london and the teaparty

[tip top toker]

I think this goes far further than some folk looting stores. It is my opinion that it is being instigated by parties with something to gain from it, by which i do not mean some stolen goods

The UK population appears fucked though. Under the story that they're simply poor folk looting stores, there is now a huge e-petition requestin that convicted rioters lose their benefits. Because this is sure going to straighten them out, umm, they're on benefits because they have no work, so take away the benefits, coupled with the still present alck of work and i wonder what happens next, all positive things i'm sure

Short story is regardless of the true story, this country really has self destructed, it' a joke. The politicians seem to think that this can alll be sorted out simply by increasing police powers hint Cameron, it stems just a teeny bit deeper than that Like how the government and banks have fucked up the future of the youth, that's a pretty good starting point. First a policeman can't keep his finger off the trigger and causes a protest, and now Cameron has authorised them to lock and load plastic bullets which have been proven to be absolutely fatal if aimed poorly.

 

[RawBudzski]

Exactly why it wont happen that way in the United States.. People would be getting shot the fuck up with bean bags and rubber bullets... and would stop rioting within the hour. let alone days..

I think this goes far further than some folk looting stores. It is my opinion that it is being instigated by parties with something to gain from it, by which i do not mean some stolen goods

The UK population appears fucked though. Under the story that they're simply poor folk looting stores, there is now a huge e-petition requestin that convicted rioters lose their benefits. Because this is sure going to straighten them out, umm, they're on benefits because they have no work, so take away the benefits, coupled with the still present alck of work and i wonder what happens next, all positive things i'm sure

Short story is regardless of the true story, this country really has self destructed, it' a joke. The politicians seem to think that this can alll be sorted out simply by increasing police powers hint Cameron, it stems just a teeny bit deeper than that Like how the government and banks have fucked up the future of the youth, that's a pretty good starting point. First a policeman can't keep his finger off the trigger and causes a protest, and now Cameron has authorised them to lock and load plastic bullets which have been proven to be absolutely fatal if aimed poorly.

 

[NoDrama]

Exactly why it wont happen that way in the United States.. People would be getting shot the fuck up with bean bags and rubber bullets... and would stop rioting within the hour. let alone days..

They would only stop for long enough to go home and get their AR's and AK's, the next day would be a blood bath.

 

[tip top toker]

Exactly. Look at the rest of the world at present, i think it's been rather inequivocably proven that violence does not solve violence. If anything violence against the poeple will only work to bring out emotions from the poeple who had not previously been involved. For example, a cerfew is possibly on the books, the only way to enforce a curfew is a. mass imprisonment. b. slaughter. Due to our war against Libya and the reasons given to us, any violence against our population will only inflame the rest of the population into a justified and warranted and quite monumental uproar. Opression is not a viable long term solution, and never has been. Funnily enough, my father laughed in my face the other day when i told him i fancied myself a UK rebel on ethical grounds, he laughed and told me this was britain, not Libya, things didn't happen like that over here. Bam, water cannons mass arrests and rubber bullets Every cell in London is full, they can't detain any more, merely take details and release.

 

[tip top toker]

that's one hell of an arsenal If police over here even suspected ther was a gun, there would be armed police crashing through the front door shooting first asking question later as appears to be the case a lot of the time these days.

Here's a question that i've given no thought to so could be silly. Should police officers conform to a minimum intelligence test, or should anyone with the "right attitude" be accepted to the force? Because man, ours are like their own population of dunce kids

 

[txpete77]

View attachment 1729663

LOL! That has to be the most absurd magazine I've ever seen...

100 rounds? I don't see how the follower would make it halfway through before sticking...

Gotta be a blast to shoot though. Ever tried bump-firing with it?

 

[RawBudzski]

Yes I have, fun as hell & your right.. its impossible to fill the mag by hand, can only get about 50 rounds before its too hard to push in.. I think they were made to be machine loaded.. oh and All of them are legalized

LOL! That has to be the most absurd magazine I've ever seen...

100 rounds? I don't see how the follower would make it halfway through before sticking...

Gotta be a blast to shoot though. Ever tried bump-firing with it?

