Don't follow this advice for plants your size - no no no - that's the kind of shit that got you here in the first place. wet/dry wet/dry wet/dry - little and often - that's what's needed at this stage
Severe drooping, curling, and browning of leaves. Underwatered? Please help
- Thread starter collision666
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TheFuture
Well-Known Member
When your plants are in red cups, take another red cup, fill it half full. Feel the weight in your hand. THAT is the weight of a fully watered Red Solo Cup planted seedling/Clone. Make sure your Red Solo Cups have FIVE, pencil-sized (3/8") drainage holes.
Water, and allow the soil to dry to the point when you stick your finger in the dirt and it is dry at 1" depth, then water again. For red solo cups this is typically every day or every other day. 4-6oz water. The goal is to water enough to give the plant what it needs, while only giving enough that the roots have to "search out" more water, growing to fill the medium in the Solo Cup.
When the roots "strike," or start coming out of the bottom of the cups, it is time to transplant to the next appropriate size container, which in my opinion should be no more than a two gallon container. This keeps roots constrained to filling out the next largest size container so you can produce the most roots.
Overwatering is the #1 killer of marijuana. Overattention is a close #2. You were overwatering, friend.
TheFuture
Water, and allow the soil to dry to the point when you stick your finger in the dirt and it is dry at 1" depth, then water again. For red solo cups this is typically every day or every other day. 4-6oz water. The goal is to water enough to give the plant what it needs, while only giving enough that the roots have to "search out" more water, growing to fill the medium in the Solo Cup.
When the roots "strike," or start coming out of the bottom of the cups, it is time to transplant to the next appropriate size container, which in my opinion should be no more than a two gallon container. This keeps roots constrained to filling out the next largest size container so you can produce the most roots.
Overwatering is the #1 killer of marijuana. Overattention is a close #2. You were overwatering, friend.
TheFuture
Exactamundo
collision666
Member
Yeah when I felt that there was still water at the bottom of the cup I should have waited to water, even though the leaves were starting to severly droop. I was watering on day 2/3, I def should have waited until 4/5 when the pot would have been drier. When they dry out I'm probably going to re-pot into 1 gals. So far this grow has very much been a learning experience.
I am using 24hrs of light because the grow is in an unheated part of the house and the temps would drop pretty low without the light on.
collision666
Member
Currently I have been watering when the top inch or so is dry every 2 to 3 days with about 4oz of water. When I went from watering every other 2 days to watering every three days is when the plants drooped like this. The soil at the bottom of the cup has never fully dried between waterings. Maybe the roots are sitting in stagnant, oxygenless water. I do have 5 drainage holes in the bottom of the cup and a few more on the sides.
His environment might be warmer than yours so more evaporation, quicker drying; or higher rh; his soil might be different to yours, so different absorption rates....blah blah - your problem is diagnosed - doesn't matter in comparison - environments differ - I bet yours is damp and cool, yes?
collision666
Member
Gotcha. It's pretty cool in my room, like in the very low 70s, but it's pretty dry too, like 25% humidity.
I had the solo cups in little bowls to help catch any drainage when watering. The sides on the bowls went up about 1/3 of the way up the cup and totally blocked the drainage holes I had in the sides. Could that have been messing with the drainage and the oxygen in the soil?
I am confident that the diagnosis of overwatering is correct. Typically how long until the leavs will start to spring back?
Good. You're right to be confident. How long? Not long, matey, not long. If there's anything you can do to warm the place up a little (up to 80f?) around and about the pots that'll increase the evaporation (therefore drying time shortens) and the rh in turn - even if it's just for a day or two to sort out current over juiciness? That would be good. Careful with blow heaters - they'll crisp leaves if positioned wrong. Otherwise it's just a wait - as it seems your environment keeps the soil moist for a good while, then you might wait a little longer to see
improvement
and defo keep us in the loop - let us know how wrong/right we might be - spread the word and everyone gets better
Peace
ps forgot yr question...doh! I had the solo cups in little bowls to help catch any drainage when watering. The sides on the bowls went up about 1/3 of the way up the cup and totally blocked the drainage holes I had in the sides. Could that have been messing with the drainage and the oxygen in the soil?
