Zaehet Strife
Well-Known Member
...............to grow
The Real Truth about Rootbound and Transplanting
- Thread starter Zaehet Strife
- Start date
Brick Top
New Member
What people who lack true plant knowledge, true horticultural knowledge do not know and refuse to accept is that as soon as a plants root begin to circle the pot they are in the plant is already under some degree of stress and it only increases as the circling and tangling/intertwining gets worse.
Something I learned about sites like this a good while back is there are horticultural facts and then there are grower beliefs ... and never the twain shall meet. Those lacking an education in facts will never abandon their self created belief structure and attempting to educate them is virtually impossible.
It becomes a personal thing with them. You explain the facts to them. They take it personally as if you referred to them as being stupid rather than you attempting to help them by educating them. They will never admit to being wrong because since they take it personally, to them it would be like admitting they are stupid and that is something almost no one will ever do.
The only ones who will ever say they took the advice and saw vast improvements are the ones who did not take the facts presented as being a personal attack against their level of intelligence. You find few people people on sites like this that are so level headed and who can keep things on an impersonal basis rather than turning everything into something personal.
That is why most sites like this remain universities of ignorance. Personal beliefs that are not based in fact are defended more ferociously than a mother grizzly would defend her cubs all because they are personal beliefs and when they are questioned or proven to be inaccurate it is seen as a personal attack. Since most people share the same, or very similar, inaccurate beliefs the weight of numbers of those defending what when it comes to actual proven facts and nothing else is indefensible, win the day and yet another crop of new growers is lied to and misled and follow in the footsteps of those who insist that their intentionally performed errors are the right way too do things. It is a perfect example of the blind leading the blind.
For all the good you can do you might as well spend your time attempting to talk a statue into going for a walk. There is no key to unlock a closed mind and no crowbar will ever be large enough to be able to pry open a closed mind so you can slip in any actual proven facts.
Zaehet Strife
Well-Known Member
well said brick top, well said
wookieslinger
Active Member
Indeed.
I was hoping someone would prove me wrong with some empirical data. I have a hard time accepting something as fact that is based on a some pictures of stressed plants and general experience of others, no matter how deep their experience is. Just as UB said when regarding hydro vs soil "it's a paradigm not fact". And it's seems the topic of rootbound has a few exceptions to the rule. Especially, when considering hydro apps.
I suppose it's time to set up some DWC in varying sizes and start observing.
Brick Top
New Member
I don't see where a root-bound condition would occur in a DWC setup, or at least I would have to believe it to be highly improbable, but any hydro that involves pots or a tub that would be undersized, that would be a totally different case. Then a root-bound condition could occur.
But that goes back to where I earlier said when people compare soil to hydro it is almost never as close of a comparison as could be made, as in pots and passive hydro or the use of tubs. Sooner or later someone always says DWC and then there is no valid way to compare the two when talking about this subject.
Zaehet Strife
Well-Known Member
its just so much easier for a plants roots to lose surface area in soil rather than hydro. losing surface area for the roots is what causes the symptoms of the infamous rootbound plant. i think its reasonable to say that even in hydro plants may become rootbound, but its so much harder since they have so much more room. but i JUST started my first hydro grow so i have little to no experience with DWC.
Brick Top
New Member
The roots have more room if it is a DWC hydro setup. The majority of the roots live in the aerated deep water so they have more room, but systems like WaterFarm's ebb and flow that grows in pots and passive hydro systems that grows in pots and ebb and flow systems using a tub, they can all end up with too little root space and a root-bound condition.
Wolverine97
Well-Known Member
Successful troll is successful.
ClamDigger
Active Member
sorry man, #4 has a nutrient charge,Remeber the plant (casey jones) I showed you guys that was rootbound in a 6 inch cup on 3-28 -11 (page 9) droopy leaves yellowing
The day I showed you all that photo I transplanted it into a 8 inch potter.... look how much better the plant is doing...5 days later
No fert added... just transplanted and watered...I never add fert to the first time watering a transplanted plant.....I use a soilless growing medium (sun#4)
The leaves are now stretching towards the light (not drooping) the green color has returned along with explosive new growth
A plant in a 6 inch cup under 400s will take almost twice as long to get rootbound compaired to the same strain in a cup growing under 1000s
A freshly watered transplanted plant takes days for the water to get used up.... as the roots expand and the plant gets rootbound... you will find yourself watering alot more if not daily
In soil grows... during veg as long as roots can expand... the growth of a plant can be almost unrestricted.... as roots get bound up the growth slows
"
Ingredients
Formulated with Canadian Sphagnum peat moss, coarse perlite, organic starter nutrient charge, Gypsum and dolomitic limestone.
