500 Watt T5 Fluorescent Grow Room Questions

Hello Everyone, this is my very first post, however I have read allot and will love being apart of this community.
First let me begin with my background of Cannabis knowledge. To sum it up…A shit load of “book knowledge” and three weeks of “field” knowledge. I spent about 100 hours reading about growing, watching youtube videos, “never get busted” videos. Then I spent about 1000$ on equipment to start my grow. I bought a 500 watt HPS, MH interchangeable light system, and 500 watt T5 fluorescents system. I was going to put my clones under the fluorescents and flower/veg with the HID lights. I also bought a butt load of Mylar, and a complete Hydoponics kit. And the water pumps and containers and other miscellaneous material from Wal-Mart….I started from soil, I was not gonna actually use my Hydroponics equipment until I successfully harvested with a soil medium. ……Well I knew about temperature issues with HID lights when a bought them, I was so “excited” though I just knew I would figure out a vent system. Well The only thing I came up with was to cut a hole in my ceiling and vent to my addict…. Speed things up…sorry guys. …. Okay I got really scared after my plants started to grow, in my state it’s 10 to life for 1000 or less plants, I have a family and kids, I am pretty and white and would defiantly be someone’s bitch in prison…. So I destroyed my babies thinking it was not worth it. I never told a soul to anybody, I know the golden rule, keep your mouth shut. But I just kept imagining these effing DEA bastards FLIRing my house and seeing those hot HID lights. I just could not take the risk…………And I know cops need an informant and a warrant to FLIR your house, but I also know cops don’t give a shit about you constitutional rights, at least most anyway………….. But still I have all my equipment, and I still want to grow….But only with my 500 watt T5 system. Because there is no heat buildup and is very stealthy. That infa- red detection crap scares the hell out of me……So after long ado…
I got this 5’ long, five bulb 500 watt T5 system. I have 10 bulbs, five veg spectrum for vegging and five flower spectrum that I will switch out when appropriate. I also have some other Fluorescent shop tubes to supplement. I will cover my grow room in Mylar (so that should help, keep that in mind) and grow using the T5’s. I would like to know some advise/knowledge about a few issues. First…. Can I still grow with my Hydroponics, and will that improve yields with just using the T5?? Secound… I was planning on still using my HID lights but on a timer to turn off every 30 min for an hour, then turn back on for 30min…This way I would keep the heat down…hopefully, if I think there is to much heat build up I will not use them at all….Will this on/off cycle even make a difference, a good difference or not worth the trouble?? Last, what do you think my yields per plant could be using this setup/hydroponics (if I can.) How could I improve them…. Thanks everyone…I know this is long and drawn out, please don’t get to mad….oh and do you know strains that do better with fluorescents??

From everything I have read growing with hydroponics is possible with a T5. It will take longer. Sounds like you've got a monster of a T5. As far as the HID schedule that sounds like it would be a lot of stress on the bulb. Also it draws more power at start up of the bulb. Turning on and off would use more energy than normal. Not sure if digital ballasts are that way though. You could always just consider more ventilation. Oh yeah and check this thread out. https://www.rollitup.org/indoor-growing/58701-results-cfl-vs-t5-vs.html

I just came back from a grow store and they said the T5 is the way to go if you're not going to the MH or HPS. My question is do T12s work for vegetation?

f1tzg3r4ald said:

You could always just consider more ventilation. Oh yeah and check this thread out. https://www.rollitup.org/indoor-growing/58701-results-cfl-vs-t5-vs.html

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This link was broken.

Origianlly posted by: Tanuvan

Results CFL vs T5 vs HPS in ScroG
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After doing a bit of research, it seems that with HPS wattages below 250hps the difference in yield between CFL/T5 is not all that much different.

*Note...this is for Scrog Only where the penetration depth isn't as big of an issue when compared to untrained or Sog style grows*

It seems to be more of a difference in compactness but not total yield. This is NOT from my experiment, but comes from researching and comparing Scrog yields between 250(cool tube & air cooled) watt hps and cfl setups with [6 - 8]42watt cfls and 2ft 8 bulb HO systems.

