4x4 Tent - Blue Hash and A-Train

[Bob Smith]

Rubber, the best preventive medicine is really keep things clean and sterile in there.

That being said, when I see too many fungus gnats for my liking, I spray them with a bottle of $5 organic insecticide/miticide/fungicide from WalMart, and it seems to do the trick every time.

I also bought SM-90 just in case I might ever have a "real problem", but (knock on wood) that hasn't happened yet.

Tried to find one of my pics of it, but they're hidden somewhere - if you go to my journal in the first post, there's a pic of it like four or five pics down, if memory serves.

BTW, finished the tent, posting pics now.

 

[smokingrubber]

Cleaned and refilled the reservior last night. It took about 15 minutes to pump the old nutes into the kitchen sink. Then I unplugged all of the equipment and took the barrel out back. Scrubbed it with bleach and rinsed it 4 or 5 times. I set it all back up and turned on the RO . . . 6 hours to fill 40 gallons. Then I added the nutrients.

Fresh water started at:
6.50 Ph
10 ppm

I added:
500 ml FloraGro
300 ml FloraMicro
100 ml FloraBloom
40 ml Floralicious Plus
400 ml FloraBlend
120 ml SM-90
200 ml Pro-Silicate

This brought it to 1150 ppm & 6.50 ph. I didn't know how stable the ph was going to be so I did not adjust it last night. I ran the water cycle one time before Light's Out and changed the watering cycle to once every 3 hours. That may be too often? I will keep an eye on it over the next couple days and I may go to every 4 hrs. The ph was stable at 6.50 when I got up this morning so I brought it down to 6.00. I will monitor that too.

What is the perfect ph level? They always give you a range of 6.5 - 5.5 or something like that, but what is THE perfect ph to aim at?

I also foliar sprayed SM-90 twice. It left some shiny spots, but that's to be expected when you're spraying an oil. If it doesn't do something noticable I probably won't be doing it too often. Here is a pic. I will have to tie the bigger ones again today or tomorrow.

What do you think?

 

[smokingrubber]

I have been giving serious thought to the next phase of construction and automation. I am not convinced that a Sentinal is the best way to go. Have any of you used this controller? http://www.cannabisculture.com/articles/4534.html

It's expensive, but if it does what it says then it would seem like a no-brainer. I found it for 1200. I'm getting a fatty check soon so my $ worries will be gone. It looks like I could spend another 3k on environmental controls in this round. I think it's worth it if you read the testimonials: http://www.harvest-master.com/casestudies.html But those are testimonials on THIER website so who knows how reliable they are. I definately need a dehimidifier and an AC so those are not really extra items. This would just be the best way to control it all.

That's a lot of machine to control a 4x4 tent, but I can upgrade the tent next year and transfer all the controls into that. I'm thinking a 4x8 would be perfect?

 

[Bob Smith]

I have been giving serious thought to the next phase of construction and automation. I am not convinced that a Sentinal is the best way to go. Have any of you used this controller? http://www.cannabisculture.com/articles/4534.html

It's expensive, but if it does what it says then it would seem like a no-brainer. I found it for 1200. I'm getting a fatty check soon so my $ worries will be gone. It looks like I could spend another 3k on environmental controls in this round. I think it's worth it if you read the testimonials: http://www.harvest-master.com/casestudies.html But those are testimonials on THIER website so who knows how reliable they are. I definately need a dehimidifier and an AC so those are not really extra items. This would just be the best way to control it all.

That's a lot of machine to control a 4x4 tent, but I can upgrade the tent next year and transfer all the controls into that. I'm thinking a 4x8 would be perfect?

Lol..........I'm also buying all my stuff with the expectation of moving into a 4x8 tent sooner rather then later.

As far as the atmospheric controller goes, what exactly does that do that a Sentinel doesn't? Looks like it might have the "dual" cooling settings that we were talking about in my thread, but that can be fixed by buying that $35 Amazon.com thermostat - if that's the only different, the $510 + $35 Sentinel seems like a much better deal then that one for $1200, no? Unless I'm missing something else.......

BTW, plants look great man.

EDIT: If you're getting an AC to run in the tent, then you don't need a dehumidifier..............the AC will remove more water by itself, and on days when it's not hot enough to have the AC running, you can just set it to dehumidify.

