Is Obama and the Senate Holding America Hostage?

[cannabineer]

A flat tax that includes capital gains in its scenario.

There is an interesting question here. One of the stated goals of a flat tax scheme is to avoid double taxation. On the one hand, taxing money made by money one has already earned (interest) would be fairly unambiguous retaxation. Otoh, capital gains from securities aren't interest but can be reasonably construed as a primary sort of income. The simplest system isn't necessarily the best. I don't have a personal concept of a best system. cn

 

[ChesusRice]

Under a Flat tax scamnario

Your income will be taxes

but yet all the flat tax scamnarios exclude capital gains

"becuase at some point they were taxed"

Since Romney collects almost none of his income as salary
How much would his tax burden decrease?

 

[beenthere]

Under a Flat tax scamnario

Your income will be taxes

but yet all the flat tax scamnarios exclude capital gains

"becuase at some point they were taxed"

Since Romney collects almost none of his income as salary
How much would his tax burden decrease?

Simple solution there bud, start investing your money and quit worrying about everyone else!
You lefties are just so obsessed with rich people and the money they make, it's pathetic.

 

[dtp5150]

Simple solution there bud, start investing your money and quit worrying about everyone else!
You lefties are just so obsessed with rich people and the money they make, it's pathetic.

refusing to ignorantly contribute to the death of this planet is not pathetic.

...but yet all the flat tax scamnarios exclude capital gains...

There is no inseparable quality matching ~flat tax ($)~ to excluding capital gains other than that fact that, the tax would be limited to a certain dollar amount by definition so income level of anything has no meaning on the dollar amount paid.

Along the same line, a ~flat tax rate (%)~ would include capital gains along with all other income to be taxed at a percentage rate, as long as tax law didn't say such income was excluded. Its that simple.

Additionally, with regards to double taxation and income tax, the argument usually relates to dividend income from corporate stocks n bonds. Its only tax law that makes them, and capital gains or losses from the buying/selling of stock/bonds, separate categories from other types of income.

To go along with the recent passing of a law forbidding congressmen from insider trading of public traded corporations, I think we need to ban the entire derivatives market, all the way up to basic options. I thought margin trading was illegal too, what happened to that?! The problem would be...how do you cozily put an end to the largest gambling ponzy scheme ever created with spreadsheets full of borrowed money? Get rid of money and cooperate. Let the greedy people realize nobody really wants hear how they wanted their crab bisque less salty. Maybe if they were useful and a good being, they wouldn't have to pay people so much money for these consumer based, meager and unsatisfactory attempts at finding significance. Its as good as guess at working than this mess full of citizens trying to rip each other off. Bah power would corrupt that one too, because people that cooperate dont thrive for power, and never become unrelenting, powerful forces of destruction and dominance.

Ah well. I guess i'll start investing in BP and Phillip Morris and Monsanto and Verizon, and Facebook!

 

[beenthere]

refusing to ignorantly contribute to the death of this planet is not pathetic.

Translate that to English please.

There is no inseparable quality matching ~flat tax ($)~ to excluding capital gains other than that fact that, the tax would be limited to a certain dollar amount by definition so income level of anything has no meaning on the dollar amount paid.

Along the same line, a ~flat tax rate (%)~ would include capital gains, as long as tax law didn't say such income was excluded. Its that simple.

Additionally, with regards to double taxation and income tax, the argument usually relates to dividend income from corporate stocks n bonds.

Hate to break it to ya, but you're wrong. The double taxation of capital gains is one of the main arguments of investors.

 

[UncleBuck]

Simple solution there bud, start investing your money...

yeah, because every middle class family supporting a family of four on $50k a year has tons of money to invest.

take romney's cock out of your mouth and try again.

 

[dtp5150]

Translate that to English please.


Hate to break it to ya, but you're wrong. The double taxation of capital gains is one of the main arguments of investors.

Hablas ingles?

Please tell me how income is double taxed, through the category of capital gains in this scenario:
I buy a lot of land for $100. I sell it for $120. $20 of taxable capital gains <- Please explain how this $20 is double taxed.

Feel free to explain any double taxation scenarios.

 

[Mellowman2112]

Why not nationalize the private federal reserve bank and have the states set up their own banks. All the money created from thin air and loaned out would result in the payments of those loans being deposited with the respective treasuries of each state and federal entity. therefore there would no longer be any need for an income tax. No more banksters ripping off the people and to big to fail threats resulting in bailouts by the taxpayer. Prior to 1913 we had no so called federale reserve bank and no income tax. We've been scammed folks.

 

[ChesusRice]

Why not nationalize the private federal reserve bank and have the states set up their own banks. All the money created from thin air and loaned out would result in the payments of those loans being deposited with the respective treasuries of each state and federal entity. therefore there would no longer be any need for an income tax. No more banksters ripping off the people and to big to fail threats resulting in bailouts by the taxpayer. Prior to 1913 we had no so called federale reserve bank and no income tax. We've been scammed folks.

Why did they decide to have a Federal Reserve in 1913?
What do you know about history?
Would you really want to live in this country if we were like we were in 1913?

 

[BA142]

So Bush got us into two wars that costed billions of taxpayer dollars then he cut taxes.....and you're all mad at Obama?

We can't spend spend spend for 10 years and cut taxes at the same time.

 

[beenthere]

Hablas ingles?

Please tell me how income is double taxed, through the category of capital gains in this scenario:
I buy a lot of land for $100. I sell it for $120. $20 of taxable capital gains <- Please explain how this $20 is double taxed.

Feel free to explain any double taxation scenarios.

