Name that logical fallacy

Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Well-Known Member
1) Evolution has many faults, such as the incomplete fossil record, therefore creationism is true.

2) Any voter who values guns in our country must vote republican.

3) Aliens must be responsible for crop circles because they are too complicated to be made by humans.


Easy one
 
guy incognito

guy incognito

Well-Known Member
overgrowem said:
Why shouldn't Creationism be taught in science class. After all evolution is just a theory.
Click to expand...
Because one is backed by science and evidence and one is 100% pure unadulterated grade A prime bullshit. You don't understand the meaning of the word theory.


http://www.notjustatheory.com/references.html

the·o·ry n. pl. the·o·ries

  1. A set of statements or principles devised to explain a group of facts or phenomena, especially one that has been repeatedly tested or is widely accepted and can be used to make predictions about natural phenomena.
  2. The branch of a science or art consisting of its explanatory statements, accepted principles, and methods of analysis, as opposed to practice: a fine musician who had never studied theory.
  3. A set of theorems that constitute a systematic view of a branch of mathematics.
  4. Abstract reasoning; speculation: a decision based on experience rather than theory.
  5. A belief or principle that guides action or assists comprehension or judgment: staked out the house on the theory that criminals usually return to the scene of the crime.
  6. An assumption based on limited information or knowledge; a conjecture.
From the National Academy Press:
Is evolution a fact or a theory?
The theory of evolution explains how life on earth has changed. In scientific terms, "theory" does not mean "guess" or "hunch" as it does in everyday usage. Scientific theories are explanations of natural phenomena built up logically from testable observations and hypotheses. Biological evolution is the best scientific explanation we have for the enormous range of observations about the living world.
Scientists most often use the word "fact" to describe an observation. But scientists can also use fact to mean something that has been tested or observed so many times that there is no longer a compelling reason to keep testing or looking for examples. The occurrence of evolution in this sense is a fact. Scientists no longer question whether descent with modification occurred because the evidence supporting the idea is so strong.
Why isn't evolution called a law?
Laws are generalizations that describe phenomena, whereas theories explain phenomena. For example, the laws of thermodynamics describe what will happen under certain circumstances; thermodynamics theories explain why these events occur.
Laws, like facts and theories, can change with better data. But theories do not develop into laws with the accumulation of evidence. Rather, theories are the goal of science.

From the Talk Origins site:
"Evolution is a Fact and a Theory"
Well evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts.

Answers in Genesis, a web site which promotes Creationism, has a section on arguments that creationists shouldn't use. Whilst they correctly direct people not to use the "just a theory" argument, their alternative is no better:
"Evolution is just a theory."
What people usually mean when they say this is "Evolution is not proven fact, so it should not be promoted dogmatically." Therefore people should say that! The problem with using the word "theory" in this case is that scientists use it to mean a well-substantiated explanation of data. This includes well-known theories such as Einstein's Theory of Relativity and Newton's Theory of Gravity, as well as lesser-known ones such as the Debye-Hückel Theory of electrolyte solutions. It would be better to say that particles-to-people evolution is an unsubstantiated hypothesis or conjecture.

From the PBS series on evolution:
When we use the word "theory" in everyday life, we usually mean an idea or a guess, but the word has a much different meaning in science. This video examines the vocabulary essential for understanding the nature of science and evolution and illustrates how evolution is a powerful, well-supported scientific explanation for the relatedness of all life.

The book The Top 10 Myths About Evolution, by Cameron M. Smith and Charles Sullivan, has a chapter entitled "Myth Two: It's Just a Theory":
...calling evolution "just a theory" involves a misunderstanding of what a scientific theory is. Evolution is a fact, and the three main processes that make up evolution - replication, variation, and selection - are observable and undeniable.
 
tyler.durden

tyler.durden

Well-Known Member
Heisenberg said:
1) Evolution has many faults, such as the incomplete fossil record, therefore creationism is true.
Click to expand...
This example qualifies as a false dilemma by trying to weaken Evolutionary Theory pointing to an incomplete fossil record. It is not taking into account that we're lucky to have as many fossils as we do, but even if we had no fossils at all the evidence for Evolution is still vast. Even if Evolutionary Theory was much weaker than it is, it wouldn't automatically mean creationism is true as there would be other possibilities.

