The new pump...

[cheshirez]

looks good

 

[The Mad Hatter]

I read your one post that said the hose barbs are stainless steel. I'm guessing that the whole thing is stainless steel. awesome.. is the cost out of range for a hydro hobbiest like me?

here's that link http://growmanager.sourceforge.net/

Well most of this fittings are not too expensive... The nozzles are about $9 each, the barbs are $7... Tees are about $3.50... Various sections of connecting pipe (Technically threaded nipples) run from a few bucks to upwards of $10 for the 8" inch sections... Honestly not much more expensive then buying stuff at a hydro shop... And I expect it to literally last a lifetime!

The sprayers put out considerably more volume then the common plastic units such as those used in the "Harvest a pound every three 3 weeks" thread -- no disrespect here or anything... I love that guys designs they are super clean, built out of off the shelf parts... And the article in HT featuring his setup was defiantly part of my inspiration for this... But this point is, you could probably get away with just 2 or 3 of the nozzles I'm using and a longer spray time if you were going with large rubber maid bins rather then the buckets I'm using...

I simply wanted more modularity, and the ability to run any give bucket with a custom formula if need be...

So no... I would say it's within' reach of the hobby grower for sure... It just all comes down to scale.

And while I'm not sure what kind of pump you got, what I have is a 330GPH clear water pump from Harbor Freight... It was on sale for $32, I paid them $4 for a no-fault warranty -- they said anything short of dropping it on the floor, just bring it back... Hope that recognize it

I gave it a rattle can paint job (Just scuffed it with a green 3M pad, and shot it with Valspar outdoor paint) and I replaced the plastic enclosure on top with my own mostly because I cracked the power terminal while tightening down a bolt (You have to wire your own cord in). I figured with the euro color scheme it would end up looking like something a bit more up market

Later this week, once I get the main system done, I'll be building a smaller self-contained POD for growing lettuces (No bullshit as I have many hungry rodents that are becoming a bit of a burden to feed... One rabbit (naturally) and two Guinea pigs... I'll be making it with leftovers, but the total cost should be around $100-200 for something that can support 8-12 4" net pots... If it works out, and there is some interest I might end up selling this as kits -- so you could just save your penny's for one of those too

As far as the oil burner nozzles go I don't have a clue... Droplet size is criticle for this sort of this with 50µm being the sweet spot for proper absorption... If you test it and get a lot of vapor coming out the top of your container your doing okay.... I see spray go up a few feet when I pass a laser beam through it... If you get something similar to a low lying fog your under 20µm and that is not doing you much good...

What you want to a nice high humidity environment where the moisture hangs in the air for a bit before recombining on the walls...

Hope that answers some of your questions -- good luck!

T.M.H.

 

[The Mad Hatter]

looks good

Thanks man!

You know you really need a good avatar

Might I suggest:

 

[The Mad Hatter]

I read your one post that said the hose barbs are stainless steel. I'm guessing that the whole thing is stainless steel. awesome.. is the cost out of range for a hydro hobbiest like me?

here's that link http://growmanager.sourceforge.net/

Took a look last night... Doesn't seem to have a binary available... Which is a shame... But I'll keep my eye on the project for sure. Good luck with yours too...

I've been fooling around in AFX with the thought that I might make a web based front end for the control system.

Maybe even with a touch panel if this harvest is good to me I really liked the heads up display at the end of District 9... So I kind of modeled it on that. It's a side project though so I don't know when I'll get to it again... But I've been sketching and I would like to have a large clock style calendar running allong the bottom... Key dates and such...

[youtube]e9fRDy85P2Q[/youtube]

 

[The Mad Hatter]

So I spent waaaaaaay to much time making this stand... And it's still not quite done -- but I have a feeling it will be pressed into service anyway... Just don't feel like spending $6 for each and every pipe cap... I mean really... What's the deal... Ever other 3" pipe fitting costs a few bucks... Caps though are like 2x the price of everything else... Retarded. I'm sure I can order them from somewhere... It's just a pain

Well without further whinging...

