Defoliation - When and how?

[legallyflying]

I am starting to realize that you need to be either a recluse or a bitter old man to be able to grow decent buds. I AM a noob at growing weed indoors and I just can't seem to wrap my head around all these really complex botanical terms. The only thing I can do is buy EVERY product at the hydro store, throw it in my rez and hope for the best.

As you can see, my second grow is going horribly. Probably because I hacked off about 50% of the fan leaves. I mean shit, my plants don't even look like plants that grow outside. Maybe I show add some CFL's under the SCROG screen? Will this help?

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[Uncle Ben]

Here's the last image which did not post in the previous post.

LOWER MASS OF DENSE NUGGETS SHADED BY DA NASTY FAN LEAVES:


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[Canon]

Thank you Ben. Nicely done!

If you check back, I've never said that straight up growing by the books is bad. Actually, I think it is the way to go when starting out.

ONLY issue I take is saying it's the ONLY way to grow. It definately is not.
Squashing people's ideas on wanting to try things on their own is a prob. with me also.
Defoliating is a good possible alternative way to grow if situation calls for it.
The effect of removing leaves causes plants to act in unusual ways. That to me makes it a tool that may be helpful to know at times.

The comparisons you offered can be read several ways depending on what one is looking for.
One example showed defoliation creating a generouse amount of branching for possible cloning / bud sites.
Another example shows that your colas are very well endowed. Probably equally so.

What is missing is strain, age, particulars of the grow method / style.
So in many way it's still apples to oranges.
However, clearly both methods work for different people for different reasons.
Neither method is perfect I guess.
Neither method kills bud production.
Neither kills the plant.

Don't believe defoliation generates any miraculously unexplainable results.
Also just can't accept your way as the only way either.

That sums it all up pretty much in a nutshell.

 

[Canon]

That's a pretty interesting comparison IMO.

 

[Uncle Ben]

Hmmmmmm, I see it did post on the previous page. I'll leave well enough alone lol.

 

[Canon]

Me too.

PS; DEFINATELY a beautiful plant by-the-way.

 

[Uncle Ben]

That's a pretty interesting comparison IMO.

Note how thick and widespread those buds are at the lowest part of the plant. The Herd consensus would be that that part of my plant is "shaded". Not only are all fan leaves still intact and healthy, but that plant was crammed into a space with many others (meaning 'shaded more so' for those with limited reasoning power). It was about 42" tall when harvested.

UB

 

[Uncle Ben]

ONLY issue I take is saying it's the ONLY way to grow. It definately is not.

Never have I said this and that is the only way to grow, quite the contrary. And if you can prove your point by linking me to such a post, you go for it. I've said, over the years posting at perhaps a dozen forums, that there are many techniques to growing, each having its pros and cons. The Master Gardener will understand his program, it's limits and opportunities and go from there.

This thread is not about methods so much as it is about photosynthesis, botany.....at least it is to me.

Having said that, I see under "similiar threads" (bottom of this page) where there are 4 defoliation threads. Like I said, with every new (lazy) crop of noobs comes the same old tired questions.

UB

 

[Canon]

Note how thick and widespread those buds are at the lowest part of the plant. The Herd consensus would be that that part of my plant is "shaded". Not only are all fan leaves still intact and healthy, but that plant was crammed into a space with many others (meaning 'shaded more so' for those with limited reasoning power). It was about 42" tall when harvested.

UB

Ohhh, man. Why must you always add them little abrasive clauses?

"42" tall when harvested" - Oh? Compared pic was waaaay under and possibly younger (ie; faster)?
Hmmmmm...

 

[dlively11]

Note how thick and widespread those buds are at the lowest part of the plant. The Herd consensus would be that that part of my plant is "shaded". Not only are all fan leaves still intact and healthy, but that plant was crammed into a space with many others (meaning 'shaded more so' for those with limited reasoning power). It was about 42" tall when harvested.

