, if you were to make the cord 25', you use 50' as your LENGTH when calculating wire size, the electricity because it goes from the wall through 25' or wire to the box with the receptacles, then returns back to the wall on an equally sized wire that is also 25' long. This is the actual physics of how electricity works, and so it is how you calculate length on a single phase circuit, which this is.

20 amps over 50 feet of #12 wire at 120 volts AC gives you a voltage drop of 4%, so 115.2 volts at the plug, which is acceptable. If you decide to drop to a 20' cord (so 40' run in total), then you have a 3% drop on #12 wire, giving you 116.4V at the plugs.

You want to use some short pieces of ordinary SOLID #12 (or realistically, #14 wire IS preferred and is short enough to NOT be ANY ISSUE) to link the receptacles together (in parelel) AND to make a short pig-tail for hot, neutral and ground connections to the recepticals, and USE WIRE NUTS to join the stranded wire from the SO cable to the solid wire feeding the outlets. Do NOT try to attach stranded wire to the terminals on the outlets unless you are using spade lugs - and even then - that is NOT the proper way to do that because - reasons.

Next, what I'd ACTUALLY ADVISE is, once you've made your "quad box extension 'awesomeness'," start plugging in all the heaviest loads until you trip the breaker @20 amps, then, (using the appliance tags that are on EVERYTHING, including fans, dehuie, AC unit - just plain EVERYTHING to get yourself down below 15 or 16 amps TOTAL on that quad-box) UNPLUG a minimum or 600 or more watts from that circuit, and you'll be well within what you can pull across a 20 amp circuit breaker ALL THE TIME without beating the breaker itself to death.

You NEVER want to run branch circuits at over 80 or 85% of their capacity as a matter of day-to-day use, because you'll eat breakers up, and fuck up whatever you are doing if it's "mission critical." (Like messing up your light cycles real bad and hormonally wrecking havoc in a grow that, you have a good deal of money and time tied up in.)

At 120 volts, you take your number of watts (Ie: 1,250 for your AC unit), then devide that by the number of volts. (Using 120 is fine, as long as you are not in a building where the wirting is all fucked and you're only reading 93 volts at the outlest or something. Really - you DO want to check this with a simple voltage meter or a Kill-A-Watt if you have one of those. Shit wiring and corrosion in old wiring is a "real thing," so it's worth mentioning.

Your AC unit is eating 10 amps when the compressor is running, because it's basically 1,200 watts. This is why NOTHING designed to plug in to a 15 amp plug in North America is ALLOWED to draw MORE than 1500 watts. Safety margin is REQUIRED. (1500 watts / 120Volts = (only) 12.5 amps.

is it also helpful to have a DVM (Digital Voltage Meter) so you can actually SEE how many volts are present with stuff running full bore. It WILL SAG a bit, and THAT'S OKAY, just as long as you're not running at less than about 110 volts CONSISTENTLY.

When your AC compressor first kicks in (or any large inductive load really), there is a thing called "Inrush current" that is way MORE amps than what the tag says it shold pull. This is normal transient, and is okay, just as long as it bounces right back up to 110 volts or better. The engineers build this into the specs, both for equipment, AND for the circuit breakers in your panel box, so don't freak out if you see that. It is norml.

I do hope that helps some. Investing in good, QUALITY extension cords is just that, and investment - not a "waste of money." Stay safe!
 
Diesel0889

Diesel0889

Well-Known Member
GOF said:
First, you can buy a length of good "SO cable," a DECENT plug for it, "Like a Leviton industrial series plug that's RATED for 20 amps, AND is tough), and just terminate it into a "quad box" with two double "Edison Style" receptacles and a metal "workshop environment type" cover to mount the receptacles. (The kind they use in residential garages and un-finished INTERIOR areas like basements and attics)

Purests will say you HAVE to run 20 amp receptacles, but I say, "That's only if you are going to plug anything in that has a 20 amp plug on it" - ie: one of the two "regular" prongs is SIDEWAYS, not straight "up and down," hence the reason 20 amp Edison style receptacles have that sideways slot added. You can plug a 15 amp item into a 20 amp receptacle, but can not plug a 20 amp plug into a 15 amp "outlet" or "receptacle." (Same thing - just "home gamer terms" vs "Industry Terms." I know - it drives me batty, too.