Keep in mind I have an HPS/T5/ and CFL and have no particular bias towards any.

From those aforementioned systems after normalizing, the average yield in scrog came to about 4.5-5 oz.

• Number of plants averaged 2. The addition of an extra plant had no significant effect on yield.
• Veg time was approx. 4 weeks
• Flower time approx 54 days give or take a few
• Screen Size 1ftX3ft and some were 2ftX2ft
• Lumen comparison 250 hps = approx 28,500; Lumen T5 8 bulb = approx 16,000;Lumen 6-8 42watt cfl = 16,200 - 21,600;

I was surprised because at this particular wattage, there was no clear winner. (The point of light was always above the canopy. No side lighting)

The total system wattage used was about even. With the 250hps system you need a bit more elegant venting with inline fans(cool tube). So extra fan watts go to that. However, this seems to even out in that you need more CFL's/T5 wattage to equal an HPS lumen output.

Growers reported no difference in bud potency. Perhaps compact buds look better...but appears to be no difference in the bowl. Most used hydro, typically DWC. A few soil grows were in there, and the yield was slightly less.


Other Observations:

Use of Approx. half of the wattage yielded roughly half of the results. One scrogger used a 2ft 4 bulb T5 and yielded approx 2.2 ounces. When increasing the wattage, the HPS scales far better.

Conclusion:

In a Scrog, the yields between those lighting systems were roughly the same.

Yields in a free grow (ie no training) the HPS performed significantly better.

Grows over 250watts the HPS performed significantly better Scrog or otherwise. A 600watt hps Scrog could yield close to a pound.


While I can provide links to all the grows there is no point. I will say that there is website with a forum dedicated specifically to 250watt hps grows. Take what you find is useful...or try it out for yourself

Mods feel free to move this post to whichever sub-forum you see fit.

I hope this info is useful to some out there.

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You already run 1000's of watts every day, everyone does. Everyone has a water heater and a stove and a furnace and your lights aren't shit, run them the way they're supposed to be run or just forget about it. Ask your wife if she's seen your balls anywhere, ever.

Seriously though if you can't grow up and stop sounding like a complete child thinking that helicopers are buzzing around looking for tiny toaster oven sized heat signatures then maybe you should just buy your weed and leave the manly act of growing to all the other little prepubescent girls on here.

OregonMeds said:

You already run 1000's of watts every day, everyone does.

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I do not care about watts. My entire house is energy star from the refrigerator to the clothes dryer, and all lights are fluorescent “energy saver” bulbs from wall-mart. I could probably run a 2000Watt grow and not use more than “average” electricity. Disregarding your rudeness you got my attention with you believe that a 500Watt HID system would not have a heat signature using FLIR. Could I get some other opinions on this please, is this true??? When I grew using the HID my closet was HOT, I barley could keep my temps below 95. My house is a constant 67 degrees so common sense told me there would be discrepancies between temperatures. And I understand that FLIR works best by picking up these temperature differences.

Sorry about the rudeness but your fear is just completely silly and the questions are like those of all the little kids on here, you really haven't done your homework like an adult or you wouldn't have asked some of the rather silly things you did.

Flir can't see inside anything at all it only knows the external temperature of things. Unless you vent your lights into your attic they won't show up at all.

Seriously if you are an adult please read some books or the faq etc so you don't pick up more sillyness second hand or come up with any more ideas as sweet as power cycling a hid lamp every 30 minutes. A lot of stuff you read in threads here is going to be completely wrong these days because there's a flood of newbies and it seems like you're learning half your knowledge wrong from the get go because of your sources.

If you don't like to read try youtube there's lots of video's that will clear this stuff up.

I understand your paranoia having a kid and all. The last thing you need is for the state to take your kid away because you smoke although you're probably a responsible parent.

