Wait? ~ 50% of people don't pay taxes?!

[beenthere]

all the marketing in the world wont make americans eat more turnips, nor parsnips, nor collards, nor chitterlings, nor piggie feet, nor sheep marrow, nor calves brains, nor suet.

only a famine can do that, and thats demand exceeding supply, forcing demand to go deeper into the shit pile for a few ragged morsels.

marketing primarily serves to convince the thick witted and thin skulled that Pilsbury Brand flour is superior to King Biscuit. even though the guy with a brain knows perfectly well that flour is flour, as long as the grain is right for the milling, and the milling is done well.

barring serious differences in quality or price, advertising makes the buyer choose on feelings rather than logic, or in the case of morons, habit rather than thought.

advertising poopdicks would love to convince everybody that they are essential, that nothing happens until somebody sells something, but you cant sell from an empty cart, and a peach is only as good as the peach itself, not the salesmanship of the fruit merchant.

the simple existence of advertising does not somehow validate the existence of advertising, any more than the existence of religions makes religions good and useful. religions are only as good as the product they sell, the preacher's charisma only goes so far with most people, if the religion's "product" is shit most people walk away. after that, only the truely lame brained or foolish continue to follow into the cult and buy more auditing, or join the sea org.

When it comes to necessities I will agree with you, what about iphones, ipads, computers, new cars, etc!

 

[medicineman]

No I don't believe the republican party panders to the wealthy for tax cuts.

Anyone who believes this is foolish. The wealthy you are speaking of make up probably 2% of the electorate, how naive to think the right panders to the rich for this reason when the rich are so few.

I believe the right understands that the wealthy are the job creators and the only hope for a prosperous economy.

You must be fucking insane!.

 

[beenthere]

You must be fucking insane!.

You must be unable to articulate!

 

[Winter Woman]

NO VAT TAXES EVER!!!!!!!!

vat taxes are a full employment program for accountants and tax lawyers.

I know, I know just look at Europe. I just hate filing every freakin' year. When you stack my income tax returns for just one year on top of each other it has to be about an inch thick. The incredibly inane things they require is re-dick-less.

But I do agree a vat tax is a great way to stick it to us again.

 

[Dr Kynes]

When it comes to necessities I will agree with you, what about iphones, ipads, computers, new cars, etc!

if the ipod were as shitty as the zune then yes, advertising makes the difference on the margins. ipods iphones and whatnot are selling not because of advertising but because they are superior to the competiton.

if you mean new products for which there is not demonstrated demand, such as ipods when the idea of a pesonal mp3 player was new and sexy, yes. advertising makes the public aware of the product and attempts to create desire for the item. it does not always work, and in some cases ads ruin the product's appeal.

you cant sell from an empty cart, and a full cart tucked in the back of your barn is equally useless. advertising has it's place, but it is not nearly as important as a quality product. ad men and salesmen disagree. they believe that THEIR skill at selling is what makes products succeed or fail, when in fact if that were true we would all have george foreman grills and slap chops in our kitchens today.

some products have become ubiquitous due to their utility and value, not the nebulous promises of ad men and salesmen. when i saw my first cellular phone i was dumbfounded that anyone would want to have a phone with them at all times, it seems outlandish. but now even little kids have cell phones, and half the people you see on the street or in stores are yapping on one. i still cant imagine any reason i might chatter on a phone at all hours, but some people love that shit. salesmen were not key to the cell phone's popularity, and advertising only promised better results with phone and plan A over phone and plan B. in the end though, there is not much difference from one phone to the next.

when there is an obvious difference, advertising can serve to make clear the advantages of a product over other similar devices, but in the end, if advertising sways you then you would have fallen for the first slick sales pitch that came along. it doesnt matter if it is necessities or gadgets, a sales pitch can only sell something that the buyer wants, it cannot induce him to buy things he does not want at all. thats government's job.