This short - very heavy duty cord is not going to "go stale in the next 10 years," so it's a pretty worth-while investment that will give you the freedom to do whatever the heck you need to, AND change your mind - your locations - or whatever. (Serve well for many many years. Buy once - cry once.

Now, if you were to make the cord 25', you use 50' as your LENGTH when calculating wire size, the electricity because it goes from the wall through 25' or wire to the box with the receptacles, then returns back to the wall on an equally sized wire that is also 25' long. This is the actual physics of how electricity works, and so it is how you calculate length on a single phase circuit, which this is.

20 amps over 50 feet of #12 wire at 120 volts AC gives you a voltage drop of 4%, so 115.2 volts at the plug, which is acceptable. If you decide to drop to a 20' cord (so 40' run in total), then you have a 3% drop on #12 wire, giving you 116.4V at the plugs.

You want to use some short pieces of ordinary SOLID #12 (or realistically, #14 wire IS preferred and is short enough to NOT be ANY ISSUE) to link the receptacles together (in parelel) AND to make a short pig-tail for hot, neutral and ground connections to the recepticals, and USE WIRE NUTS to join the stranded wire from the SO cable to the solid wire feeding the outlets. Do NOT try to attach stranded wire to the terminals on the outlets unless you are using spade lugs - and even then - that is NOT the proper way to do that because - reasons.

Next, what I'd ACTUALLY ADVISE is, once you've made your "quad box extension 'awesomeness'," start plugging in all the heaviest loads until you trip the breaker @20 amps, then, (using the appliance tags that are on EVERYTHING, including fans, dehuie, AC unit - just plain EVERYTHING to get yourself down below 15 or 16 amps TOTAL on that quad-box) UNPLUG a minimum or 600 or more watts from that circuit, and you'll be well within what you can pull across a 20 amp circuit breaker ALL THE TIME without beating the breaker itself to death.

You NEVER want to run branch circuits at over 80 or 85% of their capacity as a matter of day-to-day use, because you'll eat breakers up, and fuck up whatever you are doing if it's "mission critical." (Like messing up your light cycles real bad and hormonally wrecking havoc in a grow that, you have a good deal of money and time tied up in.)

At 120 volts, you take your number of watts (Ie: 1,250 for your AC unit), then devide that by the number of volts. (Using 120 is fine, as long as you are not in a building where the wirting is all fucked and you're only reading 93 volts at the outlest or something. Really - you DO want to check this with a simple voltage meter or a Kill-A-Watt if you have one of those. Shit wiring and corrosion in old wiring is a "real thing," so it's worth mentioning.

Your AC unit is eating 10 amps when the compressor is running, because it's basically 1,200 watts. This is why NOTHING designed to plug in to a 15 amp plug in North America is ALLOWED to draw MORE than 1500 watts. Safety margin is REQUIRED. (1500 watts / 120Volts = (only) 12.5 amps.

is it also helpful to have a DVM (Digital Voltage Meter) so you can actually SEE how many volts are present with stuff running full bore. It WILL SAG a bit, and THAT'S OKAY, just as long as you're not running at less than about 110 volts CONSISTENTLY.

When your AC compressor first kicks in (or any large inductive load really), there is a thing called "Inrush current" that is way MORE amps than what the tag says it shold pull. This is normal transient, and is okay, just as long as it bounces right back up to 110 volts or better. The engineers build this into the specs, both for equipment, AND for the circuit breakers in your panel box, so don't freak out if you see that. It is norml.

I do hope that helps some. Investing in good, QUALITY extension cords is just that, and investment - not a "waste of money." Stay safe!
Click to expand...

To be safe I'm going to try (straight to outlet) as opposed to cord. I built a stand for the ac. Drain to bucket ill get done tomorrow.

I have a dedicated 20amp 4 outlet box for dehumidifier and ac. I have a big one but plan to buy Ideal air 22 pint and set up the continuous drain. Runs about 435 watts if I remember correctly. Put me around 1650. I have a couple wall fans at 50 watts and my inline fan (ac infinity 6") think around 110 watts. I'm close to the 1920 watt threshold at 80%.... ill take exact measurements tomorrow.

