shishkaboy
Well-Known Member
Found this on another site too. good info
Soul,On Cubing:
MrSoul
Moderator
Searching for the TRUTH implies a desire to actually FIND it.
Posts: 1235
Registered: Dec 1999
posted June 10, 2000 08:13 AM
7upyours_~
Good question. Bros Grimm have been employing a method called "Cubing a Clone" to create strains from unique female plants for years now. Read the following and you'll understand:
Cubing a clone is a way to create a unique seedline (a strain) modelled after a currently existing female individual. The goal is to create seeds from which the females replicate the phenotype of the original female. Obviously the chosen female should be an outstanding specimen.
Procedure:
CONTINUOUSLY KEEP A MOTHER IN THE VEGETATIVE STATE TO PROVIDE CLONES
1. Pollinate a flowering clone of the original female with the pollen of a related male, preferably her father or a brother. The resulting seeds contain 1/2 the original female's genes and 1/2 those of the male. An unrelated male wont have the Y-chromosome of the chosen females family & therefore any Y-linked traits of the family will always be missing in the seedline.
2. Grow the above seeds & flower them. Collect an equal quantity of pollen from each selected male and mix it together.
3. Pollinate a flowering clone of the original female with the above pollen. These seeds contain 1/2 the original females genes plus 1/4 more because the male used was 1/2 her genetics too. I call this generation .75 to capture the idea that its 3/4 of the original females genetics.
4. Grow the above seeds & flower them. Collect an equal quantity of pollen from each selected male and mix it together.
5. Pollinate a flowering clone of the original female with the above pollen. These seeds contain 7/8 the original genes (1/2+3/
, the ".88" generation.
6. Grow the above seeds & flower them. Collect an equal quantity of pollen from each selected male and mix it together.
7. Pollinate a flowering clone of the original female with the above pollen. These seeds contain 15/16 the original genes (1/2+7/16), the ".94" generation. Theoretically this will be a stable, true-breeding seedline from which all females are replicas of the original.
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Cindy99 Notes
"Clone flowered under a 400watt, 42watts/sq.ft. Grown organically in a soilless medium, 1:1:1 ratio of GOOD potting mix, perlite, & worm castings. Finished about 16"-18" tall. Nice high flower to leaf ratio, manicuring would be a breeze if it didn't have so much resin globbed all over it. Nugs were dense for a 400watt, but not tight like they are under the big lights. I flowered for 53 days, last 24 hours no light. I alternated Big Bloom & Hi-P fishes (Neptune's Harvest) for food. Total yield about 15gm of very frosty & very potent well manicured buds. Good flavor, but a STRONG smoke. Very "up" high. I can get a lot done instead of just vegging. By far the best I've grown. No shit." - Bill Clinton
"C88 is the best so far. It has blown the socks off every Dutch variety I've grown for all around goodness." - flwr smkr
"The photo at the web site is Cafe'Girl, she is the sister of Princess (Cinderella 88's mom). Cafe'Girl is the seed mother I'm using to produce "Dylan's Diamond" which will be released in January 1999. She's a beauty - BIG yielder of super DENSE, crystalized buds in fairly LOW light levels. Scent/flavour is very much like ginger ale." - MrSoul
"Princess was obtained from growing out seeds found in buds of Jack Herer that was purchased in Amsterdam at the "Sensi-Smile" coffee shop, an authorized outlet of Sensi Seed Bank. Thus, it is considered to be an f2 generation Jack Herer. The seeds were found only in the deepest part of the buds indicating that the father was an unusually early-maturing JH that the growers missed at first." - MrSoul
"Princess is a female which resulted from a seed found in a Jack Herer bud I bought in Amsterdam near the Sensi Seed Bank at "Coffeeshop Sensi Smile". The bud came in a 2 gr. cello-pack with the Sensi logo; I expected sinsemilla, but it had about 10 seeds so I assume she's an F2 JH. Her characteristics were so fine I wanted to create seeds that would "replicate" this plant. She has the KILLER Haze-influenced high with the most DELICIOUS pineapple/evil scent, 50 day maturation in 12/12, and incredible resin production, doesn't stretch - yet clearly Sativa-dominant! Last but not least: Never a hint of hermaphrodism after 2 years of cloning & many different styles of grow.
I wanted to "cube" Princess but add a little beef to her branches because the buds were always too heavy at harvest and branches needed staking to keep from flopping over. I crossed my ShivaSkunk female with one of the males from the same group of seeds that Princess came from. THIS cross produced a male which was then crossed to Princess, creating "P.50" (using a shorthand notation I developed to indicate the fraction of Princess genes in the cross).
Each generation is the result of crossing a male from the previous generation to Princess herself (incestuous, I know).
Blow-by-blow description of the generations:
P.50 = Heavy, single-cola type plants with mellow high (too much influence from the ShivaSkunk) Sweet fruity scent/flavor. Unstable in most traits - for example, 10 days difference in fastest/slowest maturation period in a group of 20 seedlings.
P.75 = Plants leaning MUCH more in the direction of Princess in floral cluster and bud structure, scent/flavor turned more "tropical" like pineapple. The stability was becoming better - two major phenotypes; short & dense (potent too) or tall/HUGE (Not so potent).
P.88 = Renamed Cinderella 88 when first released on the market. It grows fast and produces excellent yields of FROSTY buds in 7 weeks! Generally uniform seedlings with minor differences in floral formation and some height variance, but the smoke is quite consistent from all plants - Dense, heavy nuggets of fruity scented & flavored (like wild berries) and covered in resin glands, the dried buds have distinctly ORANGE pistils.
And now P.94 = Cinderella 99. This project has been a huge success. The strain has been embraced by the "net"work of growers with rave reviews.
The Bros. Grimm too have been recognized for their excellent combination of quality products and unparalleled service after the sale. There's NO OTHER seed bank that has it's breeders on the net answering questions from "newbies" 40 hours/week, and the info is first-rate; even details of their breeding strategies are openly discussed so that the seed buyer can feel well-informed about the products BG offer.
I personally think the plants these Cinderella 99 seeds produce are every bit as good as a cutting from Princess herself (or better). I say better because the flavor of no two plants is "identical"; there's a personality to all living things. Like Princess herself, Cinderella is sweet & fruity to the palette and nose, and when you take a hit you're BLASTED...with the same "racy" high as Princess! The improvement comes in the yield department; 25% greater yield and a stronger branch structure, which I accomplished by starting with some ShivaSkunk genes in the original father in the cubing process. I knew I'd blend out the majority of the traits from ShivaSkunk in the cubing process, but I was hoping to incorporate the ShivaSkunk's stronger branches because Princess had a tendency to need supports in the final two weeks of flowering. As it turns out, I got lucky and it worked. The name suits the strain IMO - it's a true Cinderella Story." - MrSoul
"Jack Herer is an unstable strain bred from an unequal combination of Sk#1, NL#5, and Haze. Crossing a male and female Jack Herer creates an F2 generation which has a HUGE number of possible recombinations of the genes. I grew out some Jack Herer F2s and discovered a SPECIAL one, "Princess", which has many improvements on the original JH such as a shorter flowering time, denser bud structure and pineapple scent/flavour. I have been continually back crossing Princess with her male offspring (generation after generation) which eventually creates a stabilized strain having her special characteristics found reliably in most females grown from those seeds. Each generation is composed of a 50% genetic contribution from Princess (since she's the seed parent) and a 50% contribution from the pollen parent (which also has an increasing percentage of Princess' genetics with each generation). The progression goes: P.50, P.75, P.88, P.94, and P.97...at that point it's considered stabilized (a male and female P.97 can be crossed and the offspring are essentially the same as the parents). I have been VERY pleased with the way this project is going; even the P.75 generation was rather stable in the sense that the individuals were all rather uniform and HIGH quality. The P.88 seeds are available now, and the P.94 will be available around Christmas time. So, you see, since I have combined genes from Sk#1, NL#5, and Haze, creating a plant which has characteristics distinctly different than Jack Herer, and I'm creating a stable strain from this plant... it's legitimately MY work." - MrSoul
"I used Shiva Skunk from Sensi Seeds as a minor component in the development of Cinderella .... I crossed a fine female Shiva Skunk with a brother of Princess, then grew a male from those seeds to begin the cubing process with." - MrSoul
"C99 is has more of the Haze type of high because the mother (Princess), has that kind of high and each time I back-cross to her the next generation gets a bit more of it. Smoking PURE Princess buds is a bit scary...it's too "speedy" and paranoia-inducing for most people. But she's so RESINOUS (see photo) and her flavour is just so delicious and fruity that I knew back-crossing her to her offspring over several generations would create a strain which is actually BETTER than the original mother in terms of a more PLEASING high. It was successful beyond my expectations.
The progression I went through was:
P.50 = Princess/(ShivaSkunk/Princess'Brother)
P.75 = Princess/P.50
Cinderella 88 = Princess/P.75
Cinderella 99 = Princess/Cinderella 88
Each generation exhibited a MAJOR jump in potency (P.50 was rather mellow)...P.75 has a well-balanced body/mind high with a citrus flavour, Cinderella 88 is cerebral & paralyzing with a tropical fruit flavour, and Cinderella 99 is "TRIP WEED"...with more of the fruity flavour and speedy effect from Princess." - MrSoul
"Princess.75 finished outside in northern Kentucky Oct 15, (killer smoke!) The 99's should also, I would think. I do intend to find out! No mold and it was quite wet too." - 27yrs
"I grew out Cinderella 88 and in my experience the Great White Shark is a more interesting line although admittedly my luck with C88 was not the best. The one female I was vouchsafed grows more like a vine then a tree and is difficult to clone and cultivate. However the psychoactivity of the floral clusters is very intense and the stone is complex and very cerebral. This is a very potent plant, indeed. But if I didn't know it was Cindy, I confess I might have let this plant go a while ago. As it is I am trying to find ways to accommodate the plant's finickiness because of its lineage. But I wonder if the BG's cross between the original princess and a Green House male White Widow (Ice Princess) might not be a more propitious way of including Bg's Princess genetics in one's garden. The hybrid vigor that results from crossing two great plants of differing genetic backgrounds creates the best stock for cultivation, in my opinion." - Moose
"I want to comment that your result with the Cinderella 88 is NOT typical: I have grown an awful lot of them, and I have never seen one that was remotely "vine-like". They're usually Sativa-dominant hybrid phenotype with moderate leaf width, short & stocky stature, heavy branching, extremely high flower/leaf ratio and unparalleled resin production. The flowering plants smell like fruity cotton-candy. In my experience, they usually root through a 2 inch rockwool cube in 10 days...and I don't even use rooting hormones." -MrSoul
"Cinder: There's been a lot of talk about this strain. All I can say is that I'm very glad I grew this one. Fast, nice yields, great high. Harvested at 49 days--maybe even a little too long. While most really bite ya in the ass, the occasional bud out of my jar is simply wicked. I actually got lost a few blocks from my house--shit that hasn't happened in 10 years." - shaggy
"There are 10 C99's flowering at day 32 in the hydroponics online 2-liter bottle ebb-and flow system using GH nutes and Pure blend at about 1600 ppm(they could probably take more!!). I have to say these plants are unbelievable! The situation is that the buds are becoming too heavy for the branches, including some of the colas. It looks like some of the side buds will be scraping the floor by harvest!" - KGB
"I agree that c99 appears to be something special. Great resin production, great density at 28 days. Still no major odor(yet.) The thin leaves allow great light penetration. Sometime in the future I will do a whole garden of Cindy. What GH mix are you using on the c99 right now? She has been the most finicky feeder I've ever met." - kaka
"C-99 is very uniform. I have 4 females grown from seed that just finished their 4th week of flowering, and the only variation seems to be their height, the shortest being 3.5 feet and the tallest 4.5 feet, and all were topped once. They were started under a 400 watt MH for the first month and have been getting a full 12 hours per day of sunlight since then, and their cola's are HUGE. Wait'll you see how well they do under natural sunlight." - Rex Feral
"My estimate for Northern States would be early October. I have a friend who was growing it outdoors in Maine (48 degrees N?), it was about 3 weeks from finished in mid-September. Unfortunately, his outdoor grow was ripped off. If you're growing in an area prone to mold, you may have problems, but it's difficult to say because in the Northeast we don't have such a problem with mold. I can only tell you that the buds are DENSE (you HAVE seen the photos, haven't you?)...so it could be susceptible to mold." -MrSoul
"If its Fruit Punch that you want, you should check out "Cinderella 88"....I've smoked the mother that this is the backcross of, and YEEEEHAW she kicks ass. The smell is very similar to the Hawaiian... think back to when you (ok I) was a kid... remember Bubbalicious? Or Hubba Bubba chewing gum? Think about the tropical fruit flavor, and there ya go-- thats what it smells like... A sickly sweet fruit punch gum, a little undertone of "stink" to go with it. A first class high too... (Not to turn this into an advertisement, just a recommendation, but I've personally tried this strain and it will do it for you just like the Hawaiian)." - Shabang
"I'm kind of trying for either Kali Mist or their Himalayan Gold, essentially I'm looking for a badass sativa high that I can grow manageably indoors. -See if you can get Cinderella 88 from Mike at Weedseed. I've personally tried this smoke and it is the best, most lucid sativa high you could ask for. The breeder put a lot of time and talent into this one! Kumquat I do have 3 6' princess " crosses in my garden.
They are nothing like the j. herer growing with them, as someone mentioned...looks closer to Ncga's BW but with a more sativa look. The plants preflowered in early June which made it much easier to plan the garden spacing, although I had no idea these would get so tall. The secondary branching is quite thick and well developed with tight node spacing so looks to be a good yielder. It has handled our 100+ degree days w/o any problems, unlike the j. Herer (only minor probs with them) and even took on a Great Dane bending one over flat on the ground! It sprung right back after a bit of temporary splinting and bracing to be the fattest plant in the garden...which btw, includes most of the "hot" seedbank offerings of last year." - Desert Rat (a.k.a. M.G.)
"My head just turned full circle...This shit is good! I have to say to the brothers...Cinders passes the test with flying colours...the effect is very heady and almost hallucinogenic...very much like a potent version of silver pearl... with a smoother, fruitier taste and no nasty tickle at the back of the throat." - Mike
"I can only answer question #3 (Does it have as strong a sativa high as haze or Durban?)... WAY STRONGER!!! At least the sample of Cinderella 88 I had was. Very tight nugs too! It was grown indoors so I expect the outdoors to be even better (just the way it turns out for me). Very fruity, mellow hitting and easy to take in too much as it has a definite creep to it. The buzz is very sativa-ish and tends to make the mind wonder when trying to find something. But the energy to keep looking is there! I highly recommend it! But keep a bowl of some nice indica nearby to mellow it out! All above is strictly MHO and based on MY experience." - dead man talking a.k.a. M.G.
"The only person I know who has disliked Soul's weed is BB. Taste is a personal thing but I think we know that politics may have also played a role there. The buds of the ones I'm growing out are dense and sticky. The plants are a little small for my liking and probably won't make the grade, but it is obvious that it is high grade bud." - Vic High
"The princess I have smoked was indoor grown by a friend of mine. It is a VERY heavy sativa high bordering on paranoia at times. I found it's best when there's a bowl of a nice indica around to mellow out the edge. 3 tokes do the trick (it creeps up in about 15-20 minutes)! Very nice sweet, fruity flavor and tight nuggets. The plants I have growing outdoors in the hot desert are doing great. They have the typical sativa x-mas tree shape and very hardy. Planted 6 eggs, got 5 plants with 3 being female. It will become a permanent fixture in my garden!" - Desert Rat
"Remember that Cinderella (8 is a Sativa-dominant hybrid, so you can expect it to be a LITTLE "leggy" when grown from seed. However clones from a good mother will stay quite short - I flower 12" clones for 7 weeks in 2-gal containers of organic soil to produce a 2.5' plant which yields about 2 ounces. Yes, "crystal" production is AMAZING...the stalked resin glands appearing on bud leaves as early as 3 weeks of flowering look like white FUR!" - MrSoul
Cinderella 88: This strain is exactly what many people have been asking for. It is a Sativa-dominant strain which grows VERY well indoors, staying short and maturing as rapidly as an Indica, yet maintaining the fruity flavor and clear, soaring cerebral high of the best Sativas. The yield is well above average and her high flower/leaf ratio makes manicuring a breeze. The buds are dense, crystal-covered floral clusters shaped like braided hair. Pistil color ranges from snow white to yellow... these are PRETTY plants.
Flowering: 45-55 days
Height: 100 - 130 cm
Yield: 250 -300 gm/m2
Here you go, this (strains description) sums it up. anything else I could say about it would be irrelevent. it's my product and I am obviously biased, for good reason (it's a killer), we will let unbiased customers speak for our product. It's only been out a short while, so you will have to wait awhile for their opinions. Everyone who grows it will be extremely pleased. The high is truly an UP sativa high. It's so up it gives me the shakes for an hour or so after it, like I drank a whole pot of coffee. please feel free to relate any technical questions to the us at [email protected]. Brothers Grimm
Cinderella 99: This strain may be the "Holy Grail". The result of painstakingly back crossing a VERY RARE female to her male progeny over 3 generations. This hybrid was specifically bred for indoor cultivation. Short statured & heavily branched, this plant grows LONG, dense colas with an EXTREMELY high flower/leaf ratio and OUTRAGEOUS resin production. The breeder has observed a "giant leap" in potency with each progressive generation and, as expected, Cinderella 99 has topped all previous results -her high is heavily influenced by Haze; clear, energetic & devastatingly psychoactive. A plant with all of the above is rare enough, but Cinderella 99 finishes flowering after a scant 50 days of 12/12! Above average yields of crystal covered buds reeking of tropical fruit aromas can be harvested every other month once a mother plant is selected and asexually propagated. One final accolade - preliminary results from the breeder indicate Cinderella 99 will breed true... IMAGINE!
