The "OFFICIAL" cast your VOTE on PROP 19 thread

[Teeaytchsee]

the wording is the whole bill...it IS the whole debate....i want it to be legal as much as the next guy (or girl)...i dont want more regulation on the plant! what, my friends is it going to change? the naacp supports it because they are sick of young blacks having thier lifes ruined over a joint...hmmm no one gets thier life ruined over a joint..isnt it just a ticket? and the law will make it 21 .Statistically, the demographic that accounts for nearly one-quarter of total arrests for marijuana possession in California happens to be those in the 18-20 age group. so where is the change there?
im sick of this debate already....there are other options.
“People think it’s legalization, it’s being sold as legalization—even though it’s the opposite of legalization.” - Dennis Peron, author of Prop. 215 that legalized medical marijuana in California


“I hope people find the hope and inspiration to broadcast this, understand (the initiative), read it, and know that it's a step backwards. And we can do better. We will do better.” - Dennis Peron


sry bout the multi posts

im sorry but you are still thinking too limited. if it does nothing more than show the rest of the country its not evil then its done more than its worth of a job. those 18-20 are just going to have to suck it up for 1-3 more years. theres alot larger of a picture that is being addressed. you mentioned other options... which? this debate is heated because it is so important. because it effects more than just the few of you in cali that desire to be able to do what you want when you want or have what you want when you want it. you dont think USA is the only one watching this campaign do you? look for mexico's news to get a small idea. amsterdam, uk, germany, canada, and others are all weighing in.

how do your statistics stack up against the 21-90 demographic as a whole? 18-20 is such a small range even statistically speaking its not enough of a concern in comparison to the rest of the age groups. even with MoE its not even close.

no need to apologize for multi posts this forum is a debate and an open forum for those with the desire to express themselves to do so. however i feel its our duty as free-thinkers to spread truth and knowledge. we cant expect others to do what we want. we work to help make it happen.

what we have now is an obvious failure and (though ive said it so many times and it seems to be failing to sink in) CHANGE HAS TO START SOMEWHERE. the sooner the better.

im tired of living in fear for growing a single plant or buying a small amount. let freedom reign.

 

[hoMEGROWengurl]

prop. 19 makes it ILLEGAL for you to possess that ounce of marijuana if you buy it from anywhere other than the handful of licensed dispensaries that will be allowed to sell it. you heard me right: if you buy an ounce off your current dealer, your neighbor, or at a party, YOU WILL BE ACTING ILLEGALLY and will be subject to punishment. says so in the initiative itself (Section 3: Lawful Activities: Section 11301: Commercial Regulations and Controls: (g)):
PROHIBIT AND PUNISH through civil fines or other remedies THE POSSESSION, sale, possession for sale, cultivation, processing, or transportation OF CANNABIS THAT WAS NOT OBTAINED LAWFULLY FROM A PERSON PURSUANT TO THIS SECTION OR SECTION 11300.
(The key words being, “[c]annabis that was not obtained lawfully…”)
That means that some cannabis will be lawful, and some cannabis will be unlawful--depending on who you "obtain" it from. According to the initiative itself, a person who can "lawfully" provide cannabis is "a person pursuant to this section or section 11300." And who is "a person pursuant to section 11300?" Read on:
Section 11300: (i) ...a person who is licensed or permitted to do so [sell marijuana] under the terms of an ordinance adopted pursuant to section 11301.
--Thus, the initiative's exact words--"prohibit and punish... the possession... of cannabis that was not obtained lawfully... from a person who is licensed or permitted to do so"--mean exactly this: ***IT WILL BE ILLEGAL TO POSSESS MARIJUANA THAT WAS PURCHASED ANYWHERE OTHER THAN A LICENSED DISPENSARY.***
also, those who believe prop. 19 will keep our community out of jail haven't read the initiative.
it only legalizes 1 oz. so, if we don't have prop. 19, then what happens? everyone caught with an ounce goes to jail? i don't think so. no one goes to jail for having an ounce in california. and no one gets arrested. that's the law NOW in california. having 1 oz. is decriminalized. all you get is a little ticket.
the people who go to jail over marijuana the most are the ones who:
--are age 18-20... but prop. 19 won't legalize them, so it won't keep them out of jail.
--possess on school grounds... prop. 19 obviously won't legalize them, either, so it won't keep that group out of jail.
--grow large amounts of marijuana... prop. 19 won't legalize them, either.
--sell small amounts of marijuana... and prop. 19 won't make that legal, either.
so who does prop. 19 keep out of prison, exactly?
VOTE NO on 19 and YES in 2012 (the Jack Herer Initiative)
http://www.jackherer.com/initiative.html
http://youthfederation.com/cchhi2012.html
FOR MORE OF THE LITTLE-KNOWN PROHIBITIONS THAT PROP. 19 CREATES:
votetaxcannabis2010.blogspot.com
read it. all of it. then decide for yourself.

