"A rational individual should abstain from voting."

[londonfog]

and you still keep avoiding the question about the other three non bush presidents who have lost the popular vote and still went on to become president...

if our vote really counted, there would have been 4 different presidents then history tells us that there was...

Guy if you feel that your vote don't count then don't vote. I myself will vote because I feel my vote along with others do..

again my argument is not with the popular vote thats yours..are you like really really really high

I"m thinking you don't understand why the Electoral College was put into place?

 

[londonfog]

Racerboy, I'm just spouting out of boredom so it's quite possible it's my ass that's talking here but were set up as a Republic and not as a Democracy for a reason. They had the foresight to avoid the tyranny of the majority.

Granted, this probably has nothing to do presidential elections but I always liked that train of thought. I find myself in the minority on more than a few issues so Tyranny of the Majority sounds ominous to me.

Being a tree hugging fiscal conservative makes it hard to find clubs to join.

BINGO on all the above...tree hugging fiscal conservative are sometimes called Blue Dog Democrats..lol

 

[canndo]

Racerboy, I'm just spouting out of boredom so it's quite possible it's my ass that's talking here but were set up as a Republic and not as a Democracy for a reason. They had the foresight to avoid the tyranny of the majority.

Granted, this probably has nothing to do presidential elections but I always liked that train of thought. I find myself in the minority on more than a few issues so Tyranny of the Majority sounds ominous to me.

Being a tree hugging fiscal conservative makes it hard to find clubs to join.

Funny that - a 2nd amendment loving liberal still has few problems hanging with others on the left.

 

[cannabineer]

Hang one on the right ... balances the load. cn

 

[racerboy71]

Guy if you feel that your vote don't count then don't vote. I myself will vote because I feel my vote along with others do..

again my argument is not with the popular vote thats yours..are you like really really really high

I"m thinking you don't understand why the Electoral College was put into place?

i know why it was put in place, do you?? if not, read this right quick...

How did the electoral college come about?
It was devised by the founders as a means of resolving two concerns. First was to get away from the parliamentary model, where the elected representatives vote for the chief executive (as, for example, happens in Britain, where the majority party votes to select the prime minister). It was their belief that appointing electors to represent each state was more democratic than allowing Congress to elect the president. Second, at the time, communication and travel was much more difficult than today, and voting for delegates at a local level appeared easier and less open to corruption than counting every popular vote at a national level.


Read more: http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,55439,00.html#ixzz23qI91bU1

 

[ginwilly]

You've made me think Racer. I live in a state where I KNOW my vote for president is useless, but this allows me to vote for Johnson as a finger wave to the 2 party system. Voting is still the only tool (short of a coupe) we commoners have at our disposal to affect change.

 

[canndo]

You've made me think Racer. I live in a state where I KNOW my vote for president is useless, but this allows me to vote for Johnson as a finger wave to the 2 party system. Voting is still the only tool (short of a coupe) we commoners have at our disposal to affect change.

Figuring that our contributions have been rendered ineffective, all we have left is the vote, jury nulification, true grassroots movements and our new improved individual power of the press.

 

[racerboy71]

You've made me think Racer. I live in a state where I KNOW my vote for president is useless, but this allows me to vote for Johnson as a finger wave to the 2 party system. Voting is still the only tool (short of a coupe) we commoners have at our disposal to affect change.

i'm far from an expert ginwilly.. i browse the political section from time to time for a good chuckle and to see what other people think about the worlds events..
but from what i've been reading after doing my own research, the popular vote doesn't amount to dog poo poo.. yes, i vote, but only to be able to say i did.. i'm not niave enough to think it meant anything, not until they get rid of the electoral college at least..

i've been open to other opinions, but so far no one has really been able to tell me how four presidents lost the popular vote but still went on to become president.. if that doesn't prove that the popular vote amounts to nothing, idk what does.. maybe i'm wrong, but i haven't seen any evidence showing me why...

 

[Moses Mobetta]

There is no electable candidate to vote for. Not even close except Johnson, still not electible. If I voted for him what would that do?

 

[ginwilly]

Figuring that our contributions have been rendered ineffective, all we have left is the vote, jury nulification, true grassroots movements and our new improved individual power of the press.

