A long list of issues with practical solutions

Excellent argument, Drama

MuyLocoNC said:

Excellent argument, Drama

Click to expand...

Thanks, lets also not forget that of the top FIVE GDP per capita countries, Non Min Wage countries make up FOUR of them. According to the CIA factbook that is. Know where the USA lies? #12.

More statistics..of the top 30 richest countries in the world, countries with no min wage occupy 14 of those positions or 46%. of the 100 poorest countries only 2 of the non min wage countries exist, or about 2%.

NoDrama said:

I believe in unemployment insurance also, after all its run by the state, not the fed and is fully funded by you and your employer, i also believe in supplementary insurance like AFLAC or something too.

Let's take on your logic shall we? I am going to list all the countries in the world that do not have a government mandated minimum wage, you stop me when you find a really poor shithole of a country that you can apply your logic to ok?

Germany
Switzerland
Brunei
Denmark
Finland
Bahrain
Iceland
Norway
Italy
Sweden
Fiji
Kiribati
Liechtenstein
China
Qatar
Singapore
Suriname


Oh wait, I found 5 countries that are 3rd world and don't have min wage
Namibia
Somali
Ethiopia
Yemen
Zimbabwe ( which only recently became 3rd world)


I bet you a million dollars that the MAJORITY of people who exist in countries with no mandated minimum wage DO NOT have to make their children work at all to pay the bills since the majority of them exist in countries with the HIGHEST per capita income in the world.


Myth Busted, blown out of the water, check my facts. The Majority of the countries that do not have min wage laws are the top per capita income countries in the world.

Fully Half of the top GDP/capita countries in the entire world do not have Min Wage laws. Which is quite surprising considering there are only 23 of the 191 countries that do not have these laws. So in other words these countries make up less than 12% of the countries, yet occupy more than 50% of the top 25 GDP per capita earners.

Kinda flies in the face of everything you assumed about those countries doesn't it?

Even worse? of the poorest 50 countries on the planet, 96% of them have Min Wage laws. Only 2 countries do not, Zimbabwe and Yemen. Somalia can also be included but not officially since there are no statistics due to no government.

Click to expand...

Wow, you dare to use socialist countries, countries that offer national universal social supports, univeral health care, universal pensions and a host of other widespread social programs to say nothing of countries that have limited population growth and relatively controled borders as examples of how well unregulated pay works? Oh, and your willingness to bet imaginary money hardly establishes proof of anything. You are attempting to compare the applest of apples to American oranges.

NoDrama said:

I believe in unemployment insurance also, after all its run by the state, not the fed and is fully funded by you and your employer, i also believe in supplementary insurance like AFLAC or something too.

Let's take on your logic shall we? I am going to list all the countries in the world that do not have a government mandated minimum wage, you stop me when you find a really poor shithole of a country that you can apply your logic to ok?

Germany
Switzerland
Brunei
Denmark
Finland
Bahrain
Iceland
Norway
Italy
Sweden
Fiji
Kiribati
Liechtenstein
China
Qatar
Singapore
Suriname


Oh wait, I found 5 countries that are 3rd world and don't have min wage
Namibia
Somali
Ethiopia
Yemen
Zimbabwe ( which only recently became 3rd world)


I bet you a million dollars that the MAJORITY of people who exist in countries with no mandated minimum wage DO NOT have to make their children work at all to pay the bills since the majority of them exist in countries with the HIGHEST per capita income in the world.


Myth Busted, blown out of the water, check my facts. The Majority of the countries that do not have min wage laws are the top per capita income countries in the world.

Fully Half of the top GDP/capita countries in the entire world do not have Min Wage laws. Which is quite surprising considering there are only 23 of the 191 countries that do not have these laws. So in other words these countries make up less than 12% of the countries, yet occupy more than 50% of the top 25 GDP per capita earners.

Kinda flies in the face of everything you assumed about those countries doesn't it?