 

[Teeaytchsee]

ill happily buy from a licensed dispensary if i can finally do it without fear and i know many would feel the same. you also have the option to grow your own.

2012 is a hope and a dream. one that does not disappear because prop 19 is in place. Jack Herer is correct however narrow minded his views, however again that is not the issue.

note: though its arrogant to think its because of my arguments im overjoyed to see 12+ voting in favor and 2 against since i began posting. im glad so many understand the implications this bill has across the globe.

 

[hoMEGROWengurl]

and thank you Teeaytchsee for being civil...we all love mary jane, no need to be rude or to call names. are not we all adults?

 

[hoMEGROWengurl]

ill happily buy from a licensed dispensary if i can finally do it without fear and i know many would feel the same. you also have the option to grow your own as well.

so if i live with say a bf and my mother-in-law we all have to smoke on a 5x5...now my garden is like 50x60. does that sound like progress?

 

[Teeaytchsee]

imagine for a moment not living in California. imagine carrying 1 single gram could net you (no matter your demographic) a hefty fine and up to a year in prison + forced rehabilitation and probation. imagine growing 1 of your gorgeous plants (saw your grow, great work) only to have it seized, burned, 5 years in prison, forfeiture of property (land and home), forced rehab, and probation. thats what the rest of us deal with daily. thats the fear we want to abolish. this bill however you view it has the ability to counteract so much of these problems. it helps bring to light the positive aspects that are perpetually ignored.

cont. imagine losing your bf and mother because of a harmless and even helpful plant. imagine this and you may start to understand beyond your small neck of the woods.

as a side note you mentioned the grow space for you shrinking, however unless you are a caregiver what you have is already illegal. if you are a caregiver those standards will NOT be changed by prop 19.

 

[Teeaytchsee]

and thank you Teeaytchsee for being civil...we all love mary jane, no need to be rude or to call names. are not we all adults?

most welcome. i have no desire whatsoever to get into any kind of fight. my only hope is to educate (i understand yours is the same with merely a different PoV). help people see beyond normal limitations.

i have spent alot of time doing research of the implications and statistical analysis. if youd like i can cite references and post links. however i think much can be found through http://www.cannabisnews.com/ and http://norml.org/index.cfm as well as looking for state and federal information via the DEA's website and http://www.mpp.org/

for the record i truly admire your grow.

 

[Dan Kone]

read the bill!

I read the bill. There is nothing in prop 19 that reverses the entire US legal system assuming guilt until innocence is proven. Please, show me how prop 19 does that.

 

[Teeaytchsee]

I read the bill. There is nothing in prop 19 that reverses the entire US legal system assuming guilt until innocence is proven. Please, show me how prop 19 does that.

nothing in prop 19 can do that. it is state legislation not federal.

 

[Dan Kone]

so if i live with say a bf and my mother-in-law we all have to smoke on a 5x5...now my garden is like 50x60. does that sound like progress?

There is no such thing as a legal 3000 square foot personal medical garden in California. You're not in compliance with the law now, so why would you care if they passed a law limiting your space?

 

[Dan Kone]

nothing in prop 19 can do that. it is state legislation not federal.

exactly. I don't even think congress can do that.

 

[Hayduke]

and yet you think it is somehow better now than it would be after this prop is in place? really?

Yes...really.

if you dont like it then do something about it.

I am...I am voting Know.

btw we went to iraq for oil, not freedom. read more than these forums and listen to more than the 7pm news reels.

DUH!!!!...Try to stay focused here...that was heavy sarcasm!!!!