 

[ChesusRice]

I know, I know just look at Europe. I just hate filing every freakin' year. When you stack my income tax returns for just one year on top of each other it has to be about an inch thick. The incredibly inane things they require is re-dick-less.

But I do agree a vat tax is a great way to stick it to us again.

VAT comes right after
Flat tax

 

[Dr Kynes]

I know, I know just look at Europe. I just hate filing every freakin' year. When you stack my income tax returns for just one year on top of each other it has to be about an inch thick. The incredibly inane things they require is re-dick-less.

But I do agree a vat tax is a great way to stick it to us again.

VAT taxes stick it to us over and over and over again, till we are bleeding and scarred, hugging our knees in the shower. with a national sales tax we would get fucked regularly, deeply and gently, while currently we just get one really rough hard shag every spring, and then they forget all about us till they start rutting again next year.

i would rather get it regular, with maybe some tender kissing in the moonlight, with a bottle of wine instead of the occasional brutal rape we get now, or in the case of the VAT tax, humiliating violation every day, over and over again, till we finally just give up and become helpless gimps kept in the trunk when we arent being abused.

 

[Dr Kynes]

VAT comes right after
Flat tax

flat taxes would be infinitely preferable to the labyrinthine tax code that allows so many deductions and deferments that those with enough accountants can get a free ride, legally.

but then you wouldnt be able to stick it to the man, so i see why flat taxes would terrify you.

 

[ChesusRice]

flat taxes would be infinitely preferable to the labyrinthine tax code that allows so many deductions and deferments that those with enough accountants can get a free ride, legally.

but then you wouldnt be able to stick it to the man, so i see why flat taxes would terrify you.

Name one Flat Tax scamnario that taxes capital gains as income
Here I will give you a list of proponents that have proposed it
-Malcom Forbes
-Newt Gingrich
-Herman Cain
-Dick Armey

 

[Harrekin]

Dead easy actually ... just deploy the pool cover. (Might have to give Dumbo a Mickey.) cn

"Mickey" means something completely different on this part of the world bro

 

[Harrekin]

VAT taxes stick it to us over and over and over again, till we are bleeding and scarred, hugging our knees in the shower. with a national sales tax we would get fucked regularly, deeply and gently, while currently we just get one really rough hard shag every spring, and then they forget all about us till they start rutting again next year.

i would rather get it regular, with maybe some tender kissing in the moonlight, with a bottle of wine instead of the occasional brutal rape we get now, or in the case of the VAT tax, humiliating violation every day, over and over again, till we finally just give up and become helpless gimps kept in the trunk when we arent being abused.

Our VAT is 23%.

Every time I pay for something they give me a rough "quickie".

 

[canndo]

When it comes to necessities I will agree with you, what about iphones, ipads, computers, new cars, etc!

I honestly don't understand why you fail to comprehend this basic economic fact Beenthere. We've had this discussion before you and I. Kynes is right. (as often happens). I've asked you what rich people hire when there is nothing to produce and you fail to answer. You fail to answer because they don't. They don't "create jobs", they hire people to do work for them, work that involves fulfilling a demand.

Iphones and the like are fulfilling the same sorts of necessities, the ability to communicate, the ability to store information and the ability to publish.

Everything has competition, no competition, no product. Companies don't create demand, they cater to it. Did you think CD companies created a demand for entertainment? no, they took the demand from vhs. was the demand for VHS created? no, it was taken from movie theaters. Movie theaters got their demand from vaudvile and and live entertainment.


Certainly as value, cost and popularity change, a wider group of people demand things. An innovation does not create demand, it simply takes the demand from other older technology.