As far as Flir, I've thought alot about it myself and have come to the conclusion that its too much hassle for the cops to fly over people's homes to look for hot spots that may or may not be someone growing weed. Even if they did fly over houses, there are people growing other stuff inside their homes like tomatoes and strawberries.

Also take into consideration that it takes ALOT of MONEY to conduct a bust on somebody's home. First comes the investigation which takes a long time since the cops want to know for sure that you're growing weed then the actual bust takes place where a swarm of high paid DEA agents raid your home. Then after the bust, there's all the written reports that have to be done which costs more money because you have to pay the agents to write these things.

What you might want to do is scour the internet for news around your area to see if people have actually been busted by the cops using FLIR. I'm willing to bet that you won't find much info since there aren't alot of busts because of the use of FLIR.

From investigating this subject, I've found the best ways to get busted is if someone rats you out like your neighbor because they smell it (which btw, I bet they already know you smoke weed) or your operation is so big that you get caught trafficking.

jh127876 said:

I have read a ton of information about growing, and even a little about FLIR. I know it could not see though walls. I was watching “Barry Coopers never get busted vol.2” where he gives the advice to only use Fluorescents because HID bulbs put off heat, and he said FLIR detected heat “differences” and I am aware that my 500 watt HID system is on the lower side of power… And I was venting into my attic, the only place in my house I could vent into. So you think that FLIR would pick that up in the attic? could I vent the closet heat threw a carbon filter into my bedroom, is that a better Idea?? In any case a believe my question at best represents ignorance, which I admit to having a good amount of in regards to growing, however I am in ample supply of maturity, which you seem to have some of yourself (for the apology.) Unlike Sarah Palin (for those in the know : )

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I do not think the neighbors know I smoke, they probably believe I am just another white color worker.
Why would you think that my neighbors know I smoke??? My wife does not even know

I hear neighbors a couple blocks away coughing their lungs out, and then another person coughing their lungs out etc. It's really obvious when that's going on.

My next door neighbor smokes and I found out when I heard them hitting a bong with the window open just from the bubbling sound.
And hard core pot smokers can spot another hard core pot smoker from a mile away.

If you don't want anyone to know be really discreet and quiet and don't look the part and don't cough or hit bongs where others can hear it.

On my block there is only one family that doesn't smoke, every other house has at least one pot smoker in it.

Lastly if you are in a medical state get the card and never worry again as long as you follow the rules. Anyone can qualify and more and more states are coming on line so even if you are in a state that doesn't have it, it may soon.

I'll be honest with you and I do not want you to take offense... Your fears of Cops hovering above your house and using infrared cameras to detect your grow op amounts to nothing more than paranoia. Although such a thing is possible (anything is possible), the probability of such an occurrence is probably the most remote probability since the dawn of probabilities. Knowing something about the law as I do, I know that the pigs have to have a solid reason to get a warrant to bust in your pad... its seems highly illogical to me that circumstantial evidence of a very controvertible nature such as heat sensing technology could be used to get a warrant. The reason being is that the Judge would need to see more... He would need to see that you had a criminal past, lots of traffic too and from your house in addition to heat signature evidence in order justify giving the police a warrant. A heat signature from your house alone, is not enough to bring the DEA crashing down on your party. Like someone mentioned previously, many homes could produce a suspicious heat signature if they were imaged from the air, because people do grow other things besides pot in their homes. Some people run clusters of servers in there homes, which generate a tremendous amount of heat, and need to be exhausted somewhere. Everyone gets paranoid their first time in, that's a given. After your first grow, you come to understand how difficult in actuality it is to be caught growing inside your home. You have to be very sloppy with your habits to give yourself away. I would relax, buy some White Widow and AK47 seeds and get your grow on.

Yup, got that.... Lets get back on topic... Read my first post... The questions at the end still need to be answered.