 

[txpete77]

that's one hell of an arsenal If police over here even suspected ther was a gun, there would be armed police crashing through the front door shooting first asking question later as appears to be the case a lot of the time these days.

Fortunately many citizens in most of the states are armed. It will make it much worse for the rioters here if there is a business owner defending his property, as long as he/she is in a state that isn't anti-gun.
Take for instance riots in Chicago vs. riots in Dallas. I doubt the looters would be very successful in Dallas whereas in Chicago they would more or less have a run of the city.

Here's a question that i've given no thought to so could be silly. Should police officers conform to a minimum intelligence test, or should anyone with the "right attitude" be accepted to the force? Because man, ours are like their own population of dunce kids

Absolutely they should. I remember a story from a few years ago that a certain police force didn't accept recruits that were above a certain IQ. The scary part about that is when you start thinking of the reasons a government would want to keep their legal means of force dumbed-down. Would it be that the less intelligent officers wouldn't question the legality of their orders?

 

[tip top toker]

Pretty much hit the nail on the head so far as my thinking goes. Get the police not to question what they are doing, or understand the legalities behind it, and have the government cover up all the fuckups and illegal instances with a special comitte chaired by lord whatthefuckexperiencedoyouhaveinthisfield to head it... Match made in heaven, untouchable thug police.

 

[RawBudzski]

As structured as the Cartels or Taliban.. Law Enforcement, Drug Enforcement, Terrorism/Religion Enforcement.. All keep the Cogs turning smoothly.

 

[undertheice]

.....this isn't about me or my needs. It's about standing up to a bunch of conservative, capitalist hacks banding together at a Cannabis forum to spout mindless, self-loathing rhetoric. Ironically, a brand of rhetoric that opposes and attempts to destroy the very plant we are all, supposed, to be here to celebrate.

while, strictly speaking, i'm no conservative, i am capable of appreciating many aspects of that philosophy. chief among them is the concept of limiting the powers of a centralized command structure. after a lifetime of considering myself a dyed in the wool liberal, i noticed that modern liberalism has embraced the very authoritarian principles that were what we were all up in arms about. it became less about allowing people to be as they are and more about forcing people into a mold. all that had really changed was the mold. all those dreams of power invested in people had been replaced by just another power mad bureaucracy, eager to sweep the liberty of the individual aside. deep within the rhetoric of tradition, religion and the destiny of the nation, conservatism contains the belief that the individual reigns supreme. where liberalism has become a philosophy of "what is best for the herd", conservatism still adheres to the concepts of individualism, with all the pain and responsibility that it may contain.

just as i am no true conservative, so too is my affiliation with capitalism a tenuous one. of all the workable large-scale economic philosophies, it is capitalism that gives us the greatest hope for a truly egalitarian society. it does not seek to restrict growth or inhibit man's natural tendencies. it instead utilizes even man's greed and envy and turns them to productive purposes. at its best, it is capable of allowing a nearly unlimited distribution of wealth throughout a society. its downfall has always been its dilution. while some restriction of the marketplace is necessary for the protection of society against undue influence, we always seem to go too far. the envy of the populist mob is heightened by corrupt political animals and they are tricked into handing over their own power over their destiny, along with that of us all, to the state. where they might join together to compete against the accumulated wealth of established industry, they instead demand that government hamper existing business and redistribute that power to those with no skin in the game. along the way the state drains off much of that wealth and it disappears into bureaucratic pockets and the slush funds of favored institutions.

what is most ironic about your post is that neither conservatism nor capitalism hold the seeds of this insane prohibition we all labor under. the former would place such decisions in the hands of the individual and the latter would reward that individual for his ingenuity. it is the statist philosophy you embrace that gives such power into the hands of so few. hidden behind the great lie of democracy, that the electorate is capable of actually controlling the juggernaut of the massive state, the mechanisms of government are allowed to run rough shod over the private sector. we all are the private sector and it is only with our consent that they should be able to do anything. instead, we have given them the power to dictate the terms of our surrender. if left to their own devices, the combination of capitalistic freedom and conservative (libertarian) responsibility that this nation was built on could evolve into the sort of semi-anarchistic society that permits each to do as he so desires. with only a little control and guidance, those two could lead us into the freedom we all desire. the mediocrity and herd mentality of modern liberalism has no such rosy future to offer. it instead demands the orwellian obedience of the hive.