"
probably was a combo of more dirt and nutrients.
http://www.sungro.com/products_displayProduct.php?product_id=139&brand_id=3
Zaehet Strife
Well-Known Member
so, today its been exactly 2 weeks and 1 day since i transplanted my plant from the start of the thread. today i transplanted again. and i know many of you will tell me my plant isnt rootbound, but it is to some degree.. i noticed its growth decreasing so decided it was time to transplant. even though she isnt yellowing or thinning out really... oh boy she was def ready! the 5gal pot is going to be the finishing pot, not big enough for 100% of what the plant can offer, but i cant afford any more soil lol. nah i didnt really NEED to transplant, but to keep my plant at 100% for as long as i can, it is the perfect time to transplant!
both of the plants in the pics are trifoliates, trying to breed a trifoliate phenotype..so stressing out the little one trying to make a male (prolly makes no dif.. never tried to make a male plant before) supercropped the stem below the first node twice to stress it out, then supercropped a couple nodes. gave him a punch or two to toughen him up lol. accidently spilled some ferted water on him too, if that doesn't make a male plant i dont know what will!
both of the plants in the pics are trifoliates, trying to breed a trifoliate phenotype..so stressing out the little one trying to make a male (prolly makes no dif.. never tried to make a male plant before) supercropped the stem below the first node twice to stress it out, then supercropped a couple nodes. gave him a punch or two to toughen him up lol. accidently spilled some ferted water on him too, if that doesn't make a male plant i dont know what will!
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colonuggs
Well-Known Member
The new shit does bro.....until a month ago they didnt have a starter nute charge.....
this is what I use.....no nute charge
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
Sorry, tis the nuances of the internet - there's no non verbal communication, only words.
UB
FriendlyGuy
Well-Known Member
What you call root bound, I'd probably call something else. I'm not going to say it doesn't happen on occasion, but there is almost no way any plant got root bound within a few weeks, cup or not. I've personally kept plants in 16oz cups for about eight months, no root trimming. I've flowered plants in cups, I've kept mothers for over a year in less than a gallon of soil.
So before you make it out to be cold hard fact, do some investigating. I have a strong suspicion that your plants weren't actually root bound, and that you just needed a scape goat.
Might want to edit that out, makes you sound hypocritical
wow ima just hop in for a second and continue to read more, just have to say... what an asshole.. good job OP
Zaehet Strife
Well-Known Member
im going to be leaving the girls in the 16oz solo cups in there for the remainder of flowering. going to do my very best to keep them alive and healthy without transplanting, and i will post pics of the finished product in about 2-3 months. i might need some help keeping them alive, ive never tried to do a whole grow starting in a 16oz cup hehe. this is my 3rd grow, and im not a very experienced grower either, just in what ive experimented with myself. for me, there's really only one way to figure something like this out, and its to do a rootbound experiment yourself. (fortunately i was gifted with a lot of room for experimental plants that i didn't have to worry about my 1st two grows)
i haven't done anything special, just water/feed when they tell me they need it and transplant when they tell me to. make sure i ph my water beforehand and ph the runoff taking note to adjust the ph for the next watering. thats all i really do, plus a bunch of dif. experiments to go along with it to try to learn something new every grow. note to give two similar plants different doses of ferts at different times, cutting the leaf and leaving the node, cutting the node and leaving the leaf, theres just so many things i want to try just to see how they are going to react ya know.
i haven't done anything special, just water/feed when they tell me they need it and transplant when they tell me to. make sure i ph my water beforehand and ph the runoff taking note to adjust the ph for the next watering. thats all i really do, plus a bunch of dif. experiments to go along with it to try to learn something new every grow. note to give two similar plants different doses of ferts at different times, cutting the leaf and leaving the node, cutting the node and leaving the leaf, theres just so many things i want to try just to see how they are going to react ya know.
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shnkrmn
Well-Known Member
wookieslinger
Active Member
Is MJ considered to have a fine root system?
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
Fine as wine and twice as potent.
colonuggs
Well-Known Member
Sorry about that unlce ben and others.....I use sunshine pro mix #4 and #2
In the winter time I use #4.... its mixed with alot more perlite... this allows for better drainage during the colder months
In the summer time I use #2 it retains the water for a longer period.... usually an additional day..... its the sunshine #2 that comes with no nute charge
I got my ### confussed my bad.....must be the sour diesel on my brain
Brick Top
New Member
Depending on what sort of tree, bush or plant one might be talking about the actual size of what is called a "fine root" will vary but to give an example of fine roots of cannabis plants, when I grow on my deck the smallest pot size I use is 15-gallons and I have a few that are larger, that I used to have smaller ornamental bushes in that I no longer have.
After harvesting and I empty the old soil, down at the deeper depths and out near the farthest edges there are roots everywhere but they are so small, so thin, so fine that they look more like spider webs than roots ... but they are roots.
I believe they would qualify as being able to be accurately called fine roots.