2) Any voter who values guns in our country must vote republican.
Click to expand...
This is a classic False Choice. It gives us two choices as the only possibilities, dismissing other valid possibilities. For example, I value guns but I'm not voting Republican ;)

3) Aliens must be responsible for crop circles because they are too complicated to be made by humans.
Click to expand...
Argument from Ignorance - It has not been shown that crop circles are too complicated to have been made by humans.
 
overgrowem

overgrowem

Well-Known Member
guy incognito said:
Because one is backed by science and evidence and one is 100% pure unadulterated grade A prime bullshit. You don't understand the meaning of the word theory.


http://www.notjustatheory.com/references.html

the·o·ry n. pl. the·o·ries

  1. A set of statements or principles devised to explain a group of facts or phenomena, especially one that has been repeatedly tested or is widely accepted and can be used to make predictions about natural phenomena.
  2. The branch of a science or art consisting of its explanatory statements, accepted principles, and methods of analysis, as opposed to practice: a fine musician who had never studied theory.
  3. A set of theorems that constitute a systematic view of a branch of mathematics.
  4. Abstract reasoning; speculation: a decision based on experience rather than theory.
  5. A belief or principle that guides action or assists comprehension or judgment: staked out the house on the theory that criminals usually return to the scene of the crime.
  6. An assumption based on limited information or knowledge; a conjecture.
From the National Academy Press:
Is evolution a fact or a theory?
The theory of evolution explains how life on earth has changed. In scientific terms, "theory" does not mean "guess" or "hunch" as it does in everyday usage. Scientific theories are explanations of natural phenomena built up logically from testable observations and hypotheses. Biological evolution is the best scientific explanation we have for the enormous range of observations about the living world.
Scientists most often use the word "fact" to describe an observation. But scientists can also use fact to mean something that has been tested or observed so many times that there is no longer a compelling reason to keep testing or looking for examples. The occurrence of evolution in this sense is a fact. Scientists no longer question whether descent with modification occurred because the evidence supporting the idea is so strong.
Why isn't evolution called a law?
Laws are generalizations that describe phenomena, whereas theories explain phenomena. For example, the laws of thermodynamics describe what will happen under certain circumstances; thermodynamics theories explain why these events occur.
Laws, like facts and theories, can change with better data. But theories do not develop into laws with the accumulation of evidence. Rather, theories are the goal of science.

From the Talk Origins site:
"Evolution is a Fact and a Theory"
Well evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts.

Answers in Genesis, a web site which promotes Creationism, has a section on arguments that creationists shouldn't use. Whilst they correctly direct people not to use the "just a theory" argument, their alternative is no better:
"Evolution is just a theory."
What people usually mean when they say this is "Evolution is not proven fact, so it should not be promoted dogmatically." Therefore people should say that! The problem with using the word "theory" in this case is that scientists use it to mean a well-substantiated explanation of data. This includes well-known theories such as Einstein's Theory of Relativity and Newton's Theory of Gravity, as well as lesser-known ones such as the Debye-Hückel Theory of electrolyte solutions. It would be better to say that particles-to-people evolution is an unsubstantiated hypothesis or conjecture.

From the PBS series on evolution:
When we use the word "theory" in everyday life, we usually mean an idea or a guess, but the word has a much different meaning in science. This video examines the vocabulary essential for understanding the nature of science and evolution and illustrates how evolution is a powerful, well-supported scientific explanation for the relatedness of all life.

