Wait? ~ 50% of people don't pay taxes?!

[Winter Woman]

And of course there is a "well head depleation credit", meaning that if an oil company, who leases the land and rights from the government (us) at a very cheap rate, and pays very little in royalties (to us) will also pay less taxes because it is pumping oil out of the ground - the same oil that he is selling at a profit and getting a break because it does so.

Yay Romney!

An unearned tax credit is a credit for monies earned by means other than wages tips or salary.

It is not money given to people who don't work.

Unearned income is profits from the sale of stocks, bonds and investment properties, including homes and businesses. An unearned tax credit is a direct reduction in tax liability based on the unearned income received from these investments. The Internal Revenue Service provides several of these credits to encourage more consumers to invest in property and buy new homes.
​

You are absolutely right I got my terminology wrong.

I know a woman who has 5 kids, has food stamps, welfare and I have never seen her work. Her 'refund' was around $5,000 if I remember correctly.

And as far as giving a company credits for creating work or investments IN the usa I'm for it.

 

[canndo]

You are absolutely right I got my terminology wrong.

I know a woman who has 5 kids, has food stamps, welfare and I have never seen her work. Her 'refund' was around $5,000 if I remember correctly.

And as far as giving a company credits for creating work or investments IN the usa I'm for it.

I have no idea where she got a 5,000 dollar refund from the IRS. I assure you, that if I have no income, I don't get a "refund" from the government. I never get a refund anyway because that is a stupid way to "save".

You miss the idea of the wellhead depleation, or accelerated depleation credit. It does not create more work, it does not create more investment, it is a gift for a comany having use up some of what it was originaly given in the first place.

 

[cannabineer]

You are absolutely right I got my terminology wrong.

I know a woman who has 5 kids, has food stamps, welfare and I have never seen her work. Her 'refund' was around $5,000 if I remember correctly.

And as far as giving a company credits for creating work or investments IN the usa I'm for it.

I would ask that that be specified as "work". "Investments" is too broad ... the wealth concentrators could then claim "that's what we're doing anyway".
cn

 

[Ringsixty]

That credit is used by people like Romney, not people that haven't worked.

Maybe you 2 are confusing that with the Earned Income Credit, thats given to the working poor. If I remember correctly that came from Regan.

It doesn't matter who implemented the Earned Income Credit and it doesn't matter who gave the Rich, premium tax breaks.

The Tax system is BROKEN.

Try looking @ it from a non partisan view.

 

[beenthere]

Beenthere, a part of this conversation is my saying that republicans pander to the rich. You said that the rich make up only a small percentage of voters but they make up a huge percentage of contributions to candidates and representation and that is why the right panders to them. Yes contributions help but it's the electorate that really matters when we are talking about services in exchange for votes.

Jobs do not come from rich people. Again I will reply to what you have previously said, offshore accounts don't produce domestic jobs - Do They. Offshore accounts have squat to do with our conversation and you know it

Demand creates jobs. No rich person simply goes out and hires people just for the fun of it.
Hogwash, wealthy people take risks and create jobs to make money, cmon.
As I said, a question in itself is neither true nor false. The 47 percent "creates" jobs by exhibiting demand. They want toothpaste, toothpaste manufacturers ramp up production - and that is what "creates" jobs.

So the 47 percent are just as capable of creating jobs as any other group.

You're full of it on this one canndo, otherwise you would have cited some proof that the 47% creates jobs. You can't and you know it!

 

[beenthere]

I have no idea where she got a 5,000 dollar refund from the IRS. I assure you, that if I have no income, I don't get a "refund" from the government. I never get a refund anyway because that is a stupid way to "save".

You miss the idea of the wellhead depleation, or accelerated depleation credit. It does not create more work, it does not create more investment, it is a gift for a comany having use up some of what it was originaly given in the first place.

Are you saying people do not receive earned income credit canndo, do I have this right?

 

[canndo]

You're full of it on this one canndo, otherwise you would have cited some proof that the 47% creates jobs. You can't and you


know it!

I explained it to you beenthere.


Here, let us start it this way. We have a difference in terminology here. I can name some of the past 47 percenters who hired, I was one of them.

But let us say that the 47 percenters don't hire people. You have your point.

Now how about you demonstrate where jobs are created by your precious "job creating rich" when there was no demand or perceived demand for the product they were selling.

 

[beenthere]

Romney's "truth" is that he finds almost one half of the American public as being umimportant not only to his election but to the country itself.
You can see that can't you? Now do you agree with it?

This is the disingenuous part of you coming out, Romney said no such thing!
I'm paraphrasing but he said that 47% do not pay federal income taxes and will vote for Obama anyways. Never once did he claim they were not important to the country!

 

[canndo]

Are you saying people do not receive earned income credit canndo, do I have this right?

Nope, I didn't say that, what is it for an individual? 450 dollars or something?

If I remember correctly, this was seriously enhanced in the Reagan years wasn't it?

 

[Dr Kynes]

LOL Nice try, but my BS in business tells me supply can and does create jobs and demand!

theres a TON of BS in business, and the BS behind your statement is just one little turd in the pile.

Demand can drive suppliers to make more, but a supply of garbage will never produce a demand for garbage.

this is why farmers look to whats selling well before they plant their next crop. they want to grow more of whats in demand, not a feild of turnips that wont sell, despite the remarkably high yield weight per acre for turnips. if nobody wants them, they cannot "create demand" by growing more.

when supply exceed demand prices fall sometimes to the point where the price is BELOW cost to produce, at which point the farmer takes it in the ass.

in russia, right after the "Great Patriotic War" (thats ww2 to you and me) comrade stalin ordered the russian people to be fruitful and multiply, then ordered factories to stop making guns and tanks, and instead make baby carriages and whatnot. the russian people (in the midst of a secret famine) declined comrade stalin's invitation to have duggar5-style 8 kid families, and those baby carriages just stacked up, filling hundreds of warehouses. rumor has it that the ukraine still has dozens of warehouses stacked to the rafters with stalin era baby prams.

supply can no more create demand than a sheep can create a piano.

