A Bored Electrician to Answer Your Questions

IAm5toned

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
gumball said:
I have been thinking bout this all morning! Am I suppose to wire that type of timer between my ballast and the wall outlet? If I do that, does the timer still need the ballast ratings, or are the Tungsten values what matter when dealing with hid lighting?
Click to expand...
as in my above post,
tungsten and inductive have nothing to do with each other, at all.

tungsten ratings should never be applied when sizing electrical equipment for ANY grow application.

the timer always needs to be rated for whatever you have plugged into the timer. if you have 200w of incadescant lamps plugged into the timer, you would use the tungsten rating.
but you have 100w of ballast plugged into it, so you use inductive ratings, always use inductive ratings! always!

but you dont, and should never have, incandescent lamps in a grow room, unless your using them for heating purposes only
 
IAm5toned

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
kingofqueen said:
Got any ideas for building a cycle timer 1on 4 off ?
Click to expand...
one on, four off is an odd cycle for a timer.
the reason being is that is a 5 hour cycle, we have 24 hour days.
so you can see how no matter what, at the end of the day, your cycle will still have a few hours 'leftover'
this is a problem for you, as most industrial processes run based on a 24 hour cycle, 3 shifts of 8, or 2 of 12....no one runs 5 hour cycles commonly, so 5 hour cycle timers are rare.
building one from scratch can be done, but should be done more as a hobby than as something you would use in place of professionally rated and designed equipment with UL listings.

here is the instructions for a basic cycle timer, in the top right is a one line block diagram that shows the basic components:
http://www.intermatic.com/~/media/files/intermatic/products/instructions/timers/c8845 - english.ashx

personally, i would just buy a digital cycle timer and program it for desired operation.
 
IAm5toned

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
aTTicRaT said:
Thanks for all your info to me and the rest of the farmers '5toned. OK so I have a digital 400 HPS setup that I ordered a while ago from HTGSupply because it was the right price even if at the not so right time. Anyhow, I haven't used the system other than to fire it up to make sure it worked upon delivery. My question is, can I use a 150w or 250w HPS bulb with the 400w ballast? I don't think I really need 400w for what I'm doing but I'd like a little more than CFLs or tubes have to offer.
Click to expand...
you could if it was a magnetic ballast, and not a digital.

ps-

there is no such thing, as too much lighting, unless you cant mange the heat.
believe me, the difference that 400w will make over the cfl's will blow your mind.

cfl's work great, and produce awesome smoke when used right, but they cannot replace the speed of growth that HID lighting provides.
 
IAm5toned

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
TheDude0007 said:
Man thanks so much, that puts me at ease. Although I have no idea what the "blades" are. Excuse my ignorance. :-)
Click to expand...
the 'blades' are the metal contact points inside the outlet itself.
all the power goes through the blades. they are spring loaded, to maintain proper contact. over time, the springs can get worn out, especially if your constantly plugging ang unplugging, or controlling inductive loads (your grow is an inductive load).
 
Danielsgb

Danielsgb

Well-Known Member
IAm5toned said:
as far as that goes, your out of luck....unless its a multitap ballast. the only way you will know is to take it apart and see what type of wiring is coming off of the ballast core, or check the nameplate. if its a multitap ballast, there will be leads for many different types of voltages, usually 120/208/240/277/480.
the ballast core itself has to be wound for lower voltages for the fixture to work on 240v. even if you were to change the ignitor/cap, a 480v ballast is going to step the incoming 480 voltage down to something like 110vac, and if you put 240v on a 480v core, you will only get aprox 55v out of it. you can now see how the windings of the ballast core are directly proportionate to the incoming voltage. a 480v core has a step down ratio (also called turns ratio) of about 4:1, a 240v core has a ratio of roughly 2:1
Click to expand...
Once again Thanks.:mrgreen:
Now I understand what the Multi-tap actually does . I'll have to go back and check them out. Many are there so now I'll know which are pointless. And which are gold.:twisted:
Daniels:eyesmoke:
 
gumball

gumball

Well-Known Member
IAm5toned said:
tungsten does NOT mean inductive.
tungsten means incandescent lamps... the type of lamps you will never use for a successful grow.
your CMH ballast is inductive. all ballasts are inductive.
the 1875w general purpose timer should work for your 100w ballast, however its not rated for inductive loads, so i cannot say with any degree of certainty just how long it will work... it might be a year, it might be 12 hours, theres no way to tell.
your current timer will work just fine, albeit being a little noisy.
Click to expand...
Thanks so much 5toned, I really appreciate it. At least I can run it on my current timer while I search around. And I know NO incandescent! There as much a safety hazard as they are poor growers.
 