Yeah, get them off - interfering with evaporation rates for sure - plants love air circulation - things happen
collision666
Member
I took the bowls away when I drilled the extra holes. It's for sure getting better airflow through the soil than before. I'll def keep this thread updated. I've searched enough threads where people are in a discussion and say they'll update and they don't. I will. Thanks again for everyone's help!
collision666
Member
I check them this morning and the soil is drying out nicely with the extra holes in the cup. I was able to get the temp up to about 76. The plants are just barley starting to recover but are still very droopy. The skunk leaves never really discolored but the widow leaves that were starting to discolor yesterday are yellowing today. Both plants have a little new growth too.
Should I expect the widow leaves to continue yellowing and die off or will they attemp to make a revovery?
I haven't fed them any nutes yet. Should I start feeding them a 1/3 dose of FF Grow Big when I start watering again or wait for the plants to recover more before feeding?
Pic 1 is the skunk, pics 2,3 are the widow.
Should I expect the widow leaves to continue yellowing and die off or will they attemp to make a revovery?
I haven't fed them any nutes yet. Should I start feeding them a 1/3 dose of FF Grow Big when I start watering again or wait for the plants to recover more before feeding?
Pic 1 is the skunk, pics 2,3 are the widow.
Hi. Both plants have a little new growth too. That's good news....means you're doing the right thing. Makes me happy! Looks like you'll lose a leaf or two off the widow, but don't worry if you do, if new growth is coming you'll soon forget about a leaf or two. BTW, always leave them on the plant - if they're green at all then they're still doing a job....it's great to hear they're picking up new growth and drying off a bit - that's all good. When it comes to next watering - whenever that may be, your call obviously - maybe give them just a 1/8 strength high nitrogen feed in the dose, that'll help green off and get that veg going again, but gently does it, yeah?
collision666
Member
The new groth is very minimal, but does appear to be there (I don't think my eyes are playing tricks on me). I'm not going to mess with the widow leaves but they are def getting worse. The plants have a little more pep in them today as the soil is drying out. I'll prob add just a little fert to the water to give them a little boost when they get watered again. When should I start a regular feeding schedule (obviously a little at first)?
Get them back to vigorous growth first - it takes a shitload longer to recover from a near drowning than it does a bit of dehydration. You'll know when it's time to start feeding. Think like a plant - that's the best advice I can give...
Cheers!
collision666
Member
Makes sense to me. I'll let them recover fully before I start feeding them. Thanks for all your help jackmac, you've helped put my mind at ease as my plants appear to be slowly dying...,
What about the new growth? Positive vibration!
TheFuture
Well-Known Member
Hehe, I like to see people this excited when the plants are so small. Makes me remember those days. Yeah, there were lots of posts since my last one, but when your cups didnt have holes to allow excess water to drain adequately, the air content of the lower portion of the cup was completely used up by the roots. The droop, again, is caused by excess moisture in the leaf itself, but the root tips may have died sitting in anoxic water, causing browning of root tips and yellowing of leaves. Allow the cups to dry to the point they feel like a Red Solo Cup with 2oz of water (physically do this so you have the exact weight) before watering another time.
Do not be afraid to UNDERwater; if you allow your plants to droop limply from lack of water for a few hours before you water them, they will be stressed from this action and the result will be a plant that is stronger in the long run. Allow your pots to get drier rather than stay wetter, and your plants will create vigorous root mass to search out "new" water. Each time you allow your root mass to dry sufficiently, it causes a hormone shock that creates more roots and stronger stalks.
This process during flowering stages creates branches that can hold more weight and the stress makes the plant produce more resin, and stickier resin.
And another thing, dont worry! Theres always time for another seed to pop.
Do not be afraid to UNDERwater; if you allow your plants to droop limply from lack of water for a few hours before you water them, they will be stressed from this action and the result will be a plant that is stronger in the long run. Allow your pots to get drier rather than stay wetter, and your plants will create vigorous root mass to search out "new" water. Each time you allow your root mass to dry sufficiently, it causes a hormone shock that creates more roots and stronger stalks.