 

[beenthere]

I explained it to you beenthere.


Here, let us start it this way. We have a difference in terminology here. I can name some of the past 47 percenters who hired, I was one of them. Here you go with a miniscule example when you knew very well what I was talking about, I call BS!

But let us say that the 47 percenters don't hire people. You have your point.

Now how about you demonstrate where jobs are created by your precious "job creating rich" when there was no demand or perceived demand for the product they were selling.

I am guessing here so don't hold me to an exact figure, I will say that 98% more jobs are created by the 5% of top tax payers than the bottom 47%

Care to rebut that?

 

[NoDrama]

I have no idea where she got a 5,000 dollar refund from the IRS. I assure you, that if I have no income, I don't get a "refund" from the government. I never get a refund anyway because that is a stupid way to "save".

You miss the idea of the wellhead depleation, or accelerated depleation credit. It does not create more work, it does not create more investment, it is a gift for a comany having use up some of what it was originaly given in the first place.

5 kids is worth a shit load. If she made exactly $1, she would get $11 back from a tax refund. http://www.cbpp.org/eic2010/calculator/eitcs3.htm

 

[canndo]

This is the disingenuous part of you coming out, Romney said no such thing!
I'm paraphrasing but he said that 47% do not pay federal income taxes and will vote for Obama anyways. Never once did he claim they were not important to the country!

No, in so many words he did not, what he said was


"

There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. All right, there are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe the government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you-name-it. That that's an entitlement. And the government should give it to them. And they will vote for this president no matter what…These are people who pay no income tax.​

M]y job is is not to worry about those people. I'll never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their lives."

Now Rommey is being disengenuous. However, if he is not looking to court them then what is he looking to do with them?

He says that those people are depenedent on the government for food, housing.... you name it. Is this what you believe as well?

 

[canndo]

I am guessing here so don't hold me to an exact figure, I will say that 98% more jobs are created by the 5% of top tax payers than the bottom 47%

Care to rebut that?

Are you going to answer my question? do rich people hire when there is no work to be performed and no expectation of work to be performed?

 

[Winter Woman]

We really should just have a flat tax or a VAT tax but not both.

 

[Winter Woman]

Are you going to answer my question? do rich people hire when there is no work to be performed and no expectation of work to be performed?

yeah, it's called nepotism. lol.

 

[Grandpapy]

Are you going to answer my question? do rich people hire when there is no work to be performed and no expectation of work to be performed?

Yes, and I have a list of Rich Corporations that received tax cuts just for that purpose! .........

 

[beenthere]

theres a TON of BS in business, and the BS behind your statement is just one little turd in the pile.

Demand can drive suppliers to make more, but a supply of garbage will never produce a demand for garbage. Hence winners and losers that the free market dictates.

this is why farmers look to whats selling well before they plant their next crop. they want to grow more of whats in demand, not a feild of turnips that wont sell, despite the remarkably high yield weight per acre for turnips. if nobody wants them, they cannot "create demand" by growing more. Like i said, the free market dictates winners and losers, but the suppliers will always be there supplying. If no one grew turnips, would there be any demand?
when supply exceed demand prices fall sometimes to the point where the price is BELOW cost to produce, at which point the farmer takes it in the ass. Again, winners and losers, the farmer supplying corn for ethanol wins!

in russia, right after the "Great Patriotic War" (thats ww2 to you and me) comrade stalin ordered the russian people to be fruitful and multiply, then ordered factories to stop making guns and tanks, and instead make baby carriages and whatnot. the russian people (in the midst of a secret famine) declined comrade stalin's invitation to have duggar5-style 8 kid families, and those baby carriages just stacked up, filling hundreds of warehouses. rumor has it that the ukraine still has dozens of warehouses stacked to the rafters with stalin era baby prams.

supply can no more create demand than a sheep can create a piano.

Then why is marketing such an important factor in most every business?

 

[Dr Kynes]

We really should just have a flat tax or a VAT tax but not both.

NO VAT TAXES EVER!!!!!!!!

vat taxes are a full employment program for accountants and tax lawyers.

 

[Dr Kynes]

Then why is marketing such an important factor in most every business?

all the marketing in the world wont make americans eat more turnips, nor parsnips, nor collards, nor chitterlings, nor piggie feet, nor sheep marrow, nor calves brains, nor suet.

only a famine can do that, and thats demand exceeding supply, forcing demand to go deeper into the shit pile for a few ragged morsels.

marketing primarily serves to convince the thick witted and thin skulled that Pilsbury Brand flour is superior to King Biscuit. even though the guy with a brain knows perfectly well that flour is flour, as long as the grain is right for the milling, and the milling is done well.

barring serious differences in quality or price, advertising makes the buyer choose on feelings rather than logic, or in the case of morons, habit rather than thought.

advertising poopdicks would love to convince everybody that they are essential, that nothing happens until somebody sells something, but you cant sell from an empty cart, and a peach is only as good as the peach itself, not the salesmanship of the fruit merchant.

the simple existence of advertising does not somehow validate the existence of advertising, any more than the existence of religions makes religions good and useful. religions are only as good as the product they sell, the preacher's charisma only goes so far with most people, if the religion's "product" is shit most people walk away. after that, only the truely lame brained or foolish continue to follow into the cult and buy more auditing, or join the sea org.