UB

LOL that pic doesnt show us anything. Shows the upper portion of a "42 inch tall" plant.
Looks like maybe the top 12-16 inches at most. My plants below are 20 inches tall rock hard bugs all the way to the ground and I get 4 of them in every SQ foot while each of your plants look like they take up well ove a SQ foot . Probably explains why the defoilated plants yielded twice what yours did. Oh and these still had 2-3 weeks left to go. If we are going by pictures you lose Benny boy. Case closed

OH and here is a lower yielding strain/table

 

[Canon]

"Having said that, I see under "similiar threads" (bottom of this page) where there are 4 defoliation threads. Like I said, with every new (lazy) crop of noobs comes the same old tired questions." - Ben

I know. It definately gets old. I try not to get into too many of them. Actually don't bother too much on this site except for a few threads I'm following.
Just too much rudeness for me to even want to bother.
Occcasionally,, a new thread starts and the OP is sounding nice & genuine. I may take a moment to interject something. Unfortunately, way too often they turn into a fiasco and end up wishing I didn't bother.

 

[legallyflying]

I have to say that dively's pics are more impressive. UB, that isn't a pic of rock hard understory buds, that is clearly an apical bud and it appears to be in the upper canopy.

 

[Uncle Ben]

I have to say that dively's pics are more impressive.

Of course you would. You're just full of putdowns and the good-ol-boyz political correctness.

UB, that isn't a pic of rock hard understory buds, that is clearly an apical bud and it appears to be in the upper canopy.

CLEARLY, it's at least 3 weeks from harvest shit-fer-brains. The pistils of Cannabis turn brown with age. Get some new specs and/or a new brain.

I finish all my plants at around 42 - 48", with the exception of a sativa like Dalat which goes around 6'.

Your (personal) problem is not having the courage to admit that you might have gotten more yield if you left the fan leaves alone. Instead, you side with forum popular thought and paradigms. This is what my mutts look like close to harvest with the nuggets continuing almost to the bottom.




UB

 

[legallyflying]

CLEARLY, it's about 3 weeks from harvest shit-fer-brains. The pistils of Cannabis turn brown with age. Get some new specs and/or a new brain.

I finish all my plants at around 42 - 48", with the exception of a sativa like Dalat which goes around 6'.

UB

Who said anything about how mature it was? Thanks for addressing the fact that it IS NOT an understory bud that is heavily shaded by fan leaves as you originally suggested.

Let me spell it out clearly for you so you don't get further confused. You make the claim that you have tons of big understory buds that are shaded by fan leaves but the picture you submitted does not show heavily shaded understory buds.

BTW, why the fuck are you still here?

We've been down this road before.

unsubscribed....

 

[Uncle Ben]

Who said anything about how mature it was? Thanks for addressing the fact that it IS NOT an understory bud that is heavily shaded by fan leaves as you originally suggested.

Let me spell it out clearly for you so you don't get further confused. You make the claim that you have tons of big understory buds that are shaded by fan leaves but the picture you submitted does not show heavily shaded understory buds.

BTW, why the fuck are you still here?

What's wrong, can't admit your full of shit so you want me gone? You too are too stubborn (and blind) to admit you might have gotten more yield if you had left the fan leaves intact, as mama nature intended.

Now, have a look at the previous photo. See those fan leaves that are shading the lower part of the plant? You know, the plant with the cola that is 4-6" across and solid as a rock? OK......now, see how the cola actually flares out in breadth at the lower part of the photo?

See my avatar? V V V See those lower leaves? See the bright white collection of nuggets at the bottom, so heavy with bud that the branches drop from the weight?




....and to top if off, that plant (sitting on a table) was crammed into an indoor garden with others its size.

Silly kids......

 

[dlively11]

What's wrong, can't admit your full of shit so you want me gone? You too are too stubborn (and blind) to admit you might have gotten more yield if you had left the fan leaves intact, as mama nature intended.

Now, have a look at the previous photo. See those fan leaves that are shading the lower part of the plant? You know, the plant with the cola that is 4-6" across and solid as a rock? OK......now, see how the cola actually flares out in breadth at the lower part of the photo?

