First grow cabinet: Please Critique!

Hey thanks for stopping in. This is going to house my first grows. I'm still learning the formulas for the ventilation but I just want to make sure I'm headed in the right direction. Having just laid this out in sketchup I think I can make the whole cabinet shorter. Some of the dimensions are funky because I did not know how to enter the exact dimensions in sketchup at the time of drawing.



The box next to my reflector that is connected to the carbon filter is a fan. (Panasonic Whisperline FV-20NLF1?)







So from what you can see here am I headed in the right direction? Would you recommend any kind of fan, reflector or any other equipment if you had a similar amount of room?

As I mentioned above I was thinking of using a Panasonic Whisperline FV-20NLF1 (Air Volume (CFM) - 258 at 0.0" static pressure, 240 at 0.2" static pressure, and 200 at 0.4" static pressure) inline fan to vent/scrub the flowering room. I was thinking of seeing of one of those cheap inline booster fans from the home depot would help cool down my reflector and also my electrical room. I would put it at the end of the line in the flowering room sucking all the way through the passive intakes in the electrical chamber. I'm looking at using a Lumatek 400W Ballast/bulb with Super Sun II reflector.

Also I'm thinking of ventilating the veg cabinet with it's own fan/system because I'm under the impression that the florescent bulbs won't cause that much of a heat issue and the outside light leaking in won't be an issue either. As you might be able to tell I'm going to be attempting a modularized ScrOG.

Sorry, I know this is kind of ambiguous but any input is appreciated.
 

LetricBud

Active Member
Looks like you're very calculating and precise.

Im the same way...I actually plan to get the same ballast and reflector as you...Your grow cab looks good.

You might want to make it so that the carbon filter scrubs both chambers...Veg can get smelly as well.

As for Height...you're gonna want to keep it at that height. Flowering plants, even if scrogged can grow upwards of 4-6 ft, and you'll need every inch you can get with lights and filters in-place. Assume that your plants will double in height after vegging...plus youll need a good 12-18" space between the tops of the plants and the lights. So if you veg your plants to 18"...they might come out around 3-4 ft in flowering, plus that 12-18" space, plus your lights, etc. so 4ft, plus 18". plus lets say another 12" for your lights, cords, filters, fans, etc...thats 6-1/2 feet. which is the size of your box...so your plants (after budding) would have to be less than 4ft. This can be difficult to obtain with different strains, big containers, etc.

But, you should be on track if you put as much effort into the actual grow, as you did with your drawing lol...Good luck to ya mate!
 

NewbGrower^.^

Active Member
Get a decent exhaust fan to suck air from both chambers, the hood, and then blow through a carbon filter on top of the box. Make sure all intakes are as low as possible and keep the lights right at the top of the cabinet. Many reasons.... Heat from lights will stay only at top of cab and the exhaust is already up there making it convenient. Plants that I grow always grow faster when they are raised off the ground. They just don't seem to grow as fast when they are on the ground =/ Now when I get t5's I am going to keep them towards the top of my tent always, but you don't really need to as they create minimal heat and raising vegging plants 5 feet can be a pain when theyre 2 inches tall xD Get I'd say a 6" inline fan and have it y'd out to both cab section sucking air out and then blown through the carbon scrubber on the top. Best way I can think of doing it.
Good luck
 

tip top toker

Well-Known Member
I like the look of it, but something i found, that i had not accounted for, was i eventually wanted to keep a mother or two when i fou/nd pheno's and strains worth holding onto for a few grows/indefinately. I'd advise taking that into account (also means you can clone off real easy and quick

Other than that, looks great :)
 

darkdestruction420

Well-Known Member
with having a cooltube/forced air coold hood you should be able to easily keep it 6 inches from the plants. I'd get an adjustable light hangers.Sunrise Hi-Low Reflector Hangers or similar ones is what i'd use, The difference between 12-18 inches and 4-6 inches is huge in my experiences. so youll want to keep the lights as close as possible and slowly raise them as the plants get taller and taller. You could get some more fluoro tubes and use them in the flowering chamber for sidelighting, i strongly recommend you do. Do not buy those duct/booster fans or you will regret it. I bought very similar ones and was extremely disappointed, they lose their power from the smallest little things like the ducting being on a slight angle and stuff like that. I am very satisfied with the can fan though.
 