Have 1 spot for another breaker and can have a buddy install just one more single pole 20 possibly bigger? Other than that I'd have to add another panel. I wanted to have him do it into my veg space but being as im at 80% or so in my flower room.... I also plan to hook up environment controler as well. Id imagine not everything will be on at once all the time either. With just the ac set to 73f today it was popping on about 5 on 5 off to keep it there. Rh was about 68%. This is why the 22 pint is needed as backup. Only 2 315 were running. My fluence and hlg600h were shut off. On a controler I'm not sure the continuous load would be threatening or anything. All I know is added all together I'm at the 80% load... will post exact numbers when I get up lol.. im stoned and need sleep!

Happy growing!
 
SheeshM

SheeshM

Well-Known Member
I have a Whynter ARC-14S 14K BTU dual hose portable AC and the manufacturer says an extension cord can be used as long as it supports the maximum power consumption of the unit (around 1200 watts, 10a at 120 volts). I'm not sure what brand you have but you may want to check with the manufacturer.
 
Diesel0889

Diesel0889

Well-Known Member
I have a active air 14000btu. 1205 watts. Not sure why they say no cord lol.. I would think a 15-25ft 12g or 10g cord would be plenty safe? But hey wtf do I know?
 
Diesel0889

Diesel0889

Well-Known Member
Was also thinking the duel hose was a good choice. My room is off atm as im drying, was a tad stinky outside last night lol... not sure what I can do bout smell...
 
B

Budden

Well-Known Member
Diesel0889 said:
To be safe I'm going to try (straight to outlet) as opposed to cord. I built a stand for the ac. Drain to bucket ill get done tomorrow.

I have a dedicated 20amp 4 outlet box for dehumidifier and ac. I have a big one but plan to buy Ideal air 22 pint and set up the continuous drain. Runs about 435 watts if I remember correctly. Put me around 1650. I have a couple wall fans at 50 watts and my inline fan (ac infinity 6") think around 110 watts. I'm close to the 1920 watt threshold at 80%.... ill take exact measurements tomorrow.

Have 1 spot for another breaker and can have a buddy install just one more single pole 20 possibly bigger? Other than that I'd have to add another panel. I wanted to have him do it into my veg space but being as im at 80% or so in my flower room.... I also plan to hook up environment controler as well. Id imagine not everything will be on at once all the time either. With just the ac set to 73f today it was popping on about 5 on 5 off to keep it there. Rh was about 68%. This is why the 22 pint is needed as backup. Only 2 315 were running. My fluence and hlg600h were shut off. On a controler I'm not sure the continuous load would be threatening or anything. All I know is added all together I'm at the 80% load... will post exact numbers when I get up lol.. im stoned and need sleep!

Happy growing!
Click to expand...
I’m not an electrician, but I have built several rooms now. GOF has some really good ideas. But my thought has always been to have options and be able to make upgrades in the future. Your flower space is 4x8? How many lights are you running? Two 315 LEC? If you ever want to add more you won’t have the head room on your current circuit. Your current 20amp circuit is at its max, your running amps will always be lower than your start up amps. Give yourself a solid 20% headroom encase everything decides to come on at once. If you have e a friend that can run another circuit to your room that would be my suggestion. By the time you buy everything to put a bandaid on your room you could do it right and have piece of mind. Another option you have is to run 12# 3 strand wire. That way you can run a 220 circuit or 110 off the same line. I always run lights and a/c, if possible, on 220. Pulls less amps and runs more efficiently. Great space you haeve to work with good luck!!
 
Diesel0889

Diesel0889

Well-Known Member
Ok so my flower space has 2 beds in it. A grassroots 4x4 and a 4x8. I have a 4 light autopilot running 240. Atm I have 2 315 cmh over the 4x4. I just received my phantom photobio mx to replace them. Over the 4x8 I have a fluence spyder x plus and a hlg600h.

I have a dedicated 20amp at 120v for ac (1250watts), 2 hurricane wall fans 50watt each), ac infinity 6" and filter (64watts) that's lower than I thought. I would like to add the ideal air 22 pint and make it continuously drain to bucket. My current dehumidifier runs more than the 435 watts of the ideal air.

Total id be at 1804 watts. The ac will prob kick on and off, the dehumidifier will prob run constantly along with fans. Chances are not everything won't run all the time.. chances are I'll have another single pole 20 or 30 installed, just was hoping to run it into veg room as im more limited there. Can I carry a constant load over my 20amp breaker at 1804 watts? I know it's under the 80% but still asking lol. Electricity paranoid me more than the weed lol..