Flowering: 50 days
Height: 100 cm
Yield: 1-2lbs per 1000W lamp
MrSoul on Cinderella: Read up and post something if you want to comment or ask questions... later! Current crop is Jack Herer x Unknown (Nickname - Jack's Heir): Seeds - I bought a 2 gram bag of Jack Herer buds (1996 Cannabis Cup winner) in Amsterdam at "Sensi Smile" coffee shop on Achterburghwal straat. The buds were supposed to be sinsemilla, but I was pleasantly surprised to find about a dozen seeds in the bud. I found the high to be cerebral and energetic, but not too long lasting; the buds appeared almost white due to resin coating. Of the 6 seeds I attempted to germinate, every one was successful and I got a 50% male/female ratio.
Seedlings - Very consistent and uniform in looks and growth pattern (surprising since Jack Herer is a three-way hybrid itself). Rapid growers. Typical internodal spacing for a hybrid. Appearance shows signs of both Indica and Sativa heritage. Large, broad-bladed leaves, but lighter green in color than typical Indica. Somewhere in between stature.
Mother plants (J1 and J3) - Grow vigorously and bushy. J1 is the hardiest looking of the two females.
Father plants (J2 and J4) - Grow vigorously and bushy. J4 is the hardiest looking of the two males (surprisingly, this J4 grew from a seed I'd characterize as a "runt", about half the size of his siblings' seeds). Unfortunately all clones of J4 were lost and I have only a "decent" supply of pollen from his flowers.
Clones - Very quick to root (10-14 days) with a success rate of 90 to 100%. Several small, poorly rooted clones eventually came around and flowered nicely. Rooting occurs independent of the method used; RW cubes with pH 6 or 5.8, Rootone or not, seems to make little difference.
Flowering - Once rooted, the RW cube is buried up to its top in a 6 inch round pot of 50% perlite 50% Hyponex Professional Soil Mix, fertilized initially with Miracle Grow 15-30-15 at 1/2 tsp. per gallon of pH 6.5 water. Once looking well at 12cm tall, flowering is begun with a 12hr light/dark cycle. During the first week they "shoot" up 30 to 50cm with large fan leaves but suddenly look over-fertilized (Miracle Grow has urea-based nitrogen) with curling at the tips of the leaves. They respond virtually overnight to a good, thorough leaching with plain water, then they take on a dark green color and start to "bud out" rather than get taller. After the first week of flowering, feeding is switched to Schultz's Bloom 10-60-10 at 1/2 tsp. per gal of pH 6.5 water; I soak the pots and wait a couple days until they get light weight before the next good soaking. Flowers appear Sativa-like and extremely resinous, except that they continue to get progressively fatter and denser, much heavier buds than the Jack Herer itself. I would guess that the father of the seeds was a skunk or similar strain, since the calyx to leaf ratio is so high; the flowers just keep sprouting out in all directions from the bud with only tiny, resin coated leaflets interspersed between flower clusters. The leaves, all but the fan leaves, are covered in stalked resin glands from base to tip. Sample smoking of immature buds which were culled (tried to flower them in RW cubes but they died) after two or three weeks of flowering proved to have a sweet, skunky taste and produced a very "happy" high, not at all paranoia-inducing. The finished product should be excellent. Currently, I have several healthy, rapidly budding clones which are in their third week of flowering and they may well finish before their eighth week. The lowest four branches of one J1 clone were selectively pollinated using the J4 male's pollen and should yield roughly 50 seeds. My hope is that these seeds will produce plants with a great variety of fine characteristics. The outstanding gene pool should ensure that, inbreeding concerns aside. Then I'll have a great breeding project: trying to select individuals for future crosses which will incorporate the best characteristics of that diverse group.
Mr Soul's Princess .75
Written by Mr Soul and edited by Vic High
1. Princess was obtained from growing out seeds found in buds of Jack Herer which was purchased in Amsterdam at the "Sensi-Smile" coffee shop, an authorized outlet of Sensi Seed Bank. Thus, it is considered to be an f2 generation Jack Herer. The seeds were found only in the deepest part of the buds indicating that the father was an unusually early-maturing Jack Herer that the growers missed at first.
2. Princess smells very much like pineapple both during flowering and when dried, but there's this "evil" scent in it too, like rotting meat, which has been linked with the most devastating weed (notably the Durban/Thai hybrid from SSSC, years ago). The taste is connoisseur quality when it's cured; VERY fruity. The high is almost too intense for a lot of people; Dr. Atomic actually refused to smoke any on our second meeting, after getting rather "hazed and confused" on the first sampling we did together a couple of weeks before, so he decided to try Shiva Skunk and found that more mellow and to his liking. Two hits of Princess will induce your body to tremble involuntarily and your heart to race and paranoid thoughts... very much like Haze, but not quite as intense. It also has a "creeper" quality that makes it easy to over-indulge...you get progressively higher during the first 10 minutes after smoking. Look at the May '98 issue of High Times' centerfold and find "Yellow Cab"...that's EXACTLY what the finished Princess buds look like. The "frosting" of stalked, capitate trichomes on the flowers and smaller leaves gives them a "furry" appearance much like Haze.
3. Princess grow vigorously, and is rapidly-maturing... 6 to 7 weeks of 12/12. It feeds heavily and requires about 50% stronger nutrient solution than an Indica does. It stays short, for a Sativa-dominant strain, and finishes at about 3 ft indoors. The yield from such a plant is about 20 grams.
4. Mr Soul has been "cubing" the clone of Princess so the seedline will be Princess. The father is Shiva Skunk. He is currently growing out Princess.75 to obtain males for the creation of Princess.88. Seeds of the 0.88 generation will be ready by mid-July and should produce excellent plants, albeit not perfectly stable yet...but nearly. He plans to back-cross once more after that to arrive at 0.94 Princess genetics, which should be a stable, true-breeding seedline with females "replicating" Princess reliably.
5. This strain is exactly what most people believe doesn't exist; a Sativa which grows VERY well indoors, stays short, and matures as rapidly as an Indica (faster than many), and has the great KILLER Sativa high/flavor. The yield is fine too. Mr Soul finds that the Indica strains are too leafy/stalky and much goes to waste with them, whereas Princess has an extremely high flower/leaf ratio and therefore almost no waste.
Allow me to explain. Jack Herer is an unstable strain bred from an unequal combination of Sk#1, NL#5, and Haze. Crossing a male and female Jack Herer creates an F2 generation which has a HUGE number of possible recombinations of the genes. I grew out some Jack Herer F2's and discovered a SPECIAL one, "Princess", which has many improvements on the original JH such as a shorter flowering time, denser bud structure and pineapple scent/flavour. I have been continually back crossing Princess with her male offspring (generation after generation) which eventually creates a stabilized strain having her special characteristics found reliably in most females grown from those seeds. Each generation is composed of a 50% genetic contribution from Princess (since she's the seed parent) and a 50% contribution from the pollen parent (which also has an increasing percentage of Princess' genetics with each generation). The progression goes: P.50, P.75, P.88, P.94, and P.97...at that point it's considered stabilized (a male and female P.97 can be crossed and the offspring are essentially the same as the parents). I have been VERY pleased with the way this project is going; even the P.75 generation was rather stable in the sense that the individuals were all rather uniform and HIGH quality. The P.88 seeds are available now, and the P.94 will be available around Christmas time. So, you see, since I have combined genes from Sk#1, NL#5, and Haze, creating a plant which has characteristics distinctly different than Jack Herer, and I'm creating a stable strain from this plant... it's legitimately MY work. MrSoul
"Princess" is a female which resulted from a seed found in a Jack Herer bud I bought in Amsterdam near the Sensi Seed Bank at "Coffeeshop Sensi Smile". The bud came in a 2gm cello-pack with the Sensi logo; I expected sinsemilla, but it had about 10 seeds so I assume she's an F2 JH. Her characteristics were so fine I wanted to create seeds that would "replicate" this plant. She has the KILLER Haze-influenced high with the most DELICIOUS pineapple/evil scent, 50 day maturation in 12/12, and incredible resin production, doesn't stretch - yet clearly Sativa-dominant! Last but not least: Never a hint of hermaphrodism after 2 years of cloning & many different styles of grow. I wanted to "cube" Princess but add a little beef to her branches because the buds were always too heavy at harvest and branches needed staking to keep from flopping over. I crossed my ShivaSkunk female with one of the males from the same group of seeds that Princess came from. THIS cross produced a male which was then crossed to Princess, creating "P.50" (using a shorthand notation I developed to indicate the fraction of Princess genes in the cross). Each generation is the result of crossing a male from the previous generation to Princess herself (incestuous, I know). Blow-by-blow description of the generations:
P.50 = Heavy, single-cola type plants with mellow high (too much influence from the ShivaSkunk) Sweet fruity scent/flavour. Unstable in most traits - for example, 10 days difference in fastest/slowest maturation period in a group of 20 seedlings.
P.75 = Plants leaning MUCH more in the direction of Princess in floral cluster and bud structure, scent/flavour turned more "tropical" like pineapple. The stability was becoming better - two major phenotypes; short & dense (potent too) or tall/HUGE (Not so potent).
P.88 = Renamed Cinderella 88 when first released on the market. It grows fast and produces excellent yields of FROSTY buds in 7 weeks! Generally uniform seedlings with minor differences in floral formation and some height variance, but the smoke is quite consistent from all plants - Dense, heavy nuggets of fruity scented & flavoured (like wild berries) and covered in resin glands, the dried buds have distinctly ORANGE pistils. And now P.94 = Cinderella 99. This project has been a huge success. The strain has been embraced by the "net"work of growers with rave reviews. The Bros Grimm too have been recognized for their excellent combination of quality products and unparalleled service after the sale. There's NO OTHER seed bank that has it's breeders on the net answering questions from "newbies" 40 hours/week, and the info is first-rate; even details of their breeding strategies are openly discussed so that the seed buyer can feel well-informed about the products BG offer. I personally think the plants these Cinderella 99 seeds produce are every bit as good as a cutting from Princess herself (or better). I say better because the flavour of no two plants is "identical"; there's a personality to all living things. Like Princess herself, Cinderella is sweet & fruity to the palette and nose, and when you take a hit you're BLASTED...with the same "racy" high as Princess! The improvement comes in the yield department; 25% greater yield and a stronger branch structure, which I accomplished by starting with some ShivaSkunk genes in the original father in the cubing process. I knew I'd blend out the majority of the traits from ShivaSkunk in the cubing process, but I was hoping to incorporate the ShivaSkunk's stronger branches because Princess had a tendency to need supports in the final two weeks of flowering. As it turns out, I got lucky and it worked. The name suits the strain IMO -it's a true "Cinderella Story". MrSoul
(How good is Cinderella?) It's short, FAST, RESINOUS and HEAVY - the buds are definitely ready @ 7 weeks just as advertised. My yields are well above a pound per 1000W lamp. I grow in 2 gallon pots of organic soil and each 2.5-foot-tall plant produces from 1.5 to 4 ounces depending on how it's pruned (Single Cola vs. Bush). I usually mix some "bushes" and some "single cola" clones to make up a crop. This method yields about 1.5 ounces per square foot, but that's less than the maximum possible. The resin production is FANTASTIC... looks like the photos of White Widow, but the high is much more cerebral. The flavour is SWEET! My flowering room smells like a fruit stand after the first 3 weeks of 12/12. I've found that the C-88 females are all excellent but there's always one or two BEST. The C-99 females are more uniform - each one's like the BEST of the C-88's. This makes sense when you recognize that C-99 is the result of back crossing C-88 to "Princess". I should be able to report on how "true breeding" Cinderella 99 is sometime this Summer when I've tested enough of them. MrSoul
Remember that Cinderella is a Sativa-dominant hybrid, so you can expect it to be a LITTLE "leggy" when grown from seed. However clones from a good mother will stay quite short - I flower 12" clones for 7 weeks in 2-gal containers of organic soil to produce a 2.5' plant which yields about 2 ounces. Yes, "crystal" production is AMAZING...the stalked resin glands appearing on bud leaves as early as 3 weeks of flowering look like white FUR! SOG Methods produce plants which yield about a quarter ounce each, in most cases I never advocate more than one plant per square foot. A plant such as I described requires more like 2 square feet. So four such plants would FIT in your 3'x3' area but using a 400W lamp means a MUCH smaller yield - my data is for growing under a 1000W. Many people forget that yield is HEAVILY dependant on lighting used. Topping/pruning the plants to four main colas has optimized yield/plant for me -keep the number of branches on each plant down to 4-6 for best results. MrSoul
I'd personally advise you to "top" the C-99's at their 4th branch set (about 3-4 weeks old) then when the branches grow to be about a foot long (about 6-8 weeks old) you should flower them. You'll know which plants are female BEFORE you ever switch the light cycle to 12/12. Cinderella plants always show preflowers at the 5-7 branch sets during the VEGETATIVE stage... when they're a little over a month old. Mr Soul
I get my best yield by pruning the plants to 2 main colas. I compared single-cola, double-cola, quadruple-cola & mulitiple-cola "bushes" to elavuate their yield per area. I found that the bushes could yield as much as 5 ounces but took up the same space as 4 single-cola plants, which yield about 1.5 ounces each. The double-cola plants yield 2 ounces each and take up the SAME space as a single-cola plant. The 4-cola plants took up about 1.5 times the space, but didn't yield enough to make up for it. ALSO... the colas are MUCH more impressive on the single & double cola plants! I just realized I forgot to answer parts of your question in my "excitement". 1. Flowering time was 7 weeks of 12/12. 2. Flowered at 2 feet tall & finished at 3 feet tall. MrSoul
I find 4 colas per plant to be optimal. Sly
It will help pack on the resin glands if you let her sit in the dark for 2-3 days and let the soil dry out before cutting her down. Kinda like making go back to scrubbing floors for a few days until the Prince comes 'round with the glass slipper...LOL! MrSoul
I'm just finishing a crop of Cinderella 88 and from 7 plants there are 6 that are virtually identical. They are 3 foot tall plants grown from seed with 8 weeks of 18/6 veg and now 6 weeks into 12/12 (no more than 10 days to go). Each plant is BRISTLING with resin and their colas are the size of 2 beer cans taped together lengthwise. The high from this strain is decidedly "Sativa" with a great charge of energy and much thought provocation. The "odd" seventh plant is equally resinous as the others but skinny compared to them, so my advice is to keep the shorter plants that result from a batch of seeds and you'll be VERY happy. See the link for a description...but expect higher yields than claimed. MrSoul
You say Cinderella 88 and Apollo have been vegging for 46 days and you don't yet know their sex?... that's because you haven't LOOKED! Look carefully at the internodes above the first 4-6 branch sites & you'll see preflowers that will be either male (football shaped pods) or female (pear-shaped with two white pistils sticking out like a peace sign). These will tell you the gender of all the plants at their present stage of development. There won't be any plants which have BOTH... I've never gotten a hermaphrodite. DO NOT switch the lights to 12/12 and back again...it's a waste of time and a source of stress to the plants. Just take a clone from each female and any males you want to use for breeding BEFORE you go to flowering. Keep the clones in vegetative state under fluorescents while the flowering crop is going. About 3 weeks before the flowering plants are finished, the clones will be rooted and have grown enough to take a couple clones from each clone -These clones will be your next crop! At 18" tall, the seedlings are ALREADY big enough to flower; you'll probably get a few Cinderellas that go over 3 feet tall; the Apollos will be even taller...but still under 4 feet. The two strains have the same father, but different mothers. Crossing Cinderella and Apollo will be interesting... you'll get good plants, but a bit of variety... some will grow compact and dense & smell sweet & fruity like Cinderella and some will be big lemony/spicey monsters like Apollo. Probably lots of "mixed" phenotypes as well. I'm SURE you'll enjoy growing them & the produce will BLOW YOU AWAY! MrSoul
I ALWAYS see preflowers between the age of 4 and 6 weeks. Node 6 is commonly where they start, so I'd say you're probably seeing them. The plants that show first are usually males. Look over each plant carefully, using a loupe. If you see a preflower at such an early age, it'll most likely be male, but be SURE before culling it. If you can't find a preflower on a plant, while most of the others HAVE shown... it's most likely a female. Isn't that uniformity NICE? Cinderella 99 is a STABLE strain. Cinderella 88 was close, but this generation is there. MrSoul
(Cinderella needs odor control?) I don't know if it helps you, but the scent is very sweet & fruity. It won't "fool" anyone who's familiar with MJ, but the average person might not recognize the scent as pot. They start to smell after 3 weeks of 12/12 and they're harvested 4 weeks later, so the SHORT flowering cycle helps a bit by lessening the amount of time your garden "stinks". Yields are highly dependant on the methods used. Pruning style and number of plants/area make a BIG difference. I get about 2 lbs every 50 days under 2kW. I grow a combination of bushes & single-cola clones (about 12-20 of 'em) in 2 gallon pots of organic soil, feeding them "teas" of dissolved worm castings, PSG, high phosphorus bat guano and kelp meal. My yields are average at best. Professional growers write me saying they get 2lbs/kW, which I'm sure is true. MrSoul
The scent given off by Cinderella is NOT the typical "pot stench"...not at all skunky -she's sweet & fruity. Someone passing by the flowering room MIGHT not recognize the scent as pot & mistake it for tropical flowers. When you rub the resin you can definitely smell it. C-99 is more "psychedelic"... I think that's what you're looking for eh? Just be sure to smoke a LITTLE, wait 10 minutes, then think about whether or not you need any more...it's easy to over-indulge & become paranoid.
MrSoul
Haze is my favourite high. Very "trippy" C-99 is has more of the Haze type of high because the mother (Princess), has that kind of high and each time I back-cross to her the next generation gets a bit more of it. Smoking PURE Princess buds is a bit scary... it's too "speedy" and paranoia-inducing for most people. But she's so RESINOUS (see photo) and her flavour is just so delicious and fruity that I knew back-crossing her to her offspring over several generations would create a strain which is actually BETTER than the original mother in terms of a more PLEASING high. It was successful beyond my expectations.