Thank you guys very much for your well thought out feed back.

LetricBud, I'm not too calculating and precise, but I'm trying to be; measure twice, cut once and all that good stuff. =)

You might want to make it so that the carbon filter scrubs both chambers...Veg can get smelly as well.
I just learned that. Here is my revised design. Not too many changes really, just intakes coming in through the veg cab and being sucked into the flowering cab through a light proof darkroom louver. I also noted that my hood is sealed which was not illustrated at all before.




I am venting Approximately 100 cubic feet. It seems that with the fan pictured having to pull through the flower cab intakes, light proof louver and subsequently the veg cab intakes, it should be efficient in swapping the air at least 1.5 times a minute. Is this too low? I believe I've read it should be anywhere between 3-5.

like the look of it, but something i found, that i had not accounted for, was i eventually wanted to keep a mother or two when i fou/nd pheno's and strains worth holding onto for a few grows/indefinately. I'd advise taking that into account (also means you can clone off real easy and quick
I've thought of this as well but I'm not sure what I'm going to do. I was thinking that I might try and maintain a mom in my veg cab or even just outside. I'm also considering taking clones from the flowering plants.

with having a cooltube/forced air coold hood you should be able to easily keep it 6 inches from the plants. I'd get an adjustable light hangers.Sunrise Hi-Low Reflector Hangers or similar ones is what i'd use, The difference between 12-18 inches and 4-6 inches is huge in my experiences. so youll want to keep the lights as close as possible and slowly raise them as the plants get taller and taller. You could get some more fluoro tubes and use them in the flowering chamber for sidelighting, i strongly recommend you do. Do not buy those duct/booster fans or you will regret it. I bought very similar ones and was extremely disappointed, they lose their power from the smallest little things like the ducting being on a slight angle and stuff like that. I am very satisfied with the can fan though.
Thanks for the heads up regarding the booster fan. I think I'm going to keep everything at the top so I can try and get away with using a weaker fan to vent the hood and electrical room. Rest assured though I will be thinking about your post as I'm trying to balance my flowering plants on top of whatever. ;) I will look into the side fluoros as well.

Again, thank you guys for taking the time to check this out. =)
 

NewbGrower^.^

Active Member
Try not to have any intakes on top. It will mess with your temps. Intakes on bottom so the cool air is at the bottom along with all the c02 the plants need, it then rises naturally since as it warms since warm air rises. The exhaust helps pull up the cool air as well. Looking good mate =]
 

darkdestruction420

Well-Known Member
flowering clones will work extremely well for you! i highly advise you use the technique. people will tell you its best to clone from a vegging plant, but thats just their opinions, most of the time based on no real evidence other than they saw someone else say it and took it for a fact instead of it being just the persons opinion. IMO flowering clones are much better in almost all cases, they make great mothers too if you wanted to go that route and keep mothers for taking clones in veg. I'll get you some info, brb
 

darkdestruction420

Well-Known Member
What is a Flowering Clone?

This question arises just about everytime I mention the wonderful advantages of the Flowering clone. So, to answer a few questions that get asked frequently. I see a need for this post. A long while back a man named feral introduced us to a new way of taking clones that has taken away the need to top plants or try the fimming technique. Not only do they root well. They also will blow you away with how fast they develop branches.

What is a flowering clone?
Simply put, it is a clone taken at or around 21 days flowering or later. Day 21 seems to be the best time but clones can be taken at any point thereafter and you will get the same effect. Keep in mind. This isnt written in stone. I dont have facts for you but I do have experience with these litte giants. I just want to share something that may increase a yeild for someone out there. Keeping the numbers of plants down is a good idea for alot of growers out there. Medical growers often will have limits. If your out there and you have a medical card. It cant be stressed enough that you follow the guidelines. You guys are the bright future for mj reform in many countries. I can only envy you at the moment but one of these days I hope to be able to grow without so much fear. Okay, that said...lol. I knew I shouldnt have eaten those cookies before starting to write today...lol. I have taken clones just prior to harvest and had no problem rooting them. There are many myths out there concerning a flowering clones ability to root. As in many myths the clones get a bad rap. The truth is, a flowering clone is a fully mature plant. It is ready and willing to root quickly to continue its flowering process. The cambium layer is mature at this point making the formation of roots easier. The cambium layer is a celluar layer just below the bark from where the roots come from. So, truth is. They will and do root well.