Basic PVC for most of it... I used a hole saw and cut through the 3" to keep things looking clean. Still need the aforementioned caps... And I'll probably hit the whole thing up with the laser and level off the feet. The rails on the side are bent aluminum... Not really required, but that's never stopped me before

Cat tested, cat approved.

The whole thing did end up a bit narrow... Glad it has more legs then a centipede...

Well... Just 3 more of those to go and a little bit of work in the room and we'll be ready to grow... I have a grose excess of large linear actuators... So I have something a bit fun planned for the door... Don't know if I'll be posting pictures of that or not though...

 

[tree farmer]

So I spent waaaaaaay to much time making this stand... And it's still not quite done -- but I have a feeling it will be pressed into service anyway... Just don't feel like spending $6 for each and every pipe cap... I mean really... What's the deal... Ever other 3" pipe fitting costs a few bucks... Caps though are like 2x the price of everything else... Retarded. I'm sure I can order them from somewhere... It's just a pain

Well without further whinging...

Basic PVC for most of it... I used a hole saw and cut through the 3" to keep things looking clean. Still need the aforementioned caps... And I'll probably hit the whole thing up with the laser and level off the feet. The rails on the side are bent aluminum... Not really required, but that's never stopped me before

Cat tested, cat approved.

The whole thing did end up a bit narrow... Glad it has more legs then a centipede...

Well... Just 3 more of those to go and a little bit of work in the room and we'll be ready to grow... I have a grose excess of large linear actuators... So I have something a bit fun planned for the door... Don't know if I'll be posting pictures of that or not though...

looking good. you sure dont do things half way when you do them. youll be running those 5 gallon pails for awhile with all the work you put into those stands. you must have some good headroom where these are going. ya i have a pretty cool door setup too but like you i wouldnt post it.

well just a heads up when you do start that you might not be able to use the same EC levels your use to. and shit happens rather quick if you dont have it dialed in. so be ready.

 

[The Mad Hatter]

looking good. you sure dont do things half way when you do them. youll be running those 5 gallon pails for awhile with all the work you put into those stands. you must have some good headroom where these are going. ya i have a pretty cool door setup too but like you i wouldnt post it.

well just a heads up when you do start that you might not be able to use the same EC levels your use to. and shit happens rather quick if you dont have it dialed in. so be ready.

I do have a tendency to get caught up in a project

I had not intended to make these quite as complex as they turned out... But once I got a simple version done I just didn't feel they were very stable... The buckets wanted to slip around... And only 3 sets of legs made the whole thing a bit to flexible... But when I got close to finishing up I still felt like the buckets could go sliding off the side, so I added the rails...

Of course sometimes it's just an excuse to buy more tools But when I thought about what a catastrophic bummer it would be if this whole business ended up going over I figured it would be worthwhile in the end...

But yeah -- it does kind of commit me to the buckets. I hope that by keeping them small and just turning the crops more often it will end up working out. But if all else fails I'll just use the buckets as a breeder system... Put a few smaller net pots in each one and then work on something bigger...

The ceiling is 7.5' -12" for the stands and another 12" for the buckets and giving myself another 12" for the lights I should still have 5.5' of usable space... Cutting it a bit close, to be sure... But I think I can work with it.

Should at least keep me from having to bend over to much!

Somewhere here I've borked a dimension, cuz' the buckets come to almost the door line. But the picture was just to pretty not to show off



T.M.H.

 

[The Mad Hatter]

Well... I've been hanging drywall and doing other menial preparatory tasks for the last week or so... Repainted the pump and stuff gloss black... Not that there was anything wrong with euro blue/orange... But with everything else coming out black and silver it just clashed a bit to much... Am I insane? Yes, of course But thats what art school will do to you...

I also took a break last night to take a first whack at writing code for the cycle controller... All-in-all I'm rather pleased... Spent about a week playing with this Atmel dev board a few months ago when I ordered it... But that aside it's been more then 10 years since I've written any C, so I was rather surprised that it came back so fast.

