10+ weeks into flowering, plants dying, Harvest?

desertrat said:

re-read the first post. he stopped nutes because he knew he was going to have to harvest by the 30th. he stopped nutes a couple of weeks early but other than that and temperature has no problems. the plants don't look heat-stressed so no issue there. it will definitely not kill the quality of the weed to keep going - the plant is taking nutrients from its leaves and sending them to the buds as the plant finishes. the buds will continue to fatten up until the plant eventually dies. you have to remember that pot is an annual plant and naturally dies at the end of its lifecycle while sending as much energy as it can to its next generation. as long as the trichomes haven't changed, and he says they haven't, then you will not hurt the yield or quality of bud by going as long as he can.

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OK man... i reread, and you're right... clearly an under nutrition problem. the rigid stems also confirms this. However, you're wrong on the bud not losing quality. He stopped too early and there aren't enough stores in the leaves and stems to support optimum growth. Potency and yield will be affected. Me i wouldn't toke on those buds... as has been stated by somebody else, the leaves are too far gone too early. there's hardly anything left. Plants will slow growth, even stop altogether in a type of stasis given the right conditions. ever flowered a plant in freezing conditions before? amazing to watch a plant just stop flowering for a month and then start again. If conditions are not right the plant will not grow right. Stopping nutes too early is stopping nutes too early, i fail to see how the quality will not be harmed. Potency and flavour will be affected. Plants can compensate.

If he still has 2 weeks left then he should feed them. if not chop them up and turn them into oil. Maybe i'm just a snob... but i see little point in growing your own if it isn't going to be at least as good as the shit you can buy on the street.

the plant does not naturally die at the end of the flowering cycle... it is either killed by the environment or man. Never re-vegetated a plant before? they don't look dead to me.

I still say chop em. You're TEN WEEKS into flowering already. How much longer do you give a plant with a finite 56-60 day lifespan when its already 70 days into it? The plant is dying, the smoke quality will be going down every day, as well as the potency of the plant going down as it continues to fully die. Chop it now, dry it, cure it, and just do better next time. Its all a learning curve for a while. But seriously, you're already 12-14 days overdue to chop em, chop em and plant more!

Most ruderalis hybrids that autoflower take 10-11 weeks to finish that i've seen grown.

Your plants are sick I would cut down

desertrat said:

your plants are fine, no reason to chop early. the fan leaves are dying from lack of nutes

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Possibly my OLD eyes are giving out on me but in which picture did you see fan leaves? It appeared to me that they had been removed. If my eyes did not deceive me and the fan leaves were removed .... it was an error to do so and likely compounded problems.

However, you're wrong on the bud not losing quality. He stopped too early and there aren't enough stores in the leaves and stems to support optimum growth. Potency and yield will be affected. Stopping nutes too early is stopping nutes too early, i fail to see how the quality will not be harmed. Potency and flavour will be affected.

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i think we're having a semantics problem. i am not suggesting Spetznaaz did the right thing - he must have stopped feeding sometime in the fifth or sixth week of flowering, and probably hasn't added much nitrogen in over two months - way too early even if you subscribe to the theory that it's better to let the plant exhaust it's internal food supplies before harvest. i agree that what he has done is reduced potency and yield compared to if he hadn't stopped feeding.

what i am trying to do is help him given where he's at right now. take a step back and look at his second picture. the plant is still predominantly green with plenty of chlorophyl to support the plant, even though almost all of that green is from sugar leaves. if he had two weeks left, i'd agree with you and feed again. but he has less than a week left before he moves, and i still say that plant will continue to produce thc for the next week and the existing thc is not degrading as evidenced by the trichomes.

the plant does not naturally die at the end of the flowering cycle.

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from wikipedia "Cannabis is an annual plant in the Cannabaceae family". an annual plant is one that in nature dies after a single season. you can keep any annual plant alive indefinitely with artificial conditions, which is what we growers do, but the plant in it's natural environment will die at the end of its flowering cycle.

and for people who've not looked at the whole thread, he's not in the tenth week of flowering, he's in the eighth week. i'd probably tell him to chop it too if it were in the tenth week.