The progression I went through was:
P.50 = Princess/(ShivaSkunk/Princess'Brother)
P.75 = Princess/P.50
Cinderella 88 = Princess/P.75
Cinderella 99 = Princess/Cinderella 88
Each generation exhibited a MAJOR jump in potency: P.50 was rather mellow, P.75 has a well-balanced body/mind high with a citrus flavour, Cinderella 88 is cerebral & paralyzing with a tropical fruit flavour, and Cinderella 99 is "TRIP WEED" with more of the fruity flavour and speedy effect from Princess. MrSoul
C-99 will be a bigger yielder and faster finisher (than D/T) - which I personally think makes more sense to begin a grow with. If you're growing under 1000W lamps, you should easily get a pound of C-99 per lamp after a 7 week flowering period. When you have all the weed you need and can take your time waiting for a long-flowering Sativa, THEN start those "extra" beans (included in your order)... I don't know what the Bros Grimm sent you, but it's NOT Durban/Thai. I'm still developing it, so they won't see it for about 6 months. MrSoul
Thanks for noticing her -she IS beautiful! Cafe'Girl is a sister of "Princess" - Princess is the mother of the Cinderella series. Cafe'Girl smells like a combination of ginger, orange and cream... kinda smells like a "Creamsicle" -you know those ice cream bars? She has the highest YIELD of the 3 Sisters (Princess, Genius and Cafe'Girl). Cafe'Girl makes HUGE, DENSE, SPARKLING buds with a lovely high. A really sweet high, in that you never feel paranoid & it continues to "creep up" over the first 15 minutes after you smoke, leaving you feeling warm and at peace with life. Bros Grimm may offer an hybrid of Cafe'Girl when enough testing of her offspring has been completed. MrSoul
Sure, I'd be glad to answer your q's:
1. I flower clones when they're about a foot tall & they double in height during flowering.
2. They clone SUPER EASY.
3. Crossing Cindy 88's will you a variety of phenotypes... they're not stable. Cindy 99 IS STABLE.
4. The seeds are small, tan in colour and "speckled" not striped. If you ordered from either Bros.Grimm or Heaven's Stairway you WON'T get ripped off...but I'll describe the plants: As seedlings they're fast-growing, Indica-dominant with fairly wide leaves. They show preflowers @ 5-6 weeks old WITHOUT FAIL. They NEVER herm, so if the preflowers have pistils, it's FEMALE forever. They flower RAPIDLY - you probably won't believe how fat and dense and frosty they'll be @ 4-5 weeks 12/12. The flower/leaf is EXTREMELY high; the tops of the colas go NUTS at about 5 weeks into flowering, sending braid-like floral cluster projections out in all directions without any leaves. Just before that happens, hundreds of SNOW WHITE pistils make the tip of the colas look like they're wearing fur caps! The resin production is HEAVY (again, you won't believe it), a HEAVENLY scent of tropical fruit & berries begins to fill the room @ 3 weeks of 12/12 and just keeps getting more overpowering 'til they're done. The finished smoke is the type of high that keeps you UP; it's very cerebral - the only body effect is the "jitters". I certainly wouldn't recommend it to anyone looking to "mellow out" on the sofa, BUT if you wanted to smoke before going running or cycling - PERFECT! I smoked C-88 one eve after trying Silver Haze and the C-88 buzz cut RIGHT THROUGH the high of the Haze so badly that my wife asked me, "what did you do?... smoke too much?" The flavour is just like the scent; fruity & sweet...not at all hashy (not that there's anything WRONG with that!...heehee. MrSoul
Outdoors, Apollo 13 and Cinderella 88 will finish before October 15th at 43 degrees north lattitude. MrSoul
If you liked NL#5/Haze, you'll like C-99 too. It's got a sweet, fruity taste and some of that "paranoia inducing" effect, very cerebral and speedy. The major advantages of C-99 over the old Haze x NL#5 from the original Seed Bank are rapid maturation & bigger yield. The highs and flavours are "different" but in the same class. MrSoul
If it's Fruit Punch that you want, you should check out Cinderella 88. I've smoked the mother that this is the backcross of, and YEEEEHAW she kicks ass. The smell is very similar to the Hawaiian... think back to when you (ok I) was a kid... remember Bubbalicious? Or Hubba Bubba chewing gum? Think about the tropical fruit flavor, and there ya go -- that's what it smells like... A sickly sweet fruit punch gum, a little undertone of "stink" to go with it. A first class high too... (Not to turn this into an advertisement, just a recommendation, but I've personally tried this strain and it will do it for you just like the Hawaiian). ~shabang~
I'm kinda trying for either Kali Mist or their Himalayan Gold, essentially I'm looking for a badass sativa high that I can grow manageably indoors. -See if you can get Cinderella 88 from Mike at Weedseed. I've personally tried this smoke and it is the best, most lucid sativa high you could ask for. The breeder put alot of time and talent into this one! Kumquat
Stoney, get your grubby lil hands on some Cinderella 88 from mike at Weedseed.com You will not be sorry, but it might get you too high! The buds are dense and saturated with crystals making it appear white. The aroma of these cured buds is fruity, like a ripe pineapple. Hits from a pipe super smooth. I only smoke 5 or 6 calyx flowers per session. I know one local friend who will attempt 3 or 4 hits, but later on he's got 2 cigarettes lit in his mouth and he doesn't even know it! This bud is getting rave reviews from some of the professionals at cannabis.com and a few other private places. Kumquat
I have not grown this weed, rather some nice size nugs were donated to me for evaluation purposes. I have actually designed a special mini-hitter pipe just for this breed. I only smoke it 5 or 6 calyxes at a time, that's why I came up with my special tool. I find that black cherry wood hits the smoothest. Would the Bros Grimm like to include this special hitter with every seed order? Kumquat
If you are looking for a very very good sativa buzz, get some Cinderella99 or 88 seeds! otherwise you're prolly better off trading with people and doing your own breeding and growouts of seedstock, looking for the perfect mom(s). Try smoke testing males before breeding them. Try not to rely on just one male to do all the work. Use the top 5 or 10% of your males. Combine their pollens and use that on your honeys. Kumquat
kumquat- you designed a special pipe for it LOL send me a little info to the above addy, thanks. it really is a one hit wonder. it's also a creeper. people, myself included, have a tendency to smoke several hits because it's so sweet. 10 minutes later your way too high and completely incapacitated. I'm really looking forward to other peoples results. do you get that same jittery up high? Bros Grimm
My head just turned full circle...This shit is good! I have to say to the brothers... Cinders passess the test with flying colours... the effect is very heady and almost hallucinogenic... very much like a potent version of Silver Pearl... with a smoother, fruitier taste and no nasty tickle at the back of the throat. Mike
Smoked some Princess hahaha swag weed, I smoked some that was sent in seed to someone else I know... he grew it out and asked me my opinion of it... this was even BEFORE I knew it was the "famous" Princess.. well I rated it a 6.5 and that was being very generous... the buds did not form tight... it looked like your basic swag... and a waste of time. What else can I say about it... grow it yourself and find out. Bongblaster
Well I have smoked both Souls and Vics stuff. I wasnt too impressed with Souls (nothing against Soul here, just the way I see it) it could have been the conditions it was grown under but for me it didnt have the potency, they required a high lumen count as compared to Vics which did very well under low light conditions. Vic has let me sample some really deadly herbs that hes done, some have been so so but on the majority all have been something I would grow, commercially or as a closet operation. Bongblaster
ya I tasted this same stuff bong is reffering to when soul was down, I personally couldnt believe it merited an 8.5, I would have said a 5 or 6, really gorgeus stuff from the photographs I saw, but the strength and flavour was seriously lacking, id be interested to see what souls stuff tastes like now that hes switched to organics, because my main complaint about it was the harsh chemical taste im not positive if it was simply his technique, or bad genetics, but I was thouraghly unimpressed. Darkstar
The only person I know who has disliked Soul's weed is BB. Taste is a personal thing but I think we know that politics may have also played a role there. The buds of the ones I'm growing out are dense and sticky. The plants are a little small for my liking and probably won't make the grade, but it is obvious that it is high grade bud. Vic High
I do have 3 6' Princess "x"s in my garden. They are nothing like the Jack Herer growing with them, as someone mentioned... looks closer to NCGA's BW but with a more sativa look. The plants preflowered in early june which made it much easier to plan the garden spacing, although I had no idea these would get so tall. The secondary branching is quite thick and well developed with tight node spacing so looks to be a good yielder. It has handled our 100+ degree days w/o any problems, unlike the Jack Herer (only minor probs with them) and even took on a great dane bending one over flat on the ground! it sprung right back after a bit of temporary splinting and bracing to be the fattest plant in the garden... which btw, includes most of the "hot" seedbank offerings of last year. m.g.
The Princess I have smoked was indoor grown by a friend of mine. It is a VERY heavy sativa high bordering on paranoia at times. I found it's best when there's a bowl of a nice indica around to mellow out the edge. 3 tokes does the trick (it creeps up in about 15-20 minutes)! Very nice sweet, fruity flavor and tight nuggets. The plants I have growing outdoors in the hot desert are doing great. They have the typical sativa x-mas tree shape and very hardy. Planted 6 eggs, got 5 plants with 3 being female. It will become a permanent fixture in my garden! m.g.
The Princess .75 samples I have smoked ARE QUITE GOOD! the taste is very smooth and fruity and the buzz is a VERY HEAVY SATIVA-TYPE buzz (easy to take too much!). I have posted many times on many sites about my experiences with the strain so here's one more... grow it! it is well worth the time/space in your gardens and you won't find a heavier sativa around. 2 tokes, wait 20 minutes and just try to find what you're looking for... hehehe! the taste is unique also. Nothing like the Jack Herer I've heard comparisons to and nothing like any other I have personally known. m.g.
Sorry to say to both of you... the Princess I've smoked is top-notch. 2 hits is perfect but due to its smooth taste and cool smoke, it's way too easy to take too much. It's a VERY HEAVY sativa high that lasts way too long but can be controled with some nice indica to help bring one down. I'm growing it outdoors, have had many indoor samples dropped off so I feel qualified to say..."it kicks ass!" just be a bit wary with it. It's easy to take in too much but can be controled with an anti-sativa... the yields are superb, the buzz could be a bit mellower for my taste but all in all, there's not anything I've seen out there that can touch it!...'cept maybe the old-style, pure Haze. Harvester
I can only answer question #3 (Does it have as strong a sativa high as Haze or Durban?)... WAY STRONGER! at least the sample of Cinderella 88 I had was. Very tight nugs too! It was grown indoors so I expect the outdoors to be even better (just the way it turns out for me). Very fruity, mellow hitting and easy to take in too much as it has a definite creep to it. The buzz is very sativa-ish and tends to make the mind wonder when trying to find something. But the energy to keep looking is there! I highly recommend it! But keep a bowl of some nice indica nearby to mellow it out! All above is strictly MHO and based on MY experience. Dead Man Talking
I'm growing it now, it's a beautiful fast growing plant. Very exotic sativa leaves. It has outgrown regenerated White Widow and away White Widow and Northern Lights. I can tell this will be my favorite. Chango
I would look for diverse varieties, and not have them taste alike. By getting white rhino and white kush you are getting two varieties that contains 50% White Widow, and will be very similar. For variety choose from opposite ends of the spectrum and you can always crossbreed from them to make many variation that meet somewhere in the middle. I like the bros grimm strains a lot. Apollo 13 is done fast, it has red /orange colored buds that look good and it has a great high. The Cinderella has a sweeter taste that everyone likes but it takes a week or two longer than Apollo. Chango
I'm on my second crop with Princess. Mr Soul was kind enough to send me some demo seeds and possibly the prototype for Cinderella 88, I don't know about that. They have a nice sativa look. 2 of my 4 females were decent size light green with frosty pinkish yellow buds. The pineapple smell was terrific mixed with a peppery smell. These were smaller yielders. The other two must have taken after the mother plant, Princess. They were huge, and kong like in appearance. Their weight tripled the other two. I recommend it to anyone. IMO it is better than White Widow. I'm just starting a Blueberry order and they are kinda weak in this first few days. I have read that they start slow and finish with a bang! Abbie Hoffman
I grew Cinderella and White Widow side by side. Cindy was the best and the widow got the axe
[FONT=verdana, arial, helvetica][FONT=verdana, arial, helvetica]Hi Abby soul and I have been experimenting with letting both strains go for an extra week (8 weeks) lately and I find that it tones the the c/88 down a little. It's just too jittery for me and I normally like the up, sativa highs better that the indicas. I can't even smoke the original pure Princess mom, it just wires me out too much. 2 hits and I feel like I just chugged a whole pot of coffee. Sly
Strawberry Blonde is an interesting novelty, but it can't touch a good Haze or the Cinderella 88. I've smoked all three. Budder
The happy day is here! Thanks to my brothers and sisters out there (you know who you are!) the genetics are the BEST I have ever seen! BRAVO! Princess.75 this one blows away every thing else in the grow for taste/high! The buds are hard, dark green with amber to cream hairs and does she shine with huge trochomes in the light! The center cola is the diameter of a beer can, about 11 in long, this babe is going to turn heads! The high is best left to abusive smokers (like me!), the classic "3 shots of tequila after a large spaghetti dinner" gut rush, then a grin (sometimes drooling!) that lasts for hours! The smell is fruity (pineapple) with a touch of "rotten meat" in the background. This ones MY stash! Greenbear
P.75 (petite): at 3 1/2 ft. about half the yield (best guess) compared to the gross phenotype P.75, but at least twice as many trichomes! Tight and very heavy dark green buds, about 35% hairs have turned orange. The smell is the fruity/floral with rotten meat overtones. A top 5% plant (or higher!). P.75 x BigBud: (I thought it was WW) Massive buds compared to P.75, but twice as many leaves on the bud, also not as tight as P.75. But it does have whorled braid like clusters growing out of the central bud like P.75. Buds are a lighter green with white. P.75 x California Indica: 1/2 have a single main cola with a clubed shaped top, the other 1/2 have multi nodes with "fox tail" buds. Both types have outstanding trichome production and both have tight, dark green buds with white hairs. The smell of the club shaped type is very sweet and fruity, the "fox tail" type is much more floral, not sweet at all. No samples have been tried. Greenbear
I've grown the Great White Shark and would advise getting it to any grower. A very nice smoke! I have not had the pleasure of growing GrimWhiteShark but everything I have gotten from BG has been WONDERFUL! I would say either Greenhouse or BG would be a fine addtion to your grow. PS--you really HAVE to try the Cinderella line (.88 or .99) from BG! Its my FAVE! Up high, fruity/citrusy taste, and the fastest sativa (48-52 days 12/12!) I've ever seen! Greenbear
The C.88 has 2 major types a tall and a short. The tall gets to about 5 feet, the short about 3 feet grown in organic soil mix in 4 gal pots. The C.99 is very uniform, about 3 feet. The Cinderella line likes LOTS of light, and more N in flower than most other breeds. I grew them without any training to observe the unaltered plant (and didn't get as much as if I had trained them). I bet you could weave the tall C.88 all around a SCRog set up, every time I bend over a plant to fill a space in the garden it gets NICE colas all along the plant, the point of SCRog ! The C.88 tall has a "Lemon Nestea" smell and taste and great high (don't expect to go to sleep after smoking some, this applies to the entire Cindy line!) The C.88 short smells like Fruit Loops cereal, when it's curing it smells like a day old fruit salad! This was the fave of everyone I have smoked it with. The C.99 is even more potent than the C.88, almost psychadelic! The smell and taste are, well I guess Hi-C Tropical punch describes it best. Greenbear
My faves: #1-C.88 Brothers Grimm #2-Lemonaid: a hybrid of Romberry and AK-47, you'll have to make them yourself #3-Romberry BCGA #4-P.75 Bros. Grimm (not available) C-99 -this is THE sh#t, they are my next objective! Greenbear
Because of a space problem (not enough!) I have 3 C-88's still in a 1 kw veg. One is now over 3 feet tall in a 3 gal. pot! I haven't topped any of these as I want to check out the 3 different phynotypes, one tall, one medium and one short. The shorty is WIDER than she is tall, she's over 2 foot wideand getting wider as I type! The medium makes up 50% of the C-88's I have, she's at about 2 feet, she reminds me of the one P.75 that I had last time. The tall looks like a Haze or Thai, long internodes etc. I'm hoping that all the phenotypes have the fast flowering gene in 'em! I'll let ya know. Greenbear
Go for any of the Cinderella line, the C88 is more variable but the two main phenotypes (a tall and a short) BOTH kick. The C99 has little variation and an UP UP UP high, smells like day old fruit salad when you cure her right, 46 days 12/12, the fastest sativa I have EVER seen. Mzzmo has it right on the ferts, the C line likes a lot more N during flower than anything else I've done(5-1-1 ferts work well -STAY AWAY from anything with UREA as a N sorce it causes the smoke to be harsh and takes FOREVER to cure out!), and she is a Mg hog during her entire life. Cindy likes LOTS of light, the more the better. Top after the 7th node and train the 4 branches to form an X, I think you will be happy with the results. Greenbear
Well so far so good I have only the Apollo but I have tried the Cinderella genetics line and its very good, Apollo has a few of the same genetics in her too, I myself havent growen her out, but have tried both sides of her lineage and they are world class to say the least. Flavor is fruity and pungent odor are enough to get you high. I love the crystaly sizzle of the massive resin glands frying in the glass bong! Yes you cant go wrong with either of these strains. I have been burning alot for along time and this is one of, if not the tastiest herbs lineage I have ever tried. The potency is very high, but be warned this is not a Indica high it is sutble and introspective gets your greymatter tweeking down to the very cerebral core...then you think I can have another, maby one more... then you look around and are going shit, oh man how did I get this high it sneaks up on you under the guise of the fruity flavor and WHAM you stoned to the bone. Get em both you cant go wrong. The price is right. Webfish179