Jury nullification gives me a boner. I may be naive but I truly believe the Tea Party sprung from the Campaign for Liberty but was hi-jacked by the Kochs and Palins of the world. Money will absorb grass roots movements. I think our power of the press has actually diluted the 4th estate. I remember my parents didn't watch the news, they watched Cronkite. We used to be able to trust what the news told us, no longer. There are no standards.

This new power is in it's infancy still though, maybe we'll learn how not to abuse it in the future.

 

[racerboy71]

There is no electable candidate to vote for. Not even close except Johnson, still not electible. If I voted for him what would that do?

this is my problem as well.. i'm surely not happy with what obama has done in his time in office, and i'm surely not getting behind mitt and paul..

also, the fact that the potus doesn't really run the country, he only answers to those who had the money to get him elected in the first place.. special interest groups are who are really running this country, right into the ground unfortunately..

 

[olylifter420]

EC votes are far more important then citizens votes hands down.

if not for the electoral votes they wouldn't even come to some States...lol

 

[olylifter420]

Share your interpretation of the ec?


P

Guy if you feel that your vote don't count then don't vote. I myself will vote because I feel my vote along with others do..

again my argument is not with the popular vote thats yours..are you like really really really high

I"m thinking you don't understand why the Electoral College was put into place?

 

[londonfog]

Share your interpretation of the ec?


P

I though t I did with this statement post @ #26

Electoral votes are use so every state has a chance to make a difference and value. If it was based solely on the popular vote then we all would be owned by New York and Cali. Your less-populated States would be shit out of luck. Hell farmers have a right to have a say...not just big city dwellers

 

[Canna Sylvan]

I have an easy solution, make voting a cellphone ap.

 

[Dr Kynes]

Jury nullification gives me a boner. I may be naive but I truly believe the Tea Party sprung from the Campaign for Liberty but was hi-jacked by the Kochs and Palins of the world. Money will absorb grass roots movements. I think our power of the press has actually diluted the 4th estate. I remember my parents didn't watch the news, they watched Cronkite. We used to be able to trust what the news told us, no longer. There are no standards.

This new power is in it's infancy still though, maybe we'll learn how not to abuse it in the future.

you do realize cronkite was a sham, a shill,, a figurehead for his editor's political views. he was a mouthpiece. He told more lies than truths, particularly regarding the vietnam war,, where he told everybody we were losing, had no chance, and our men were dieing like dogs in the rice paddies at the hands of charlie and his superior will to win.

in the late 80's a vietnamese revolutionary general who was later chief of the viet cong forces said they were losing, and only walter cronkite allowed them to win.

cronkite sold our guys out to charlie for his leftist political agenda. he also sold out every viet who didnt want to be a piss poor rice farmer for china's elite. he sold that entire nation out to the marxist/maoist regime and helped enslave three generations and counting to the socialist lie.

fuck cronkite.

 

[cannabineer]

I have an easy solution, make voting a cellphone ap.

That penalizes telecom vegans like me. cn

 

[ginwilly]

you do realize cronkite was a sham, a shill,, a figurehead for his editor's political views. he was a mouthpiece. He told more lies than truths, particularly regarding the vietnam war,, where he told everybody we were losing, had no chance, and our men were dieing like dogs in the rice paddies at the hands of charlie and his superior will to win.

in the late 80's a vietnamese revolutionary general who was later chief of the viet cong forces said they were losing, and only walter cronkite allowed them to win.

cronkite sold our guys out to charlie for his leftist political agenda. he also sold out every viet who didnt want to be a piss poor rice farmer for china's elite. he sold that entire nation out to the marxist/maoist regime and helped enslave three generations and counting to the socialist lie.

fuck cronkite.

I was too young to form an opinion other than boring but it doesn't surprise me. Shattered illusions suck. That period was unreal though, I was 3 when I watched tanks roll down the road in Detroit but it took probably 20 years to understand the significance.

It seems our country goes through an extremely dark period then a shift every 50 years or so, I guess we were just due.

 

[Canna Sylvan]

That penalizes telecom vegans like me. cn

You're posting here, you're like one of them fish eating vegetarians.

 

[cannabineer]

You're posting here, you're like one of them fish eating vegetarians.

I do it from a desktop. I ain't got no cellular. cn

<add> My fav' vegetable is baby seal. Delectable little idiots.