Just an overview shot here... From left to right: The LED output board is my status display... Lights let me know which of the 4 channels is currently energized + one light when the pump is on (Have not got the solid state relay for that yet) and one light to let me know the cycle is currently running... Ultimately this thing will probably be hooked to the lighting controller or at least an LDR so the cycle only runs during the day.

In the center is the actual Atmel 128 controller board from Futerlec...

Behind that is the flow sight that came this morning... Best ebay find of the whole damn year! $0.99!!!! I was so happy The thing goes 0-5 GPM, is almost all S.S. and it's just plain pretty. I had really wanted a turbine style gauge so I could hook sensors to to... But I was getting quotes in the $175-350 range... Bleh...

And lastly the AC output board. It's optocoupled triacs, each one capable of switching a few amps... Though the load from the solenoids is much, much less...

I have to admit I'm a bit surprised at the mix of traditional and SM components, but for $29 I'm not about to argue.

The little white chips each pack a photosensor and an LED... The control signal from the microprocessor goes in one end, and the other is hooked up to the triacs (Basically transistors/switches for AC)... So there is no physical connection between the low voltage side and the mains current... And they are even socketed so if one blows it can be replaced... Very nice!

Damn that looks bitchin'




And not that anyone really gives a shit, but here is the sloppy code that runs it all:

/*
* pump_control.c
*
* Created on: Nov 18, 2009
* Author: Peter
*
* Vestion 1.0
* Need to rewrite with constant loop and accumulator timer... i.e. if seconds > 60 activate BANKA...
*/

#define F_CPU 16000000UL // 16Mhz Clock
#include <avr/io.h>
#include <util/delay.h>
#include "sbit.h"

//#define SW1 SBIT(PORTD, 0) // No flippin' switchs for now, will be used for setting bank timing
//#define SW2 SBIT(PORTD, 1)

#define BANKA SBIT(PORTA, 0) // AC Solenoid for bank A nozzles
#define BANKB SBIT(PORTA, 1)
#define BANKC SBIT(PORTA, 2)
#define BANKD SBIT(PORTA, 3)

#define BANKA_DDR SBIT(DDRA, 0)
#define BANKB_DDR SBIT(DDRA, 1)
#define BANKC_DDR SBIT(DDRA, 2)
#define BANKD_DDR SBIT(DDRA, 3)


#define PUMP SBIT(PORTB, 0) // SSR For jet pump
#define PUMP_DDR SBIT(DDRB, 0)

#define PUMP_ON_LED SBIT(PORTC, 0) // Status led for pump
#define CYCLE_RUNNING_LED SBIT(PORTC, 7) // Status led to let us know the cycle is still running even if the pump is off
#define BANKA_LED SBIT(PORTC, 2) // Status led for bank A
#define BANKB_LED SBIT(PORTC, 3) // Status led for bank B
#define BANKC_LED SBIT(PORTC, 4) // Status led for bank C
#define BANKD_LED SBIT(PORTC, 5) // Status led for bank D

#define PUMP_ON_LED_DDR SBIT(DDRC, 0)
#define CYCLE_RUNNING_LED_DDR SBIT(DDRC, 7)
#define BANKA_LED_DDR SBIT(DDRC, 2)
#define BANKB_LED_DDR SBIT(DDRC, 3)
#define BANKC_LED_DDR SBIT(DDRC, 4)
#define BANKD_LED_DDR SBIT(DDRC, 5)

#define MAIN_LOOP 300 // 5 min for the full cycle
#define BANKATIME 60 // 1 min for bank A cycle
#define BANKBTIME 60 // 1 min for bank A cycle
#define BANKCTIME 60 // 1 min for bank A cycle
#define BANKDTIME 60 // 1 min for bank A cycle
#define RUNUP 10 // 10 seconds for the system to pressurize

unsigned char run = 1; // run status... should be tied to photocell or light system on output
unsigned long p_offtime = (MAIN_LOOP - (BANKATIME + BANKBTIME + BANKCTIME + BANKDTIME));


void main() {

BANKA_DDR = 1; // Set DDRs to output
BANKB_DDR = 1;
BANKC_DDR = 1;
BANKD_DDR = 1;