The book The Top 10 Myths About Evolution, by Cameron M. Smith and Charles Sullivan, has a chapter entitled "Myth Two: It's Just a Theory":
...calling evolution "just a theory" involves a misunderstanding of what a scientific theory is. Evolution is a fact, and the three main processes that make up evolution - replication, variation, and selection - are observable and undeniable.
Click to expand...
Good you got it.People who say this are using the wrong def. of theory.Many are ignorant,a fault that can be overcome if that person is willing,others are intellectually dishonest a shortcoming that is much harder to remedy.
 
tyler.durden

tyler.durden

Well-Known Member
overgrowem said:
Good you got it.People who say this are using the wrong def. of theory.Many are ignorant,a fault that can be overcome if that person is willing,others are intellectually dishonest a shortcoming that is much harder to remedy.
Click to expand...
I had a feeling you were simply playing devil's advocate on your first post ;) You got guy all riled up...
 
Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Well-Known Member
tyler.durden said:
This example qualifies as a false dilemma by trying to weaken Evolutionary Theory pointing to an incomplete fossil record. It is not taking into account that we're lucky to have as many fossils as we do, but even if we had no fossils at all the evidence for Evolution is still vast. Even if Evolutionary Theory was much weaker than it is, it wouldn't automatically mean creationism is true as there would be other possibilities.



This is a classic False Choice. It gives us two choices as the only possibilities, dismissing other valid possibilities. For example, I value guns but I'm not voting Republican ;)



Argument from Ignorance - It has not been shown that crop circles are too complicated to have been made by humans.
Click to expand...
Very good. A false dilemma is easy to spot if you think of it as a false dichotomy, an "either/or" fallacy. It happens when we arbitrarily reduce the possible results to two choices. Even if evolution was proven wrong tomorrow, it would have no bearing on the truth value of creationism. Even if we did find that crop circles were too complicated to be made by humans, it would not automatically follow that they were made by aliens. You get a B+ because the last one is not technically an argument from ignorance, although it does stem from a sibling fallacy, argument from incredulity. Argument from ignorance points to ignorance as it's reasoning; we don't know aliens aren't involved so they probably are. Argument from incredulity simply relies on lack of imagination; I can't imagine humans making something so complicated therefore they aren't. What makes the statement a false dichotomy is not it's assumption that humans are incapable, but it's assumption that there is nothing more to learn beyond that, therefore aliens.
 
tyler.durden

tyler.durden

Well-Known Member
Ah, I get it. Thanks for explaining, Heis. I'll take the B+, it's a much better grade than I used to get in HS...
 
Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Well-Known Member
1) Gay marriage is wrong because it goes against the custom of marriage in this country

2) Homeopathy should be given equal consideration as mainstream medicine because it has been practiced for generations

3) Women may be equal to men, but a woman's place is in the home


Remember, the key is the fallacy they all have in common.
 
mindphuk

mindphuk

Well-Known Member
Heisenberg said:
1) Gay marriage is wrong because it goes against the custom of marriage in this country

2) Homeopathy should be given equal consideration as mainstream medicine because it has been practiced for generations

3) Women may be equal to men, but a woman's place is in the home


Remember, the key is the fallacy they all have in common.
Click to expand...
Appeal to tradition
 
overgrowem

overgrowem

Well-Known Member
Next time someone uses the excuse that the fossile record is incomplete to knock evolution concede the total record IS sketchy,then ask them what they know about the pig,they won't know much if anything,invite them to study the pig and come back later.The record of the pig is very complete from its begining; they will have to decide whether to believe what they hear from the pulpit or their lying eyes,and will know they have a tough case to make.
 
tyler.durden

tyler.durden

Well-Known Member
Heisenberg said:
1) Gay marriage is wrong because it goes against the custom of marriage in this country

2) Homeopathy should be given equal consideration as mainstream medicine because it has been practiced for generations

3) Women may be equal to men, but a woman's place is in the home


Remember, the key is the fallacy they all have in common.
Click to expand...
I'm going with argumentum ad antiquitatem for $500...
 
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