See my avatar? V V V See those lower leaves? See the bright white collection of nuggets at the bottom, so heavy with bud that the branches drop from the weight?


View attachment 1471171



....and to top if off, that plant (sitting on a table) was crammed into an indoor garden with others its size.



Silly kids......

Damn you fail . You cant even look at pictures without your stubborn, biased views LOL. I said it before and I'll say it again,that picture you are so proud of, while looking good, is no where near the yield of the plants I grow in the same space. Has one large cola that isnt even as big as mine. I can fit atleast 8-12 hell maybe even 16 under the same footprint as your posterboy plant above. That is a minimum of 8 colas all larger then the one you have on that plant but most like 12-16. No wonder I yield 2X what you do. Your growing style is no where near as efficient in light distribution as a good SOG table is. You'd be lucky to get more then 4 of those plants on a 4X4 tray where I can get 64 plants. Hey its great for a lazy grower who doesnt want to do any work. You just cant wrap your mind around the fact you are not being efficient with your grow. Silly senile old man lol ...... Hey I thought you left, NM, you must have forgotten that already lol

 

[Canon]

Proof positive!

Ya just can't fix stupid!

 

[legallyflying]

Can't teach an old dog new tricks. That's the consensus

 

[Uncle Ben]

Uncle Ben,

All of your pics are clearly of top plant sections. You claim one thing yet show a pic of another. It is all too clear that Dlively's yield makes yours look like the noob you are. If you're not a noob to growing, you're surly a noob to being a human with basic manners. If it seems like people are picking on you it's because you act like an ass. Damn, I can just picture you in your stained bath robe, sweating and typing away in never ending frustration. Do us all a favor and go get laid.

So, in all your hype of having some fantastic medical grow using enough watts to light up the City of Seattle, you do a thread that looks like a typical noob job with spindly plants. Son, some advice......use some side reflecting panels, keep the leaves, and perhaps the medical cannabis racket will buy your baloney.

As an aside, Bubba needs some help.

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We had a big shopping spree today: 6 - 1000 watt Ballasts, 6 - 600 watt Ballasts, Digilux bulbs for all, a couple reflectors, 2 - 10" Inline Fans, 1 - 8" Inline Fan, 2 - 8" Booster Fans, 2 - 6" Booster Fans, a bunch of ducting and fittings, 70 Pint Dehumidifier, 12,000btu Portabe Air Conditioner, Rope Ratchets, and some rough electrical gear. All told: $6,200. We're expecting delivery on 2 - 10" x 39" carbon filters tomorrow...just in time!


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The bloom room is way too crowded. We're installing 6 new 1000 watt lights tomorrow. We spent today getting parts and installing a new sub-panel for the lights and cooling fans. Once the new lights are in, we can bring about 6 more plants in from the veg room to fill out the flower room. Then we'll hang 4 - 600 watt bare bulbs around a few smaller un topped Lavander crosses I have just for this purpose.


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Here's 9 Bubba Kush plants 2 weeks into bloom. They're in 10 gallon buckets with Sunshine #4. I'm switching to this great coarse/fine coco blend I found for all future planting


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This Bubba is 3 weeks into bloom. I'm very happy with the amount of bud sites and the current size. I'm going to go out on a limb an estimate this plant will yield 6ozs.



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Here's a close up on a Bubba 3 weeks into bloom. By tomorrow night these girls are going to be getting blasted with alot more light than they have right now. These first couple crops are all about getting a feel for canopy shape, training, and light distribution. This is my first grow with real plant limits. Typically with a grow this size I'd have...well...uhhhh...let's just say alot more plants than I have here. So, we're trying to get a feel for how to maximize yield with only about 45 plants in an 8 x 24 foot area under 12,000+ watts of light. The other 45 plants are in the veg room, and I reserve 9 plant spots for a mother or 2 and some new strains.

Bubba

 

[legallyflying]

I kind of wish I could see what UB wrote but i just discovered the wonderful ignore list function.

Let me guess though.. Condescending piss and vinegar