The pump will have one but it wont hurt to add another if you want to. There`s only forward flow with the pump off if its being used as line pressure booster (ie for reverse osmosis) where there`s a constant positive pressure on the inlet. Nothing can flow the other way due to the internal non return valve. I use a limited amount of brass and never had any issues, it`s more of a concern with recirculating systems where the concentration can build up in the res. Its not an issue for drain to waste.Also, I'm finishing up hooking up the rest of my system. Is a check valve needed after the pump? I wasn't sure if it was alright to subject the pump to the constant 125+ psi or if the pump even prevented the backflow since it states it doesn't prevent forward flow even when off. I just thought it easier to ask then hook up the setup and hav eto take some fittings back apart to put in the check valve after testing
True HP Aero For 2011
- Thread starter Trichy Bastard
- Start date
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
Well, there's a difference when someone is just plain trolling and post after post has nothing constructive to say but only insults to everyone.. I think I was extremely patient for months and finally got tired of helping someone who only returned insults to everyone here...
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
We were just avoiding it when possible. Actually since we tend to drain to waste, it makes it even less of a worry because the nutes aren't recycling past the copper/brass over and over again for days in a row like in hydro. There is a difference between having tapwater and nutes, the salts surely accellerate the leaching of the metals in my mind. Not to worry, I am just a perfectionist, and probably set the stage for everyone else worrying more than necessary... Although I would not use copper coils for my water lines in my setup or anything excessive as I have seen grows die due to such excessive copper... Also, the pump will hold the pressure fine and no check valve is required for that particular reason...Ok, I have a question.
This crossed my mind when gathering some fittings to finish assembling my rig. Why does it seem like everybody is avoiding brass and copper like the plague? I understand that some people would be worried about copper toxicity, but would it really reach anywhere near the amounts that would show any signs of illness? I mean, copper is used as a common fungicide for many vegetable plants. Granted overdoing the application would do harm to the plant, but still the concentration of copper in the fungicide would be at least hundreds of times more concentrated than any sort of copper leaching out of fittings (I would imagine).
I mean, prior to coming out of your faucet, the water goes through numerous feet of solid copper pipe water line, past numerous brass valves, and finally exiting out of a normally brass crafted garden hose nozzle.
I'm just curious what the reasoning is behind buying specialty stainless pressure relief valves/gauges/check valves. I mean if you were THAT concerned about that much copper leaching out of the yellow brass, you should be concerned about the lead leaching out too... lol... I can see avoiding making huge long runs using copper pipe as a nute transport between chambers in a large grow room, but couldn't see brass or copper making any difference in a small setup like most of us have.
Like I said, I also avoided brass where I could, but in a few places I had to use a couple small brass fittings and used regular pressure gauges out of convenience. This is just out of curiosity, not trying to argue a point or change anybodys mind. I just want to know the reasonings behind your decisions
DoktorD1313
Member
Well, everything is hooked up and I made my first test today. I'm running at 100psi to the nozzles and I know it's been said before, but boy the mist from those nozzles sure does look coarse. I really hope that the nozzles are working properly and I'm achieving the droplet size we're reaching for. Tomorrow I'll test the actual flow rate of the nozzles and hopefully it jives with what was expected. I have a disturbing feeling that I'm getting too much output from the nozzles even with the short bursts and them being threaded directly into my solenoids.
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
It's okay- the mist from those nozzles is better even though you were expecting it to be finer. It will support the plants needs when it gets bigger and needs more water. Took me a spell to figure it out myself and accept it. Just remember that the guys with all the experience recommend them, and they know what they're doing considering most of our design here was seeded from their trail-blazing experiences...
DoktorD1313
Member
Yeah, like I said I remember at least one other person commenting on the apparent coarseness of the mist from those nozzles. I still trust that it will bring good results considering all the high praise they're gotten from the other contributors.
Anyhow, here's a video of a test fire: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8CFd7jEGCY
I just wish it didn't have those dense streams deflecting off of the point.
If you don't mind me asking, what were the characteristics of the certain "defective" nozzles people were receiving?
Anyhow, here's a video of a test fire: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8CFd7jEGCY
I just wish it didn't have those dense streams deflecting off of the point.