BANKA_LED_DDR = 1;
BANKB_LED_DDR = 1;
BANKC_LED_DDR = 1;
BANKD_LED_DDR = 1;

PUMP_ON_LED_DDR = 1;
CYCLE_RUNNING_LED_DDR = 1;

PUMP_DDR = 1;

PUMP = 0; // Make sure everything defaults to off
CYCLE_RUNNING_LED = 1;
PUMP_ON_LED = 1;

BANKA = 1;
BANKB = 1;
BANKC = 1;
BANKD = 1;

BANKA_LED = 1; // LED Board is ACTIVE LOW!!!
BANKB_LED = 1;
BANKC_LED = 1;
BANKD_LED = 1;



while (run > 0){
CYCLE_RUNNING_LED = 0;
PUMP = 1; // Activate the pump
PUMP_ON_LED = 0; // LED Board is ACTIVE LOW!!!
int i=0;
for(i=0; i < RUNUP; i++){ // Wait 10s for the system to build pressure
_delay_ms(1000);
}

// Run bank A
BANKA = 0; // AC Board is active low
BANKA_LED = 0;
for(i=0; i < BANKATIME; i++){
_delay_ms(1000);
}
BANKA = 1; // Shut off bank A, no need for overlap with pump return
BANKA_LED = 1;

// Run bank B
BANKB = 0;
BANKB_LED = 0;
for(i=0; i < BANKBTIME; i++){
_delay_ms(1000);
}
BANKB = 1;
BANKB_LED = 1;

// Run bank C
BANKC = 0;
BANKC_LED = 0;
for(i=0; i < BANKCTIME; i++){
_delay_ms(1000);
}
BANKC = 1;
BANKC_LED = 1;

// Run bank D
BANKD = 0;
BANKD_LED = 0;
for(i=0; i < BANKDTIME; i++){
_delay_ms(1000);
}
BANKD = 1;
BANKD_LED = 1;


// Shut off pump and wait 1 min
PUMP = 0;
PUMP_ON_LED = 1; // Turn OFF pump ON led (Got to think of some better names)
for(i=0; i < p_offtime; i++){
_delay_ms(1000);
}
}
}

So everything is currently hard set and requires a recompile/flash for any change in timing... The next step is to add a VFD display, and some switches so I can have better status, and make adjustments on the fly.

I'm looking at the best way to do this, but either way... The code will get a total rewrite in the coming weeks... Cuz' what you see up there would make any self respecting programmer cry.

I'll probably end up with either interrupt driven timers... Or perhaps even a real-time kernel... Fancy shit... Think something like the software that runs mission critical stuff like train switches, and you get the idea...

But I needed something I could bang out and make work in a day or two... So there it is... Each output runs for 60 seconds, one after the other... Then there is a one min rest... So 1 min on/4 min off... The neat thing about doing it this way is that I could theoretically run a shitload more nozzles off each bank (Currently plumbed to one one row of 5 20GPH nozzles, with a capacity for 20 each)... Thus a total system capacity of 80 nozzles, all from one 330GPH pump...

Well... That's it for now... Stay safe kids... And don't forget to change that nasty bong water before it spills on your pants.


T.M.H.

 

[tree farmer]

man you really know your shit. jack of all trades it looks like. might take you a while to get everything dialed in but looks like once you do that thing will rock. at least for some nice shrubs. are you planning on using co2. i would love to see what co2 and hp aero does. just some related advice, try and mist as little as possible without drying out and go very low on the nutes EC. less is more ive found. almost to the point of seeming impossible to support rapid growth. you dont want that to just be a high priced NFT machine you built.

 

[The Mad Hatter]

man you really know your shit. jack of all trades it looks like. might take you a while to get everything dialed in but looks like once you do that thing will rock. at least for some nice shrubs. are you planning on using co2. i would love to see what co2 and hp aero does. just some related advice, try and mist as little as possible without drying out and go very low on the nutes EC. less is more ive found. almost to the point of seeming impossible to support rapid growth. you dont want that to just be a high priced NFT machine you built.