Yes definitely a semantics problem... you see from the look of the pix those plants don't have a week left but at least two weeks. This goes back to my mentioning of stasis, plants will slow down growth if conditions are not perfect. even delay flowering. his plant has 2 weeks left to my eyes, easily. so needs another feed.

cannabis will not naturally die. There are many environments on this planet where cannabis could reproduce each year and grow into a tree. Indonesia is one place where cannabis grows for 2 seasons it actually only dies because of the dense canopies, and i once read of a guy with a canna tree in his garden in Hawaii that had kept the plant for 5 years. Despite what wiki says, i stand by my belief that cannabis is a tree with annual fruits, and not a plant with flowers. actually i'd like to change that to cannabis being both at once. Cannabis adapts and could be a tree or a plant depending on the environment presented to it.

what do your tric's look like? can't tell from the photos. maybe hit them with some molasses and light nutrients and see if that helps...then just water and molasses for the next 10 days or so. i think they could go 2 weeks yet. we're soil growers here so can't tell you anything more, other than she's close, but not done if treated right. shann

The reason there is no fan leaves is that they have all died, crisped up, and fallen off.

They were stopped being fed, if i remember correctly, on the begging of week 9, where they got their last feed, we only gave them 1ml/l of grow and 1ml/l of bloom though, thinking back i wish we had of given more.

They haven't looked healthy before they stopped getting fed though, there were a number of problems, with pH lockouts etc.

Unfortunately, giving them more nutes is not an option due to moving.

I'm going to go see them in a bit, and decide what to do.. may just cut my loses and harvest tonight. When i last checked the trich's were all clear or cloudy, and not many brown hairs, but according to my mate their are a lot more brown hairs now so we shall see i guess..

Edit - those pics are from Monday btw

Another edit - If anyone who happens to have the power to change thread titles could you change mine to 8+ instead of 10+, tis causing some confusion. They are 10 weeks old, 8 weeks flowering (that would of been from Monday mind)

There are many environments on this planet where cannabis could reproduce each year and grow into a tree.

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nothing like a good conversation. anyway, more semantic issues. a plant is defined as an annual or perennial based on its ability to live year round in a specific geography. a plant can be both perennial in some areas and an annual elsewhere. most plants in the world that are annuals will be perennials in tropical climates that don't experience much of a winter, cannabis is no different. for all of north america with the possible exception of southern mexico i believe you will find that cannabis is an annual plant. for most of the world cannabis is an annual. and most telling, the plant has developed a lifecycle that continues the species in a way that anticipates death in less than a year. contrast that to many perennial plants that don't become sexually mature until years into their growth.

desertrat said:

nothing like a good conversation. anyway, more semantic issues. a plant is defined as an annual or perennial based on its ability to live year round in a specific geography. a plant can be both perennial in some areas and an annual elsewhere. most plants in the world that are annuals will be perennials in tropical climates that don't experience much of a winter, cannabis is no different. for all of north america with the possible exception of southern mexico i believe you will find that cannabis is an annual plant. for most of the world cannabis is an annual. and most telling, the plant has developed a lifecycle that continues the species in a way that anticipates death in less than a year. contrast that to many perennial plants that don't become sexually mature until years into their growth.

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well then you've just admitted that cannabis is not naturally an annual plant. it just acts that way in certain environments which is exactly what i said.

all trees were once plants. they would have evolved to develop sexual expression later. the same would happen to cannabis if allowed to realise it's potential as a perennial tree. The buds would maybe even turn to real flesh, and the potency diminish as a result. I wonder how apple trees started out?

well then you've just admitted that cannabis is not naturally an annual plant. it just acts that way in certain environments which is exactly what i said.

