• Here is a link to the full explanation: https://rollitup.org/t/welcome-back-did-you-try-turning-it-off-and-on-again.1104810/

A message from the 3rd party candidates to the establishment:YOU'RE F*CKING THE US UP

H

HotNSexyMILF

Well-Known Member
When you can bring together the likes of Ron Paul, Baldwin, McKinney, and Nader- and have them agree whole heartily on 4 major issues, YOU KNOW LIBERTY IS AT STAKE.

The press conference was held this morning, all those that attended gave a short speech about how the 2 party system of this country is destroying us by offering no real choice on the most important issues in our country and blocking other candidates from having a real chance.. the agreement they all signed onto..

We Agree​
Foreign Policy: The Iraq War must end as quickly as possible with removal of all our soldiers from the region. We must initiate the return of our soldiers from around the world, including Korea, Japan, Europe and the entire Middle East. We must cease the war propaganda, threats of a blockade and plans for attacks on Iran, nor should we re-ignite the cold war with Russia over Georgia. We must be willing to talk to all countries and offer friendship and trade and travel to all who are willing. We must take off the table the threat of a nuclear first strike against all nations.

Privacy: We must protect the privacy and civil liberties of all persons under US jurisdiction. We must repeal or radically change the Patriot Act, the Military Commissions Act, and the FISA legislation. We must reject the notion and practice of torture, eliminations of habeas corpus, secret tribunals, and secret prisons. We must deny immunity for corporations that spy willingly on the people for the benefit of the government. We must reject the unitary presidency, the illegal use of signing statements and excessive use of executive orders.

The National Debt: We believe that there should be no increase in the national debt. The burden of debt placed on the next generation is unjust and already threatening our economy and the value of our dollar. We must pay our bills as we go along and not unfairly place this burden on a future generation.

The Federal Reserve: We seek a thorough investigation, evaluation and audit of the Federal Reserve System and its cozy relationships with the banking, corporate, and other financial institutions. The arbitrary power to create money and credit out of thin air behind closed doors for the benefit of commercial interests must be ended. There should be no taxpayer bailouts of corporations and no corporate subsidies. Corporations should be aggressively prosecuted for their crimes and frauds.



"We are not being faced with the choice of the lesser of two evils- we're really being faced with the evils of two lessers."

"When you're forced to choose between the lesser of two evils- you're still choosing evil."
 
homerdog

homerdog

Well-Known Member
Great Post!!!!! The core of what needs to be changed and made true in this country. Please cite where you are getting info from, I would love to pass this info onto my Policy Classmates, but must cite references. It is a good practice, even for RIU, as information without a valid source is its self not valid (not saying that about this post, just a lot of crappy info going around).
 
H

HotNSexyMILF

Well-Known Member
I purposely don't cite my sources out of principle- though there are a lot that would like to disagree with my tactics (usually throwing a bunch of 'rules' at me that may I point out, were handed to them by others)- I think more people need to learn how to think for themselves. I'd like to hope all voting adults can use google- form your own independent opinion with your own research , I wish more people did that..

There were plenty of main stream articles today on the event.
 
TheBrutalTruth

TheBrutalTruth

Well-Known Member
Though, yeah, I found an article, just not something published by the MSM, but that's fine by me.

Be interesting to see what happens this election, considering the fact that it seems that both the Democrats and Republicans have done a fair job of pissing of .... well almost everyone.
 
TheBrutalTruth

TheBrutalTruth

Well-Known Member
On September 10th, 2008 WoodinvilleRP says:
Since McCain/Obama really just represent one party: the party of the purple cow? - we need to reinforce the idea that we're not talking about a "3rd" party here - we're talking about a 2nd party... that avoids the "3rd party" baggage and helps reinforce the points made in the press release today.


Just a post from a media site I couldn't resist but to post.


Party of the Purple Cow, that's a good description of Obama and McCain.
 
ZenMaster

ZenMaster

Well-Known Member
HotNSexyMILF said:
When you can bring together the likes of Ron Paul, Baldwin, McKinney, and Nader- and have them agree whole heartily on 4 major issues, YOU KNOW LIBERTY IS AT STAKE.

The press conference was held this morning, all those that attended gave a short speech about how the 2 party system of this country is destroying us by offering no real choice on the most important issues in our country and blocking other candidates from having a real chance.. the agreement they all signed onto..

We Agree​
Foreign Policy: The Iraq War must end as quickly as possible with removal of all our soldiers from the region. We must initiate the return of our soldiers from around the world, including Korea, Japan, Europe and the entire Middle East. We must cease the war propaganda, threats of a blockade and plans for attacks on Iran, nor should we re-ignite the cold war with Russia over Georgia. We must be willing to talk to all countries and offer friendship and trade and travel to all who are willing. We must take off the table the threat of a nuclear first strike against all nations.