Also, post a link of anything on here before you buy it - for atmospheric controllers, you need to make sure that they have a "restore" function which will start them up again as soon as they get power, as most newer models are electronic and need to be manually restarted after losing power, which makes them worthless for atmospheric controllers.

 

[smokingrubber]

I just got my ELECTRIC BILL ... $168 ... up from $40 last month sonofa . . . !

 

[smokingrubber]

The controller is a "learning" controller. It learns what your system does and makes everything perfect. It also has the ability to speed up the harvest time by several WEEKS. At least it says it has that ability!

Read the links I included. The thing is pretty incredible if it does what it says it does. It does a LOT more than the sentinal imo.

 

[Bob Smith]

The controller is a "learning" controller. It learns what your system does and makes everything perfect. It also has the ability to speed up the harvest time by several WEEKS. At least it says it has that ability!

Read the links I included. The thing is pretty incredible if it does what it says it does. It does a LOT more than the sentinal imo.

Read it, it's hogwash.

It can't do anything that you can't do with a Sentinel (sometimes with a minor modification or buying a $35 thermostat or $10 timer).

The gist is that going to an 18 hour day with 14 hours on and 4 hours off for veg at 2000PPMs of CO2 is what quickened his harvest time - you can do that with a timer for the lights and a Sentinel.

I mean, it's your call, but that extra $700 could be better used, IMHO.

 

[smokingrubber]

Yeah, I'm inclined to disregard the improved cycle time claims. I mean, that would be nice . . . but I don't really buy it cuz we WOULD HAVE HEARD ABOUT IT BEFORE NOW! But hey, most growers that have finished their grow rooms and KNOW what they're doing . . . they don't sit around and share their knowledge on these forums.

Still, I like the idea of it learning how my space can be controlled and adapting to it. Sentinal doesn't claim to do that. It shuts the fans off when the Co2 is on, that's about it.

Like you, once I'm stuck on an item it's hard to peel me off. My check won't be here for another 2 weeks so I've got time to investigate everything. I figure, if the thing were a piece of crap I would find them littering ebay. They're not. I will keep looking for people that are using them real-world.

 

[Bob Smith]

Yeah, I'm inclined to disregard the improved cycle time claims. I mean, that would be nice . . . but I don't really buy it cuz we WOULD HAVE HEARD ABOUT IT BEFORE NOW! But hey, most growers that have finished their grow rooms and KNOW what they're doing . . . they don't sit around and share their knowledge on these forums.

Still, I like the idea of it learning how my space can be controlled and adapting to it. Sentinal doesn't claim to do that. It shuts the fans off when the Co2 is on, that's about it.

Like you, once I'm stuck on an item it's hard to peel me off. My check won't be here for another 2 weeks so I've got time to investigate everything. I figure, if the thing were a piece of crap I would find them littering ebay. They're not. I will keep looking for people that are using them real-world.

Meh, I could get "peeled off" of that one pretty quick - sounds like snake oil.

Give me a hard and fast example of how that "learns and adapts" to a space, and I might change my mind.

IMHO, atmospheric controllers are there to help you stay within a temp/humidity/CO2 level that you desire (which the Sentinel does, very, very well), not to tell me what the best levels are - I've got RIU and my eyes for that.

Anyways, in case you haven't figured it out, I'm quite skeptical about it.

 

[smokingrubber]

That's good! Go ahead and shoot holes in it cuz I don't have 1200 burning a hole in my pocket or anything. I just want the best long-term option and I don't want to spend 500 on a sentinal then realize something better was available. Also, I'm hoping that this controller doesn't make me go through 20lbs of Co2 every week. I want a controlled environment, just like you do. Since I'm not an expert at knowing and diagnosing the "perfect" temp/RH/Co2 combination levels at various stages of growth. . . it would help if a computer could do it for me. Seems like an Environmental Controller for Dummies (with too much $). Certainly COULD be worth the extra 700.

Retail on the fucker is 1600! I thought I found a deal!

 

[Bob Smith]

That's good! Go ahead and shoot holes in it cuz I don't have 1200 burning a hole in my pocket or anything. I just want the best long-term option and I don't want to spend 500 on a sentinal then realize something better was available. Also, I'm hoping that this controller doesn't make me go through 20lbs of Co2 every week. I want a controlled environment, just like you do. Since I'm not an expert at knowing and diagnosing the "perfect" temp/RH/Co2 combination levels at various stages of growth. . . it would help if a computer could do it for me. Seems like an Environmental Controller for Dummies (with too much $). Certainly COULD be worth the extra 700.

