Late Flower in DWC, Lockout PH below 5.2, how to fix?

[Mongobud]

I'm in very late flower with my AK48, and It's a 4 site DWC/Bubbleponic system. I'm using Fox Farm Big Bloom, Tiger Bloom, Cha Ching. Running RO.

I'm trying to get the buds to finish (Ripen), and I'm trying to get my PH from dropping below 5.5, but it keeps dropping below 5.2 even below 5.0

I've already flushed with Cearex and RO for 48 hours, got it back up 5.58/70 ppm, then re-nuted at half strength....but then it fell again!

What should I do to keep my PH in range, and allow my girls to finish? Here is what I have to work with..Maybe I can get some suggestions.

Nutrients/additives:
Fox Farm- Grow Big (Hydro), Tiger Bloom, Big Bloom, Open Sesame, Beastie Bloom, Cha Ching

Botanicare- Cal-Mag, Sweet Berry,

Ceanser/Preventative- H202 12%, Clearex, Hygrozyme

I also have GH Flora series, but I've been using FF throughout this grow.

 

[SMOKEnCHOKE]

I've already flushed with Cearex and RO for 48 hours, got it back up 5.58/70 ppm, then re-nuted at half strength....but then it fell again!


.

You ph the water before you add nutes?

Nutes are going to lower the ph so I would add them first and then adjust the ph

 

[Mongobud]

No, I always add nutes then PH it....I mix it all in a 5 gallon bucket befor it goes in the res.

 

[laserbrn]

I'm not sure if this a joke or if it's real? You are LATE in flower and you have this question? How late are you in flower?

You could try, I dunno, PH Up. And why are you adjusting the ph before adding nutes?

This is crazy talk for someone to get this far in DWC without understanding this.

I must be misunderstanding the question. I'm not trying to be an ass, I'm just SURE I've misunderstood something.

 

[Mongobud]

I start with plain RO, add nutes, then adjust PH. I fill the res then 12 hours later it goes from 5.8 to 5.0. Then, I take a gallon of plain RO, PH it to about 7.5, ( take a gallon out of the res if needed ) add the 7.5 which brings me back up to around 5.5-5.6

I use PH up....it's just not staying.

I should be harvesting this week, most of the hairs are still white and haven't receded into the bud. I'm locked out.

 

[laserbrn]

This isn't a good problem. Your ph is dropping drastically overnight? Late in flower? Have you been using h2o2 in your reservoir? The only time I had this happen to me was when there was a bacteria in the reservoir.

Not good. Hopefully you are really almost done.

 

[Mongobud]

Yes thank you, I know it's not a good problem, I haven't come across many good problems in my life.

Yes I have H2o2 12%. There is not any slime in my res or on my roots. No light leaks in the res and a shit load of bubbles.

 

[laserbrn]

Yes thank you, I know it's not a good problem, I haven't come across many good problems in my life.

Yes I have H2o2 12%. There is not any slime in my res or on my roots. No light leaks in the res and a shit load of bubbles.

Yeah, it's not mold or algea, it's bacteria. It's not going to present with slime or with anything at you can see. Sometimes a smell, but not always. The biggest indicator is going to be falling ph, especially drastically falling ph.

You gotta clean it all out, but this is one of many reasons I hate DWC. I say it's not a good problem only because I'm not sure what to do about it in DWC. I use Ebb & Flow and the remedies are fairly simple. I know it doesn't directly help you, but maybe you can think of something. I would flush the reservoir remove the pumps and lines, remove the plants from the tray (they are in pots, in rockwool, with hydroton (kind of like netpots) and run everything through with a solution of water/bleach probably in the neigborhood of 30:1 to clean it all out. Then rinse it clean very, very thoroughly, I would either replace the pumps or run them with the cleaning solution. Clean EVERYTHING I possibly can, obviously the plants in their pots with hydroton aside.

I'd put it all back together and refill the reservoir and a product with beneficial bacteria. Something like AN Tarantula to give the reservoir a chance to fight the bacteria that will still exist in the roots and in the pots theselves. Should go a long way to getting it under control.

Might help just to drain the reservoir completely and refill, but this time add the tarantula or something simliar.

 

[Mongobud]

I have Aquashield, do you think may help?

 

[laserbrn]

I have Aquashield, do you think may help?

It has a very good chance of helping. I've never used that particular product, but I've read others that swore it helped with root rot. I know it's not the same, but it's a bunch of beneficial bacteria. It would certainly be worth a shot compared to nothing.

 

[Mongobud]

Thanks bro, +Rep on the way. I'll keep you updated.