Privacy: We must protect the privacy and civil liberties of all persons under US jurisdiction. We must repeal or radically change the Patriot Act, the Military Commissions Act, and the FISA legislation. We must reject the notion and practice of torture, eliminations of habeas corpus, secret tribunals, and secret prisons. We must deny immunity for corporations that spy willingly on the people for the benefit of the government. We must reject the unitary presidency, the illegal use of signing statements and excessive use of executive orders.

The National Debt: We believe that there should be no increase in the national debt. The burden of debt placed on the next generation is unjust and already threatening our economy and the value of our dollar. We must pay our bills as we go along and not unfairly place this burden on a future generation.

The Federal Reserve: We seek a thorough investigation, evaluation and audit of the Federal Reserve System and its cozy relationships with the banking, corporate, and other financial institutions. The arbitrary power to create money and credit out of thin air behind closed doors for the benefit of commercial interests must be ended. There should be no taxpayer bailouts of corporations and no corporate subsidies. Corporations should be aggressively prosecuted for their crimes and frauds.



"We are not being faced with the choice of the lesser of two evils- we're really being faced with the evils of two lessers."

"When you're forced to choose between the lesser of two evils- you're still choosing evil."
Click to expand...
I agree with all besides the very first one, and that is my major issue with Ron Paul. Save from his foreign policy he'd be a decent POTUS. However, he would be a decent VP given that he would not be the commander in chief, and that is what I believe him best as, a VP.
 
homerdog

homerdog

Well-Known Member
I found the source, didn't have to look far. Citing sources makes it easier for people to verify validity, you bring up some great points MILF, and yes I can find the info for myself if I really care.

ZEN- You have to understand that Paul's foriegn policy an integral piece in all of the other points. We are operating outside of our constitutional bounds by joining international organizations and becoming subject to their laws, not to mention operating an empire around the globe. Look at what caused the fall of all of the great empires of the past and you will see why our current state is so disturbing.
 
ViRedd

ViRedd

New Member
If a third party came to power and tried to contain the federal government within the bounds of the Constitution, we would have a revolt the likes of which the world hasn't seen. Do you guyz actually believe that the New American, entitlement mentality and all, would stand still for liberty? :bigjoint:

Vi
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
Most everyone could agree with the content of the post, the problems are many in getting them implemented. I for one agree with about 80% of Ron Pauls agenda. I have problems with the privatization areas. We can all see what a great job our corporations have done with privatization. But they are outnumbered by total political ignorance on the part of the American people. When you bring R.P. up on this forum, you are preaching to the choir, and there aren't enough people here to make a difference. The best hope we have for change is Obama. McSame will continue on the destructive path Bush has laid down and probably start WWIII. I would bet on this, but if I win, I lose. BTW, I may check and see what the odds are in Vegas, I've heard it's 2-1 Obama.
 
H

HotNSexyMILF

Well-Known Member
ViRedd said:
If a third party came to power and tried to contain the federal government within the bounds of the Constitution, we would have a revolt the likes of which the world hasn't seen. Do you guyz actually believe that the New American, entitlement mentality and all, would stand still for liberty? :bigjoint:

Vi
Click to expand...
Maybe it's time to remind everyone what liberty is and start reteaching our roots (since the public school system has perfectly changed history)...


Seriously though Vi- if it came down to a blood bath between those that want real freedom and those that want everything given to them.. who do you see winning? :fire: We have true inspiration- nothing is a stronger force than the thirst for freedom..
 
H

HotNSexyMILF

Well-Known Member
medicineman said:
Most everyone could agree with the content of the post, the problems are many in getting them implemented. I for one agree with about 80% of Ron Pauls agenda. I have problems with the privatization areas. We can all see what a great job our corporations have done with privatization. But they are outnumbered by total political ignorance on the part of the American people. When you bring R.P. up on this forum, you are preaching to the choir, and there aren't enough people here to make a difference. The best hope we have for change is Obama. McSame will continue on the destructive path Bush has laid down and probably start WWIII. I would bet on this, but if I win, I lose. BTW, I may check and see what the odds are in Vegas, I've heard it's 2-1 Obama.
Click to expand...
I agree, most everyone can agree on the 4 major points- EXCEPT THE TWO MAIN CANDIDATES.. you can argue there's minor difference but when you scrap all the cream off the top, they both believe the same thing..

I know Med you are worried about the 'free market' approach, as are many of the modern liberals- honestly though- what we have is NOT a free market. The market we currently have is purposely biased towards the corporations- wherein a true free market joe shmo on the corner would have just as much of a shot as making a sale as say Walmart. All the government regulations, permits, licenses, etc. have ruined the idea of a free market.