Here we go...20 tried 20 germed 16 of em females. I started out organic went hydro for 30 days, nuked em with nutrients and went back to dirt. Timing was just as the Bros. Said 7 weeks and they were ready. Tried 6 C-88 6 A13 and 8 I/O mix. I flowered em at 14 to 18 inches and they finished at 3 feet. All the I/O seemed to be a close variation to Cinderella and Apollo. I grow for myself so I don't have a means to weigh but guesstimates would be just under a oz. for the Cinders and well over for the Apollo. First try at something good and I tried to do everything to em you probably shouldn't and they still made it. Finished em with Fox Farms big bloom. 2 400w lights one of each. The Cinderella is my favorite, one good toke is like taking a couple of hits of speed. Great smoke for first thing in the morning if you don't over do it. A thinking mans buzz. Nice smooth expands in your lungs, reminds me of some fine red lebanese hash I smoked in Germany twenty years ago. The Apollo was a little too much for me. It has a slight flavor of the Cinderella but is not as smooth and a knock down stone. My lips got numb for about an hour after I smoked it. The high lasted all night and I swear I felt hung over the next day. I won't smoke it again, I don't enjoy being devastated by a bowl of weed. I bred every plant with a fine C-88 male and will try a few with the bros. Green Giant I just started. Looking forward to the cubed Princess next month although I don't know how it could be any better than the C-88. She'll be a staple in my grow for years to come. Without a doubt some of the finest smoke I've ever had. I thought 8.50 seemed pretty steep for a seed but they were well worth it. I would bet if someone were to get the Bros. I/O 40 for 50 they would get more than a few Cinderella variations worth growing out. Thanks Soul and Sly! Frank
Hey Cha Cal, thanks for your kind words, people like yourself made that report possible. I am hoping my spammy nature isn't taken the wrong way, it is only my experience and being my first real attempt I am quite satisfied with the results. The Princess' high IMHO is much like the bros description although I consider myself a lightweight and don't like to overindulge to the trembling point. I like a high that is somewhat productive like C-88 compared to Apollo which in my opinion was like getting hit over the head with a sledge hammer. I drove and had no problems maintaining my composure with the Princess, although I've witnessed friends who just have to finish the whole bowl themselves sit there trembling for about an hour after their first few hits. All things in moderation. Coming down was gradual, she just kind of wears down after a few hours and I'm ready to toke again. Really clear cerebral high, maybe a few tingles here and there physically but mostly a thinking high. Frank
What do your friends think of the A13? Is the high relaxing or crippling? Besides being a "lightweight" would you consider it a good end of the day/after dinner smoke? C-88 is definitely one I must get but from what I understand I would think of it as a "party on the weekend with friends" type of smoke. Watty Watts
Cinderella is definitely one to enjoy with friends. IMO Cinder was a relaxing high compared to Apollo. Apollo is a knock down stone that left me looking to come down from it. It is just too intense kinda like the one type of weed you would stash away and pull out when you want to impress your friends with because it is so devastating. I didn't say Cinderella was a lightweight, I said I am. It is a great afterdinner smoke if you don't over do it. It kind of reminded me of smoking Thai in the 70's -clear cerebral energetic with one fine flavor of hashish. Really smooth smoke but it can knock you out like the Apollo if you over do it. Definitely worth your time to check out. Frank
I want to talk about the Cinderella 88 high as it so awesome and complex compared to most of the sledge hammer couch lock stones you get from most street weed thats gone so much longer for better yields. I take one good draw on my glass pipe and all I can smell as I exhale is the sweet smell of hashish, similar to a red or blonde picked up by the hundred gram plates covered with a silk bag in Frankfurt about twenty years back while giving Uncle Sam a few years of my life in Germany. This high is immediate it slowly swells your brain as your thoughts start to race and your senses become so keen. I can feel my eye start twitching and completely tune into it. With the proper focus you can really get something done while high on C-88 but it's also ok to just sit at the keyboard pecking away trying to explain something to someone who knows exactly what you mean if they've been there before themselves. I don't find this high the least bit paranoid as I have read by others although I haven't pushed it to a point where I don't enjoy it yet. The Apollo is another story, I got paranoid within minutes of smoking it and was so stoned I couldn't think straight for about an hour or two. IMO this is the best high I've had in twenty years or more. Just the ramblings of a fellow stoner trying to share the reward of my efforts and all of yours who helped with the newbie type questions. It is a great time to be able to share this experience with others with hope that someone will learn from it. Enjoy, Happy New Year and thanks to the bros.grimm. Frank
(best energy weed out there?) -Try the C-88 if your looking for a lift, I'm still buzzed from a good toke I took about six hours ago. Yields are so-so, maybe a oz from a three footer under the 400, but I'm new and you can probably do better. This smoke is like taking a couple of hits of speed and you just kind of sail through the high no heavy crash at the end it just sort of mellows out. If you're tired of Indicas I'd give her a try, the seeds are expensive but well worth the money. If you are in the states it's definitely your best bet. The next version of Cinderella is supposed to be ready soon although I don't know how they could improve her except for the yield. Frank
We're at week 9 two weeks into flower and here's whats happening: All in supersoil and 5gal grow bags 2 400w, 1hps 1mh. Six C-88 offspring of which four look exactly like their mom and two are more indica looking, short and bushy and staying that way instead of starting out indica and changing to sativa growth during late veg-early flower. Not a large sample but look good for homemade. If they are half as potent as their mom I'll be pleased. Water schedule everyfew days with a foxfarms and pure blend mix with a weak GH nutrient mix. Frank
I suffer from severe migraines and have a need to control nausea to keep from vomiting. I've grown C-88 and wouldn't think about it for my medical needs. A couple of hits of this stuff reminds me of the LSD of yesteryear. This is some really intense trippy weed. Your heart immediately picks up about fifty beats per minute and stays there for a while. I'd try one of the Bros crosses first. Cal Indica is really mellow. Anything with Widow works for me also. Docs' Huron looks good or his Shiva crosses. Just my opinion. Frank
Cinderella is definitely some of the most potent weed I've had the pleasure of growing. Extremely easy to grow, likes to feed heavy in soil. Can take anything you throw at her and won't turn hermy. Check out some of Soul's posts on how to maximize yield. Super clear up high, I like a wee bit if I have something to do that needs to get done right away, a couple of tokes and you're off in lala land. Head rushes galore, easy to smoke too much. High has creeper qualities, although it hits you within a short time of smoking it builds over the next fifteen minutes or so. Some people try it once and pass the next time around because it's so potent. Smells like grapefruit while growing and also has this dank kind of smell when cured. You won't regret growing her out if what your looking for is some kick ass weed. Frank
I was growing the C-88. It's fast growing, slender, not stocky, with longish internodes but as soon as it starts flowering they tighten up. You wind up with mighty dense buds, the influence of that little bit of Shiva Skunk in there (I think). Mine finished in 55 days under an ounce per plant but this was just a mother selection run so I expect production of clones in next run to be much higher, based on what I saw. I'm not sure if this is the best scrog plant as mine didn't seem to want to develop flowers very far down the stem but it is the strongest sativa high I have ever had and the buds look amazingly frosty, beautiful. Personally, I only smoke it on special times because it is almost too speedy and I am high strung, but people LOVE it. My friends say it is definitely best bud they have had outside A-dam.
I've been flowering my current garden for 3 weeks exactly today. The flower production of the Cinderella 88 is about the same as the Super Skunk with the C-88 having much more crystals. The Cinderellas are much taller than the Super Skunks... about 27-28 inches and have finally stopped stretching. The smell is very fruity and definitely smells like a fruit punch or light tropical sweet aroma. I expect them to pack on size this week. I can already tell the C-88 is going to have bigger colas than the Super Skunk. Train1
Setup starts with 1000 watt AgroSun Metal Halide. One gallon pots with Sunshine mix, perlite, and vermiculite. Fed with GH and Foxfarm Bigbloom. Plants were flowered at twelve inches for 50 days. I had 11 Cinderella's and 1 runt all yielding 12.23oz. 6 Super Skunks and 2 runts (rooted late) all yielding 5.815oz. Total harvest: 18.045oz The Cinderella 88s were good yielders, they finished at 2.5ft with nice long colas. The dried buds were totally frosted, looking almost silver. The high is definitely very up and trippy, all in your head. I prefer smoking the Super Skunk on a light day, the Cinderella is too much for everyday use. But at least it doesn't put you to sleep. The smell of Cinderella was very different since I had 3 mothers. C-88-a was piney with a skunky undertone. C-88-a and C-88-c had a fruity tropical smell. I didn't top the plants at all. Flowered plants were all cuttings. I'm going to top the next garden for sure. My clones are all ready (6 AK-47s and 7 Cindies). I'm going to grow fewer, but bigger plants and all organic. Train1
I just finished a crop of C-88. The plant is very easy to grow and is a decent yielder. The finished buds are nicely frosted and very dense when using a 1000 watt light. The high is definitely very up and paranoid. A little too much for me to smoke on a daily basis. That's what I have Super Skunk for, very relaxing and doesn't blow you away. Train1
C-99 males showed pre sex before three weeks, and the plants are extremely vigorous. Males also were about 50% more vigorous during early veg than females. All plants are uniform, but there are some mutations. One plant grew 2 fan leaves one on top of the other from one leaf stem. Another had blunt rounded leaf tips and a third grew three leaves only at internode 5. The plants develop side branches at around 5" tall given adequate light. These plants will be VERY DENSE. C-99 has been the most vigorous plant I've grown, growing to six internodes in less than 2 weeks. The Skunk
Re: white russian or Cinderella99? People have different opinions on each. Some will like the WR and some the Cindys.while you can't hardly go wrong with each it depends on what you like. You might even consider Cindy 88. I've grown the C-88 and the WR and it seems the WR is a little tough but it'll waste you quick. And I think the C-88 was a little smoother and tastier but still a super buzz. What you need to consider is your gro area, what size plants you want, what kind of buzz you like then choose a strain instead of the other way around. Cindy 99 hasn't been out that long. But i'm sure people who pay that much aren't going to bad mouth it in this forum because of all the criticism they'll take. Buddy Green
Re: White Russian or Cinderella99? The White Rhino is a heavy smoke, with a pretty heavy high. If you want a better taste, try the AK-47, much more sativa. The C-88 is an up and zingy high. The flavor is much fruitier with the C-88 (one of my favs). The White Rhino is a crystal queen, with a little more hashy high than the C-88, which is the truer sativa phenotype. I'd go with the C-88 for everyday fun on the run. A-1
Don't waste your time with NL#5 x Haze at this time, everyones experience seems to be the same with Sensis NL#5 x Haze lately. I grew the 88-89 version and really was looking forward to todays version but it was a disappointment to say the least. Look farther down the page for some comments and experiences with this strain. Based on respected members' comments if I were looking for a strain like that I would go with Cinderella 88 at this time. Stix
C-88 is strong but does not have a particularly good high. It's kind of a paranoid weed. It's not as strong as Silver Pearl or Jack Flash and both of those highs are a lot more fun. Visitor
Cinderella has that weird speedy high that weirds a lot of people out. It just doesn't have a good stone. It doesn't matter if you just smoke a couple of hits, you get this strange spacy high that just doesn't cut it. You don't get that killer stone you be looking for but more of a nervous paranoid trip. I really haven't met anyone who really likes the high. Gardener
I think it is definitely not for everyone, that racy paranoid high seems to be what Soul likes. I agree that this pot is quite speedy, and that the amount smoked doesn't seem to matter a whole lot, smoked a whole doob a couple nights ago which got my heart RACING and sent my mind into another realm, but just took 2 tube rips the day after and was right back to the same place (almost). The high isn't for everyone, I found it tends to make me overly self-analyzing and sometimes paranoid. I have been smoking much less of the Cinderella lately due to those effects and have been puffing more mellow indica-dominant strains like the Shiva Skunk. However the resin production and taste of the Cinderella are killer, and if you are looking for a racy up high this stuff is for you! I think your "killer stone you be looking for" is a matter of personal preference. Just need to know what you're looking for. Merry Dankster
All I have to say is if your looking for the "tripping" high, C-88 is your winner and I will say it's stronger than some Original Haze that I tried. Dankmaster
If you like shaky achey paranoid "where are the cops" pot, you will love C-88. It's not so much strong as it is anxiety producing. A pretty big disappointment considering all the hype it got. Notsogood
I've smoked a few small bowls now and she continues to whip me each time. You are right, I get so high fast, off 3 hits. This is the most potent sativa hybrid I've smoked. I've grown a 50/50 indica/sativa Orange Bud before that had very few effects of the C-99 high. C-99 causes much visual distortion, has a great vibe energy high. This is one plant I will not be giving up anytime soon. Kaka
If you were interested in a Haze-based high I would suggest the C-99. She stays short and the intensity of the high is way up. I don't like smoking pure bowls of the Cinderella anymore, it is just too much power. I mix the amount of the eraser of a yellow pencil with some Hawaiian Indica and I am flying. Serious zoning with lots of visual distortion. And I can never sit still after smoking this. I've heard a lot of bad stuff about the NL x Haze. Kaka
I purchased some C-99's from Heaven's Stairway. My usual metod of germination is as follows: soak seeds in a mixture of maxicrop and water (1oz/gal) 24hrs. Place seeds in moist paper towel cotained in tupperware and put on top of refrigerator for warmth. I've germinated Niagara, Huron and Niagara x Shiva all with nearly 100% germination. Only two of the seeds opened and the tap root never progressed. Should I have used bottled water, is that the critical factor? The guy at Heaven's thinks that is the case. I don't understand why the seeds would be that sensitive. I also started some Romberry's w/ the C-99's and most of them opened and flourished. Any suggestions? Pops
You aren't the only one. Only 3 out of 10 C-99's germed while 10 of 10 Skunk #1 germed. Richard knows that C-99's are troublesome in germinating because others have complained. He's just trying not to replace them and making excuses. Carbon 14
I'm growing a Princess x NL that has a couple leaves that are twisted also, it is growing well however I haven't checked closely for any critters yet because it seemed okay. In fact it is the biggest and best of the bunch at about 1 month of growth. I'm also growing some Apollo x NL and they are okay. Torog
I tried an early sample of C-99 last night. Plants are budding outside right now and buds are VERY immature but the bud leaves had some resin I smoked a bowl of it after smoking Flo, Niagara and some Skunk I felt the C-99 over the top of the rest of the samples... all I could say way whoo!... it tasted great, and was VERY heady. The guy smoking with me didn't want anymore after two hits; I wanted to fly so I smoked it up and I say this: It is worth the effort guys... a very nice smoke, hehe. Eric
This is my first grow, so I made a ton of mistakes, over water, underwater too much fert not enough fert, etc. Stonehedge and Cindy99: The Stonehedge are absolutely bomb proof. I don't know how you could accidentally do anything that they wouldn't recover from. The Cindy however is one fragile chick, I lost nine of ten, in the same enviroment that didn't stop the Stonehedge. It's so fragile that I've toyed with the idea of using it every grow as an eary indicator of something that might go wrong, like the "canary in the mine". I haven't given up on Cindy, currently have $600 in beans just waiting for the next attempt. But man oh man, what a tender lady. Ju_ce71
I agree, Cindy is super delicate and not for the newbie. It needs almost the perfect environment or plant really suffers and yield goes to almost non-existent. It sure isn't like Bubbleberry or Northern Lights which can take any amount of abuse and still yield great. Conesmoker
I just plant in dirt that has been watered with nutriboost and tapwater. Recent batch is as follows: C-99 30/30, BCGA Romberry 9/9, Federation Romulan 6/6. The Fed Romulans are the shortest. As a whole, the C-99 are the tallest. But both Romberry and C-99 look as though they would average out to the same dry weight. Vic High
Things are going very slow now that my garden is limited to a few flo tubes and a 1K HID. Curently in the works is creating Space Queen, ever since I first heard of Soul and his Princess I've wanted to get Princess and Romulan together, I think they will complement each other well. A year and a half later, we are within months of seeing if my hunch was correct. I have another surprise mating to try with the C99, thinking of calling it Killer Queen, hope it lives up to its name, hehe. After that it will be going back to Blueberry for a while, I need to make more Romberry and Blueberry, they are pissin me off, can't keep stock levels up, haha. After that, I guess I'll flip a coin, not sure where to head. Maybe I'll take a closer look at the Strawberry Blonde, it was the surprise of the surprises. But then there is the Hawaiian Sativa that would be fun, or one of these bags of local treasures, or... Vic High
Cinderella99. Very easy grower with indica/sativa like branching. 7-8.5 weeks flowering. Not as consistent as advertised. Nice taste and good, but not great, high. Not blowaway but up high. Grohio's friend
C99 was a little inconsistant. Some plants looked mostly sativa and a couple looked mostly indica. The mostly indica plants matured earlier and with more wieght than the sativa looking ones. C99 had a nice high but just didn't measure up to Sensi's Marley in the high category, high being an up feeling vs. the blowaway stone of the NL/Shiva It was real easy to grow and germination was great although the tap roots had the problem of curling around. but thats no big problem. Grohio's friend
As far as C99 goes, its tropical taste is great, but that rot is a bit undesireable to me, its potency is good, but there is a paranoid/fear about it, I could handle it, but the urge to tear it down came over me and I've had other "trippy" highs and I've felt noia before, but this was magnified. It's probably me, but that's something a "grower" doesn't want to feel when getting a buzz. If you can handle or like the noia it gives then it's great, but if you don't want that with getting a buzz then it will turn you off. I've read some reports that the noia turns the smokers off and that's right if you don't like paranoid factors in a high, but this doesn't mean I am not going to grow it cause I have "Genius" and that is acid bud IMO with even more noia in it! (no offence to you Soul buddy). Dankmaster[/FONT][/FONT]
Soul,On Cubing:
MrSoul
Moderator
Searching for the TRUTH implies a desire to actually FIND it.