This process during flowering stages creates branches that can hold more weight and the stress makes the plant produce more resin, and stickier resin.
And another thing, dont worry! Theres always time for another seed to pop.
^^^
Aye to that. Funny, because there's another overwatering thread (it's still on the board and has 9 bloody pages) where I tried to encourage the op to do just that - so he could learn the difference between a pot without any water and a pot with a drowning plant in it. I told him it would do no harm, but I got someone jumping down my throat (because he thought it was ph issue or lockout), wailing about not stressing plants at all etc etc and this guy claims he's forgotten more than I'll ever know! blah di blah - when you and I both know that your description above is absolutely right.
That's the trouble with a site like this in a way. Who can you trust to give you the right info? That guy on the other thread was telling the op to water his plant till run-off and measure the ph (water a drowning plant?!), go spend 100 bucks on a ph/ec meter he didn't need, and he told the op that any leaf that had a bit of damage might as well be taken off because once it was damaged 'it doesn't recover so it doesn't matter'. So the op gets two totally opposing pieces of advice and gets confused. There seems to be a fair number of people here who always want to make the problem a little bit more 'exotic' than what it is. More often than not it's somethign basic and mundane, watering or the wrong growing media to begin with - couple that with someone who never grew any plant in their life and that's what happens, basic stuff....These plants are tough, virulent, fecund and fast. Get the basics right and you'll be fine; these plants are not orchids. A good growing medium, lighting, ventilation and temp, watering and that's it; get these in the right range and you succeed. Some posters giving advice shouldn't be jumping into threads shouting 'looks like a ph lock-out issue to me', and shit like that, because you need to look at the basics first -
Anyway, that's my rant for the day! lol! Thanks for posting the above TF - nice to know there are others who know
Cheers!
Ref post 13 in this thread
collision666
Member
Update:
When I checked the plants this morning I noticed there is positivley new growth on both plants! Also, the growth that is about a week old is starting perk right back up. There seems to have been a growth spurt in the secondary growth at the base of the the dying leaf stems on the widow. However, the older growth is pretty much the same as it was two days ago, except much more brown on the widow before.
I know that the browned widow leaves are not going to come back but are the green leaves, like mostly on the skunk, going to recover in time or has the damage already been done and they are just dying slower than the widow? The skunk was a slightly larger plant than the widow so it probably had a bigger root system than the widow and didn't quite get overwatered as much. The solo cups are definitley lighter than the last two times I watered and still feel like they have a little ways to go. I am planning on waiting for slight droop in the perky new growth to let me know when to water again.
Pic 1 is skunk, pic 2 is widow
When I checked the plants this morning I noticed there is positivley new growth on both plants! Also, the growth that is about a week old is starting perk right back up. There seems to have been a growth spurt in the secondary growth at the base of the the dying leaf stems on the widow. However, the older growth is pretty much the same as it was two days ago, except much more brown on the widow before.
I know that the browned widow leaves are not going to come back but are the green leaves, like mostly on the skunk, going to recover in time or has the damage already been done and they are just dying slower than the widow? The skunk was a slightly larger plant than the widow so it probably had a bigger root system than the widow and didn't quite get overwatered as much. The solo cups are definitley lighter than the last two times I watered and still feel like they have a little ways to go. I am planning on waiting for slight droop in the perky new growth to let me know when to water again.
Pic 1 is skunk, pic 2 is widow
collision666
Member
I have been reading that thread and felt the same way, in my beginners opinion. People love to over complicate things and end up only making the problem worse. Start, patiently, with the simple variables. Once all that is under control start examining other options if the problem aren't solved. It probably will take more than a day for plant issues to be resolved so time has to be given before another variable is changed. It sure seems like my plants are back on the right track with less water and more air getting into the soil. Common problem, simple fix. You just have to do some research and actually understand what, and why, people are saying and see if it actually related to your problem.