I see very little difference between McCain and Obama, esp. in these 4 root issues.
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
HotNSexyMILF said:
Maybe it's time to remind everyone what liberty is and start reteaching our roots (since the public school system has perfectly changed history)...


Seriously though Vi- if it came down to a blood bath between those that want real freedom and those that want everything given to them.. who do you see winning? :fire: We have true inspiration- nothing is a stronger force than the thirst for freedom..
Click to expand...
Are you insinuating the Haves should attack the have nots. I'm pretty sure that should be the other way around, and unless the haves get the military on their side, they would be outnumbered by about 1,000-1. Come on now, when you espouse "real Freedom", aren't you basically saying you want to have the government leave "your" money alone? That is what Vi is all about. See, here's the deal: When you live in a society, then every individual has the civic duty to look out for every citizen, young, old, rich, or poor. That is what society means, interaction with your fellow citizens. The only fair way is to tax the rich progressively to help the poor. I don't believe in hand outs except in dire situations, hand ups are what I espouse.
 
H

HotNSexyMILF

Well-Known Member
medicineman said:
Are you insinuating the Haves should attack the have nots. I'm pretty sure that should be the other way around, and unless the haves get the military on their side, they would be outnumbered by about 1,000-1. Come on now, when you espouse "real Freedom", aren't you basically saying you want to have the government leave "your" money alone? That is what Vi is all about. See, here's the deal: When you live in a society, then every individual has the civic duty to look out for every citizen, young, old, rich, or poor. That is what society means, interaction with your fellow citizens. The only fair way is to tax the rich progressively to help the poor. I don't believe in hand outs except in dire situations, hand ups are what I espouse.
Click to expand...
I am by no means insinuating that the 'haves should attack the have nots'. What I am saying is that when it comes to drive, to determination- I don't see those that 'want their handouts' being as motivated as those who desire freedom.

Last time I checked our bill of rights was for the individual. I am not a part of a society, I am an individual in a republic- by choice. I reject the notion that it is my responsibility to take care of any other adult. That includes my money, my home, my possessions, my time- the government has no right to forcefully take any of those. (though they seem to think they do) I care very much for others around me and help others when I can and when I choose to.
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
HotNSexyMILF said:
I agree, most everyone can agree on the 4 major points- EXCEPT THE TWO MAIN CANDIDATES.. you can argue there's minor difference but when you scrap all the cream off the top, they both believe the same thing..

I know Med you are worried about the 'free market' approach, as are many of the modern liberals- honestly though- what we have is NOT a free market. The market we currently have is purposely biased towards the corporations- wherein a true free market joe shmo on the corner would have just as much of a shot as making a sale as say Walmart. All the government regulations, permits, licenses, etc. have ruined the idea of a free market.

I see very little difference between McCain and Obama, esp. in these 4 root issues.
Click to expand...
I must vehemently disagree on the government controls on corporations. There are basically none outside of licences and permits. The corporations basically do what they want including downsizing longterm jobs and outsourcing them to foriegn lands, heck, the Bush regime even gave them tax incentives to do just that. When a corporation like Enron, Global crossing, Etc. can steal all the money and pilfer the retirement accounts of thousands and cause all the employees to lose their jobs and retirement while the CEOs walk with millions, I'd say there isn't enough regulation on corporations. Since they wont police themselves, a little government oversight may be in order. Where are the workers protections? Is it fair to work for a company for 20+ years and be approaching retirement and have the plug pulled on your life, no job, no retirement??? Let's get real.
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
HotNSexyMILF said:
I am by no means insinuating that the 'haves should attack the have nots'. What I am saying is that when it comes to drive, to determination- I don't see those that 'want their handouts' being as motivated as those who desire freedom.

Last time I checked our bill of rights was for the individual. I am not a part of a society, I am an individual in a republic- by choice. I reject the notion that it is my responsibility to take care of any other adult. That includes my money, my home, my possessions, my time- the government has no right to forcefully take any of those. (though they seem to think they do) I care very much for others around me and help others when I can and when I choose to.
Click to expand...
Then take your home your money and all your possessions and move to a farm way out on a dirt road and stop bitching about government. It is all of that that makes a society. if you don't want to belong then leave. The world does not revolve around you, (even though you must think it does), so either figure out that you are part of the society or get the fuck out. I guess that pretty much sums up my position. Remember I said, no hand outs, just hand ups, except in dire situations. No lazy bastards need apply.
 