Thanks man, I try

I'll definately monitor the humidity level in the buckes when I start dialing in the times... I agree it would be a crying shame to just have NFT.

Likewise with the nutes... I've picked up a good Ec meter off ebay, just need to get a probe now... I always start low and work it up.

What, if I might ask, are you currently running?

I still debating FoxFarm v. Canna... I'm lucky enough to be able to pick either up locally...


Definitely going to have CO2... When I added it to the previous grow I was just stunned... 3 days after adding in a timed tank system things just exploded... It was like opening the door to the emerald city

I'll probably start with a timer... And then work on a regulated system once that's going. I've located a nice infrared type sensor module for about $100, that seems pretty easy to interface too... 1-5v out for 0-2000ppm... Hell I could read it with a voltmeter if need be.


T.M.H.

 

[tree farmer]

Thanks man, I try

I'll definately monitor the humidity level in the buckes when I start dialing in the times... I agree it would be a crying shame to just have NFT.

Likewise with the nutes... I've picked up a good Ec meter off ebay, just need to get a probe now... I always start low and work it up.

What, if I might ask, are you currently running?

I still debating FoxFarm v. Canna... I'm lucky enough to be able to pick either up locally...


Definitely going to have CO2... When I added it to the previous grow I was just stunned... 3 days after adding in a timed tank system things just exploded... It was like opening the door to the emerald city

I'll probably start with a timer... And then work on a regulated system once that's going. I've located a nice infrared type sensor module for about $100, that seems pretty easy to interface too... 1-5v out for 0-2000ppm... Hell I could read it with a voltmeter if need be.


T.M.H.

if i could get canna local i would use them but i cant so im using GH until i can work out how to get canna. EC .5, havent been able to go over that. only at 2sec every 4min. was at 2 sec every 2min but wasnt seeing what i thought i should. now im starting to see more of what im looking for. temped to try 2 sec every 5 -6 minutes off. My LP i could run at 1.2 EC. its been a challenge trying to get things dialed in with no references to go by.

 

[The Mad Hatter]

if i could get canna local i would use them but i cant so im using GH until i can work out how to get canna. EC .5, havent been able to go over that. only at 2sec every 4min. was at 2 sec every 2min but wasnt seeing what i thought i should. now im starting to see more of what im looking for. temped to try 2 sec every 5 -6 minutes off. My LP i could run at 1.2 EC. its been a challenge trying to get things dialed in with no references to go by.

Wow... I'm glad I asked... I probably would have shot right past .5... What kind of Ph range do you try and maintain?

I've got friends that swear by GH... It's what I used the first few times too... Honestly I'm only going with the canna for the myzocondrial inoculation... And I figure I might as well just keep it in the family... Although I'm intrigued by their specific aero formulation... Lets hope that it's not just a less concentrated version of the regular hydro product And I am intrigued by their claims of no required Ph adjustment... I mean... Is it just some kind of better buffering agent? It's so hard to tell sometimes... So often these company's talk about stuff that everyone had like they invented it... Of course canna probably did... But still

I'm stoaked! I just scored an NIB Orion EC probe off ebay for $26... Since the damn things list for several hundred I was starting to doubt I would be able to find one for a price I could afford... Though I might have to use the old graphite probe I had left over from a few years back.

Anyway... I'm headed back home for the holidays so I probably won't be able to check in as often as I would like. Take care of yourself and your girls...

I'll be working on the cycle timer software when I'm down there... I'll see if I can code a bit more flexibility into it so I can do things like try out a shorter cycle on one row. Since the first grow or 3 is going to be all about learning how to optimize this kind of setup...


T.M.H.

 

[tree farmer]

Wow... I'm glad I asked... I probably would have shot right past .5... What kind of Ph range do you try and maintain?