Retail on the fucker is 1600! I thought I found a deal!

Just think, you can either get that controller, or you can get a Sentinel with a Hydrogen and a 1K HPS.

No brainer, to me, but I'd be curious to hear what other people's thoughts are.

And as far as the "perfect" environment, 80F with 50-60% humidity and 1500PPMs of CO2 are good for vegging, and just take the humidity down for flower.

There you go, perfect

Don't need to spend an additional $700 for a box to tell me (or you) what we already know...........don't waste your money, man.

 

[smokingrubber]

If it's worthless I can resell it for almost full price on ebay I'd love to talk to people that are using it already. I've got a couple weeks to do more research. I'm still leaning toward purchasing it though.

Imagine the fun I could have with fast crop-cycles every 5 or 6 weeks Not that I would go to that straight away, but after awhile it would be interesting to play with.

 

[Bob Smith]

If it's worthless I can resell it for almost full price on ebay I'd love to talk to people that are using it already. I've got a couple weeks to do more research. I'm still leaning toward purchasing it though.

Imagine the fun I could have with fast crop-cycles every 5 or 6 weeks Not that I would go to that straight away, but after awhile it would be interesting to play with.

I'll let someone else comment and verify for you, but there's no box that makes plants grow faster - we can give them the perfect environment (which a Sentinel does), and then it's on them.

The rest of that is marketing hype - but, do your research, and let me (us) know what you find out.

EDIT: BTW, the only way to not go through a bottle of CO2 per week is to lower the PPM setpoint or to get a generator - there's no other options.

 

[laserbrn]

I'll let someone else comment and verify for you, but there's no box that makes plants grow faster - we can give them the perfect environment (which a Sentinel does), and then it's on them.

The rest of that is marketing hype - but, do your research, and let me (us) know what you find out.

EDIT: BTW, the only way to not go through a bottle of CO2 per week is to lower the PPM setpoint or to get a generator - there's no other options.

I've been refraining from commenting. But it does sound like you're just TRYING to throw money at this box to make it a "superbox" and I don't think you're going to ever see the ROI on the cash your willing to lay out.

You can't make the plants grow and flower in 6 weeks. The plants take as long to flower as they take, you can't speed it up. Having a "perfect" environment will only get you so far, this isn't a science experiment, it's just growing plants.

You want bigger buds? You want higher yields? The game is: "How much light can I pack into as large a space as I can have and MAINTAIN a good environment?"

There isn't a secret way around it, you need more plants, more space, and more light to grow more bud. Don't waste your money chasing dreams.

 

[smokingrubber]

So far, I'm not real impressed with their availablity and accessability. Their website shows an address that comes up as a strip mall in Carson City. Their phone number is answered by a receptionist that claims everyone is in a meeting... but they have 24/7 phone support? Someone is going to call me back in a few minutes and I plan to get to the bottom of this.

I also found a thread on another forum where this guy was waiting for his unit to arrive. He said someone warned him about faulty wiring . . . and his shit fried as soon as he plugged it in. This was back in '07 though. If it were a real problem now, I would have found complaints about it I'm sure. Still, it doesn't appear to be the kind of business that sells a lot of product and spends a ton on R&D. Damnit.

EDIT: I am purposefully NOT including the name of the company or the name of the product in these posts because I don't want every future google search leading people here, where I have no solid facts or information to provide.

 

[Bob Smith]

So far, I'm not real impressed with their availablity and accessability. Their website shows an address that comes up as a strip mall in Carson City. Their phone number is answered by a receptionist that claims everyone is in a meeting... but they have 24/7 phone support? Someone is going to call me back in a few minutes and I plan to get to the bottom of this.

I also found a thread on another forum where this guy was waiting for his unit to arrive. He said someone warned him about faulty wiring . . . and his shit fried as soon as he plugged it in. This was back in '07 though. If it were a real problem now, I would have found complaints about it I'm sure. Still, it doesn't appear to be the kind of business that sells a lot of product and spends a ton on R&D. Damnit.

EDIT: I am purposefully NOT including the name of the company or the name of the product in these posts because I don't want every future google search leading people here, where I have no solid facts or information to provide.