.....why the fuck would you assume most stoners are libertarian. Most stoners I associate with don't mind sharing and giving. Take a penny, leave a penny. Libertarians believe everything should be privatized and maximized.

time for a bit more schoolin' little boy. while you and your ilk might be concerned only with the financial end of politics, stealing the wealth created by others, there is so much more to it all. economics may be a driving force behind much of the legislation and rhetoric of political mavens, but it is the ability of the citizenry to create the wealth that drives any economy. that ability is only enhanced by the liberty of the individual and this is the basis of libertarian philosophy. while statist dupes concern themselves only with limiting the choices of the individual and accumulating power within the state, privatization spreads that power out to the citizens themselves to use as they see fit. no bureaucrat in some ivory tower knows as well as the people themselves how to utilize the fruits of their labors and no bureaucrat should have the power to distribute that private wealth according to some political agenda. simply moving existing wealth from one place to another is all that government can ever hope to accomplish. it is up to the private sector to create and keep on creating that wealth, something the state has never actually been able to more than inhibit and marginally direct.

 

[undertheice]

I am still trying to figure out who this clown is.

there is always the possibility that med has entered his second childhood and is posting with dementia fueled vigor.

 

[txpete77]

Exceptional post, as usual UTI.

 

[VTXDave]

Exceptional post, as usual UTI.

Indeed it is.

 

[Parker]

Seven.. I grow pot, I love pot.. I wish POT WAS REGULATED MORE.. The only people who want it to be really LEGAL are the people who have a hard time growing or obtaining it.. For all the REAL GROWERS, Strict rules on Pot brings more $$$

you are speaking of a managed marijuana economy, which is the opposite of the free market.

here I changed it for you. The only people who want it to be really LEGAL are the people who love liberty and fight hard to allow every adult to grow or obtain it.

 

[newworldicon]

It's been awhile since I grappled with the old fool, but this character reminds me of Medicine Man, both in his ideology and his speedy delivery of insults against anyone that does not fit within his paradigm.

You just described Uncleschmuck...

 

[newworldicon]

that's one hell of an arsenal If police over here even suspected ther was a gun, there would be armed police crashing through the front door shooting first asking question later as appears to be the case a lot of the time these days.

Here's a question that i've given no thought to so could be silly. Should police officers conform to a minimum intelligence test, or should anyone with the "right attitude" be accepted to the force? Because man, ours are like their own population of dunce kids

Here's a question for Brits......what were the circumstances surrounding the Mark Douggan shooting, how did a group of cops find themselves in front of him with weapons? Since when do bobbies carry live firearms? Nobody in the mainstream media is covering this.

Another thing that is not being covered by mainstream media is the fact that there is conclusive evidence already that someone and I say someone as nobody knows who they are were goading and offering money to people on the streets to loot and pilage.

 

[tip top toker]

Here's a question for Brits......what were the circumstances surrounding the Mark Douggan shooting, how did a group of cops find themselves in front of him with weapons? Since when do bobbies carry live firearms? Nobody in the mainstream media is covering this.

Another thing that is not being covered by mainstream media is the fact that there is conclusive evidence already that someone and I say someone as nobody knows who they are were goading and offering money to people on the streets to loot and pilage.

The armed stop was completely pre-planned, part of operation somesuch. Basically they wanted to arrest him but were a little scared, despite his violence free record from accounts. So naturally they shot him dead in a minicab and tried to say he shot at them, right up until ballistic reports proved that he fired no weapon and the police acutally shot their own person. Noone in the mainstream media is covering this as they're trying to make these riots out as something they aren't. People around the world are all chatting about how it's all economy driven and such, bullshit, the police have been harassing and intimidating black youths for decades in london, stopping and searching them purely because they are black, that is not a lie, and then they go and murder yet another black man wihtout reasonable cause. This started because of racism. When there was a peaceful protest outside a police station requesting some answers, first the police simply inored them, and then police moved to attack a 16yr old girl. People started protesting with more than words. Then bam, why mass looting. It was instigated.