Rusko

Rusko

Active Member
im having a electrician come over to fix my NO electricity in the garage.lol.

HOW can i ask him(correct terms) how many Watts or power(fuck i dont knw vocab.) can i use without blowing a fuse.and is ther any tips or tricks in saving energy or hooking up save protection shit??????
 
IAm5toned

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
Rusko said:
im having a electrician come over to fix my NO electricity in the garage.lol.

HOW can i ask him(correct terms) how many Watts or power(fuck i dont knw vocab.) can i use without blowing a fuse.and is ther any tips or tricks in saving energy or hooking up save protection shit??????
Click to expand...
dont bother asking him, ive done the work for you. as far as tips on saving energy, to be brutally honest there really are not any that will make a big savings magically appear on your bill. the best trick, is running your lights @ nightime when at all possible, its easier for a/c to cool the grow @ night then it is during the day in the summer, and in the winter, it helps with your heating bill. if you plan on pulling some serious wattage, like greater than 2kw, then you can have the lights running on opposite phases (saw 1kw on blk phase one, and 1 kw on red phase 2) running large parallel loads on opposite phases can save you 5-8%, but like i said, it only works on large loads.
all you really have to worry about is how your going to pay for his services. :D

common continuous duty grow operation wattages based on voltage, with breaker and wire sizes. all wire sizes are based on thwn-2/thhn Cu conductors with a max run of 300'
breaker size----volts------ max wattage allowed ----smallest wire size allowed

  • 15 amp breaker @ 120v = 1440w(12 amps actual) max = #14 awg Cu wire, min
  • 20 amp breaker @ 120v = 1920w(16 amps actual) max = #12 awg Cu wire, min
  • 30 amp breaker @ 120v = 2880w(24 amps actual) max = #10 awg Cu wire, min
  • 40 amp breaker @ 120v = 3840w(32 amps actual) max = #8 awg Cu wire, min
  • 60 amp breaker @ 120v = 5760w(48 amps actual) max = #6 awg Cu wire, min
  • 100 amp breaker @ 120v = 9600w(80 amps actual) max = #3 awg Cu wire, min

  • 15 amp breaker @ 240v = 2880w(12 amps actual) max = #14 awg Cu wire, min
  • 20 amp breaker @ 240v = 3840w(16 amps actual) max = #12 awg Cu wire, min
  • 30 amp breaker @ 240v = 5760w(24 amps actual) max = #10 awg Cu wire, min
  • 40 amp breaker @ 240v = 7680w(32 amps actual) max = #8 awg Cu wire, min
  • 60 amp breaker @ 240v = 11520w(48 amps actual) max = #6 awg Cu wire, min
  • 100 amp breaker @ 240v= 19200w(80 amps actual) max = #3 awg Cu wire, min
 
gumball

gumball

Well-Known Member
Hello again 5toned! i wanted to do the legwork on this myself, and this is how I think I should wire my new ballast. this is my ballast, i took the shot and edited it. all wires I did not label were pre-wired from the manufacturer. I used the term neutral here, i think i used it right.

i did not include any of this in the diagram, but I want to spell out what I plan to do so you can slap my hand before I get burnt!! :roll: the ground is the bottom wire on an outlet. that wire is then "grounded" to the case which I am mounting the ballast in on the opposite end. the ballast being secured to the case then makes a "ground" for electricity to discharge in case of an electrical fault of some type.

did I get it right? I wanted to figure it out myself, but I couldnt wire it up without some reassurance from an expert!! thanks for your help once again
 
