I've been hearing extremely good things about 2 products from this company, Nourish-L and Photosynthsis plus. I recently went online to place an order for 2 small bottles of each to try out this grow when i noticed the dosage rate, it said for soil to "introduce 2-3 ounces per gallon of water to your regular watering cycle" even if I just watered with this like every third watering would still need over 32 ounces for a small 1000w test run. Has anyone else used these products? If so what rate do you apply them at?
Microbe life hydroponics
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Southerner
Well-Known Member
I got the free sample pack or whatever, opened one of the bottles that was suggsted as a foliar spray and it smelled like absolute dumpster. I'm sure whatever it was might be beneficial to the plants but I lost interest after that and just put the samples in a box with other such shit I don't ever use. You are correct in the application rates you read, thats why I didn't even bother to try any of the water-in products.
SpicySativa
Well-Known Member
Great White?!? Talk about an overpriced, hyped up product! If you want beneficial bacteria and fungus, brew a tea using homemade compost or worm castings and dirt cheap molasses.
If you must use Great White, at least don't try to brew it into a tea. Myccorhizal fungi won't grow in a tea, so your basically just wasting them. If you want to add mycorrhizal fungi, buy a mix that only contains Glomus Intraradices and Glomus Mossae (the only two types actually shown to form mycorrhiza with cannabis). All those other myco species listed on the Great White label (13 out of the fifteen or so species listed) won't do any good for cannabis (but they sure make the label look good).
SpicySativa
Well-Known Member
Glomus intraradices and Glomus mossae are both endmycorrhizal fungi. That just means that the fungi actually grow INTO the plants roots. Ectomycorrhizal fungi only grow outside the root, and serve no purpose in MJ cultivation (trees like them, though).
SpicySativa
Well-Known Member
What methods are they using other than the fancy microbes?
If their soil is lacking life before they add the schmancy microbes, then of course they will have a big affect. If they are already using sound organic practices and ensuring that their soil is alive and well, I doubt adding those fancy products would make much difference.
If their soil is lacking life before they add the schmancy microbes, then of course they will have a big affect. If they are already using sound organic practices and ensuring that their soil is alive and well, I doubt adding those fancy products would make much difference.
SpicySativa
Well-Known Member
Wow... I just browsed Microbe Life Hydroponic's website and read about their Photosynthesis Plus. These guys are some SERIOUS experts at buzzword advertising. They say A LOT without actually saying ANYTHING about what their product actually is or what it actually does. Just nonsensical blabbering sentence after sentence of buzzwords like "enhance", "improve", and "one-of-a-kind". Most of the benefits they list are provided by humic and fulvic acids. These will already be in healthy organic soil, or you can add them in the form of much less expensive products. Products that actually say what they are on the bottle. BioAg is a good source for humics and fulvics.
Hang on to your pennies before they get snatched up by these clever salesmen.
Or don't. Your call.
Hang on to your pennies before they get snatched up by these clever salesmen.
Or don't. Your call.
the one in particular grower I look up to for grow info more than anyone else is known as KomaGrows on YouTube and instagram. Last I heard he was running the roots organic line in happy frog soil with a few other additives such as the microbe life hydroponics and uses some mild teas. I've just never seen anybody else on forums in real life or on YouTube that has plants that look as healthy and frosty as his are.
SpicySativa
Well-Known Member
Well there ya have it. Bagged soil and bottled nutrients will definitely benefit from anything that enhances the soil biology.
I've been growing for over a decade and I've been using Photo plus and the root dip/foliar solutions since they came out ( got them in the stores in MI). They are both without a doubt game changers for me. I'm not gonna try and sell anyone. I could care less if any of you grow well. Listening to other people you probably won't. Educate yourself on endo myc. Fungi. And trichodermia and the identity they give your plant. Then you will understand just how many different types of variations there are. Why use just one?
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Well that cola has me pretty sold! What other nutrients are you using if you don't mind me asking?
NightOwlBono
Well-Known Member
I'd say at leas 50-60% of the people on RIU are knowledgable in endo myc,and trichodermia.
I agree don't use just one kind.but as spicysativa said.
i add every variety I can in my garden and flower beds.........but that's a different story,and not a waste of money
I agree don't use just one kind.but as spicysativa said.
Not much point in adding 40 kinds of fungi and bacteria that don't help with the one variety of plant we're growing.
i add every variety I can in my garden and flower beds.........but that's a different story,and not a waste of money
im definitely part of the group that isn't educated, so what your saying is endmycorrhizal fungi are the only beneficial ones?
