too much sodium in my tap water?

guy incognito

guy incognito

Well-Known Member
Hey everyone. Been having a problem with my plants in flowering dying. I've made other threads about it, and been pointed in a million directions. After searching the net a bit more I came across this:

http://www.mandalaseeds.com/Guides/Water-and-pH

which shows this picture:



which this as the caption:
Photo: yellowing, leaf curl, circular burnt spots on leaves, and leaf drop are typical symptoms from water with a high level of sodium.
Click to expand...


(even though the file name on the server is titled "sulphur.jpg")

I posted my plants a few days ago and they are having the same problem it looks like:











I have been using tap water to water my plants. I have an omni whole house water filter set up on my main water inlet. I'm at work right now, so I don't remember the exact model. It was set up when I purchased the house.

Anyone think this could be the reason my plants are fucked? If so what should I do? I'm going to start using filtered water in gallon jugs to water my girls from now until I can get the situation figured out.
 
guy incognito

guy incognito

Well-Known Member
I thought it was a magnesium deficiency too, but im pretty sure I have enough magnesium. My next thought was that the Mg is being locked out due to low pH. I have some pH test strips and im going to test my water as soon as I go home today (I had to wait until I could snag some test strips at work). I supposed I will wait until I have the results of my tap water pH and the actual model of the water filter I have before I make any further decisions. I will be back on later tonight with that information.
 
guy incognito

guy incognito

Well-Known Member
Ok I checked the pH of the water with a test strip that goes in intervals of 1. It's greater than 6, but less than 7. If I had to guess I would say 6.5, which is the ideal range for soil I understand. I am going to water my girls until I get excess drainage out of the bottom of the pot and see what that pH is, but they are still moist so that will have to wait a couple days.

The filter I have is model TO1-SS series A. It says it "reduces rust and sediment", and also "reduces odor & chlorine".

So if the pH is in the correct range I can rule nute lock out correct?

here is a blurb from doc11's water thread here: https://www.rollitup.org/general-marijuana-growing/294579-water-most-essential-compound.html

doc111 said:
Household water softeners typically use a different process, known as ion exchange. Ion-exchange devices consist of a bed of plastic (polymer) beads covalently bound to anion groups, such as -COO-. The negative charge of these anions is balanced by Na+ cations attached to them. When water containing Ca2+ and Mg2+ is passed through the ion exchanger, the Ca2+ and Mg2+ ions are more attracted to the anion groups than the Na+ ions. Hence, they replace the Na+ ions on the beads, and so the Na+ ions (which do not form scale) go into the water in their place.
Figure 1

When hard tapwater passes through the ion exchanger (left), the calcium ions from the tapwater replace the sodium ions in the ion exchanger. The softened water, containing sodium ions in place of calcium ions, can be collected for household use.
Click to expand...
So bingo the filter is not only removing Ca and Mg, but its dumping Na in its place. That would explain the Mg deficiency and the page about Na poison (if that is in fact what caused their brown spots - unless they assume its Na poison when really it's the Mg deficiency since they may happen simultaneously). The pro bloom fertilizer I have contains 0.5% Mg. I have not been using it much because I thought it could be nute burn, so I've been giving plain tap water.

I will switch to store bought filtered water and start using my bloom nutes asap and see how it goes. If anyone has any other input please please reply. I don't want to lose my babies. And if I do, I at least want to know why so I don't repeat my mistake like I have been.
 
guy incognito

guy incognito

Well-Known Member
There was a bit of residual water collected in the pot beneath one of my plants from last nights watering. I tested it and it was between 4 and 5. It seemed like it was closer to 5, but definitely less than 5 still. So maybe 4.7 or so. So i'm putting 6.5 water in and getting 4.7 out. Do I need to add something to the soil to adjust it up?
 
guy incognito

guy incognito

Well-Known Member
VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO said:
get a real ph tester,http://www.suntekstore.com/Digital-pH-Meter-Tester---2-Pouches-of-Calibration-.html

I have never tested ph of run off, Not sure what that accomplishes. do you add salt to your house filter? or is it just a filter you replace?
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Well if I water with pH 6.5 water, and its coming out the bottom less than 5, that means it's becoming acidic in the soil. If my soil was 6.5, and my water was 6.5, I would expect the excess water to still be 6.5 when it drains out the bottom. Since it's below 5, my soil must be more acidic than the drained water, correct?

No I do not add salt. It is an inline filter installed immediately following my meter in my basement.