Posts: 1235
Registered: Dec 1999
posted June 10, 2000 08:13 AM
7upyours_~
Good question. Bros Grimm have been employing a method called "Cubing a Clone" to create strains from unique female plants for years now. Read the following and you'll understand:
Cubing a clone is a way to create a unique seedline (a strain) modelled after a currently existing female individual. The goal is to create seeds from which the females replicate the phenotype of the original female. Obviously the chosen female should be an outstanding specimen.
Procedure:
CONTINUOUSLY KEEP A MOTHER IN THE VEGETATIVE STATE TO PROVIDE CLONES
1. Pollinate a flowering clone of the original female with the pollen of a related male, preferably her father or a brother. The resulting seeds contain 1/2 the original female's genes and 1/2 those of the male. An unrelated male wont have the Y-chromosome of the chosen females family & therefore any Y-linked traits of the family will always be missing in the seedline.
2. Grow the above seeds & flower them. Collect an equal quantity of pollen from each selected male and mix it together.
3. Pollinate a flowering clone of the original female with the above pollen. These seeds contain 1/2 the original females genes plus 1/4 more because the male used was 1/2 her genetics too. I call this generation .75 to capture the idea that its 3/4 of the original females genetics.
4. Grow the above seeds & flower them. Collect an equal quantity of pollen from each selected male and mix it together.
5. Pollinate a flowering clone of the original female with the above pollen. These seeds contain 7/8 the original genes (1/2+3/
, the ".88" generation. 6. Grow the above seeds & flower them. Collect an equal quantity of pollen from each selected male and mix it together.
7. Pollinate a flowering clone of the original female with the above pollen. These seeds contain 15/16 the original genes (1/2+7/16), the ".94" generation. Theoretically this will be a stable, true-breeding seedline from which all females are replicas of the original.
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Cindy99 Notes
"Clone flowered under a 400watt, 42watts/sq.ft. Grown organically in a soilless medium, 1:1:1 ratio of GOOD potting mix, perlite, & worm castings. Finished about 16"-18" tall. Nice high flower to leaf ratio, manicuring would be a breeze if it didn't have so much resin globbed all over it. Nugs were dense for a 400watt, but not tight like they are under the big lights. I flowered for 53 days, last 24 hours no light. I alternated Big Bloom & Hi-P fishes (Neptune's Harvest) for food. Total yield about 15gm of very frosty & very potent well manicured buds. Good flavor, but a STRONG smoke. Very "up" high. I can get a lot done instead of just vegging. By far the best I've grown. No shit." - Bill Clinton
"C88 is the best so far. It has blown the socks off every Dutch variety I've grown for all around goodness." - flwr smkr
"The photo at the web site is Cafe'Girl, she is the sister of Princess (Cinderella 88's mom). Cafe'Girl is the seed mother I'm using to produce "Dylan's Diamond" which will be released in January 1999. She's a beauty - BIG yielder of super DENSE, crystalized buds in fairly LOW light levels. Scent/flavour is very much like ginger ale." - MrSoul
"Princess was obtained from growing out seeds found in buds of Jack Herer that was purchased in Amsterdam at the "Sensi-Smile" coffee shop, an authorized outlet of Sensi Seed Bank. Thus, it is considered to be an f2 generation Jack Herer. The seeds were found only in the deepest part of the buds indicating that the father was an unusually early-maturing JH that the growers missed at first." - MrSoul
"Princess is a female which resulted from a seed found in a Jack Herer bud I bought in Amsterdam near the Sensi Seed Bank at "Coffeeshop Sensi Smile". The bud came in a 2 gr. cello-pack with the Sensi logo; I expected sinsemilla, but it had about 10 seeds so I assume she's an F2 JH. Her characteristics were so fine I wanted to create seeds that would "replicate" this plant. She has the KILLER Haze-influenced high with the most DELICIOUS pineapple/evil scent, 50 day maturation in 12/12, and incredible resin production, doesn't stretch - yet clearly Sativa-dominant! Last but not least: Never a hint of hermaphrodism after 2 years of cloning & many different styles of grow.
I wanted to "cube" Princess but add a little beef to her branches because the buds were always too heavy at harvest and branches needed staking to keep from flopping over. I crossed my ShivaSkunk female with one of the males from the same group of seeds that Princess came from. THIS cross produced a male which was then crossed to Princess, creating "P.50" (using a shorthand notation I developed to indicate the fraction of Princess genes in the cross).
Each generation is the result of crossing a male from the previous generation to Princess herself (incestuous, I know).
Blow-by-blow description of the generations:
P.50 = Heavy, single-cola type plants with mellow high (too much influence from the ShivaSkunk) Sweet fruity scent/flavor. Unstable in most traits - for example, 10 days difference in fastest/slowest maturation period in a group of 20 seedlings.
P.75 = Plants leaning MUCH more in the direction of Princess in floral cluster and bud structure, scent/flavor turned more "tropical" like pineapple. The stability was becoming better - two major phenotypes; short & dense (potent too) or tall/HUGE (Not so potent).
P.88 = Renamed Cinderella 88 when first released on the market. It grows fast and produces excellent yields of FROSTY buds in 7 weeks! Generally uniform seedlings with minor differences in floral formation and some height variance, but the smoke is quite consistent from all plants - Dense, heavy nuggets of fruity scented & flavored (like wild berries) and covered in resin glands, the dried buds have distinctly ORANGE pistils.
And now P.94 = Cinderella 99. This project has been a huge success. The strain has been embraced by the "net"work of growers with rave reviews.
The Bros. Grimm too have been recognized for their excellent combination of quality products and unparalleled service after the sale. There's NO OTHER seed bank that has it's breeders on the net answering questions from "newbies" 40 hours/week, and the info is first-rate; even details of their breeding strategies are openly discussed so that the seed buyer can feel well-informed about the products BG offer.
I personally think the plants these Cinderella 99 seeds produce are every bit as good as a cutting from Princess herself (or better). I say better because the flavor of no two plants is "identical"; there's a personality to all living things. Like Princess herself, Cinderella is sweet & fruity to the palette and nose, and when you take a hit you're BLASTED...with the same "racy" high as Princess! The improvement comes in the yield department; 25% greater yield and a stronger branch structure, which I accomplished by starting with some ShivaSkunk genes in the original father in the cubing process. I knew I'd blend out the majority of the traits from ShivaSkunk in the cubing process, but I was hoping to incorporate the ShivaSkunk's stronger branches because Princess had a tendency to need supports in the final two weeks of flowering. As it turns out, I got lucky and it worked. The name suits the strain IMO - it's a true Cinderella Story." - MrSoul
"Jack Herer is an unstable strain bred from an unequal combination of Sk#1, NL#5, and Haze. Crossing a male and female Jack Herer creates an F2 generation which has a HUGE number of possible recombinations of the genes. I grew out some Jack Herer F2s and discovered a SPECIAL one, "Princess", which has many improvements on the original JH such as a shorter flowering time, denser bud structure and pineapple scent/flavour. I have been continually back crossing Princess with her male offspring (generation after generation) which eventually creates a stabilized strain having her special characteristics found reliably in most females grown from those seeds. Each generation is composed of a 50% genetic contribution from Princess (since she's the seed parent) and a 50% contribution from the pollen parent (which also has an increasing percentage of Princess' genetics with each generation). The progression goes: P.50, P.75, P.88, P.94, and P.97...at that point it's considered stabilized (a male and female P.97 can be crossed and the offspring are essentially the same as the parents). I have been VERY pleased with the way this project is going; even the P.75 generation was rather stable in the sense that the individuals were all rather uniform and HIGH quality. The P.88 seeds are available now, and the P.94 will be available around Christmas time. So, you see, since I have combined genes from Sk#1, NL#5, and Haze, creating a plant which has characteristics distinctly different than Jack Herer, and I'm creating a stable strain from this plant... it's legitimately MY work." - MrSoul
"I used Shiva Skunk from Sensi Seeds as a minor component in the development of Cinderella .... I crossed a fine female Shiva Skunk with a brother of Princess, then grew a male from those seeds to begin the cubing process with." - MrSoul
"C99 is has more of the Haze type of high because the mother (Princess), has that kind of high and each time I back-cross to her the next generation gets a bit more of it. Smoking PURE Princess buds is a bit scary...it's too "speedy" and paranoia-inducing for most people. But she's so RESINOUS (see photo) and her flavour is just so delicious and fruity that I knew back-crossing her to her offspring over several generations would create a strain which is actually BETTER than the original mother in terms of a more PLEASING high. It was successful beyond my expectations.
The progression I went through was:
P.50 = Princess/(ShivaSkunk/Princess'Brother)
P.75 = Princess/P.50
Cinderella 88 = Princess/P.75
Cinderella 99 = Princess/Cinderella 88
Each generation exhibited a MAJOR jump in potency (P.50 was rather mellow)...P.75 has a well-balanced body/mind high with a citrus flavour, Cinderella 88 is cerebral & paralyzing with a tropical fruit flavour, and Cinderella 99 is "TRIP WEED"...with more of the fruity flavour and speedy effect from Princess." - MrSoul
"Princess.75 finished outside in northern Kentucky Oct 15, (killer smoke!) The 99's should also, I would think. I do intend to find out! No mold and it was quite wet too." - 27yrs
"I grew out Cinderella 88 and in my experience the Great White Shark is a more interesting line although admittedly my luck with C88 was not the best. The one female I was vouchsafed grows more like a vine then a tree and is difficult to clone and cultivate. However the psychoactivity of the floral clusters is very intense and the stone is complex and very cerebral. This is a very potent plant, indeed. But if I didn't know it was Cindy, I confess I might have let this plant go a while ago. As it is I am trying to find ways to accommodate the plant's finickiness because of its lineage. But I wonder if the BG's cross between the original princess and a Green House male White Widow (Ice Princess) might not be a more propitious way of including Bg's Princess genetics in one's garden. The hybrid vigor that results from crossing two great plants of differing genetic backgrounds creates the best stock for cultivation, in my opinion." - Moose
"I want to comment that your result with the Cinderella 88 is NOT typical: I have grown an awful lot of them, and I have never seen one that was remotely "vine-like". They're usually Sativa-dominant hybrid phenotype with moderate leaf width, short & stocky stature, heavy branching, extremely high flower/leaf ratio and unparalleled resin production. The flowering plants smell like fruity cotton-candy. In my experience, they usually root through a 2 inch rockwool cube in 10 days...and I don't even use rooting hormones." -MrSoul
"Cinder: There's been a lot of talk about this strain. All I can say is that I'm very glad I grew this one. Fast, nice yields, great high. Harvested at 49 days--maybe even a little too long. While most really bite ya in the ass, the occasional bud out of my jar is simply wicked. I actually got lost a few blocks from my house--shit that hasn't happened in 10 years." - shaggy
"There are 10 C99's flowering at day 32 in the hydroponics online 2-liter bottle ebb-and flow system using GH nutes and Pure blend at about 1600 ppm(they could probably take more!!). I have to say these plants are unbelievable! The situation is that the buds are becoming too heavy for the branches, including some of the colas. It looks like some of the side buds will be scraping the floor by harvest!" - KGB
"I agree that c99 appears to be something special. Great resin production, great density at 28 days. Still no major odor(yet.) The thin leaves allow great light penetration. Sometime in the future I will do a whole garden of Cindy. What GH mix are you using on the c99 right now? She has been the most finicky feeder I've ever met." - kaka
"C-99 is very uniform. I have 4 females grown from seed that just finished their 4th week of flowering, and the only variation seems to be their height, the shortest being 3.5 feet and the tallest 4.5 feet, and all were topped once. They were started under a 400 watt MH for the first month and have been getting a full 12 hours per day of sunlight since then, and their cola's are HUGE. Wait'll you see how well they do under natural sunlight." - Rex Feral
"My estimate for Northern States would be early October. I have a friend who was growing it outdoors in Maine (48 degrees N?), it was about 3 weeks from finished in mid-September. Unfortunately, his outdoor grow was ripped off. If you're growing in an area prone to mold, you may have problems, but it's difficult to say because in the Northeast we don't have such a problem with mold. I can only tell you that the buds are DENSE (you HAVE seen the photos, haven't you?)...so it could be susceptible to mold." -MrSoul
"If its Fruit Punch that you want, you should check out "Cinderella 88"....I've smoked the mother that this is the backcross of, and YEEEEHAW she kicks ass. The smell is very similar to the Hawaiian... think back to when you (ok I) was a kid... remember Bubbalicious? Or Hubba Bubba chewing gum? Think about the tropical fruit flavor, and there ya go-- thats what it smells like... A sickly sweet fruit punch gum, a little undertone of "stink" to go with it. A first class high too... (Not to turn this into an advertisement, just a recommendation, but I've personally tried this strain and it will do it for you just like the Hawaiian)." - Shabang
"I'm kind of trying for either Kali Mist or their Himalayan Gold, essentially I'm looking for a badass sativa high that I can grow manageably indoors. -See if you can get Cinderella 88 from Mike at Weedseed. I've personally tried this smoke and it is the best, most lucid sativa high you could ask for. The breeder put a lot of time and talent into this one! Kumquat I do have 3 6' princess " crosses in my garden.
They are nothing like the j. herer growing with them, as someone mentioned...looks closer to Ncga's BW but with a more sativa look. The plants preflowered in early June which made it much easier to plan the garden spacing, although I had no idea these would get so tall. The secondary branching is quite thick and well developed with tight node spacing so looks to be a good yielder. It has handled our 100+ degree days w/o any problems, unlike the j. Herer (only minor probs with them) and even took on a Great Dane bending one over flat on the ground! It sprung right back after a bit of temporary splinting and bracing to be the fattest plant in the garden...which btw, includes most of the "hot" seedbank offerings of last year." - Desert Rat (a.k.a. M.G.)
"My head just turned full circle...This shit is good! I have to say to the brothers...Cinders passes the test with flying colours...the effect is very heady and almost hallucinogenic...very much like a potent version of silver pearl... with a smoother, fruitier taste and no nasty tickle at the back of the throat." - Mike
"I can only answer question #3 (Does it have as strong a sativa high as haze or Durban?)... WAY STRONGER!!! At least the sample of Cinderella 88 I had was. Very tight nugs too! It was grown indoors so I expect the outdoors to be even better (just the way it turns out for me). Very fruity, mellow hitting and easy to take in too much as it has a definite creep to it. The buzz is very sativa-ish and tends to make the mind wonder when trying to find something. But the energy to keep looking is there! I highly recommend it! But keep a bowl of some nice indica nearby to mellow it out! All above is strictly MHO and based on MY experience." - dead man talking a.k.a. M.G.
"The only person I know who has disliked Soul's weed is BB. Taste is a personal thing but I think we know that politics may have also played a role there. The buds of the ones I'm growing out are dense and sticky. The plants are a little small for my liking and probably won't make the grade, but it is obvious that it is high grade bud." - Vic High
"The princess I have smoked was indoor grown by a friend of mine. It is a VERY heavy sativa high bordering on paranoia at times. I found it's best when there's a bowl of a nice indica around to mellow out the edge. 3 tokes do the trick (it creeps up in about 15-20 minutes)! Very nice sweet, fruity flavor and tight nuggets. The plants I have growing outdoors in the hot desert are doing great. They have the typical sativa x-mas tree shape and very hardy. Planted 6 eggs, got 5 plants with 3 being female. It will become a permanent fixture in my garden!" - Desert Rat
"Remember that Cinderella (8
is a Sativa-dominant hybrid, so you can expect it to be a LITTLE "leggy" when grown from seed. However clones from a good mother will stay quite short - I flower 12" clones for 7 weeks in 2-gal containers of organic soil to produce a 2.5' plant which yields about 2 ounces. Yes, "crystal" production is AMAZING...the stalked resin glands appearing on bud leaves as early as 3 weeks of flowering look like white FUR!" - MrSoul Cinderella 88: This strain is exactly what many people have been asking for. It is a Sativa-dominant strain which grows VERY well indoors, staying short and maturing as rapidly as an Indica, yet maintaining the fruity flavor and clear, soaring cerebral high of the best Sativas. The yield is well above average and her high flower/leaf ratio makes manicuring a breeze. The buds are dense, crystal-covered floral clusters shaped like braided hair. Pistil color ranges from snow white to yellow... these are PRETTY plants.
Flowering: 45-55 days
Height: 100 - 130 cm
Yield: 250 -300 gm/m2
Here you go, this (strains description) sums it up. anything else I could say about it would be irrelevent. it's my product and I am obviously biased, for good reason (it's a killer), we will let unbiased customers speak for our product. It's only been out a short while, so you will have to wait awhile for their opinions. Everyone who grows it will be extremely pleased. The high is truly an UP sativa high. It's so up it gives me the shakes for an hour or so after it, like I drank a whole pot of coffee. please feel free to relate any technical questions to the us at [email protected]. Brothers Grimm
Cinderella 99: This strain may be the "Holy Grail". The result of painstakingly back crossing a VERY RARE female to her male progeny over 3 generations. This hybrid was specifically bred for indoor cultivation. Short statured & heavily branched, this plant grows LONG, dense colas with an EXTREMELY high flower/leaf ratio and OUTRAGEOUS resin production. The breeder has observed a "giant leap" in potency with each progressive generation and, as expected, Cinderella 99 has topped all previous results -her high is heavily influenced by Haze; clear, energetic & devastatingly psychoactive. A plant with all of the above is rare enough, but Cinderella 99 finishes flowering after a scant 50 days of 12/12! Above average yields of crystal covered buds reeking of tropical fruit aromas can be harvested every other month once a mother plant is selected and asexually propagated. One final accolade - preliminary results from the breeder indicate Cinderella 99 will breed true... IMAGINE!