That was your translation for "refusing to ignorantly contribute to the death of this planet"? LOL

Simple, your initial $100 dollar investment capital was already taxed, if your new investment went south, like many do, do you think the government will cover your loss?
Government is the perfect investment partner, they're always there holding their hand out when a profit is realized, but when you lose your ass, they're nowhere to be found!

 

[dtp5150]

That was your translation for "refusing to ignorantly contribute to the death of this planet"? LOL

Simple, your initial $100 dollar investment capital was already taxed, if your new investment went south, like many do, do you think the government will cover your loss?
Government is the perfect investment partner, they're always there holding their hand out when a profit is realized, but when you lose your ass, they're nowhere to be found!

The $100 purchase of land was already taxed how? Sales tax, property tax, etc? Taxed from when you earned $100 by building something?
Ok, so you sell it for $80 in 12 months. In that 1 year period, your income from buying/selling of real estate is -$20. How are you double taxed from a capital gains on income tax perspective on that negative $20?

 

[beenthere]

The $100 purchase of land was already taxed how? Sales tax, property tax, etc? Taxed from when you earned $100 by building something?
Ok, so you sell it for $80 in 12 months. In that 1 year period, your income from buying/selling of real estate is -$20. How are you double taxed from a capital gains on income tax perspective on that negative $20?

Are you kidding me, -$20 is not a gain!

Government tells Americans that unless your capital is in a government approved tax exempt investment, with caps, you can 1, take the risk of losing your savings by investing it or 2, pay us if your investment turns a profit.

Hell, the damn federal government even taxes you on municipal bonds!

 

[dtp5150]

Are you kidding me, -$20 is not a gain!

Government tells Americans that unless your capital is in a government approved tax exempt investment, with caps, you can 1, take the risk of losing your savings by investing it or 2, pay us if your investment turns a profit.
...

A gain of -$20 is the same as saying a loss of $20.

And still, how is that double taxation? Do you want people to pay taxes on income earned from real estate speculation? How is this any different from gambling income? Double taxation is when you get dividends from a corporation you partly own, who has already paid taxes on their income.

municipal bonds..it would be hard to say double taxation exists, and that matters if you consider the government a corporation that you partly own. It would be hard, because they get their money from so many sources.

 

[Harrekin]

You guys don't know of double taxation, no...fucking...clue.

Come visit Europe, when you buy a product, it's mostly taxes from a variety of angles.

They don't even need to break into your house to rob and fuck you here.

 

[dtp5150]

You guys don't know of double taxation, no...fucking...clue.

Come visit Europe, when you buy a product, it's mostly taxes from a variety of angles.

They don't even need to break into your house to rob and fuck you here.

Yeah man, I tried to hint at that when I asked when it was doubled taxed? From his income? Sales tax? property tax? Local school tax? etc. And of course taxes on consumer goods, because gas damages the ecosystem, alcohol causes car wrecks, cigarettes give babies birth defects, import tax, etc.

But mainly we were tryin to talk about the income tax law.

 

[beenthere]

A gain of -$20 is the same as saying a loss of $20.

And still, how is that double taxation? Do you want people to pay taxes on income earned from real estate speculation? How is this any different from gambling income? Double taxation is when you get dividends from a corporation you partly own, who has already paid taxes on their income.

municipal bonds..it would be hard to say double taxation exists, and that matters if you consider the government a corporation that you partly own. It would be hard, because they get their money from so many sources.

Here's where we disagree. I believe once you are taxed from your regular income, the government doesn't deserve to tax any risk capital we choose to invest. My point is, many and most investments have the capability of a loss, sometimes a very substantial loss. Where is my investment partner (federal government) when I loose my ass? I would go along with a special tax on capital gains if it was someones sole income, but many of us rely on capital gains to supplement our retirement and the government is right there waiting to penalize us for taking a risk to get ahead in life.

As it is in my state of California, I get taxed a 15% federal capital gains rate plus a 9.3% rate from the state.

If both of us had $100k and you pay cash for a new car and boat and took your wife on vacation, the most you'll be taxed is the sales tax rate of the state you live in, that's if they even have one. If I invest my $100k and realize a profit from my risk, I get railed by both the federal government and the state of California and if I loose any part of my original $100k, I'm screwed, but you still have your boat and car and the memories of your vacation. Now tell me that the government isn't punishing success.

 

[Mellowman2112]

Why did they decide to have a Federal Reserve in 1913?
What do you know about history?
Would you really want to live in this country if we were like we were in 1913?

I read alot so I know alot about history. Read the creature from Jekyl Island it explains why a few paid off Senators and Congressmen decided to tuck us over in 1913. I am talking abour restoring the banking system to the people and not leaving it in private hands that is the only change I am proposing. You act as if I am proposing returning to 1913 technology for crying out loud.

 

[Mellowman2112]

You guys don't know of double taxation, no...fucking...clue.

Come visit Europe, when you buy a product, it's mostly taxes from a variety of angles.

They don't even need to break into your house to rob and fuck you here.

Sad to see the shlonging given to my Celtic brothers in Ireland for the past few centuries. IF the USA disarms I am sure well get the same treatment.

 

[Moses Mobetta]

I read alot so I know alot about history. Read the creature from Jekyl Island it explains why a few paid off Senators and Congressmen decided to tuck us over in 1913. I am talking abour restoring the banking system to the people and not leaving it in private hands that is the only change I am proposing. You act as if I am proposing returning to 1913 technology for crying out loud.

There is so much at stake for a select few, what makes you think we could achieve what you suggest. If anything ?