I'm beginning to think my soils too acidic and thats causing nute lockout.
 
guy incognito

guy incognito

Well-Known Member
VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO said:
these plants are in flower, what are you feeding them? do you check the p.h of the mix after you've made it?
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I have botanicare bloom pro which I think is 1-3-4. It also has 0.5% Mg. I have not been feeding them too much though as I was afraid the browning and dying leaves were nute burn and I didn't want to exacerbate the problem, so i've been giving them tapwater for the most part. I had a batch of flower nutes premade though, and I measured the pH last night. It was lower than tap water, but not as low as the run off. It was around 6. I also have a 10-15-10 nute I used while they were in veg, but didn't get any problems until flowering. Maybe the nutes have built up in the soil and made it acidic? It's partially mg soil, and mg perlite too, so maybe that is adding excess nutes causing even more acidic conditions.
 
VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO

VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO

New Member
maybe there starving for some nitrogen and other things because you cut them off. They need to be fed with something if you were feeding them 10-15-10 and now they get almost nothing. Your in flower, so your soil has no nutes left in it. I would use that 10-15-10 for the next couple waterings and test the p.h of it after you mixed it with water,before you feed. I bet they spring back to life in a couple days.
 
guy incognito

guy incognito

Well-Known Member
VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO said:
maybe there starving for some nitrogen and other things because you cut them off. They need to be fed with something if you were feeding them 10-15-10 and now they get almost nothing. Your in flower, so your soil has no nutes left in it. I would use that 10-15-10 for the next couple waterings and test the p.h of it after you mixed it with water,before you feed. I bet they spring back to life in a couple days.
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I'm using mg soil though with nutes already in it, and I transplanted them to bigger pots about 10 days before putting them into flower.
 
VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO

VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO

New Member
MG sucks,but It works if you know how to use it,I guess. it probably has time released nutes in it. You answered your own question, Everything was fine until you transplanted it into mg. explains why your runoff p.h is dropping.
 
C

CANNABLIS

Member
These look very similar to mine. How many weeks are you into flower and how many to go.

I had a high PH which caused the nutes to be locked out causing chlorosis in the leaves (turning yellow). lower PH and add epsom salts fixed this for me, but now I'm not showing any signs of THC. Plenty bud but none of the good crystals. Im in week 5 out of 7
 
guy incognito

guy incognito

Well-Known Member
I was using mg for some of the veg too and I don't have problems. I don't want to just say mg sucks when it might be something else. I'm going to purchase some fox farms soil for my next batches anyway, but I would still like to nail down exactly why this happened, and what exactly is in fact going on.

I'm not brewing anything, those are my roommates. I believe he is brewing some hard cider. He also brews mead.

I think those were taken around 3 weeks. I just harvested the larger plants mother a few days ago. She was about 10 weeks in, but stunted from losing all her fan leaves I think. This time around the leaf death is setting in much more rapidly.

Should I buy some lime and put it in the soil to adjust pH up? Or should I just chop them down and start over with fresh clones and some fox farms soil? I have several clones of both strains, I just don't want to lose all the time i've already invested in these girls. But then again it may be worth it to start over and do it right. The harvest might be pushed back a month or two, but it might be worth it if there's a difference in quality.
 
VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO

VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO

New Member
Last piece of advice, If your going to use MG,I can't help you,It's great for orchards,but not for MJ. It can be done, but WHY do you think everyone knocks it and hydro stores don't sell it? It has Time released nutes in it,You can't counteract that,no matter how hard you try.
Best bet before you cut them down, Get some pro mix,worm castings,perlite,vermiculite. add 20% of each of those to the pro mix.
Now you got some killer soil with no nutes. First couple waterings,you won't need to do anything but P.H. some water. then start on regular feeding of some good nutes. Try and transplant them into the good stuff. they will go into shock, but then thank you for getting them out of that MG. Good Luck
 
guy incognito

guy incognito

Well-Known Member
VICTORYGARDENSHYDRO said:
Last piece of advice, If your going to use MG,I can't help you,It's great for orchards,but not for MJ. It can be done, but WHY do you think everyone knocks it and hydro stores don't sell it? It has Time released nutes in it,You can't counteract that,no matter how hard you try.
Best bet before you cut them down, Get some pro mix,worm castings,perlite,vermiculite. add 20% of each of those to the pro mix.
Now you got some killer soil with no nutes. First couple waterings,you won't need to do anything but P.H. some water. then start on regular feeding of some good nutes. Try and transplant them into the good stuff. they will go into shock, but then thank you for getting them out of that MG. Good Luck
Click to expand...
I went to the hydro store to purchase some fox farms, and they DID have miracle grow there. They had more miracle grow than any other kind of soil.
 
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