Flowering: 50 days
Height: 100 cm
Yield: 1-2lbs per 1000W lamp
MrSoul on Cinderella: Read up and post something if you want to comment or ask questions... later! Current crop is Jack Herer x Unknown (Nickname - Jack's Heir): Seeds - I bought a 2 gram bag of Jack Herer buds (1996 Cannabis Cup winner) in Amsterdam at "Sensi Smile" coffee shop on Achterburghwal straat. The buds were supposed to be sinsemilla, but I was pleasantly surprised to find about a dozen seeds in the bud. I found the high to be cerebral and energetic, but not too long lasting; the buds appeared almost white due to resin coating. Of the 6 seeds I attempted to germinate, every one was successful and I got a 50% male/female ratio.
Seedlings - Very consistent and uniform in looks and growth pattern (surprising since Jack Herer is a three-way hybrid itself). Rapid growers. Typical internodal spacing for a hybrid. Appearance shows signs of both Indica and Sativa heritage. Large, broad-bladed leaves, but lighter green in color than typical Indica. Somewhere in between stature.
Mother plants (J1 and J3) - Grow vigorously and bushy. J1 is the hardiest looking of the two females.
Father plants (J2 and J4) - Grow vigorously and bushy. J4 is the hardiest looking of the two males (surprisingly, this J4 grew from a seed I'd characterize as a "runt", about half the size of his siblings' seeds). Unfortunately all clones of J4 were lost and I have only a "decent" supply of pollen from his flowers.
Clones - Very quick to root (10-14 days) with a success rate of 90 to 100%. Several small, poorly rooted clones eventually came around and flowered nicely. Rooting occurs independent of the method used; RW cubes with pH 6 or 5.8, Rootone or not, seems to make little difference.
Flowering - Once rooted, the RW cube is buried up to its top in a 6 inch round pot of 50% perlite 50% Hyponex Professional Soil Mix, fertilized initially with Miracle Grow 15-30-15 at 1/2 tsp. per gallon of pH 6.5 water. Once looking well at 12cm tall, flowering is begun with a 12hr light/dark cycle. During the first week they "shoot" up 30 to 50cm with large fan leaves but suddenly look over-fertilized (Miracle Grow has urea-based nitrogen) with curling at the tips of the leaves. They respond virtually overnight to a good, thorough leaching with plain water, then they take on a dark green color and start to "bud out" rather than get taller. After the first week of flowering, feeding is switched to Schultz's Bloom 10-60-10 at 1/2 tsp. per gal of pH 6.5 water; I soak the pots and wait a couple days until they get light weight before the next good soaking. Flowers appear Sativa-like and extremely resinous, except that they continue to get progressively fatter and denser, much heavier buds than the Jack Herer itself. I would guess that the father of the seeds was a skunk or similar strain, since the calyx to leaf ratio is so high; the flowers just keep sprouting out in all directions from the bud with only tiny, resin coated leaflets interspersed between flower clusters. The leaves, all but the fan leaves, are covered in stalked resin glands from base to tip. Sample smoking of immature buds which were culled (tried to flower them in RW cubes but they died) after two or three weeks of flowering proved to have a sweet, skunky taste and produced a very "happy" high, not at all paranoia-inducing. The finished product should be excellent. Currently, I have several healthy, rapidly budding clones which are in their third week of flowering and they may well finish before their eighth week. The lowest four branches of one J1 clone were selectively pollinated using the J4 male's pollen and should yield roughly 50 seeds. My hope is that these seeds will produce plants with a great variety of fine characteristics. The outstanding gene pool should ensure that, inbreeding concerns aside. Then I'll have a great breeding project: trying to select individuals for future crosses which will incorporate the best characteristics of that diverse group.
Mr Soul's Princess .75
Written by Mr Soul and edited by Vic High
1. Princess was obtained from growing out seeds found in buds of Jack Herer which was purchased in Amsterdam at the "Sensi-Smile" coffee shop, an authorized outlet of Sensi Seed Bank. Thus, it is considered to be an f2 generation Jack Herer. The seeds were found only in the deepest part of the buds indicating that the father was an unusually early-maturing Jack Herer that the growers missed at first.
2. Princess smells very much like pineapple both during flowering and when dried, but there's this "evil" scent in it too, like rotting meat, which has been linked with the most devastating weed (notably the Durban/Thai hybrid from SSSC, years ago). The taste is connoisseur quality when it's cured; VERY fruity. The high is almost too intense for a lot of people; Dr. Atomic actually refused to smoke any on our second meeting, after getting rather "hazed and confused" on the first sampling we did together a couple of weeks before, so he decided to try Shiva Skunk and found that more mellow and to his liking. Two hits of Princess will induce your body to tremble involuntarily and your heart to race and paranoid thoughts... very much like Haze, but not quite as intense. It also has a "creeper" quality that makes it easy to over-indulge...you get progressively higher during the first 10 minutes after smoking. Look at the May '98 issue of High Times' centerfold and find "Yellow Cab"...that's EXACTLY what the finished Princess buds look like. The "frosting" of stalked, capitate trichomes on the flowers and smaller leaves gives them a "furry" appearance much like Haze.
3. Princess grow vigorously, and is rapidly-maturing... 6 to 7 weeks of 12/12. It feeds heavily and requires about 50% stronger nutrient solution than an Indica does. It stays short, for a Sativa-dominant strain, and finishes at about 3 ft indoors. The yield from such a plant is about 20 grams.
4. Mr Soul has been "cubing" the clone of Princess so the seedline will be Princess. The father is Shiva Skunk. He is currently growing out Princess.75 to obtain males for the creation of Princess.88. Seeds of the 0.88 generation will be ready by mid-July and should produce excellent plants, albeit not perfectly stable yet...but nearly. He plans to back-cross once more after that to arrive at 0.94 Princess genetics, which should be a stable, true-breeding seedline with females "replicating" Princess reliably.
5. This strain is exactly what most people believe doesn't exist; a Sativa which grows VERY well indoors, stays short, and matures as rapidly as an Indica (faster than many), and has the great KILLER Sativa high/flavor. The yield is fine too. Mr Soul finds that the Indica strains are too leafy/stalky and much goes to waste with them, whereas Princess has an extremely high flower/leaf ratio and therefore almost no waste.
Allow me to explain. Jack Herer is an unstable strain bred from an unequal combination of Sk#1, NL#5, and Haze. Crossing a male and female Jack Herer creates an F2 generation which has a HUGE number of possible recombinations of the genes. I grew out some Jack Herer F2's and discovered a SPECIAL one, "Princess", which has many improvements on the original JH such as a shorter flowering time, denser bud structure and pineapple scent/flavour. I have been continually back crossing Princess with her male offspring (generation after generation) which eventually creates a stabilized strain having her special characteristics found reliably in most females grown from those seeds. Each generation is composed of a 50% genetic contribution from Princess (since she's the seed parent) and a 50% contribution from the pollen parent (which also has an increasing percentage of Princess' genetics with each generation). The progression goes: P.50, P.75, P.88, P.94, and P.97...at that point it's considered stabilized (a male and female P.97 can be crossed and the offspring are essentially the same as the parents). I have been VERY pleased with the way this project is going; even the P.75 generation was rather stable in the sense that the individuals were all rather uniform and HIGH quality. The P.88 seeds are available now, and the P.94 will be available around Christmas time. So, you see, since I have combined genes from Sk#1, NL#5, and Haze, creating a plant which has characteristics distinctly different than Jack Herer, and I'm creating a stable strain from this plant... it's legitimately MY work. MrSoul
"Princess" is a female which resulted from a seed found in a Jack Herer bud I bought in Amsterdam near the Sensi Seed Bank at "Coffeeshop Sensi Smile". The bud came in a 2gm cello-pack with the Sensi logo; I expected sinsemilla, but it had about 10 seeds so I assume she's an F2 JH. Her characteristics were so fine I wanted to create seeds that would "replicate" this plant. She has the KILLER Haze-influenced high with the most DELICIOUS pineapple/evil scent, 50 day maturation in 12/12, and incredible resin production, doesn't stretch - yet clearly Sativa-dominant! Last but not least: Never a hint of hermaphrodism after 2 years of cloning & many different styles of grow. I wanted to "cube" Princess but add a little beef to her branches because the buds were always too heavy at harvest and branches needed staking to keep from flopping over. I crossed my ShivaSkunk female with one of the males from the same group of seeds that Princess came from. THIS cross produced a male which was then crossed to Princess, creating "P.50" (using a shorthand notation I developed to indicate the fraction of Princess genes in the cross). Each generation is the result of crossing a male from the previous generation to Princess herself (incestuous, I know). Blow-by-blow description of the generations:
P.50 = Heavy, single-cola type plants with mellow high (too much influence from the ShivaSkunk) Sweet fruity scent/flavour. Unstable in most traits - for example, 10 days difference in fastest/slowest maturation period in a group of 20 seedlings.
P.75 = Plants leaning MUCH more in the direction of Princess in floral cluster and bud structure, scent/flavour turned more "tropical" like pineapple. The stability was becoming better - two major phenotypes; short & dense (potent too) or tall/HUGE (Not so potent).
P.88 = Renamed Cinderella 88 when first released on the market. It grows fast and produces excellent yields of FROSTY buds in 7 weeks! Generally uniform seedlings with minor differences in floral formation and some height variance, but the smoke is quite consistent from all plants - Dense, heavy nuggets of fruity scented & flavoured (like wild berries) and covered in resin glands, the dried buds have distinctly ORANGE pistils. And now P.94 = Cinderella 99. This project has been a huge success. The strain has been embraced by the "net"work of growers with rave reviews. The Bros Grimm too have been recognized for their excellent combination of quality products and unparalleled service after the sale. There's NO OTHER seed bank that has it's breeders on the net answering questions from "newbies" 40 hours/week, and the info is first-rate; even details of their breeding strategies are openly discussed so that the seed buyer can feel well-informed about the products BG offer. I personally think the plants these Cinderella 99 seeds produce are every bit as good as a cutting from Princess herself (or better). I say better because the flavour of no two plants is "identical"; there's a personality to all living things. Like Princess herself, Cinderella is sweet & fruity to the palette and nose, and when you take a hit you're BLASTED...with the same "racy" high as Princess! The improvement comes in the yield department; 25% greater yield and a stronger branch structure, which I accomplished by starting with some ShivaSkunk genes in the original father in the cubing process. I knew I'd blend out the majority of the traits from ShivaSkunk in the cubing process, but I was hoping to incorporate the ShivaSkunk's stronger branches because Princess had a tendency to need supports in the final two weeks of flowering. As it turns out, I got lucky and it worked. The name suits the strain IMO -it's a true "Cinderella Story". MrSoul
(How good is Cinderella?) It's short, FAST, RESINOUS and HEAVY - the buds are definitely ready @ 7 weeks just as advertised. My yields are well above a pound per 1000W lamp. I grow in 2 gallon pots of organic soil and each 2.5-foot-tall plant produces from 1.5 to 4 ounces depending on how it's pruned (Single Cola vs. Bush). I usually mix some "bushes" and some "single cola" clones to make up a crop. This method yields about 1.5 ounces per square foot, but that's less than the maximum possible. The resin production is FANTASTIC... looks like the photos of White Widow, but the high is much more cerebral. The flavour is SWEET! My flowering room smells like a fruit stand after the first 3 weeks of 12/12. I've found that the C-88 females are all excellent but there's always one or two BEST. The C-99 females are more uniform - each one's like the BEST of the C-88's. This makes sense when you recognize that C-99 is the result of back crossing C-88 to "Princess". I should be able to report on how "true breeding" Cinderella 99 is sometime this Summer when I've tested enough of them. MrSoul
Remember that Cinderella is a Sativa-dominant hybrid, so you can expect it to be a LITTLE "leggy" when grown from seed. However clones from a good mother will stay quite short - I flower 12" clones for 7 weeks in 2-gal containers of organic soil to produce a 2.5' plant which yields about 2 ounces. Yes, "crystal" production is AMAZING...the stalked resin glands appearing on bud leaves as early as 3 weeks of flowering look like white FUR! SOG Methods produce plants which yield about a quarter ounce each, in most cases I never advocate more than one plant per square foot. A plant such as I described requires more like 2 square feet. So four such plants would FIT in your 3'x3' area but using a 400W lamp means a MUCH smaller yield - my data is for growing under a 1000W. Many people forget that yield is HEAVILY dependant on lighting used. Topping/pruning the plants to four main colas has optimized yield/plant for me -keep the number of branches on each plant down to 4-6 for best results. MrSoul
I'd personally advise you to "top" the C-99's at their 4th branch set (about 3-4 weeks old) then when the branches grow to be about a foot long (about 6-8 weeks old) you should flower them. You'll know which plants are female BEFORE you ever switch the light cycle to 12/12. Cinderella plants always show preflowers at the 5-7 branch sets during the VEGETATIVE stage... when they're a little over a month old. Mr Soul
I get my best yield by pruning the plants to 2 main colas. I compared single-cola, double-cola, quadruple-cola & mulitiple-cola "bushes" to elavuate their yield per area. I found that the bushes could yield as much as 5 ounces but took up the same space as 4 single-cola plants, which yield about 1.5 ounces each. The double-cola plants yield 2 ounces each and take up the SAME space as a single-cola plant. The 4-cola plants took up about 1.5 times the space, but didn't yield enough to make up for it. ALSO... the colas are MUCH more impressive on the single & double cola plants! I just realized I forgot to answer parts of your question in my "excitement". 1. Flowering time was 7 weeks of 12/12. 2. Flowered at 2 feet tall & finished at 3 feet tall. MrSoul
I find 4 colas per plant to be optimal. Sly
It will help pack on the resin glands if you let her sit in the dark for 2-3 days and let the soil dry out before cutting her down. Kinda like making go back to scrubbing floors for a few days until the Prince comes 'round with the glass slipper...LOL! MrSoul
I'm just finishing a crop of Cinderella 88 and from 7 plants there are 6 that are virtually identical. They are 3 foot tall plants grown from seed with 8 weeks of 18/6 veg and now 6 weeks into 12/12 (no more than 10 days to go). Each plant is BRISTLING with resin and their colas are the size of 2 beer cans taped together lengthwise. The high from this strain is decidedly "Sativa" with a great charge of energy and much thought provocation. The "odd" seventh plant is equally resinous as the others but skinny compared to them, so my advice is to keep the shorter plants that result from a batch of seeds and you'll be VERY happy. See the link for a description...but expect higher yields than claimed. MrSoul
You say Cinderella 88 and Apollo have been vegging for 46 days and you don't yet know their sex?... that's because you haven't LOOKED! Look carefully at the internodes above the first 4-6 branch sites & you'll see preflowers that will be either male (football shaped pods) or female (pear-shaped with two white pistils sticking out like a peace sign). These will tell you the gender of all the plants at their present stage of development. There won't be any plants which have BOTH... I've never gotten a hermaphrodite. DO NOT switch the lights to 12/12 and back again...it's a waste of time and a source of stress to the plants. Just take a clone from each female and any males you want to use for breeding BEFORE you go to flowering. Keep the clones in vegetative state under fluorescents while the flowering crop is going. About 3 weeks before the flowering plants are finished, the clones will be rooted and have grown enough to take a couple clones from each clone -These clones will be your next crop! At 18" tall, the seedlings are ALREADY big enough to flower; you'll probably get a few Cinderellas that go over 3 feet tall; the Apollos will be even taller...but still under 4 feet. The two strains have the same father, but different mothers. Crossing Cinderella and Apollo will be interesting... you'll get good plants, but a bit of variety... some will grow compact and dense & smell sweet & fruity like Cinderella and some will be big lemony/spicey monsters like Apollo. Probably lots of "mixed" phenotypes as well. I'm SURE you'll enjoy growing them & the produce will BLOW YOU AWAY! MrSoul
I ALWAYS see preflowers between the age of 4 and 6 weeks. Node 6 is commonly where they start, so I'd say you're probably seeing them. The plants that show first are usually males. Look over each plant carefully, using a loupe. If you see a preflower at such an early age, it'll most likely be male, but be SURE before culling it. If you can't find a preflower on a plant, while most of the others HAVE shown... it's most likely a female. Isn't that uniformity NICE? Cinderella 99 is a STABLE strain. Cinderella 88 was close, but this generation is there. MrSoul
(Cinderella needs odor control?) I don't know if it helps you, but the scent is very sweet & fruity. It won't "fool" anyone who's familiar with MJ, but the average person might not recognize the scent as pot. They start to smell after 3 weeks of 12/12 and they're harvested 4 weeks later, so the SHORT flowering cycle helps a bit by lessening the amount of time your garden "stinks". Yields are highly dependant on the methods used. Pruning style and number of plants/area make a BIG difference. I get about 2 lbs every 50 days under 2kW. I grow a combination of bushes & single-cola clones (about 12-20 of 'em) in 2 gallon pots of organic soil, feeding them "teas" of dissolved worm castings, PSG, high phosphorus bat guano and kelp meal. My yields are average at best. Professional growers write me saying they get 2lbs/kW, which I'm sure is true. MrSoul
The scent given off by Cinderella is NOT the typical "pot stench"...not at all skunky -she's sweet & fruity. Someone passing by the flowering room MIGHT not recognize the scent as pot & mistake it for tropical flowers. When you rub the resin you can definitely smell it. C-99 is more "psychedelic"... I think that's what you're looking for eh? Just be sure to smoke a LITTLE, wait 10 minutes, then think about whether or not you need any more...it's easy to over-indulge & become paranoid.
MrSoul
Haze is my favourite high. Very "trippy" C-99 is has more of the Haze type of high because the mother (Princess), has that kind of high and each time I back-cross to her the next generation gets a bit more of it. Smoking PURE Princess buds is a bit scary... it's too "speedy" and paranoia-inducing for most people. But she's so RESINOUS (see photo) and her flavour is just so delicious and fruity that I knew back-crossing her to her offspring over several generations would create a strain which is actually BETTER than the original mother in terms of a more PLEASING high. It was successful beyond my expectations.