IAm5toned

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
gumball said:
Hello again 5toned! i wanted to do the legwork on this myself, and this is how I think I should wire my new ballast. this is my ballast, i took the shot and edited it. all wires I did not label were pre-wired from the manufacturer. I used the term neutral here, i think i used it right.

i did not include any of this in the diagram, but I want to spell out what I plan to do so you can slap my hand before I get burnt!! :roll: the ground is the bottom wire on an outlet. that wire is then "grounded" to the case which I am mounting the ballast in on the opposite end. the ballast being secured to the case then makes a "ground" for electricity to discharge in case of an electrical fault of some type.

did I get it right? I wanted to figure it out myself, but I couldnt wire it up without some reassurance from an expert!! thanks for your help once again
Click to expand...
you got it right!

bonghits for you
bongsmilie
 
J

jetskey

Active Member
hey IamStoned,

I was wondering if 50amp breaker be enough to run 6 1000w hps lights , canfan, 2 small fans, and ac/dehumidifier? Thanks
 
IAm5toned

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
jetskey said:
hey IamStoned,

I was wondering if 50amp breaker be enough to run 6 1000w hps lights , canfan, 2 small fans, and ac/dehumidifier? Thanks
Click to expand...
at what voltage?

@ 120v, 50amp = 4800w, max, so the answer would be no.
@ 240v, 50 amp = 9600w, max, so the answer would be yes.

heres how you figuire it out-

for each peice of equipment, multiply the max input wattage x .8, then add them all up.
if you dont know the wattage, but know the voltage and the amperage, multiply the voltage x the amperage to get the wattage, then multiply times .8, and add to the total.

example-

27.5amps of lighting (1000w lamp, 60w demand factor for ballast)@ 240v = 6600w x .8 = 5280w
4.58amps of a/c @ 240v = 1100w x .8 = 880w
.75amps of small fans (45w x 2) @ 120v= 90w x .8 = 72w
1amps of can fan @ 120v = 120w x .8 = 96w

5280w
880w
72w
+ 96w
--------
6328w > 4800w@120vac=nope
6328w < 9600w@240vac=yep

:bongsmilie:
 
Danielsgb

Danielsgb

Well-Known Member
So while working on my next Grow Chamber I'm calling Amana Grow Indica I was looking at it's diagram. While removing the UL sticker, I had a thought I had to share. I see it's all Underwriters Laboratory listed. Help from you should be UnderIAm5toned Laboratory Listed:weed:
Danielsbongsmilie
Back cleaned 003.jpg
 
McNerdius

McNerdius

Active Member
Hello. McNerd here. I'm in the process of (finally) moving to HPS for flowering. I own a Kill-A-Watt and it's reporting my Power Factor as .4 on my mechanical ballast. Is this ridiculous ? I've been googling around but all i can find figures on is newer digital/electric ballasts with >.9% and >.99 PF. Nobody's going to brag about a .4 PF.

On the off chance it's my Kill-A-Watt that's at fault, a 26w 6500k Bright Effects CFL shows .62 PF.

If ANYONE has a magnetically ballasted HPS and/or similar CFL, along with the means to measure PF and/or Volt-Amps, please do so. I understand that a low PF doesn't up my bill, but i'm just trying to rule out a faulty ballast.
 
IAm5toned

IAm5toned

Well-Known Member
mor elikely it is a faulty capacitor..... qs its the capacitor that is used to correct the power factor in the first place.... get an oem replacement, or, gt one with a slightly higher mF rating than the one in the fixture, and it should correct the problem.
 
Slixxor

Slixxor

Well-Known Member
Although 240/120V AC fans flow more I prefer 12V fans, they are safer to use, setup and safer to adjust the flow of. using AC speed controllers that regulate voltage or resist current can cause fires.

The only correct way to dim AC fans is via PWM (Pulse Width Modulation) For that matter if anyone would like a circuit diagram of a simple AC motor speed controller I can provide a diagram. My design uses high power MOSFETs and a 555 timer. for those more technical I can provide source for a PIC circuit using a 16F628A.

- Slix
 
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