If you don't mind me asking, what were the characteristics of the certain "defective" nozzles people were receiving?
konagirl420
Well-Known Member
Yay Tb congrats on your babies 
I will be watching to see them grow heehe !!! They def sound cool, I am excited my mom and lil girl just stepped foot onto the mainland and are coming to visit me for a couple weeks yay !!
I will be watching to see them grow heehe !!! They def sound cool, I am excited my mom and lil girl just stepped foot onto the mainland and are coming to visit me for a couple weeks yay !!Try a a diff nozzle I think you got a bad one from watching the test fire! Try a couple diff ones and see if it's not such a stream
DoktorD1313
Member
It's actually the same kind of spray coming from all three nozzles I have installed at the moment... I ordered 6, so I have three backups... I'll try out a few of my backups and try slightly adjusting the impingement tip to see if I can't get rid of those dense streams.
DoktorD1313
Member
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
Thanks Kona, and congrats yourself... Hope you guys have a good time...Yay Tb congrats on your babies
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
As imperfect as they are, they should work okay... For testing purposes, it might be easier to let your ON time be longer just so you're eyes can see a little better. That first nozzle is similar to the issues I had, but one literally shot out a straight stream as if it'd missed the impingement needle all together!
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
Side project-
As most of you know, I am testing the aerolife AA system in another thread. I needed some cuttings to start off in there and decided to also play around with my fog setup and share it with you. Basically I have a triple head fogger with ceramic discs in a 5 gallon bucket. The float keeps the fogger just at the optimal height under the water regardless of water level in the bucket. On top of the bucket is a small pc fan blowing air into the bucket which then carries the fog along a pool vac hose tube to the rooting chamber. I decided to put the fogger and fan on a timer that is set for 20 seconds on/1 minute off. This seems to keep the stems wet but also keeps the heat down and doesn't oversatureate the roots. I hope perhaps I can make the fog work better by controlling it this way. A few of the specimens were put into netpots directly in the neoprene pucks and no media, while the others were put in netcups with rockwool that I plan to hand water until the roots get established just like how I would in my aero chamber. I put them in around 24 hours ago with clonex gel and some Dyna-gro KLN rooting additive in the water to be fogged ph'd to 5.8. Right now there are cherry tomato cuttings in there, sorry..
As most of you know, I am testing the aerolife AA system in another thread. I needed some cuttings to start off in there and decided to also play around with my fog setup and share it with you. Basically I have a triple head fogger with ceramic discs in a 5 gallon bucket. The float keeps the fogger just at the optimal height under the water regardless of water level in the bucket. On top of the bucket is a small pc fan blowing air into the bucket which then carries the fog along a pool vac hose tube to the rooting chamber. I decided to put the fogger and fan on a timer that is set for 20 seconds on/1 minute off. This seems to keep the stems wet but also keeps the heat down and doesn't oversatureate the roots. I hope perhaps I can make the fog work better by controlling it this way. A few of the specimens were put into netpots directly in the neoprene pucks and no media, while the others were put in netcups with rockwool that I plan to hand water until the roots get established just like how I would in my aero chamber. I put them in around 24 hours ago with clonex gel and some Dyna-gro KLN rooting additive in the water to be fogged ph'd to 5.8. Right now there are cherry tomato cuttings in there, sorry..
Mike Young
Well-Known Member
Pretty cool fog setup. I think you've optimized it about as much as plausable. Nicely done.
I got an idea that sounds a little crazy, but I think it's not all that crazy. A root chamber is alot like a speaker box, and I'm pretty sure we've all built one of those in our time, lol. The only thing missing from the root chamber is a woofer creating turbulance inside the chamber. With a light fog that just floats around until it comes into contact with something...? 15 hz you barely hear anything, yet your speakers look like they're trying to commit suicide. Unlike the idea of using a fan to move mist, this could work without introducing new air. In my mind I see mist being shifted back & forth rather quickly, making use of droplets that might normally fall to the floor. I guess it could also cause larger droplets to form by accumulation. Might not be a bad thing... Haven't contributed much in awhile. Just thought I'd drop that idea.