NightOwlBono
Well-Known Member
From reading alot in the organic section,and reading quite a few books on the subject.
thats the basic breakdown,but if your guerrilla growing in a forest,or mixing MJ with other plants in a bed.then all of the other species would be benificial.
i really enjoyed reading teaming with microbes by Jeff lowenfels,Wayne Lewis.
its not a hard read and really sparked my interest in learning/practicing organic gardening.
thats the basic breakdown,but if your guerrilla growing in a forest,or mixing MJ with other plants in a bed.then all of the other species would be benificial.
i really enjoyed reading teaming with microbes by Jeff lowenfels,Wayne Lewis.
its not a hard read and really sparked my interest in learning/practicing organic gardening.
When I first started out I was strictly a vegan grower. That was until the heavy 16 line came out. Since Im not an outdoor grower I choose to use a my organic teachings with the new semi synthetic Heavy 16. I get weight plus the full genetics of the strains Im growing. On any given week I will feed heavy 16 followed by an organic fresh brewed compost (or vise versa depending on life stage). I brew the photo plus with other compost. I also dont bother with store bought air stones. Not enough air moving thru the water for me. I built my own tea brewer out of a Brute 30 gallon Trash can with PVC pipe.... Think of a circle of PVC at the bottom of a trash can with with tiny hole drilled thru. Connect that to longer pipes going toward the top to a air pump. Major bubble action. I bubble to a big froth everytime.
I also use Progressive earths Earth tonic to start my teas before I add humic. Only product of theres that I use other stuff is too expensive.
NightOwlBono
Well-Known Member
Nice 16 macro nutrients and elements in only 9 packages!! How much that cost per run?
google three products for me please
1. Azomite(from Utah)
2. Gia green glacial rock dust(BC,Canada)
3. Any kelp meal on the market (the ocean)
im not saying anything negative,your bud profile pic is nice man,obviously I'm jealous
google three products for me please
1. Azomite(from Utah)
2. Gia green glacial rock dust(BC,Canada)
3. Any kelp meal on the market (the ocean)
im not saying anything negative,your bud profile pic is nice man,obviously I'm jealous
SpicySativa
Well-Known Member
There's another BIG reason to avoid the "all in one" microbial products like Great White, etc...
I'll explain it using a little analogy:
Mycorrhizal fungi are slow to infect roots, and relatively slow growing. The fastest I've heard of mycorrhiza becoming established In the rhizosphere after innoculation is about a week. That's why it's always recommended that your inoculate plants when they are very small in order to reap the benefits of mycorrhiza later in bloom (i.e. increased phosphorus availability and uptake). They are slow growing, slow establishing, friendly (plant-helping), organic matter-(and mineral)-munching creatures. For the sake of my analogy, let's call them buffalo (also which also happen to be organic matter-munchers that help plants by cycling nutrients).
On the other side, we have trichoderma. Trichoderma are a fast-growing, fast-colonizing fungi that FEED ON OTHER FUNGI (including mycorrhizal fungi). For the sake of my analogy, lets call them lions. Fast, strong, hungry, and opportunistic (this is why trichoderma are used for control of fungal diseases).
Now, let's say you have a blank slate; your pot of soil lacking microbiology, or a 100 square mile piece of African safari (depending on which side of the analogy you choose to sit on). If you wanted to restore these blank slates to diverse, complete, thriving ecosystems, would you start by releasing 166 buffalo (Great White has 166 propagules/gram of mycorrhizal fungi that associate with cannabis) and 313,124 lions (Great White has 313,124 propagules/gram trichoderma)? Probably not...
Here's a link to the abstract of a journal article that touches on what I'm saying above:
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0038071794902194
I'll explain it using a little analogy:
Mycorrhizal fungi are slow to infect roots, and relatively slow growing. The fastest I've heard of mycorrhiza becoming established In the rhizosphere after innoculation is about a week. That's why it's always recommended that your inoculate plants when they are very small in order to reap the benefits of mycorrhiza later in bloom (i.e. increased phosphorus availability and uptake). They are slow growing, slow establishing, friendly (plant-helping), organic matter-(and mineral)-munching creatures. For the sake of my analogy, let's call them buffalo (also which also happen to be organic matter-munchers that help plants by cycling nutrients).
On the other side, we have trichoderma. Trichoderma are a fast-growing, fast-colonizing fungi that FEED ON OTHER FUNGI (including mycorrhizal fungi). For the sake of my analogy, lets call them lions. Fast, strong, hungry, and opportunistic (this is why trichoderma are used for control of fungal diseases).
Now, let's say you have a blank slate; your pot of soil lacking microbiology, or a 100 square mile piece of African safari (depending on which side of the analogy you choose to sit on). If you wanted to restore these blank slates to diverse, complete, thriving ecosystems, would you start by releasing 166 buffalo (Great White has 166 propagules/gram of mycorrhizal fungi that associate with cannabis) and 313,124 lions (Great White has 313,124 propagules/gram trichoderma)? Probably not...
Here's a link to the abstract of a journal article that touches on what I'm saying above:
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0038071794902194