 

[Dr Kynes]

Name one Flat Tax scamnario that taxes capital gains as income
Here I will give you a list of proponents that have proposed it
-Malcom Forbes
-Newt Gingrich
-Herman Cain
-Dick Armey

MY constitutionally based flat tax system does so, to whit:

every incorporated agency pays a flat tax on their gross receipts with no exemptions, deductions or deferrals and no allowances for depreciation etc. to the state in which they do business, the rate of the tax would be set annually by the individual states based on the budget expenses set by the congress for constitutionally allowed programs and services, which the congress would then have to live within. no more debt based expenditures. this budget would then be apportioned to the states as their share of the federal budget which they must then collect from the corporate interests within that state, or from the people of the state, or most likely a mix of the two.

corporations which wish to do business nationally or internatrionally would incorporate through te federal government, with a flat tax rate with no deductions or deferrals based on their gross receipts which would then be subtracted from the budget before apportionment to the states, plus a small extra dip (1-2%) which would be dumped directly into the TREASURY (as a saving account against war, disaster or economic downturn) and stored in the form of gold, silver or rock solid bonds from states or municipalities just to keep the money moving.

hence every corporate interest would pay the taxes BEFORE paying out dividends to investors (people) while dividends paid out to other corporate investors or from the subsidiaries within the individual states, would be taxed again as income to said second corporation this would result in corporations doing ONE thing, not nesting subsidiaries within subsidiaries till the ownership of the business is impossible to untangle. further, to engage in business within a state the corporation must be incorporated within that state, reside within the state, and pay the taxes to that state, or if they wish to do business in many states or internationally they would also face the federal income tax

PEOPLE would not be taxed on income at all save by the states (or not if the state so desires), and the IRS and SEC would become a single economic watchdog ensuring that corporate interests do not cheat, defraud or conceal income from the federal tax man.

i know you dont want to hear it but capital gains are already taxed as the income from the corporate interest before being disbursed to investors. the capital gains tax is a second tier of taxation on an already taxed transaction. like having a sales tax, AND a sellers tax both. only the guy at the end of the chain pays the taxes, so currently capital gains are taxed twice, once as the company's money, and once as the investors.

or to put it another way, you would be taxed for putting money into your pocket, and for taking it out.

the current system is designed to gouge the rich, and pauper the poor for the benefit of the merchant class in the middle.

 

[ink the world]

It's earned income credit not unearned and I assure you Romney does NOT get an earned income credit! LOL

Clayton,

Reread what I posted, you "corrected" me by saying exactly what I said.

No shit Romney doesn't qualify fir the EIC.... No idea how you gor that from my post.

 

[althor]

"RED STATES = more military bases, federally owned land, resources, etc. That is NOT welfare.

Of the top 16 welfare states, 15 are BLUE. Find the data reported by CNBC.

Google: Biggest Welfare States CNBC"

http://www.cnbc.com/id/31910310/The_Bigg...are_States

http://specfriggintacular.wordpress.com/...at-states/

State——-% of Pop on Welfare—–Spending on Welfare—-Total on Welfare—–Unemp

#1. California……………3.30%………………$3.28 BILLION………..1,212,893…….11.5%

#2. Maine………………..2.37%……………….$61.73 MILLION………..31,148……….8.3%

#3. Tennessee………….2.15%……………..$91.28 MILLION……….133,505……….10.7%

#4. Massachusetts…….2.09%…………….$295.29 MILLION………136,033………8.2%

#5. Vermont…………….2.02%……………..$30.92 MILLION………..12,543……..7.3%

#6. Wash DC…………..1.99%……………….$18.67 MILLION………..11,806………..10.7%

#7. New York…………..1.92%………………$1.47 BILLION…………..373,305………8.2%

#8. Minnesota…………..1.88%………………$106.29 MILLION………98,028…….8.2%

#9. Washington…………1.86%………………$265.88 MILLION……121,864……..9.4%

#10. New Mexico……….1.83%………………$58.87 MILLION…….36,322…………..6.5%

#11. Indiana……………..1.83%………………..$102.27 MILLION…..116,430……….10.6%

#12. Rhode Island……..1.79%……………….$57.4 MILLION…………..18,839…………..12.1%

#13. Michigan…………..1.60%………………..$380.93 MILLION……….164,589………14.1%

#14.Pennsylvania……….1.60%………………$247.29 MILLION………198,666…………8.2%

#15. Oregon…………….1.55%………………….$83.85 MILLION……….58,831………….12.4%

 

[Carne Seca]

I always though that was just a republican talking point but that's true.