AND THIS INITIATIVE IS NOT ABOUT LEGALIZING MARIJUANA!!!!!!!!

I don't need to be a lawyer to understand that prop 19 doesn't reverse our entire legal system. Anyone who completed jr highschool should understand that.

Ah ha!...tHeIr's I's problum!

the wording is the whole bill...it IS the whole debate....i want it to be legal as much as the next guy (or girl)...i dont want more regulation on the plant! what, my friends is it going to change? the naacp supports it because they are sick of young blacks having thier lifes ruined over a joint...hmmm no one gets thier life ruined over a joint..isnt it just a ticket? and the law will make it 21 .Statistically, the demographic that accounts for nearly one-quarter of total arrests for marijuana possession in California happens to be those in the 18-20 age group. so where is the change there?
im sick of this debate already....there are other options.
“People think it’s legalization, it’s being sold as legalization—even though it’s the opposite of legalization.” - Dennis Peron, author of Prop. 215 that legalized medical marijuana in California


“I hope people find the hope and inspiration to broadcast this, understand (the initiative), read it, and know that it's a step backwards. And we can do better. We will do better.” - Dennis Peron


sry bout the multi posts

Exactly...Thank you! Your post that followed this one also

imagine for a moment not living in California. imagine carrying 1 single gram could net you (no matter your demographic) a hefty fine and up to a year in prison + forced rehabilitation and probation. imagine growing 1 of your gorgeous plants (saw your grow, great work) only to have it seized, burned, 5 years in prison, forfeiture of property (land and home), forced rehab, and probation. thats what the rest of us deal with daily. thats the fear we want to abolish. this bill however you view it has the ability to counteract so much of these problems. it helps bring to light the positive aspects that are perpetually ignored.

cont. imagine losing your bf and mother because of a harmless and even helpful plant. imagine this and you may start to understand beyond your small neck of the woods.

I don't have to imagine this...I am from the Midwest...In '94 we drove east after the West Coast leg of the Grateful Dead's Summer Tour...I am from KC so we kicked it there for a few weeks before Deer Creek shows...Well dreads and a VW Bus with shit tied to the roof stands out a bit in some parts and the KCMO police searched my van because of the MJ "residue" on the dash (dried flowers)...well eventually señor swine found 1 gram of the SH!TTIEST brown (in this thread it would be cartel weed) mexican...they put it in a test pack...turns purple...pigs start to dance a little jig saying "this is the good stuff"...taken to the downtown jail along with the bloods and crips that were continuing the gang war in the midwest...skipped bond (my crime was anywhere from probation to 6 months in jail...having dreads, no job, and no physical address...probation was out of the question) And somehow there is no record of it

But this is not about some horrible place like Misery or Kansas!

People who are not eligible to vote on prop 19 should STFU! If you live in a state that does not have MMJ...you have no hope besides the federal level...Sign the dude's petition for an immediate special joint..hehehe...session of congress to immediately legalize on a federal level...put your name and address where your mouth is! I did.

 

[Teeaytchsee]

exactly. I don't even think congress can do that.

scheduling has to change first. im not religious in any way, but i pray that will happen shortly after prop 19 shows the invalidity of their claims of it being a schedule 1 even though 215 failed to. i believe it needs to be made highly publicized and 19 has a chance to do just that.

 

[Teeaytchsee]

Yes...really.



I am...I am voting Know.



DUH!!!!...Try to stay focused here...that was heavy sarcasm!!!!

AND THIS INITIATIVE IS NOT ABOUT LEGALIZING MARIJUANA!!!!!!!!

you can kid yourself all you like, but the spread of misinformation needs to cease.

Ah ha!...tHeIr's I's problum!



Exactly...Thank you! Your post that followed this one also



I don't have to imagine this...I am from the Midwest...In '94 we drove east after the West Coast leg of the Grateful Dead's Summer Tour...I am from KC so we kicked it there for a few weeks before Deer Creek shows...Well dreads and a VW Bus with shit tied to the roof stands out a bit in some parts and the KCMO police searched my van because of the MJ "residue" on the dash (dried flowers)...well after eventually señor swine found 1 gram of the SH!TTIEST brown (in this thread it would be cartel weed) mexican...they put it in a test pack...turns purple...pigs start to dance a little jig saying "this is the good stuff"...taken to the downtown jail along with the bloods and crips that were continuing the gang war in the midwest...skipped bond (my crime was anywhere from probation to 6 months in jail...having dreads, no job, and no physical address...probation was out of the question) And somehow there is no record of it

But this is not about some horrible place like Misery or Kansas!