The progression I went through was:
P.50 = Princess/(ShivaSkunk/Princess'Brother)
P.75 = Princess/P.50
Cinderella 88 = Princess/P.75
Cinderella 99 = Princess/Cinderella 88
Each generation exhibited a MAJOR jump in potency: P.50 was rather mellow, P.75 has a well-balanced body/mind high with a citrus flavour, Cinderella 88 is cerebral & paralyzing with a tropical fruit flavour, and Cinderella 99 is "TRIP WEED" with more of the fruity flavour and speedy effect from Princess. MrSoul
C-99 will be a bigger yielder and faster finisher (than D/T) - which I personally think makes more sense to begin a grow with. If you're growing under 1000W lamps, you should easily get a pound of C-99 per lamp after a 7 week flowering period. When you have all the weed you need and can take your time waiting for a long-flowering Sativa, THEN start those "extra" beans (included in your order)... I don't know what the Bros Grimm sent you, but it's NOT Durban/Thai. I'm still developing it, so they won't see it for about 6 months. MrSoul
Thanks for noticing her -she IS beautiful! Cafe'Girl is a sister of "Princess" - Princess is the mother of the Cinderella series. Cafe'Girl smells like a combination of ginger, orange and cream... kinda smells like a "Creamsicle" -you know those ice cream bars? She has the highest YIELD of the 3 Sisters (Princess, Genius and Cafe'Girl). Cafe'Girl makes HUGE, DENSE, SPARKLING buds with a lovely high. A really sweet high, in that you never feel paranoid & it continues to "creep up" over the first 15 minutes after you smoke, leaving you feeling warm and at peace with life. Bros Grimm may offer an hybrid of Cafe'Girl when enough testing of her offspring has been completed. MrSoul
Sure, I'd be glad to answer your q's:
1. I flower clones when they're about a foot tall & they double in height during flowering.
2. They clone SUPER EASY.
3. Crossing Cindy 88's will you a variety of phenotypes... they're not stable. Cindy 99 IS STABLE.
4. The seeds are small, tan in colour and "speckled" not striped. If you ordered from either Bros.Grimm or Heaven's Stairway you WON'T get ripped off...but I'll describe the plants: As seedlings they're fast-growing, Indica-dominant with fairly wide leaves. They show preflowers @ 5-6 weeks old WITHOUT FAIL. They NEVER herm, so if the preflowers have pistils, it's FEMALE forever. They flower RAPIDLY - you probably won't believe how fat and dense and frosty they'll be @ 4-5 weeks 12/12. The flower/leaf is EXTREMELY high; the tops of the colas go NUTS at about 5 weeks into flowering, sending braid-like floral cluster projections out in all directions without any leaves. Just before that happens, hundreds of SNOW WHITE pistils make the tip of the colas look like they're wearing fur caps! The resin production is HEAVY (again, you won't believe it), a HEAVENLY scent of tropical fruit & berries begins to fill the room @ 3 weeks of 12/12 and just keeps getting more overpowering 'til they're done. The finished smoke is the type of high that keeps you UP; it's very cerebral - the only body effect is the "jitters". I certainly wouldn't recommend it to anyone looking to "mellow out" on the sofa, BUT if you wanted to smoke before going running or cycling - PERFECT! I smoked C-88 one eve after trying Silver Haze and the C-88 buzz cut RIGHT THROUGH the high of the Haze so badly that my wife asked me, "what did you do?... smoke too much?" The flavour is just like the scent; fruity & sweet...not at all hashy (not that there's anything WRONG with that!...heehee. MrSoul
Outdoors, Apollo 13 and Cinderella 88 will finish before October 15th at 43 degrees north lattitude. MrSoul
If you liked NL#5/Haze, you'll like C-99 too. It's got a sweet, fruity taste and some of that "paranoia inducing" effect, very cerebral and speedy. The major advantages of C-99 over the old Haze x NL#5 from the original Seed Bank are rapid maturation & bigger yield. The highs and flavours are "different" but in the same class. MrSoul
If it's Fruit Punch that you want, you should check out Cinderella 88. I've smoked the mother that this is the backcross of, and YEEEEHAW she kicks ass. The smell is very similar to the Hawaiian... think back to when you (ok I) was a kid... remember Bubbalicious? Or Hubba Bubba chewing gum? Think about the tropical fruit flavor, and there ya go -- that's what it smells like... A sickly sweet fruit punch gum, a little undertone of "stink" to go with it. A first class high too... (Not to turn this into an advertisement, just a recommendation, but I've personally tried this strain and it will do it for you just like the Hawaiian). ~shabang~
I'm kinda trying for either Kali Mist or their Himalayan Gold, essentially I'm looking for a badass sativa high that I can grow manageably indoors. -See if you can get Cinderella 88 from Mike at Weedseed. I've personally tried this smoke and it is the best, most lucid sativa high you could ask for. The breeder put alot of time and talent into this one! Kumquat
Stoney, get your grubby lil hands on some Cinderella 88 from mike at Weedseed.com You will not be sorry, but it might get you too high! The buds are dense and saturated with crystals making it appear white. The aroma of these cured buds is fruity, like a ripe pineapple. Hits from a pipe super smooth. I only smoke 5 or 6 calyx flowers per session. I know one local friend who will attempt 3 or 4 hits, but later on he's got 2 cigarettes lit in his mouth and he doesn't even know it! This bud is getting rave reviews from some of the professionals at cannabis.com and a few other private places. Kumquat
I have not grown this weed, rather some nice size nugs were donated to me for evaluation purposes. I have actually designed a special mini-hitter pipe just for this breed. I only smoke it 5 or 6 calyxes at a time, that's why I came up with my special tool. I find that black cherry wood hits the smoothest. Would the Bros Grimm like to include this special hitter with every seed order? Kumquat
If you are looking for a very very good sativa buzz, get some Cinderella99 or 88 seeds! otherwise you're prolly better off trading with people and doing your own breeding and growouts of seedstock, looking for the perfect mom(s). Try smoke testing males before breeding them. Try not to rely on just one male to do all the work. Use the top 5 or 10% of your males. Combine their pollens and use that on your honeys. Kumquat
kumquat- you designed a special pipe for it LOL send me a little info to the above addy, thanks. it really is a one hit wonder. it's also a creeper. people, myself included, have a tendency to smoke several hits because it's so sweet. 10 minutes later your way too high and completely incapacitated. I'm really looking forward to other peoples results. do you get that same jittery up high? Bros Grimm
My head just turned full circle...This shit is good! I have to say to the brothers... Cinders passess the test with flying colours... the effect is very heady and almost hallucinogenic... very much like a potent version of Silver Pearl... with a smoother, fruitier taste and no nasty tickle at the back of the throat. Mike
Smoked some Princess hahaha swag weed, I smoked some that was sent in seed to someone else I know... he grew it out and asked me my opinion of it... this was even BEFORE I knew it was the "famous" Princess.. well I rated it a 6.5 and that was being very generous... the buds did not form tight... it looked like your basic swag... and a waste of time. What else can I say about it... grow it yourself and find out. Bongblaster
Well I have smoked both Souls and Vics stuff. I wasnt too impressed with Souls (nothing against Soul here, just the way I see it) it could have been the conditions it was grown under but for me it didnt have the potency, they required a high lumen count as compared to Vics which did very well under low light conditions. Vic has let me sample some really deadly herbs that hes done, some have been so so but on the majority all have been something I would grow, commercially or as a closet operation. Bongblaster
ya I tasted this same stuff bong is reffering to when soul was down, I personally couldnt believe it merited an 8.5, I would have said a 5 or 6, really gorgeus stuff from the photographs I saw, but the strength and flavour was seriously lacking, id be interested to see what souls stuff tastes like now that hes switched to organics, because my main complaint about it was the harsh chemical taste im not positive if it was simply his technique, or bad genetics, but I was thouraghly unimpressed. Darkstar
The only person I know who has disliked Soul's weed is BB. Taste is a personal thing but I think we know that politics may have also played a role there. The buds of the ones I'm growing out are dense and sticky. The plants are a little small for my liking and probably won't make the grade, but it is obvious that it is high grade bud. Vic High
I do have 3 6' Princess "x"s in my garden. They are nothing like the Jack Herer growing with them, as someone mentioned... looks closer to NCGA's BW but with a more sativa look. The plants preflowered in early june which made it much easier to plan the garden spacing, although I had no idea these would get so tall. The secondary branching is quite thick and well developed with tight node spacing so looks to be a good yielder. It has handled our 100+ degree days w/o any problems, unlike the Jack Herer (only minor probs with them) and even took on a great dane bending one over flat on the ground! it sprung right back after a bit of temporary splinting and bracing to be the fattest plant in the garden... which btw, includes most of the "hot" seedbank offerings of last year. m.g.
The Princess I have smoked was indoor grown by a friend of mine. It is a VERY heavy sativa high bordering on paranoia at times. I found it's best when there's a bowl of a nice indica around to mellow out the edge. 3 tokes does the trick (it creeps up in about 15-20 minutes)! Very nice sweet, fruity flavor and tight nuggets. The plants I have growing outdoors in the hot desert are doing great. They have the typical sativa x-mas tree shape and very hardy. Planted 6 eggs, got 5 plants with 3 being female. It will become a permanent fixture in my garden! m.g.
The Princess .75 samples I have smoked ARE QUITE GOOD! the taste is very smooth and fruity and the buzz is a VERY HEAVY SATIVA-TYPE buzz (easy to take too much!). I have posted many times on many sites about my experiences with the strain so here's one more... grow it! it is well worth the time/space in your gardens and you won't find a heavier sativa around. 2 tokes, wait 20 minutes and just try to find what you're looking for... hehehe! the taste is unique also. Nothing like the Jack Herer I've heard comparisons to and nothing like any other I have personally known. m.g.
Sorry to say to both of you... the Princess I've smoked is top-notch. 2 hits is perfect but due to its smooth taste and cool smoke, it's way too easy to take too much. It's a VERY HEAVY sativa high that lasts way too long but can be controled with some nice indica to help bring one down. I'm growing it outdoors, have had many indoor samples dropped off so I feel qualified to say..."it kicks ass!" just be a bit wary with it. It's easy to take in too much but can be controled with an anti-sativa... the yields are superb, the buzz could be a bit mellower for my taste but all in all, there's not anything I've seen out there that can touch it!...'cept maybe the old-style, pure Haze. Harvester
I can only answer question #3 (Does it have as strong a sativa high as Haze or Durban?)... WAY STRONGER! at least the sample of Cinderella 88 I had was. Very tight nugs too! It was grown indoors so I expect the outdoors to be even better (just the way it turns out for me). Very fruity, mellow hitting and easy to take in too much as it has a definite creep to it. The buzz is very sativa-ish and tends to make the mind wonder when trying to find something. But the energy to keep looking is there! I highly recommend it! But keep a bowl of some nice indica nearby to mellow it out! All above is strictly MHO and based on MY experience. Dead Man Talking
I'm growing it now, it's a beautiful fast growing plant. Very exotic sativa leaves. It has outgrown regenerated White Widow and away White Widow and Northern Lights. I can tell this will be my favorite. Chango
I would look for diverse varieties, and not have them taste alike. By getting white rhino and white kush you are getting two varieties that contains 50% White Widow, and will be very similar. For variety choose from opposite ends of the spectrum and you can always crossbreed from them to make many variation that meet somewhere in the middle. I like the bros grimm strains a lot. Apollo 13 is done fast, it has red /orange colored buds that look good and it has a great high. The Cinderella has a sweeter taste that everyone likes but it takes a week or two longer than Apollo. Chango
I'm on my second crop with Princess. Mr Soul was kind enough to send me some demo seeds and possibly the prototype for Cinderella 88, I don't know about that. They have a nice sativa look. 2 of my 4 females were decent size light green with frosty pinkish yellow buds. The pineapple smell was terrific mixed with a peppery smell. These were smaller yielders. The other two must have taken after the mother plant, Princess. They were huge, and kong like in appearance. Their weight tripled the other two. I recommend it to anyone. IMO it is better than White Widow. I'm just starting a Blueberry order and they are kinda weak in this first few days. I have read that they start slow and finish with a bang! Abbie Hoffman
I grew Cinderella and White Widow side by side. Cindy was the best and the widow got the axe
[FONT=verdana, arial, helvetica][FONT=verdana, arial, helvetica]Hi Abby soul and I have been experimenting with letting both strains go for an extra week (8 weeks) lately and I find that it tones the the c/88 down a little. It's just too jittery for me and I normally like the up, sativa highs better that the indicas. I can't even smoke the original pure Princess mom, it just wires me out too much. 2 hits and I feel like I just chugged a whole pot of coffee. Sly
Strawberry Blonde is an interesting novelty, but it can't touch a good Haze or the Cinderella 88. I've smoked all three. Budder
The happy day is here! Thanks to my brothers and sisters out there (you know who you are!) the genetics are the BEST I have ever seen! BRAVO! Princess.75 this one blows away every thing else in the grow for taste/high! The buds are hard, dark green with amber to cream hairs and does she shine with huge trochomes in the light! The center cola is the diameter of a beer can, about 11 in long, this babe is going to turn heads! The high is best left to abusive smokers (like me!), the classic "3 shots of tequila after a large spaghetti dinner" gut rush, then a grin (sometimes drooling!) that lasts for hours! The smell is fruity (pineapple) with a touch of "rotten meat" in the background. This ones MY stash! Greenbear
P.75 (petite): at 3 1/2 ft. about half the yield (best guess) compared to the gross phenotype P.75, but at least twice as many trichomes! Tight and very heavy dark green buds, about 35% hairs have turned orange. The smell is the fruity/floral with rotten meat overtones. A top 5% plant (or higher!). P.75 x BigBud: (I thought it was WW) Massive buds compared to P.75, but twice as many leaves on the bud, also not as tight as P.75. But it does have whorled braid like clusters growing out of the central bud like P.75. Buds are a lighter green with white. P.75 x California Indica: 1/2 have a single main cola with a clubed shaped top, the other 1/2 have multi nodes with "fox tail" buds. Both types have outstanding trichome production and both have tight, dark green buds with white hairs. The smell of the club shaped type is very sweet and fruity, the "fox tail" type is much more floral, not sweet at all. No samples have been tried. Greenbear
I've grown the Great White Shark and would advise getting it to any grower. A very nice smoke! I have not had the pleasure of growing GrimWhiteShark but everything I have gotten from BG has been WONDERFUL! I would say either Greenhouse or BG would be a fine addtion to your grow. PS--you really HAVE to try the Cinderella line (.88 or .99) from BG! Its my FAVE! Up high, fruity/citrusy taste, and the fastest sativa (48-52 days 12/12!) I've ever seen! Greenbear
The C.88 has 2 major types a tall and a short. The tall gets to about 5 feet, the short about 3 feet grown in organic soil mix in 4 gal pots. The C.99 is very uniform, about 3 feet. The Cinderella line likes LOTS of light, and more N in flower than most other breeds. I grew them without any training to observe the unaltered plant (and didn't get as much as if I had trained them). I bet you could weave the tall C.88 all around a SCRog set up, every time I bend over a plant to fill a space in the garden it gets NICE colas all along the plant, the point of SCRog ! The C.88 tall has a "Lemon Nestea" smell and taste and great high (don't expect to go to sleep after smoking some, this applies to the entire Cindy line!) The C.88 short smells like Fruit Loops cereal, when it's curing it smells like a day old fruit salad! This was the fave of everyone I have smoked it with. The C.99 is even more potent than the C.88, almost psychadelic! The smell and taste are, well I guess Hi-C Tropical punch describes it best. Greenbear
My faves: #1-C.88 Brothers Grimm #2-Lemonaid: a hybrid of Romberry and AK-47, you'll have to make them yourself #3-Romberry BCGA #4-P.75 Bros. Grimm (not available) C-99 -this is THE sh#t, they are my next objective! Greenbear
Because of a space problem (not enough!) I have 3 C-88's still in a 1 kw veg. One is now over 3 feet tall in a 3 gal. pot! I haven't topped any of these as I want to check out the 3 different phynotypes, one tall, one medium and one short. The shorty is WIDER than she is tall, she's over 2 foot wideand getting wider as I type! The medium makes up 50% of the C-88's I have, she's at about 2 feet, she reminds me of the one P.75 that I had last time. The tall looks like a Haze or Thai, long internodes etc. I'm hoping that all the phenotypes have the fast flowering gene in 'em! I'll let ya know. Greenbear
Go for any of the Cinderella line, the C88 is more variable but the two main phenotypes (a tall and a short) BOTH kick. The C99 has little variation and an UP UP UP high, smells like day old fruit salad when you cure her right, 46 days 12/12, the fastest sativa I have EVER seen. Mzzmo has it right on the ferts, the C line likes a lot more N during flower than anything else I've done(5-1-1 ferts work well -STAY AWAY from anything with UREA as a N sorce it causes the smoke to be harsh and takes FOREVER to cure out!), and she is a Mg hog during her entire life. Cindy likes LOTS of light, the more the better. Top after the 7th node and train the 4 branches to form an X, I think you will be happy with the results. Greenbear
Well so far so good I have only the Apollo but I have tried the Cinderella genetics line and its very good, Apollo has a few of the same genetics in her too, I myself havent growen her out, but have tried both sides of her lineage and they are world class to say the least. Flavor is fruity and pungent odor are enough to get you high. I love the crystaly sizzle of the massive resin glands frying in the glass bong! Yes you cant go wrong with either of these strains. I have been burning alot for along time and this is one of, if not the tastiest herbs lineage I have ever tried. The potency is very high, but be warned this is not a Indica high it is sutble and introspective gets your greymatter tweeking down to the very cerebral core...then you think I can have another, maby one more... then you look around and are going shit, oh man how did I get this high it sneaks up on you under the guise of the fruity flavor and WHAM you stoned to the bone. Get em both you cant go wrong. The price is right. Webfish179