Why use a flowering clone?
This is a simple question to answer. Just take a look at the attatched pictures. The branching power of the flowering clone is unbelievable compaired to any other clone I've dealt with. In fact, one usually has to prune some of these branches before flowering starts to direct energy into the larger cola's. I guess the proper question here is why one wouldnt use a flowering clone? I have seen products out there that boast that they stimulate branching. Lol.... why spend money on that when massive branching is simply a few clips away? Let me give you an example. I am currently growing a scrog with a single plant on each side. The screens are 3'x3'. I have 112 holes to be filled in each screen. Out of the 224 holes only 24 do not have a budsite in them. I counted the budsites on one half of one screen and came up with 62 so far and Im only 23 days into flowering so far. I've done seed grows in this fashion and never come up with the amount of sites I get with flowering clones. Another great application for the flowering clone is growing outdoors. I gave thirty of these little jewels to an outdoor cultivator a few years back. All the plants stayed low and got super bushy. To avoid detection a small profile plant is ideal for outdoor cultivators. Try this method once and I imagine you will never take a vegging clone again.

What is the best method to grow these clones?
I prefer a Scrog (screen of green) but alot of people out there use them for the natural way of growing. These clones are just plain old effective no mater which way you grow. They can even be used in the SOG (sea of green) method. Flowering clones in this application will grow straight up and form a nice large cola about 14-18 inches long if started into flowering at less than 6inches. Hydro bubblers, ebb n flo, turbotank, coco or soil these babies rock.

How do I take a Flowering Clone?
Just as you would any other clone. No special handling is needed here. Treat the clones as you would any other. Cut, scrap, dip and then into the medium. Is this your first time taking cloning? Have no fear. Just jump in there and clip away at them. Take a few more clones than you expect to use. This way if a few fail, you will have enough to get started. There are numerous guides and how to threads at this site to help you with the details (use the search tool to find what you need). I often times see new gardeners that are apprehensive about taking clones but these fears are quickly taken away with a little hands on experience. You have to find a system that works for you and stick with it. Remember the old saying, if it aint broke dont fix it. Well, that applies in cloning. Once you find what works for you stay with it.

How long do they take to root?
These clones usually are a little slower to regenerate but not to bad. I average about 14days till I start to see roots coming out the bottom of the rockwool cubes. That time will vary a little it seems with different strains. Some of them take forever and some root quickly. The clones should stay perky and upright. A small flo right above the humidity dome is all they need for light. Remove the humidity dome at least once a day to allow some fresh air inside. Do not walk off and forget about it. They will die quickly if left in the open air to long without a root system to support them. If the plants begin to wilt while the hood is off. This tells you that they have not formed roots yet. They still rely on the humidity to support their needs. Also, keep an eye out for new growth forming. Once it starts to emerge you have roots forming and the plant is responding well to its environment. Once I see roots starting to poke out the bottom I remove the paper and sink them into whatever medium I'm using. I normally will not wait for many roots to show. Once they show a few roots they can be transfered.The mature clone will start to throw out unserated leaves at first and it kinda looks a little odd. Not to worry though. Right behind the unserated leaves will emerge the normal leaf sets. Once they start to come around you will see the branching ability of these clones. Sometimes its best to at least tie down some main branches to promote a wider plant. Multiple cola's will form from these tie downs. A week prior to flowering a pruning session happens and once more at the two week period of flowering. You have to remember to leave yourself a few nice clones to be taken in the third week.

What mixture of nutrients do I use for these clones?
This may be a debateable item but this is what I do. I use a one gallon milk jug and keep it just for clones. I let the chlorine burn off first. Then add a capful of bloom, capful of B1 complex, capful of h2o2 and one half teaspoon of Dark Energy. I then soak the rockwool cubes in the solution overnite and then select my clones when the lamps come on in the morning. Since I've started using this mixture I have had minimal yellowing in the clones and the sucesss rate has been better.