So, to recap:

1) Both Laser and me have affirmed that plants can only grow as fast as nature allows, and that providing the proper environment is the only way for them to reach their full potential

2) This product had issues back in 2007, which may or may not have been fixed

3) They are hard to reach and don't seem to have great customer support

4) It costs $700 more then the Sentinel

5) The Sentinel has countless great reviews from almost everyone who's ever used it, including yours truly

6) Besides the snake oil claim of artificial intelligence making your plants grow at a physically impossible rate, there's no difference between the two units

Does that about sum it up?

C'mon dude, just trust us and save your money............

 

[smokingrubber]

I've been refraining from commenting. But it does sound like you're just TRYING to throw money at this box to make it a "superbox" and I don't think you're going to ever see the ROI on the cash your willing to lay out.

You can't make the plants grow and flower in 6 weeks. The plants take as long to flower as they take, you can't speed it up. Having a "perfect" environment will only get you so far, this isn't a science experiment, it's just growing plants.

You want bigger buds? You want higher yields? The game is: "How much light can I pack into as large a space as I can have and MAINTAIN a good environment?"

There isn't a secret way around it, you need more plants, more space, and more light to grow more bud. Don't waste your money chasing dreams.

I'm not "trying" to throw money at it. Im trying NOT to! This is a product that SHOULD be available. The Sentinal should be able to do everything this thing does. Why is this the only company out there that provides enough sensors and outputs to control everything that needs to be controlled? This is a product that should be available with a computerized interface at half this price. This is almost 2010 and everything should be computer controlled by now imo. . . especially with all the money we like to throw at these grows.

If the thing does what it claims, it's worth the $. I need a demonstation first though.

 

[Bob Smith]

I'm not "trying" to throw money at it. Im trying NOT to! This is a product that SHOULD be available. The Sentinal should be able to do everything this thing does. Why is this the only company out there that provides enough sensors and outputs to control everything that needs to be controlled? This is a product that should be available with a computerized interface at half this price. This is almost 2010 and everything should be computer controlled by now imo. . . especially with all the money we like to throw at these grows.

If the thing does what it claims, it's worth the $. I need a demonstation first though.

The Sentinel with a $10 timer for your lights and a $35 thermostat for your lightcooling fan does everything this does.

I actually wouldn't even use a light timer if the Sentinel had it - with everything else it controls, it would trip a circuit - need to have the dehumidifer and heater on their own circuits separate from the 1K.

In fact, I'd imagine you'd need to buy a relay to be able to operate everything from that, unless you have a dedicated 40 amp breaker in there (which still wouldn't handle everything when you upgrade to an 8x4 with two 1Ks).

All right, I've said my piece, whatever you decide is what you decide.

 

[smokingrubber]

I know I know. It's looking more and more iffy the farther I dig. I DO want the perfect controller to create the perfect room environment and they're playing to my desires. I don't want to spend that much dough on the friggin thing but I want ... I want ... I want.

Well I've got 2 weeks to chew on it some more. Not in a big hurry and I'm glad I'm doing some homework. Thanks for your opinion, it DOES help. Honestly, there is not much info / reviews available on the Sentinal either. Its all a big crap-shoot.

 

[laserbrn]

If you had a 15x15 you were growin in then the sentinel would be a worthwhile investment. I didn't read back through the thread, but did this start with just wanting the Co2 controller? Are you looking at a Sentinel CHHC-1? My buddy has one of these and it works awesome. It doesn't claim to suck your dick when you turn it on like the one you are looking at, but wild claims are easy to make.

It does exactly what it says it does, you program the timers for the lights, you set all your environmental variables and it voila, it takes care of it for you. I believe it has the built in "Anti-Cook" that the sentinel light timers have so if something goes wrong and your "cooling device" stops working and the temp keeps rising it'll shut the lights off to get the room to cool back down.

THAT is the only reason I would purchase the Sentinel even. It hurts when 13 weeks of work goes down the toilet because a fuckin' fan died while you were away. Co2 is nice, but it's expensive and annoying to fill so I don't bother with it. The time it would take, the attention it would attract and the cost have always made me feel it would take to long to b worthwhile.

Again....15x15 sealed room, yeah I'm gonna run the sit. My 4x4 tent? A little silly.