People who are not eligible to vote on prop 19 should STFU! If you live in a state that does not have MMJ...you have no hope besides the federal level...Sign the dude petition for an immediate special joint..hehehe...session of congress to immediately legalize on a federal level...put you name and address where your mouth is! I did.

[/QUOTE]

the sarcasm is not only pointless it renders the rest of your post unreadable. learn to be less confrontational... or in terms you can understand a little better... grow up. you can vote yes or "know" as you please its every voters rights. your childish attitude is far from endearing.

the biggest part you fail to understand is that it effects more than a few people in a single state. we all have the right to weigh in on anything that has even a residual effect on us. so no i will not stfu i will continue and i will laugh at your pathetic attempts to seize this thread by force. your attempt at getting to know me falls short as well, i have signed all petitions (in regard to legalizing MJ) on a federal level and sent multiple appeals to representatives of my state and the Governor (who surprisingly responded to the one of the vote against the next drug czar fascist) and will continue to do so.

ill have you know not only was i born in CA and lived there for 23 years as i grew up i still have many friends and family living there including my mother, father, and sister. do not attempt to speak on things you clearly know nothing about.

 

[UncleBuck]

i love how people are voting against this prop because it won't free people from jail, or allow them to grow and carry unlimited amounts, or whatever other insane demand they have.

as if voting against this prop will somehow be a positive step in that direction

one step at a time, people.

 

[UncleBuck]

People who are not eligible to vote on prop 19 should STFU!

as long as we are tossing opinions out there, i think you should stfu. no valid reason, i just think you should.

consider that this prop will send a shockwave and ripples throughout the nation. this does not effect california only.

not to mention all the people like me who will (or others who might) end up living in california within their lifetimes.

worst. opinion. ever.

 

[Teeaytchsee]

as long as we are tossing opinions out there, i think you should stfu. no valid reason, i just think you should.

consider that this prop will send a shockwave and ripples throughout the nation. this does not effect california only.

not to mention all the people like me who will (or others who might) end up living in california within their lifetimes.

worst. opinion. ever.

as much as that made me laugh and i commend you for your brass balls, please lets try to remain civil.

your previous post i very much agree with. the demands we are seeing are simply absurd.

 

[Hayduke]

There is no such thing as a legal 3000 square foot personal medical garden in California. You're not in compliance with the law now, so why would you care if they passed a law limiting your space?

Prop 215 did not specify garden size or amount to possess...ON PURPOSE!!!

SB 420 TRIED to define legal numbers with a default 12/6 plant number unless local gov. sets a higher level...But...and stay focused here kiddies is where the problem with prop 19 and it's purposefully bad choice of words...Prop 215 CANNOT be amended by a senate bill...only by another voter initiative (the Ca supreme court ruled on this in January 2010)...This is why it is imperative that the language in any legalization law...actually legalizes mj for everyone without further criminalization!

Besides I am allowed 36 veg AND 18 flower in writing (not that it really matters, but not every pig can spell at the 8th grade level...much less know the law!) And there is currently NO restriction on space...Outdoors 5x5 = 1 fooking plant!!!! Not cool and not legalization!!! THIS CRAP IS ONLY FOR RICHARD LEE and a few others TO GET VERY WEALTHY while narrowing the access we already have


edit: you funny Uncle Chuck

 

[fdd2blk]

i love how people are voting against this prop because it won't free people from jail, or allow them to grow and carry unlimited amounts, or whatever other insane demand they have.

as if voting against this prop will somehow be a positive step in that direction

one step at a time, people.

voting yes on this prop shows how easily some people will cave in for a simple cookie.

i'm not a pussy. i'll stand my ground.

 

[Teeaytchsee]

voting yes on this prop shows how easily some people will cave in for a simple cookie.

i'm not a pussy. i'll stand my ground.

as well you have every right to. however your demands remain unrealistic. i do believe 1 cookie > 0 cookies.