Its dropped a little lower then 50% but still 47%.?

This is like every person in america who pays taxes has one of their bum ass cousins crashing at their house.

At this rate I say fuck paying any taxes and put up more tolls.

Sales tax, property tax, payroll tax, etc., etc., etc.. Everyone pays taxes.

 

[Dr Kynes]

Certainly as value, cost and popularity change, a wider group of people demand things. An innovation does not create demand, it simply takes the demand from other older technology.

not quite true, some things create an entirely new market which may or may not find demand depending on the market.

fashionable clothing for example does not appeal to the buyer through utility, durability or low cost, it sells solely based on the whim of the buyer, and their desire to be foppish. trousers with holes in them, jeans with sparkles, glitter and rhinestones, or shirts that are 6 sizes to big are in no way functional. they are entirely based on the fancy of popinjays.

these senseless garments do not detract from the sales of real clothing, as the clowns and minstrel performers who wear them would be disinterested in the clothing worn by people who work for a living.

luxury goods and sumptuary products are separate from the laws of supply and demand, in that there is no "Demand" only desire. and foolish desire at that.

or looked at through another angle, lowriders do not detract from the sales of normal automobile parts, they simply create a market for shitty hydraulics kits, sparkly paint, and tiny steering wheels. those who indulge in these flights of fancy are not creating a demand for chopped suspensions and banged up mufflers (if equipped) they simply are simply creating a market by which fools can be separated from their money in exchange for whistle tips and faux fur dashboard covers.

if nobody were foolish, foppish or stupid, there would be no demand for laceless sneakers 5 sizes too big (we used to cal them slippers), whistle tips, or shamwows. therefore there would be no producers of such products, and the world would be a little less funny, and a little less colourful.

 

[Harrekin]

not quite true, some things create an entirely new market which may or may not find demand depending on the market.

fashionable clothing for example does not appeal to the buyer through utility, durability or low cost, it sells solely based on the whim of the buyer, and their desire to be foppish. trousers with holes in them, jeans with sparkles, glitter and rhinestones, or shirts that are 6 sizes to big are in no way functional. they are entirely based on the fancy of popinjays.

these senseless garments do not detract from the sales of real clothing, as the clowns and minstrel performers who wear them would be disinterested in the clothing worn by people who work for a living.

luxury goods and sumptuary products are separate from the laws of supply and demand, in that there is no "Demand" only desire. and foolish desire at that.

or looked at through another angle, lowriders do not detract from the sales of normal automobile parts, they simply create a market for shitty hydraulics kits, sparkly paint, and tiny steering wheels. those who indulge in these flights of fancy are not creating a demand for chopped suspensions and banged up mufflers (if equipped) they simply are simply creating a market by which fools can be separated from their money in exchange for whistle tips and faux fur dashboard covers.

if nobody were foolish, foppish or stupid, there would be no demand for laceless sneakers 5 sizes too big (we used to cal them slippers), whistle tips, or shamwows. therefore there would be no producers of such products, and the world would be a little less funny, and a little less colourful.

How do you type so fucking fast?! Lol.

 

[canndo]

"RED STATES = more military bases, federally owned land, resources, etc. That is NOT welfare.

That depends upon what states pay to the Feds more than they take. If california pays to the feds more than they take back in welfare then they are not really a welfare state.

It is interesting that you claim that if a state has lots of military bases - it can't be welfare. I wonder how it is that on one hand the right claims that government cannot create jobs and on the other are very upset at the jobs lost if we close down a base.

How does that work?

 

[Dr Kynes]

How do you type so fucking fast?! Lol.

i simply copy and paste directly from my wetware. this saves a lot of time, but the spell checker sucks.