Even worse? of the poorest 50 countries on the planet, 96% of them have Min Wage laws. Only 2 countries do not, Zimbabwe and Yemen. Somalia can also be included but not officially since there are no statistics due to no government.

Click to expand...

[TABLE="class: sortable wikitable jquery-tablesorter"]
[TR]
[TD]Germany
[/TD]
[TD]none, except for construction workers, electrical workers, janitors, roofers, painters, and letter carriers; set by collective bargaining agreements in other sectors of the economy and enforceable by law[SUP][9][/SUP]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

[TABLE="class: sortable wikitable jquery-tablesorter"]
[TR]
[TD]Denmark
[/TD]
[TD]none, nationally; instead, negotiated between unions and employer associations; 103.15 kroner per hour, according to statistics released on March 1, 2009
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

[TABLE="class: sortable wikitable jquery-tablesorter"]
[TR]
[TD]Finland
[/TD]
[TD]not in law; however, the law requires all employers, including nonunionized ones, to pay minimum wages agreed to in collective bargaining agreements; almost all workers are covered under such arrangements[SUP][9][/SUP]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

[TABLE="class: sortable wikitable jquery-tablesorter"]
[TR]
[TD]Norway
[/TD]
[TD]none; wages normally fall within a national scale negotiated by labor, employers, and local governments
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

[TABLE="class: sortable wikitable jquery-tablesorter"]
[TR]
[TD]Switzerland
[/TD]
[TD]none; however, a majority of the voluntary collective bargaining agreements contain clauses on minimum compensation, ranging from 2,200 to 4,200 francs per month for unskilled workers and from 2,800 to 5,300 francs per month for skilled employees[SUP][9][/SUP]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

[TABLE="class: sortable wikitable jquery-tablesorter"]
[TR]
[TD]Sweden
[/TD]
[TD]none; set by annual collective bargaining contracts
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

[TABLE="class: sortable wikitable jquery-tablesorter"]
[TR]
[TD]Italy
[/TD]
[TD]none by law; instead set through collective bargaining agreements on a sector-by-sector basis
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

[TABLE="class: sortable wikitable jquery-tablesorter"]
[TR]
[TD]Iceland[/TD]
[TD]none; minimum wages are negotiated in various collectively bargained agreements and applied automatically to all employees in those occupations, regardless of union membership; while the agreements can be either industry- or sector-wide, and in some cases firm-specific, the minimum wage levels are occupation-specific[SUP][9]



[TABLE="class: sortable wikitable jquery-tablesorter"]
[TR]
[TD]Fiji[/TD]
[TD]none, nationally; set by the Wages Councils for certain sectors[SUP]https://www.rollitup.org/#cite_note-CRHRP-2008-8[/SUP][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/SUP][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

I could go on and on. IN regards to Brunei and Bahrain. They actually rely on near Slave Labor imported from other Countries from Africa and Asia

Thanks, I forgot collective bargaining. Seems his argument is blown entirely.

MuyLocoNC said:

Excellent argument, Drama

Click to expand...

Aparently not MuylocoNC.

canndo said:

Aparently not MuylocoNC.

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First, it's more than a stretch to compare bargained union wages of select parts of the overall workforce to a Federally mandated minimum wage for everyone. Second, I would have to know what percentage of the working citizens of those countries are in the unions that have these collective bargaining wages in place. If it's a small percentage of the overall working population, I'd say Drama's examples and argument still have the advantage, if it's a majority, I'd say HereToday makes a good counterpoint.

MuyLocoNC said:

First, it's more than a stretch to compare bargained union wages of select parts of the overall workforce to a Federally mandated minimum wage for everyone. Second, I would have to know what percentage of the working citizens of those countries are in the unions that have these collective bargaining wages in place. If it's a small percentage of the overall working population, I'd say Drama's examples and argument still have the advantage, if it's a majority, I'd say HereToday makes a good counterpoint.

Click to expand...

Not a word however about the socialist nature of most of the countries mentioned - the result of the two is that you can't really compare then with the U.S..