Use the T5 array for veg/clones and use the HPS for flowering. That's a pretty simple formula I think most people use also. You can use a T5 for veg and flower... I did with an 8 bulb array that consumed about 400 watts. I considered buying the flowering bulbs for it, but changed my mind and got a 400 watt HPS. The moment I started using the HPS I saw results immediately. The plants perked up like they were getting something they had never had before. An HPS of = wattage as your T5 array will produce more lumens and hence, be better for flowering than the array. With hydro you should get exceptional results with both, but I still think an HPS would be better choice for flower. In my grow box thats under construction I am using a 150 watt HPS for veg and flower. The HPS is really the best multipurpose bulb you can do both veg and flower with. The same cannot be said for fluoros or metal halide. Although some would say you can flower with a metal halide, I know the bud production will not be the same as with an HPS. Flowering is strictly about light spectrum and HPS produces the most desirable light spectrum for blooming plants. Anything else you wanna cover?

https://www.rollitup.org/indoor-growing/219696-grow-cabinet-build-log-pics.html

Your yield per plant is dependent on the size on your plants and the nutrients you use. Its a variable that only the most seasoned growers can predict, but you still have to know the size of the plant to predict something. Turning on and off the HID fixture with a timer is a bad idea. The plants will not benefit from something like that. Does the sun turn on and off during the day? hahah joke! I think you will get the best results from doing what I suggested in my previous response. The 500 watt HPS is a beast for flowering and you really should use it for that. Trying to flower with both just produces more heat and clutter in the grow room. If you really want to make this work you need to vent to the attic and get rid of the hot air. Ideally, since you have a T5 and HPS you should compartmentalize your grow areas. One area is 18 hours of light and the other is 12 hours of light. This is how most produce a "perpetual harvest." I hope this helps you out.

Okay I just bought these seeds from attitude. I heard really good things from them and got the shipping with the mug(guaranteed.) I need some help though, because I only have one seed to germinate I need to make sure and do it right, where is a great place to learn the perfect germination technique. I will keep you all posted, I will make mothers of them all and clone until I get sick of smoking. But with strains I doubt it will happen anytime soon
BTW… Any one with attitude exp wanna tell me if the free seeds are feminized?

Pick & Mix Seeds / G13 Labs White Widow Feminized
Pick & Mix Seeds per pack - 01 Seeds
Pick & Mix Seeds / G13 Labs Pure Power Feminized
Pick & Mix Seeds per pack - 01 Seeds
Pick & Mix Seeds / World of Seeds Afghan Kush Feminized
Pick & Mix Seeds per pack - 01 Seeds
Pick & Mix Seeds / Barney's Farm Red Dragon Feminized
Pick & Mix Seeds per pack - 01 Seeds
UFO 1 Dinafem Moby Dick -FREE
UFO 2 Dinafem Seeds Roadrunner Autoflowering-FREE

Yes they are Fems. I use the T5's from http://htgsupply.com/ for veg and bloom (I use twice the wattage on the bloom) and have always been satisfied with the result. In contrast I tried a large watt blooming CFL first grow and was less productive as 1/2 the watts of a T5. Hope this helps

jh127876 said:

Okay I just bought these seeds from attitude. I heard really good things from them and got the shipping with the mug(guaranteed.) I need some help though, because I only have one seed to germinate I need to make sure and do it right, where is a great place to learn the perfect germination technique. I will keep you all posted, I will make mothers of them all and clone until I get sick of smoking. But with strains I doubt it will happen anytime soon
BTW… Any one with attitude exp wanna tell me if the free seeds are feminized?

Pick & Mix Seeds / G13 Labs White Widow Feminized
Pick & Mix Seeds per pack - 01 Seeds
Pick & Mix Seeds / G13 Labs Pure Power Feminized
Pick & Mix Seeds per pack - 01 Seeds
Pick & Mix Seeds / World of Seeds Afghan Kush Feminized
Pick & Mix Seeds per pack - 01 Seeds
Pick & Mix Seeds / Barney's Farm Red Dragon Feminized
Pick & Mix Seeds per pack - 01 Seeds
UFO 1 Dinafem Moby Dick -FREE
UFO 2 Dinafem Seeds Roadrunner Autoflowering-FREE

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Whast T5 set up did you use?