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by your logic there would be no such thing as an annual plant, since almost all plants are perennials in the right environment. but if you use, as the experts do, how much of the globe a plant acts as an annual vs. a perennial, and label the plant based on that, then cannabis is an annual. which is how it's defined in the literature. in other words, annual and perennial are descriptions of how a given plant behaves in a given environment, not a descriptor of the plant universally. it's a shortcut to call a plant an annual if in most real world conditions it dies within a year. Q.E.D.

but, fuck, it's friday afternoon and only 18 minutes away from 4:20, which is close enough for me.

oh, and plus rep for good discussion.

desertrat said:

by your logic there would be no such thing as an annual plant, since almost all plants are perennials in the right environment. but if you use, as the experts do, how much of the globe a plant acts as an annual vs. a perennial, and label the plant based on that, then cannabis is an annual. which is how it's defined in the literature. in other words, annual and perennial are descriptions of how a given plant behaves in a given environment, not a descriptor of the plant universally. it's a shortcut to call a plant an annual if in most real world conditions it dies within a year. Q.E.D.

but, fuck, it's friday afternoon and only 18 minutes away from 4:20, which is close enough for me.

oh, and plus rep for good discussion.

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yes... i agree that by definition it is an annual.. but as an indoor grower and inside my environment cannabis is definitely not an annual.

i'll return the favour on the rep

freezing to death is not death by natural causes. if conditions are right, cannabis will continue to grow for many years. I don't think cannabis anticipates death at all, breeding is for better survival of the conditions nature presents to the plant. i suppose it depends on how you turn the logic.

skunkushybrid01 said:

freezing to death is not death by natural causes. if conditions are right, cannabis will continue to grow for many years. I don't think cannabis anticipates death at all, breeding is for better survival of the conditions nature presents to the plant. i suppose it depends on how you turn the logic.

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The only conditions that could allow cannabis to stay alive for that long is not letting it flower. Once it flowers, its on auto die mode and naturally wont be re-surviving in the wild.

researchkitty said:

The only conditions that could allow cannabis to stay alive for that long is not letting it flower. Once it flowers, its on auto die mode and naturally wont be re-surviving in the wild.

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indoors... also certain tropical climates.

auto-die mode... LOL

I've had plants where I cut all fan leaves off one, and left them on another plant same strain, same seeds...the bud count was pretty much the same at the end. Once in flower, the plant doesn't need the leaves anymore, the nutrients come directly from the root system during flower. But the strain here is obviously not the same as what I had, so you could be right...just sayin', not always the case.

Ten weeks into flower? That's a long time, even for pure sativa strains. Look at the trichomes, the stigma and pistils (hairs)...I go by that. They say once the round balls turn from clear to milky white or cloudy with no clear balls left, then the bud is at it's highest potential potency, after that, the balls turn amber or reddish-brown and the buzz changes to more of a couch lock buzz apparently...the THC degrades to CBDs and other compounds. That's the best way...get a USB digital microscope, hook up to your lap top or desk top or cell phone...you can zoom in on your buds close up, see the colour of the trichomes. I use Photo Booth on a MacBook Air, then either take a video of the buds close up one by one or take snaps...best way to tell, the 8 weeks or 10 weeks is close but not close enough, you cut her down too soon, say most of the trichomes are clear on the newer buds, then it'll be a waste...those digital USB microscopes are well worth the $30 $40...

guitarzan said:

Ten weeks into flower? That's a long time, even for pure sativa strains. Look at the trichomes, the stigma and pistils (hairs)...I go by that. They say once the round balls turn from clear to milky white or cloudy with no clear balls left, then the bud is at it's highest potential potency, after that, the balls turn amber or reddish-brown and the buzz changes to more of a couch lock buzz apparently...the THC degrades to CBDs and other compounds. That's the best way...get a USB digital microscope, hook up to your lap top or desk top or cell phone...you can zoom in on your buds close up, see the colour of the trichomes. I use Photo Booth on a MacBook Air, then either take a video of the buds close up one by one or take snaps...best way to tell, the 8 weeks or 10 weeks is close but not close enough, you cut her down too soon, say most of the trichomes are clear on the newer buds, then it'll be a waste...those digital USB microscopes are well worth the $30 $40...

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Dude. It’s a decade old. I’m pretty sure he harvested already

DrOgkush said:

Dude. It’s a decade old. I’m pretty sure he harvested already

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At least he didn't harvest too early...