Warmth is Key!
Important to remember that a little warmth for the new cuttings helps them along. I place my small container on top of a towel that rests upon a normal household heating pad on the low setting. This extra warmth not only keeps the new cuttings warm and cozy. It also makes the dome sweat keeping it damp constantly. I always add a small amount of mixture mentioned above to the rocks below. Then its time to sit back and wait. Dont ya hate that part? lol.

Will these clones improve my yeild?
Lol.... compaired to topping and fimming yes this will improve your harvest and make it happen faster. I truely do not think Im going out on a limb here (lol). When I say they will improve your grows I can say from experience that if done correctly it will without a doubt. When you top a plant everything stops. With a flowering clone that never happens. Never a slowdown. Its full tilt boogie from the time they start to regenerate till harvest time.


The pictures below speak volumes for the clones. I've been using them for a long time now and well, I just cant see another way of getting this much out of a plant. Give it a try and see for yourself. Have fun and stay safe, greenmonster714

This is another greenmonster714 post. I will post pictures later.

rf

You can clone a plant at any time in it's life cycle. Top branches are the hardest to clone though as they hold most of the growth hormones (auxins) When you top or bend a top over to where it's below some of the lower branches you redirect these auxins to lower branches which is why you suddenly get a rush of growth from the lower branches. The auxins have been redirected. By cloning lower branches you avoid alot of the growth hormones as they are in the top branches. This is why lower branches clone easier. They can concentrate on root developement instead of upwards growth.
I hope this makes sense here. I just medicated and it's some good stuff.:D

rf

PS Here are the pictures that were suppose to go to the main post.



 
Try not to have any intakes on top. It will mess with your temps. Intakes on bottom so the cool air is at the bottom along with all the c02 the plants need, it then rises naturally since as it warms since warm air rises. The exhaust helps pull up the cool air as well. Looking good mate =]
The intakes at the the top of the cab are the beginning of an isolated system having air only being pulled through the electrical cab and then through ducting connected to the sealed hood and then straight out of the cab right next to the other exhaust. This is just to get air moving over my ballasts and light bulb to help control temps in the cab. This is exactly what I was debating using the booster fan for since it's pretty much a straight shot with the exception of the 90* angles at the intakes.

darkdestruction420, Thanks for the info! I've seen similar things when a friend's plants went from flowering back into vegging. =)
 

NewbGrower^.^

Active Member
The intakes at the the top of the cab are the beginning of an isolated system having air only being pulled through the electrical cab and then through ducting connected to the sealed hood and then straight out of the cab right next to the other exhaust. This is just to get air moving over my ballasts and light bulb to help control temps in the cab. This is exactly what I was debating using the booster fan for since it's pretty much a straight shot with the exception of the 90* angles at the intakes.

darkdestruction420, Thanks for the info! I've seen similar things when a friend's plants went from flowering back into vegging. =)
So does the left side have intakes at the bottom? What I'm saying is you will have higher temps if you have all your intakes up top. Of course this doesn't count for seperate ducting only for like cooltubes
 
^
The left side has intakes in the middle of the whole cab, which is the bottom of the veg cab. I could have it coming in through the bottom of the veg cab but then it would also need to suck through intakes at the bottom of the supply cab. I think I'll risk the temperature change about 3' up.
 

NewbGrower^.^

Active Member
Gotcha Just make sure the intakes are as long as they can be in the certain veg section ;] I understand the supply cab thing now haha smart man
 

Punk

Well-Known Member
Take the advice of using a high power fan instead of the booster. In regards to controling temps, booster fans are like not having a fan at all, they simply don't work.
 
^ Thanks for the link! That setup looks very legit.

Gotcha Just make sure the intakes are as long as they can be in the certain veg section ;] I understand the supply cab thing now haha smart man
Thank you! But you're questioning of my design led me to the thought "Well shoot, why can't the supplies cab be in the middle enabling me to drop the veg cab down so I can take in cooler air?". All I would have to do is run wires through the supplies cab up to the electrical cab. Great idea NewbGrower, I think I'll try it. =D
Take the advice of using a high power fan instead of the booster. In regards to controling temps, booster fans are like not having a fan at all, they simply don't work.
Well I realize that it hasn't worked for hundreds of others but you know, I think it'll work for me. ;) No, I'm starting to realize that I will probably need another fan or do as someone else mentioned and Y it out with a fan that can handle both systems.

Thanks for your input g(als)uys. =)
 
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