P

Parker

Well-Known Member
HotNSexyMILF said:
I am by no means insinuating that the 'haves should attack the have nots'. What I am saying is that when it comes to drive, to determination- I don't see those that 'want their handouts' being as motivated as those who desire freedom.

Last time I checked our bill of rights was for the individual. I am not a part of a society, I am an individual in a republic- by choice. I reject the notion that it is my responsibility to take care of any other adult. That includes my money, my home, my possessions, my time- the government has no right to forcefully take any of those. (though they seem to think they do) I care very much for others around me and help others when I can and when I choose to.
Click to expand...
You hit the nail right on the head. If I wanted someone to tell me how to spend my money I'll get married. These clowns who think otherwise should move to a socialist country.
 
homerdog

homerdog

Well-Known Member
“I know Med you are worried about the 'free market' approach, as are many of the modern liberals- honestly though- what we have is NOT a free market. The market we currently have is purposely biased towards the corporations- wherein a true free market joe shmo on the corner would have just as much of a shot as making a sale as say Walmart. All the government regulations, permits, licenses, etc. have ruined the idea of a free market.”

Exactly!!!

[FONT=&quot]“I must vehemently disagree on the government controls on corporations. There are basically none outside of licences and permits.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]No, this is the point. Individuals should be able to sell food, alcohol, mj, clothes, etc. The regulations and licenses requirements are the demise of the free trade. I understand some of them are for “safety”, but they have become much more than that. The problem is still that incentives are given and make it easier for a corporation in the first place, then add incentives to move overseas and its more F’d up. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]“Is it fair to work for a company for 20+ years and be approaching retirement and have the plug pulled on your life, no job, no retirement???”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]When you think you are entitled to those benefits then I suppose you do have a problem with it. Personal resp! Now if you are paying into it and someone takes it away then that is wrong. Note – it still sucks[/FONT]
 
TheBrutalTruth

TheBrutalTruth

Well-Known Member
Medman, to state that just the corporations are responsible, or just the government is responsible is a fallacious argument at best. The government is, for all intents and purposes, ran by the lobbyists, who are bought and paid for by special interest groups, including the corporations, teachers' union, AARP, Workers' Unions, Doctors, Lawyers, More Lawyers, and so on and so forth.

The foxes have been put in charge of the hen house due to failure on the part of the individual to ensure that they were diligent, and did not fall for the lies fed to them by socialists, and people under the control of the special interest groups.

Income tax and the 16th amendment were instituted by people lying to the public about how it would only be levied against the "rich". Any time you reduce the argument to one about haves or have nots you show your incompetency. You are letting people that want to strip every single individual of their rights define the argument. And when you have lost control of being able to frame the argument you have already lost half the battle.

Besides, the only thing that comes from the "Bread and Circuses for all" promises that the Socialists would promise us is a lethargic, lazy public that lacks in motivation and drive, and one that will bow down before tyrants and demagogues as long as they are promised even more "bread and circuses."

"The struggle for the ages has been to rescue liberty from the grasp of executive power." - I don't remember who it's from...

Besides, I don't know how you can possibly believe in socialism when it has shown that it can not be respected. In our capitalist society people are free to speak their mind, and advocate changes, in a socialist society change is feared, and dissent is punished with death and impisonment. Speaking your mind only means that your neighbor is likely to betray you to the "thought police."

Socialism is a dead system that has shown time and time again that it DOES NOT WORK. You are not going to change humanity, no matter how hard you strive, because at its core humanity knows that the individual needs to be free to function correctly. The idea that it takes "a village" to raise a child is ludicrous. What it takes to raise a child is parents free of interference unless they truly are abusing a child, or neglecting a child, and not just by sending the child to bed with out supper, or spanking them. How can you advocate a system that would not allow free speech?
How can you advocate a system that needs to fear its citizenry so much that it takes away their guns?
How can you advocate a system so afraid of debate and dissent that it kills people who speak up against it?

Socialism reduces people to the status of animals by denying that the individual is sacred. It is our very individuality that sets us above the animals. "If everyone is thinking alike some one isn't thinking." - George Patton.
 
ViRedd

ViRedd

New Member
HotNSexyMILF said:
I am by no means insinuating that the 'haves should attack the have nots'. What I am saying is that when it comes to drive, to determination- I don't see those that 'want their handouts' being as motivated as those who desire freedom.

Last time I checked our bill of rights was for the individual. I am not a part of a society, I am an individual in a republic- by choice. I reject the notion that it is my responsibility to take care of any other adult. That includes my money, my home, my possessions, my time- the government has no right to forcefully take any of those. (though they seem to think they do) I care very much for others around me and help others when I can and when I choose to.
Click to expand...
MILF ... This is your best post ever. :)

Vi
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top