I've got friends that swear by GH... It's what I used the first few times too... Honestly I'm only going with the canna for the myzocondrial inoculation... And I figure I might as well just keep it in the family... Although I'm intrigued by their specific aero formulation... Lets hope that it's not just a less concentrated version of the regular hydro product And I am intrigued by their claims of no required Ph adjustment... I mean... Is it just some kind of better buffering agent? It's so hard to tell sometimes... So often these company's talk about stuff that everyone had like they invented it... Of course canna probably did... But still

I'm stoaked! I just scored an NIB Orion EC probe off ebay for $26... Since the damn things list for several hundred I was starting to doubt I would be able to find one for a price I could afford... Though I might have to use the old graphite probe I had left over from a few years back.

Anyway... I'm headed back home for the holidays so I probably won't be able to check in as often as I would like. Take care of yourself and your girls...

I'll be working on the cycle timer software when I'm down there... I'll see if I can code a bit more flexibility into it so I can do things like try out a shorter cycle on one row. Since the first grow or 3 is going to be all about learning how to optimize this kind of setup...


T.M.H.

It is hard to learn that less is more with these systems. im always wanting to reach for the nute bottles. i feel like a crack head going thru withdrawls sometimes. that .5 is including 125 ppm of cal mag with starting RO water. (i know thats hardly anything but thats what they like at this point.) i dont know if its just the geno i have or the system but the ph is also sensitive. if it goes above 6 they punish me. what seems to be working well is i start off each day around 5.3 and by the time the day is finished it usually has drifted to 5.8-5.9. the ppm go down about 40-50 during that time frame. i add back nutes then to bring it back to .5Ec and adjust ph down to 5.3 to start the next day. convential wisdom would tell you im underfeeding but i have tried to up the ec only to see burn the next day. i am actually at 2 sec every 6 minutes now and feel they are staying just about perfect as far as moisture in the root zone. i definetly was overwatering from the beginning. its hard looking and not seeing water beading over everything, you think your doing them harm but its the oxygen they really want and they have shown me thats the case.

i found that when i was misting more often they could tolerate higher ec levels.(dont think they really liked it but werent as sensitive). which seems to indicate to me now looking back that i was running it more like an LP aero. i defineatly think there is a direct correlation between the misting cycles and the EC levels that are optimal for HP aero. since cutting the mist cycles back ive seen a lot more roots come out of the netpots and have seen a lot more fine roots developing. ive also noticed that the roots that climb the chamber walls are healthier looking(whiter,finer) than those that sit on the floor. i wish i would have lifted all the roots off the floor but that will have to wait.

this is the first time ive ever used hydroton. ive always used lava rock in the past but the stuff i found had so much sediment i couldnt seem to rinse it clean enough. i was afraid that it would keep clogging the 1 micron filter so i went with hydroton. well the hydroton just doesnt have the support like the lava rock did. imagine the surprise to see a veg plant tip. so im going to have to find a way to clean the lava cause hydroton just isnt going to cut it.


hopefully some of this info will help sus things out for you when you get that machine rolling

 

[travish413]

Mad Hatter
I didnt read all of this thread so sorry if its already been discussed... but you can get an acc. tank and maximize the life of your pump. it will only run to fill the tank up and the misters will feed off the tank. I also found a cheap ibc tank that i will be using for a grow chamber. I live in farm country so i found one at somebody had layin around that they werent using for 15 dollars. They come in different sizes but they are usually 3ft by 4ft or somewhere along those lines. You will have to disassemble the cage around the tank and cut it to size of course but one of those would work great with your system, in my opinion.

 

[The Mad Hatter]

Mad Hatter
I didnt read all of this thread so sorry if its already been discussed... but you can get an acc. tank and maximize the life of your pump. it will only run to fill the tank up and the misters will feed off the tank. I also found a cheap ibc tank that i will be using for a grow chamber. I live in farm country so i found one at somebody had layin around that they werent using for 15 dollars. They come in different sizes but they are usually 3ft by 4ft or somewhere along those lines. You will have to disassemble the cage around the tank and cut it to size of course but one of those would work great with your system, in my opinion.

I wish I could pick one up that inexpensively... I would like to play around with one... But this design was intended to operate without one... No really good reason for that, other then trying something different... I certainly can't cite cost at this point

But the pump was only $45, and the most inexpensive tank I could find around here as $90 and that was with something like 1/8" fittings...