I got an idea that sounds a little crazy, but I think it's not all that crazy. A root chamber is alot like a speaker box, and I'm pretty sure we've all built one of those in our time, lol. The only thing missing from the root chamber is a woofer creating turbulance inside the chamber. With a light fog that just floats around until it comes into contact with something...? 15 hz you barely hear anything, yet your speakers look like they're trying to commit suicide. Unlike the idea of using a fan to move mist, this could work without introducing new air. In my mind I see mist being shifted back & forth rather quickly, making use of droplets that might normally fall to the floor. I guess it could also cause larger droplets to form by accumulation. Might not be a bad thing... Haven't contributed much in awhile. Just thought I'd drop that idea.
Trichy Bastard
Well-Known Member
Thanks...,
well guess you could mount a 12" kicker in there and crank some And Justice For All. The cone moving back and forth rapidly would definitely be like a super speed bellows. If the box was airtight I don't think you'd get any meaningful movement, and if it were ported then it would work as you say. But it would be more mechanical based like a bellows than the soundwaves actually moving the mist around. I get weird ideas when I smoke too- I try not to post too much in that state cuz I would trip everyone out. hahaah Let us know if you do it, and use a polypropylene cone not a cheap cardboard one so it can take the moisture...
thejokertoker2011
Member
Just finished reading though all 224 pages of this thread. There is a ton of great info...wish I had found this thread before I bought The TreeFrog by Multiponics. I'm currently running 14 total sprayers off of two Aquatec 6800 pumps (7 each) I'm getting about 60PSI and I'm seeing quite a bit of fine fuzz on my root hairs. I'm also running a 9 head fogger. I have them under a 400Watt MH about 2 feet above the table 3x3 on 18/6. The growth still seems to be really slow compared to my DWC bubbler setup. Most of my plants are about 8 inches tall but that's a full 3 weeks after the clones rooted!!
Timing:
Fogger: 15min on/45min off (I only have a 15 min inc timer for this right now)
Pumps: currently 10sec on/2.5 min off
For the pump timing I have also tried 30 sec on/5min off & 5sec on/3 min off & 5sec on/2min off
Nutes: Full Aqua Canna line with aquashield and Cal-Mag @ about 800 ppm
Temps:
Air low 70's
Rez: 68-72
RH: %50
PH: 5.5-6.2
Any suggestions as to why there is such slow growth?
Timing:
Fogger: 15min on/45min off (I only have a 15 min inc timer for this right now)
Pumps: currently 10sec on/2.5 min off
For the pump timing I have also tried 30 sec on/5min off & 5sec on/3 min off & 5sec on/2min off
Nutes: Full Aqua Canna line with aquashield and Cal-Mag @ about 800 ppm
Temps:
Air low 70's
Rez: 68-72
RH: %50
PH: 5.5-6.2
Any suggestions as to why there is such slow growth?
tree farmer
Well-Known Member
the nozzles will work but youd have a better mist dispersion if the nozzles were thru the lid and firing into open space. these nozzles are not 360 degree firing nozzles and alot of your mist is being fired into the side of the container or downward toward the container floor, with the nozzles hanging down from the top they will disperse the mist into open space greatly improving the performance. looks like you have some good pressure behind them also and a clean selonoid fire. if you do hang them from the top down keep a good distance from the netpot or turn the firing pattern so that it doesnt hit the netpot dirrectly but fires into open space. if it was me id also put four nozzles in there although im not sure of the container size. i havent read all your posts so dont know.
The same thing happened to me except I bought a system from supreme hydroponics and the kid dissapered do I did my own research and found this thread and all the guys here saved my ass! He also sold me the 6800 which will work but I think there's a number of issues with that tree fog set up the biggest issue is the chamber is way to small! This could be why there's. I growth I had mine in 5 gallon buckets and they only grew to 20"! But
I'd start by flushing straight RO water through it till your runoff is back to almost 0 ppm then I'd start your nutes at 400 ppm for a few days and then go up to 500 and keep adding until you notice a difference and see what it does. Also on your timing when I used that pump I found to start 4 sec on 2 min off and then landed at 2 sec on and kept backing the off time off every week or every few weeks to the point where I was 2 sec on 30 min off! Hope this helps