I am now convinced that this is an entirely organised series of events for parties with vested interests. The number of new powers being given to the police are a ilttle mad, and many of them are powers which the government has long fought to try and bring in to no avail, such as the legal ability to remove face masks or scarves etc without question if there is reason to suspect criminality. They can get fucked i don't recognise their authority i'll ust keep walking unless they tell me i'm under arrest and if so, for what crime

To me one of the bigger tells that this is not as it's being described, is that they are cancelling the opening matches for the Premier League football under the guise of no police for the game. More likely they opted to ban the football match because they knew how much that would piss people off and get them angry at the rioters, if the news words it correctly.

Cameron is stating that anyone found guilty should go to prison, even those stealing a £300 tv, yet the politicians all ran around stealing tens of thousands of pounds of our taxes and were simply asked to pay it back with 2 or 3 getting a few months in jail but released to house arrest.

The most alarming thing though is the sheer stupiddity of the people of England, it is quite scary really, they are all calling for the army on the streets (they've got all the footballers stating it for that celeb effect) and should just shoot the rioters. Do they not understand why we are at war against Libya? By our position in Libya, i don't see how that would not make the government of the UK illegitimate by default. we'll invade one country to protect civilians while massively increasing police powers of abuse to it's own civilians including potentially deadly protocols.

 

[newworldicon]

The armed stop was completely pre-planned, part of operation somesuch. Basically they wanted to arrest him but were a little scared, despite his violence free record from accounts. So naturally they shot him dead in a minicab and tried to say he shot at them, right up until ballistic reports proved that he fired no weapon and the police acutally shot their own person. Noone in the mainstream media is covering this as they're trying to make these riots out as something they aren't. People around the world are all chatting about how it's all economy driven and such, bullshit, the police have been harassing and intimidating black youths for decades in london, stopping and searching them purely because they are black, that is not a lie, and then they go and murder yet another black man wihtout reasonable cause. This started because of racism. When there was a peaceful protest outside a police station requesting some answers, first the police simply inored them, and then police moved to attack a 16yr old girl. People started protesting with more than words. Then bam, why mass looting. It was instigated.

I am now convinced that this is an entirely organised series of events for parties with vested interests. The number of new powers being given to the police are a ilttle mad, and many of them are powers which the government has long fought to try and bring in to no avail, such as the legal ability to remove face masks or scarves etc without question if there is reason to suspect criminality. They can get fucked i don't recognise their authority i'll ust keep walking unless they tell me i'm under arrest and if so, for what crime

To me one of the bigger tells that this is not as it's being described, is that they are cancelling the opening matches for the Premier League football under the guise of no police for the game. More likely they opted to ban the football match because they knew how much that would piss people off and get them angry at the rioters, if the news words it correctly.

Cameron is stating that anyone found guilty should go to prison, even those stealing a £300 tv, yet the politicians all ran around stealing tens of thousands of pounds of our taxes and were simply asked to pay it back with 2 or 3 getting a few months in jail but released to house arrest.

The most alarming thing though is the sheer stupiddity of the people of England, it is quite scary really, they are all calling for the army on the streets (they've got all the footballers stating it for that celeb effect) and should just shoot the rioters. Do they not understand why we are at war against Libya? By our position in Libya, i don't see how that would not make the government of the UK illegitimate by default. we'll invade one country to protect civilians while massively increasing police powers of abuse to it's own civilians including potentially deadly protocols.

Interesting, where did you get this info on operation somesuch? or am I misreading what you said?

 

[tip top toker]

Somesuch being that i don't remember the name. Turns out to be operation trident which is ust the name for the armed police stuff.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/aug/05/man-shot-police-london-arrest

That is how the story first came out, and the followup proved that the police had fired all ths shots including at their own officer. There was no justification in pulling the trigger. Accounts are also pointing towards the gun being inside of a sock and as such, unfireable at the time.

The scene was visited by David Lammy, the MP for the area, who said: "I am shocked and deeply worried by this news. There is now a mood of anxiety in the local community

So the community stood outside the polie station and asked for some answers.

Here's one of many witness interviews.
[youtube]CJQHWwEpwAY&NR=1[/youtube]