The pump is (theoretically) rated for continuous duty so I would probably just replace the thing once a year if not more often just to stay ahead of things... It's always a balance between duty cycle and the general wear and tear of a start/stop cycle...

 

[The Mad Hatter]

It is hard to learn that less is more with these systems. im always wanting to reach for the nute bottles. i feel like a crack head going thru withdrawls sometimes. that .5 is including 125 ppm of cal mag with starting RO water. (i know thats hardly anything but thats what they like at this point.) i dont know if its just the geno i have or the system but the ph is also sensitive. if it goes above 6 they punish me. what seems to be working well is i start off each day around 5.3 and by the time the day is finished it usually has drifted to 5.8-5.9. the ppm go down about 40-50 during that time frame. i add back nutes then to bring it back to .5Ec and adjust ph down to 5.3 to start the next day. convential wisdom would tell you im underfeeding but i have tried to up the ec only to see burn the next day. i am actually at 2 sec every 6 minutes now and feel they are staying just about perfect as far as moisture in the root zone. i definetly was overwatering from the beginning. its hard looking and not seeing water beading over everything, you think your doing them harm but its the oxygen they really want and they have shown me thats the case.

i found that when i was misting more often they could tolerate higher ec levels.(dont think they really liked it but werent as sensitive). which seems to indicate to me now looking back that i was running it more like an LP aero. i defineatly think there is a direct correlation between the misting cycles and the EC levels that are optimal for HP aero. since cutting the mist cycles back ive seen a lot more roots come out of the netpots and have seen a lot more fine roots developing. ive also noticed that the roots that climb the chamber walls are healthier looking(whiter,finer) than those that sit on the floor. i wish i would have lifted all the roots off the floor but that will have to wait.

this is the first time ive ever used hydroton. ive always used lava rock in the past but the stuff i found had so much sediment i couldnt seem to rinse it clean enough. i was afraid that it would keep clogging the 1 micron filter so i went with hydroton. well the hydroton just doesnt have the support like the lava rock did. imagine the surprise to see a veg plant tip. so im going to have to find a way to clean the lava cause hydroton just isnt going to cut it.


hopefully some of this info will help sus things out for you when you get that machine rolling

Good info man, thanks... I guess the large PH swing is due to the lower concentration of nutrients? Or is that just how these kinds of areo systems go? Not that I see it as a bad thing, IMHO you need a moving window like that for optimal absorption of all your elements... I'm just surprised to hear that it moves over half a point a day.

I guess with that kind of duty cycle I really should consider an accumulator tank... I was thinking that it would be like 50/50... But with 2 sec on and 6min off.... Hum... Guess I'll just have to see how it goes.

Sorry to be gone for so long BTW... It was a very hectic holiday and I just didn't get to put any time into the system... Good to be back though... I can't wait to see what you've all been up to.


Cheers,
TMH

 

[tree farmer]

well i was surprised to see your thread pop back up. you really take holidays.

well check out my thread alot has gone on since youve been gone. switched to DTW. man its soo much nicer and so much easier to figure out whats up since you can monitor the runoff and then adjust the input res.

well i know i told you i thought those buckets would be OK for some small shrubs but after getting the mist cycle dialed in and seeing how the roots filled up my 22 gallon chambers im not so sure that was the right answer.

anyway check out what i learned on the misting cycle and how getting it dialed in will be different for every setup. check out the root pic of what your aiming for in the root zone.

 

[The Mad Hatter]

After hearing just how short a mist cycle you guys were running I started thinking DTW too... I'm glad to hear it's working out... I figure between the cycle time and low concentrations I'll be doing the same.

Sadly I had a few setbacks as far as my grow room size is concerned , but I'll make the best of what I've got... It's looking like it's going to be between 4-5 of those buckets for the first run rather then 20... But perhaps it's for the best anyway... It would be a shame to have an experiment with 20 plants go wrong.