Happy growing!
 
B

Budden

Well-Known Member
Diesel0889 said:
Ok so my flower space has 2 beds in it. A grassroots 4x4 and a 4x8. I have a 4 light autopilot running 240. Atm I have 2 315 cmh over the 4x4. I just received my phantom photobio mx to replace them. Over the 4x8 I have a fluence spyder x plus and a hlg600h.

I have a dedicated 20amp at 120v for ac (1250watts), 2 hurricane wall fans 50watt each), ac infinity 6" and filter (64watts) that's lower than I thought. I would like to add the ideal air 22 pint and make it continuously drain to bucket. My current dehumidifier runs more than the 435 watts of the ideal air.

Total id be at 1804 watts. The ac will prob kick on and off, the dehumidifier will prob run constantly along with fans. Chances are not everything won't run all the time.. chances are I'll have another single pole 20 or 30 installed, just was hoping to run it into veg room as im more limited there. Can I carry a constant load over my 20amp breaker at 1804 watts? I know it's under the 80% but still asking lol. Electricity paranoid me more than the weed lol..

Happy growing!
Click to expand...
Electricity is not a perfect science. The whole grid does fluctuate, even the service to your house fluctuates. Evenings and mornings are the worst. Stoves, a/c, washer/dryers, tv’s in the eve I g as people get home from work and hairdryers, coffee pots, microwaves, stoves, dryers I. The morning as folks are getting ready. Always play it safe. If you place a dedicated circuit for your veg area, will that free up some space on the other circuit?
 
Diesel0889

Diesel0889

Well-Known Member
My veg room is on a 12g extention cord 315@75% and a hlg 135 board bout 50%. Enough for slow growth. And keeps a few keepers alive and slowly growing. House was built in 2000 I think. Think it's on a 20amp breaker but the wire to it looks 14 to me (white) so I don't push it. Ive been sharing with my washing machine,, That's why I wanted a dedicated 20 amp to veg. I have 1 slot on my breaker (single pole). I kinda need it there in a sense. Is 1804 pushing it on the 20amp in flower room?
 
B

Budden

Well-Known Member
Diesel0889 said:
My veg room is on a 12g extention cord 315@75% and a hlg 135 board bout 50%. Enough for slow growth. And keeps a few keepers alive and slowly growing. House was built in 2000 I think. Think it's on a 20amp breaker but the wire to it looks 14 to me (white) so I don't push it. Ive been sharing with my washing machine,, That's why I wanted a dedicated 20 amp to veg. I have 1 slot on my breaker (single pole). I kinda need it there in a sense. Is 1804 pushing it on the 20amp in flower room?
Click to expand...
Personally, and if I could spare 200 bucks, could be way less depending on distance to you box, I would consider running 220 to power all your lights. A light running on 110-120v pulling 3 amps will only pull 1.5 on 220. Meaning you could, in your current state, run all your lights on that circuit leaving your original circuit with space for everything else. Nice and clean with no worries. I’ve ran extension cords across the garage/basement so I could power a heater inside my grow space, after about 6 weeks the plug was burnt. It was the only thing on that circuit.

18 amps on a 20 amp circuit is, in my opinion and according to current standards, over pushing that circuit. But you have a controlled space, know exactly what is tied to that circuit, and know you’re at the threshold could get away with it, but nothing else could be added and I would DEFINITELY monitor that circuit at the wall and breaker for early warning signs of failure.
 
Diesel0889

Diesel0889

Well-Known Member
Was looking at getting the autopilot f60 environment controler as well for the ac and 22 pint dehumidifier. It has a max operating amperage of 14.5. My ac is 10.8 and the ideal air dehumidifier is 4 amp. That puts me at 14.8, wtf. Why would they make this if there own products can't be run together as designed? Any input?
 
rkymtnman

rkymtnman

Well-Known Member
Diesel0889 said:
Was looking at getting the autopilot f60 environment controler as well for the ac and 22 pint dehumidifier. It has a max operating amperage of 14.5. My ac is 10.8 and the ideal air dehumidifier is 4 amp. That puts me at 14.8, wtf. Why would they make this if there own products can't be run together as designed? Any input?
Click to expand...
have you tried running the A/C without the dehuey? it might keep your RH% low enough by itself. would be worth testing
 
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