Here we go...20 tried 20 germed 16 of em females. I started out organic went hydro for 30 days, nuked em with nutrients and went back to dirt. Timing was just as the Bros. Said 7 weeks and they were ready. Tried 6 C-88 6 A13 and 8 I/O mix. I flowered em at 14 to 18 inches and they finished at 3 feet. All the I/O seemed to be a close variation to Cinderella and Apollo. I grow for myself so I don't have a means to weigh but guesstimates would be just under a oz. for the Cinders and well over for the Apollo. First try at something good and I tried to do everything to em you probably shouldn't and they still made it. Finished em with Fox Farms big bloom. 2 400w lights one of each. The Cinderella is my favorite, one good toke is like taking a couple of hits of speed. Great smoke for first thing in the morning if you don't over do it. A thinking mans buzz. Nice smooth expands in your lungs, reminds me of some fine red lebanese hash I smoked in Germany twenty years ago. The Apollo was a little too much for me. It has a slight flavor of the Cinderella but is not as smooth and a knock down stone. My lips got numb for about an hour after I smoked it. The high lasted all night and I swear I felt hung over the next day. I won't smoke it again, I don't enjoy being devastated by a bowl of weed. I bred every plant with a fine C-88 male and will try a few with the bros. Green Giant I just started. Looking forward to the cubed Princess next month although I don't know how it could be any better than the C-88. She'll be a staple in my grow for years to come. Without a doubt some of the finest smoke I've ever had. I thought 8.50 seemed pretty steep for a seed but they were well worth it. I would bet if someone were to get the Bros. I/O 40 for 50 they would get more than a few Cinderella variations worth growing out. Thanks Soul and Sly! Frank
Hey Cha Cal, thanks for your kind words, people like yourself made that report possible. I am hoping my spammy nature isn't taken the wrong way, it is only my experience and being my first real attempt I am quite satisfied with the results. The Princess' high IMHO is much like the bros description although I consider myself a lightweight and don't like to overindulge to the trembling point. I like a high that is somewhat productive like C-88 compared to Apollo which in my opinion was like getting hit over the head with a sledge hammer. I drove and had no problems maintaining my composure with the Princess, although I've witnessed friends who just have to finish the whole bowl themselves sit there trembling for about an hour after their first few hits. All things in moderation. Coming down was gradual, she just kind of wears down after a few hours and I'm ready to toke again. Really clear cerebral high, maybe a few tingles here and there physically but mostly a thinking high. Frank
What do your friends think of the A13? Is the high relaxing or crippling? Besides being a "lightweight" would you consider it a good end of the day/after dinner smoke? C-88 is definitely one I must get but from what I understand I would think of it as a "party on the weekend with friends" type of smoke. Watty Watts
Cinderella is definitely one to enjoy with friends. IMO Cinder was a relaxing high compared to Apollo. Apollo is a knock down stone that left me looking to come down from it. It is just too intense kinda like the one type of weed you would stash away and pull out when you want to impress your friends with because it is so devastating. I didn't say Cinderella was a lightweight, I said I am. It is a great afterdinner smoke if you don't over do it. It kind of reminded me of smoking Thai in the 70's -clear cerebral energetic with one fine flavor of hashish. Really smooth smoke but it can knock you out like the Apollo if you over do it. Definitely worth your time to check out. Frank
I want to talk about the Cinderella 88 high as it so awesome and complex compared to most of the sledge hammer couch lock stones you get from most street weed thats gone so much longer for better yields. I take one good draw on my glass pipe and all I can smell as I exhale is the sweet smell of hashish, similar to a red or blonde picked up by the hundred gram plates covered with a silk bag in Frankfurt about twenty years back while giving Uncle Sam a few years of my life in Germany. This high is immediate it slowly swells your brain as your thoughts start to race and your senses become so keen. I can feel my eye start twitching and completely tune into it. With the proper focus you can really get something done while high on C-88 but it's also ok to just sit at the keyboard pecking away trying to explain something to someone who knows exactly what you mean if they've been there before themselves. I don't find this high the least bit paranoid as I have read by others although I haven't pushed it to a point where I don't enjoy it yet. The Apollo is another story, I got paranoid within minutes of smoking it and was so stoned I couldn't think straight for about an hour or two. IMO this is the best high I've had in twenty years or more. Just the ramblings of a fellow stoner trying to share the reward of my efforts and all of yours who helped with the newbie type questions. It is a great time to be able to share this experience with others with hope that someone will learn from it. Enjoy, Happy New Year and thanks to the bros.grimm. Frank
(best energy weed out there?) -Try the C-88 if your looking for a lift, I'm still buzzed from a good toke I took about six hours ago. Yields are so-so, maybe a oz from a three footer under the 400, but I'm new and you can probably do better. This smoke is like taking a couple of hits of speed and you just kind of sail through the high no heavy crash at the end it just sort of mellows out. If you're tired of Indicas I'd give her a try, the seeds are expensive but well worth the money. If you are in the states it's definitely your best bet. The next version of Cinderella is supposed to be ready soon although I don't know how they could improve her except for the yield. Frank
We're at week 9 two weeks into flower and here's whats happening: All in supersoil and 5gal grow bags 2 400w, 1hps 1mh. Six C-88 offspring of which four look exactly like their mom and two are more indica looking, short and bushy and staying that way instead of starting out indica and changing to sativa growth during late veg-early flower. Not a large sample but look good for homemade. If they are half as potent as their mom I'll be pleased. Water schedule everyfew days with a foxfarms and pure blend mix with a weak GH nutrient mix. Frank
I suffer from severe migraines and have a need to control nausea to keep from vomiting. I've grown C-88 and wouldn't think about it for my medical needs. A couple of hits of this stuff reminds me of the LSD of yesteryear. This is some really intense trippy weed. Your heart immediately picks up about fifty beats per minute and stays there for a while. I'd try one of the Bros crosses first. Cal Indica is really mellow. Anything with Widow works for me also. Docs' Huron looks good or his Shiva crosses. Just my opinion. Frank
Cinderella is definitely some of the most potent weed I've had the pleasure of growing. Extremely easy to grow, likes to feed heavy in soil. Can take anything you throw at her and won't turn hermy. Check out some of Soul's posts on how to maximize yield. Super clear up high, I like a wee bit if I have something to do that needs to get done right away, a couple of tokes and you're off in lala land. Head rushes galore, easy to smoke too much. High has creeper qualities, although it hits you within a short time of smoking it builds over the next fifteen minutes or so. Some people try it once and pass the next time around because it's so potent. Smells like grapefruit while growing and also has this dank kind of smell when cured. You won't regret growing her out if what your looking for is some kick ass weed. Frank
I was growing the C-88. It's fast growing, slender, not stocky, with longish internodes but as soon as it starts flowering they tighten up. You wind up with mighty dense buds, the influence of that little bit of Shiva Skunk in there (I think). Mine finished in 55 days under an ounce per plant but this was just a mother selection run so I expect production of clones in next run to be much higher, based on what I saw. I'm not sure if this is the best scrog plant as mine didn't seem to want to develop flowers very far down the stem but it is the strongest sativa high I have ever had and the buds look amazingly frosty, beautiful. Personally, I only smoke it on special times because it is almost too speedy and I am high strung, but people LOVE it. My friends say it is definitely best bud they have had outside A-dam.
I've been flowering my current garden for 3 weeks exactly today. The flower production of the Cinderella 88 is about the same as the Super Skunk with the C-88 having much more crystals. The Cinderellas are much taller than the Super Skunks... about 27-28 inches and have finally stopped stretching. The smell is very fruity and definitely smells like a fruit punch or light tropical sweet aroma. I expect them to pack on size this week. I can already tell the C-88 is going to have bigger colas than the Super Skunk. Train1
Setup starts with 1000 watt AgroSun Metal Halide. One gallon pots with Sunshine mix, perlite, and vermiculite. Fed with GH and Foxfarm Bigbloom. Plants were flowered at twelve inches for 50 days. I had 11 Cinderella's and 1 runt all yielding 12.23oz. 6 Super Skunks and 2 runts (rooted late) all yielding 5.815oz. Total harvest: 18.045oz The Cinderella 88s were good yielders, they finished at 2.5ft with nice long colas. The dried buds were totally frosted, looking almost silver. The high is definitely very up and trippy, all in your head. I prefer smoking the Super Skunk on a light day, the Cinderella is too much for everyday use. But at least it doesn't put you to sleep. The smell of Cinderella was very different since I had 3 mothers. C-88-a was piney with a skunky undertone. C-88-a and C-88-c had a fruity tropical smell. I didn't top the plants at all. Flowered plants were all cuttings. I'm going to top the next garden for sure. My clones are all ready (6 AK-47s and 7 Cindies). I'm going to grow fewer, but bigger plants and all organic. Train1
I just finished a crop of C-88. The plant is very easy to grow and is a decent yielder. The finished buds are nicely frosted and very dense when using a 1000 watt light. The high is definitely very up and paranoid. A little too much for me to smoke on a daily basis. That's what I have Super Skunk for, very relaxing and doesn't blow you away. Train1
C-99 males showed pre sex before three weeks, and the plants are extremely vigorous. Males also were about 50% more vigorous during early veg than females. All plants are uniform, but there are some mutations. One plant grew 2 fan leaves one on top of the other from one leaf stem. Another had blunt rounded leaf tips and a third grew three leaves only at internode 5. The plants develop side branches at around 5" tall given adequate light. These plants will be VERY DENSE. C-99 has been the most vigorous plant I've grown, growing to six internodes in less than 2 weeks. The Skunk
Re: white russian or Cinderella99? People have different opinions on each. Some will like the WR and some the Cindys.while you can't hardly go wrong with each it depends on what you like. You might even consider Cindy 88. I've grown the C-88 and the WR and it seems the WR is a little tough but it'll waste you quick. And I think the C-88 was a little smoother and tastier but still a super buzz. What you need to consider is your gro area, what size plants you want, what kind of buzz you like then choose a strain instead of the other way around. Cindy 99 hasn't been out that long. But i'm sure people who pay that much aren't going to bad mouth it in this forum because of all the criticism they'll take. Buddy Green
Re: White Russian or Cinderella99? The White Rhino is a heavy smoke, with a pretty heavy high. If you want a better taste, try the AK-47, much more sativa. The C-88 is an up and zingy high. The flavor is much fruitier with the C-88 (one of my favs). The White Rhino is a crystal queen, with a little more hashy high than the C-88, which is the truer sativa phenotype. I'd go with the C-88 for everyday fun on the run. A-1
Don't waste your time with NL#5 x Haze at this time, everyones experience seems to be the same with Sensis NL#5 x Haze lately. I grew the 88-89 version and really was looking forward to todays version but it was a disappointment to say the least. Look farther down the page for some comments and experiences with this strain. Based on respected members' comments if I were looking for a strain like that I would go with Cinderella 88 at this time. Stix
C-88 is strong but does not have a particularly good high. It's kind of a paranoid weed. It's not as strong as Silver Pearl or Jack Flash and both of those highs are a lot more fun. Visitor
Cinderella has that weird speedy high that weirds a lot of people out. It just doesn't have a good stone. It doesn't matter if you just smoke a couple of hits, you get this strange spacy high that just doesn't cut it. You don't get that killer stone you be looking for but more of a nervous paranoid trip. I really haven't met anyone who really likes the high. Gardener
I think it is definitely not for everyone, that racy paranoid high seems to be what Soul likes. I agree that this pot is quite speedy, and that the amount smoked doesn't seem to matter a whole lot, smoked a whole doob a couple nights ago which got my heart RACING and sent my mind into another realm, but just took 2 tube rips the day after and was right back to the same place (almost). The high isn't for everyone, I found it tends to make me overly self-analyzing and sometimes paranoid. I have been smoking much less of the Cinderella lately due to those effects and have been puffing more mellow indica-dominant strains like the Shiva Skunk. However the resin production and taste of the Cinderella are killer, and if you are looking for a racy up high this stuff is for you! I think your "killer stone you be looking for" is a matter of personal preference. Just need to know what you're looking for. Merry Dankster
All I have to say is if your looking for the "tripping" high, C-88 is your winner and I will say it's stronger than some Original Haze that I tried. Dankmaster
If you like shaky achey paranoid "where are the cops" pot, you will love C-88. It's not so much strong as it is anxiety producing. A pretty big disappointment considering all the hype it got. Notsogood
I've smoked a few small bowls now and she continues to whip me each time. You are right, I get so high fast, off 3 hits. This is the most potent sativa hybrid I've smoked. I've grown a 50/50 indica/sativa Orange Bud before that had very few effects of the C-99 high. C-99 causes much visual distortion, has a great vibe energy high. This is one plant I will not be giving up anytime soon. Kaka
If you were interested in a Haze-based high I would suggest the C-99. She stays short and the intensity of the high is way up. I don't like smoking pure bowls of the Cinderella anymore, it is just too much power. I mix the amount of the eraser of a yellow pencil with some Hawaiian Indica and I am flying. Serious zoning with lots of visual distortion. And I can never sit still after smoking this. I've heard a lot of bad stuff about the NL x Haze. Kaka
I purchased some C-99's from Heaven's Stairway. My usual metod of germination is as follows: soak seeds in a mixture of maxicrop and water (1oz/gal) 24hrs. Place seeds in moist paper towel cotained in tupperware and put on top of refrigerator for warmth. I've germinated Niagara, Huron and Niagara x Shiva all with nearly 100% germination. Only two of the seeds opened and the tap root never progressed. Should I have used bottled water, is that the critical factor? The guy at Heaven's thinks that is the case. I don't understand why the seeds would be that sensitive. I also started some Romberry's w/ the C-99's and most of them opened and flourished. Any suggestions? Pops
You aren't the only one. Only 3 out of 10 C-99's germed while 10 of 10 Skunk #1 germed. Richard knows that C-99's are troublesome in germinating because others have complained. He's just trying not to replace them and making excuses. Carbon 14
I'm growing a Princess x NL that has a couple leaves that are twisted also, it is growing well however I haven't checked closely for any critters yet because it seemed okay. In fact it is the biggest and best of the bunch at about 1 month of growth. I'm also growing some Apollo x NL and they are okay. Torog
I tried an early sample of C-99 last night. Plants are budding outside right now and buds are VERY immature but the bud leaves had some resin I smoked a bowl of it after smoking Flo, Niagara and some Skunk I felt the C-99 over the top of the rest of the samples... all I could say way whoo!... it tasted great, and was VERY heady. The guy smoking with me didn't want anymore after two hits; I wanted to fly so I smoked it up and I say this: It is worth the effort guys... a very nice smoke, hehe. Eric
This is my first grow, so I made a ton of mistakes, over water, underwater too much fert not enough fert, etc. Stonehedge and Cindy99: The Stonehedge are absolutely bomb proof. I don't know how you could accidentally do anything that they wouldn't recover from. The Cindy however is one fragile chick, I lost nine of ten, in the same enviroment that didn't stop the Stonehedge. It's so fragile that I've toyed with the idea of using it every grow as an eary indicator of something that might go wrong, like the "canary in the mine". I haven't given up on Cindy, currently have $600 in beans just waiting for the next attempt. But man oh man, what a tender lady. Ju_ce71
I agree, Cindy is super delicate and not for the newbie. It needs almost the perfect environment or plant really suffers and yield goes to almost non-existent. It sure isn't like Bubbleberry or Northern Lights which can take any amount of abuse and still yield great. Conesmoker
I just plant in dirt that has been watered with nutriboost and tapwater. Recent batch is as follows: C-99 30/30, BCGA Romberry 9/9, Federation Romulan 6/6. The Fed Romulans are the shortest. As a whole, the C-99 are the tallest. But both Romberry and C-99 look as though they would average out to the same dry weight. Vic High
Things are going very slow now that my garden is limited to a few flo tubes and a 1K HID. Curently in the works is creating Space Queen, ever since I first heard of Soul and his Princess I've wanted to get Princess and Romulan together, I think they will complement each other well. A year and a half later, we are within months of seeing if my hunch was correct. I have another surprise mating to try with the C99, thinking of calling it Killer Queen, hope it lives up to its name, hehe. After that it will be going back to Blueberry for a while, I need to make more Romberry and Blueberry, they are pissin me off, can't keep stock levels up, haha. After that, I guess I'll flip a coin, not sure where to head. Maybe I'll take a closer look at the Strawberry Blonde, it was the surprise of the surprises. But then there is the Hawaiian Sativa that would be fun, or one of these bags of local treasures, or... Vic High
Cinderella99. Very easy grower with indica/sativa like branching. 7-8.5 weeks flowering. Not as consistent as advertised. Nice taste and good, but not great, high. Not blowaway but up high. Grohio's friend
C99 was a little inconsistant. Some plants looked mostly sativa and a couple looked mostly indica. The mostly indica plants matured earlier and with more wieght than the sativa looking ones. C99 had a nice high but just didn't measure up to Sensi's Marley in the high category, high being an up feeling vs. the blowaway stone of the NL/Shiva It was real easy to grow and germination was great although the tap roots had the problem of curling around. but thats no big problem. Grohio's friend
As far as C99 goes, its tropical taste is great, but that rot is a bit undesireable to me, its potency is good, but there is a paranoid/fear about it, I could handle it, but the urge to tear it down came over me and I've had other "trippy" highs and I've felt noia before, but this was magnified. It's probably me, but that's something a "grower" doesn't want to feel when getting a buzz. If you can handle or like the noia it gives then it's great, but if you don't want that with getting a buzz then it will turn you off. I've read some reports that the noia turns the smokers off and that's right if you don't like paranoid factors in a high, but this doesn't mean I am not going to grow it cause I have "Genius" and that is acid bud IMO with even more noia in it! (no offence to you Soul buddy). Dankmaster[/FONT][/FONT]