I'm expecting what I hope will be the last of the plumbing fitting in today... Damn shit is killing me! $26 for a 1" MPTx3/4" hose barb... But it's going to look damn nice and should last forever... I'm sure it won't sting quite as much when it's smokin' time

I ordered some feminized Church the other day... Don't know how long that will take to get here, but I'll be ready when it does.

I'm planning on using Canna Substra to fertilize it... This grow will be starting with a single 600W and I'll hopefully be adding 1-2 more before it's over. I'm trying out the Daystar AC with a Quantum ballast... Tight quarters are probably going to call for some additional cooling on those... Will have to see if I can pick up a small AC or a chiller and some of those heater core inserts (Can't remember what they are called, but they look like a small radiator with a shroud that goes inline with the light vents. And are most assuredly an automotive heater core...)

Don't know what to do on the buckets... You really think even with a single plant I'm going to max out 5 gallons? The thought makes me giddy and sick all at the same time... I was so happy with how clean it all looked... I know I'm a tweaker for caring about aesthetics so much... But I can't really help myself... It's just part of who I am

Back to the subject of bucket size... I'm still thinking of using some kind of mesh to try and spread out the roots and keep them clear of the nozzle... Almost added some S.S. woven wire cloth to the last order but it would have come out to nearly $100 for 5 buckets worth... Too much when nylon will only cost a few bucks... I like the idea of managing the roots thought... I don't think it's really been explored enough with aero... In other systems or in dirt the medium limits and dictates root formation patterns... Without those limitations we are free to explore new areas of optimization... And I think we should

T.M.H.

well i was surprised to see your thread pop back up. you really take holidays.

well check out my thread alot has gone on since youve been gone. switched to DTW. man its soo much nicer and so much easier to figure out whats up since you can monitor the runoff and then adjust the input res.

well i know i told you i thought those buckets would be OK for some small shrubs but after getting the mist cycle dialed in and seeing how the roots filled up my 22 gallon chambers im not so sure that was the right answer.

anyway check out what i learned on the misting cycle and how getting it dialed in will be different for every setup. check out the root pic of what your aiming for in the root zone.

 

[The Mad Hatter]

Still goofing off with the pump setup. Got a small video below... They system is comming along well, but I'm not quite getting the pressure levels I was before... Perhaps to much flash inline with the water flow... I can't imagine it's really just the few extra feet of lift, but I'll be messing around with it this weekend trying to get it straightened out... The pump really makes a retched squealing noise when the flow is restricted enough to get a decent mist pattern so I'll have to add a pressure relief solenoid and will likely ultimately move to a different make of pump.

Seems like there is some nice stuff for the reef tank folks, but the highest pressure rating I found was 50 PSI and thats just not enough, so I'll scoping flotec and some other commercial sprinkler and booster pumps...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTvoaRH4ekE


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RFhfe_mZe4 <- Fixed

The track is Wax Taylor - This Train...

Cheers,
T.M.H.

So I just checked and youtube seems to have puked all over the video... I'll update the link when I can fix it.

 

[travish413]

Still goofing off with the pump setup. Got a small video below... They system is comming along well, but I'm not quite getting the pressure levels I was before... Perhaps to much flash inline with the water flow... I can't imagine it's really just the few extra feet of lift, but I'll be messing around with it this weekend trying to get it straightened out... The pump really makes a retched squealing noise when the flow is restricted enough to get a decent mist pattern so I'll have to add a pressure relief solenoid and will likely ultimately move to a different make of pump.

Seems like there is some nice stuff for the reef tank folks, but the highest pressure rating I found was 50 PSI and thats just not enough, so I'll scoping flotec and some other commercial sprinkler and booster pumps...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTvoaRH4ekE

The track is Wax Taylor - This Train...

Cheers,
T.M.H.

So I just checked and youtube seems to have puked all over the video... I'll update the link when I can fix it.

T.M.H
About the pumps and noise... I purchased an aquatec 6800. It is a RO booster pump capable of 150 psi and is pretty much silent. Also keep in mind the acc. tank idea so the pump wont be kickin on and off all the time making that noise. I am sure you have already got things figured out but just wanted to chime in bc i like to have all the info i can get