 

[Mongobud]

Ok man, I believe I fixed it...we'll see. Last night my PH fell to 5.35. I had used 5ml of aquashield per gallon with my nute change out. After seeing it fall again I changed it out again. This time I added 15ml of Hygrozyme along with 15ml of Aquashield (per 5 gal of RO) to half strength nutrients. I set it at 5.83/389 PPM, this morning (lights off) it was 6.24/411 PPM. I think to PPM rise is due to "ppm creep" from my RO filter, but we'll see when the lights come back on.

Any suggestions or comments welcome.

 

[laserbrn]

Ok man, I believe I fixed it...we'll see. Last night my PH fell to 5.35. I had used 5ml of aquashield per gallon with my nute change out. After seeing it fall again I changed it out again. This time I added 15ml of Hygrozyme along with 15ml of Aquashield (per 5 gal of RO) to half strength nutrients. I set it at 5.83/389 PPM, this morning (lights off) it was 6.24/411 PPM. I think to PPM rise is due to "ppm creep" from my RO filter, but we'll see when the lights come back on.

Any suggestions or comments welcome.

Hygrozyme and Aquashield together should work perfect. And yes, the rise in the ppm is a good sign overnight! I know it's an annoying problem, but at least it's a sign the bacteria are dying off! It's only been overnight, but I'm glad it was resolved. A lot of people would've just kept on adding ph up. I'm glad you posted your question and we got past the initial confusion. I knew it wasn't just that you didn't understand that the nutes lowered the ph. Haha

 

[Mongobud]

Bro, I owe you big time. I believe you may have helped me save my crop.

The Ph held at 6.1. Tell me if this sounds strange to you though. I added a half gallon of 5.0 plain RO to top off a few minutes ago, and the PH rose to 6.25...but the PPM fell from 425 to 385. Does that sound right to you?

 

[laserbrn]

Bro, I owe you big time. I believe you may have helped me save my crop.

The Ph held at 6.1. Tell me if this sounds strange to you though. I added a half gallon of 5.0 plain RO to top off a few minutes ago, and the PH rose to 6.25...but the PPM fell from 425 to 385. Does that sound right to you?

It sounds about right to me. The difference between 6.1 and 6.25 is a horsefart. I wouldn't be concerned about that, fact is your reservoir is more stable now than it was before. I don't usually add already adjusted water to my reservoir by the way. Always seemed a strange practice. I just add water, add nutes, readjust ph and move on about my business.

All done in the reservoir itself.

 

[Mongobud]

Yea, but adding 5.0 water should have brought it down I would think...Is it possible that adjusting with plain water without nutes could be it, as in the plants are trying to tell me that they need more food?

I'm in DWC, can't adjust straight in the res with the roots.

 

[laserbrn]

Yea, but adding 5.0 water should have brought it down I would think...Is it possible that adjusting with plain water without nutes could be it, as in the plants are trying to tell me that they need more food?

I'm in DWC, can't adjust straight in the res with the roots.

I've done it in DWC and I've adjusted it directly in the water. Never been a problem, but I suppose it could be. The Ph should've dropped in theory. But such a small change is almost immeasurable. I wouldn't worry too much about it and I've definitely adjusted the PH of my reservoir in DWC directly. If you do it though, use a dropper so you don't "over do" it an have to make adjustments back and forth. One drop at a time until it gets where you want it shouldn't be a problem at all.

And a ph anywhere from 5.5 - 6.5 should be anyway. 6.2 should be just fine.

 

[Mongobud]

Like I said before, I owe you alot. You've been a great help to me and I really appreciate you for that. Thanks alot brother....by the way, how long did it take to dry that big ass bud in your avatar?

If I could rep you again I would, I'll catch you in other threads though.

 

[rreign]

laserbrn... I gotta rep you for the quick save too bro. I was reading through and thought for sure Mongo was in for a really big problem. You saved the day while giving me some helpful hints.

 

[laserbrn]

No worries, I'm really glad that it worked out for you. I'm always happy to help someone especially when I see it's an obscure problem that I know doesn't come up every single day on this forum. I spend a lot of time helping new growers, but I generally get more enjoyment from helping somone with something more unique and that I've actually seen before.

Anyway, now hopefully someday you can help someone else who has the ph dropping problem because I'm sure many have lost their crop to root rot and infection because they didn't catch that indicator and kept adding ph up. It just doesn't come up for everyone so it doesn't come by many answers.

Grow on and post some pics of your girls. That's the only thing missing from this thread.

That bud in my avatar took about 5 days to dry hanging and then another 2 weeks in the jars before I would really call it 'dry'. When they are that big you can't really get them 'dry' just by hanging. Need to slow the drying process to keep it drying nice and even. Back and forth between jars to preserve moisture and paper bags to absorb it. But as slow as I can without inviting mold.