switching flowering schedule.

[stopcallingmedude]

well, i've never had to do this before so i think i'll toss this up and see what you guys think.

i just got a new job that keeps me away from the house during the day so i'll be unable to tend my girls during flower. the lights are on 6 am - 6 pm and i'll be gone in the morning before they are on and not home until later when i won't have enough time to do whatever needs to be done by 6 pm...

so what i'd like to do is switch my on times from 6 pm till 6 am and have the lots off while i am gone. i'm two weeks into flower. i'd like to do this now and just give them 24 hrs of dark to fix the light schedule. does anyone have any experience with this, and does it cause any ill effects? thank a lot.

 

[RandyRocket]

i had to do this on my last grow. just pick a day and give it 18 hours of light and 18 hours of day and that will fix it. you wont see any problems less the girls may be a day late to bloom.

a few light mess up in one flower period will not hurt your plant.

 

[t@intshredder]

Adding light to the schedule can be harmful. Subtracting light is what you want to do.
Just leave the lights off until the beginning of your first 6pm-6am schedule then kick on the schedule from there. You won't stress the plant at all.
Good luck!

 

[born2killspam]

Adding light to the schedule can be harmful. Subtracting light is what you want to do.
Just leave the lights off until the beginning of your first 6pm-6am schedule then kick on the schedule from there. You won't stress the plant at all.
Good luck!

Absolutely disagree.. Do not tanper with the 12hrs dark, adjust the light hours.. Doing it over a couple days can't hurt, but if needed give them 24hrs light, then normal 12hrs dark..
This is based on the fact that a chemical called phytochrome drives the plant's response to day length, (or rather night length).. Phytochrome exists in two states, typically denoted pR and pFR.. pR likes red light, and when it absorbs it it converts it to pFR which likes far red light (think of far-red light as darkness since is just teetering on infrared).. The signal to flower is induced by pR, so acceptable levels of this must be maintained within a day cycle, which happens when there is sufficient dark hours..
http://users.rcn.com/jkimball.ma.ultranet/BiologyPages/P/Photoperiodism.html
Now too much light isn't exactly good either.. If your intensity is high, perhaps it wouldn't be a bad idea to raise the lights so the plants aren't really absorbing twice the normal number of photons before resting.. I have a pretty in depth bio-chem pdf about reactions of photosynthesis that explains pretty well the risks/defenses of a plant absorbing both too much light over-all, and abnormal amounts of light in a given period.. Its a 1.2MB pdf, if you want it pm me with an email that can accept that because I can't attach it on the board unfortunately..

 

[t@intshredder]

Absolutely disagree.. Do not tanper with the 12hrs dark, adjust the light hours.. Doing it over a couple days can't hurt, but if needed give them 24hrs light, then normal 12hrs dark..
This is based on the fact that a chemical called phytochrome drives the plant's response to day length, (or rather night length).. Phytochrome exists in two states, typically denoted pR and pFR.. pR likes red light, and when it absorbs it it converts it to pFR which likes far red light (think of far-red light as darkness since is just teetering on infrared).. The signal to flower is induced by pR, so acceptable levels of this must be maintained within a day cycle, which happens when there is sufficient dark hours..
http://users.rcn.com/jkimball.ma.ultranet/BiologyPages/P/Photoperiodism.html
Now too much light isn't exactly good either.. If your intensity is high, perhaps it wouldn't be a bad idea to raise the lights so the plants aren't really absorbing twice the normal number of photons before resting.. I have a pretty in depth bio-chem pdf about reactions of photosynthesis that explains pretty well the risks/defenses of a plant absorbing both too much light over-all, and abnormal amounts of light in a given period.. Its a 1.2MB pdf, if you want it pm me with an email that can accept that because I can't attach it on the board unfortunately..

Looks like I've done been proved wrong! Thanks for the info, born2killspam. That's a great read!
I've based my statement off of my own observations. I ran an experiment a couple of years ago with a strain (Nirvana's Snow White) that I've found to be very sensitive to both lighting schedule interruptions as well as light leaks.
I setup two flowering rooms that were on the same 12/12 schedule for 3 weeks of flowering. I changed the lighting schedule by 6 hours in each of the rooms. Room 1 I left the lights on until the start of the new schedule, exposing the plants to 6 additional hours of light.
Room 2, I modified my timer so that the plants received 6 less hours of light.
About 10 days later I started to notice some male flowers growing on 60% of the females in room 1 and no male flowers in room 2.
Mind you, obviously, this is an admittedly unscientific testing method. I just tried it for the proverbial "shits and giggles".

 

[born2killspam]

It is definately specific to genetics, hell look at autos.. Two things I would fear are stalling the flower growth without being able to extend flowering weeks, or herming obviously.. Both may or may not happen with a given degree of light stress..
Heck, if they're clones that have been light stressed worse on previous crops without any consequences, then its likely safe not to give a damn about the science..

And contrary to popular belief, anecdotes are critical to science.. They are the foundation for hypotheses.. Besides, don't be so harsh on your methodology.. MythBusters call their farces science ; experiments like yours, compounded with others done by trustworthy growers can actually yield usable data.. Look at the progress made since indoor growing began..

 

[t@intshredder]

It is definately specific to genetics, hell look at autos.. Two things I would fear are stalling the flower growth without being able to extend flowering weeks, or herming obviously.. Both may or may not happen with a given degree of light stress..
Heck, if they're clones that have been light stressed worse on previous crops without any consequences, then its likely safe not to give a damn about the science..

And contrary to popular belief, anecdotes are critical to science.. They are the foundation for hypotheses.. Besides, don't be so harsh on your methodology.. MythBusters call their farces science ; experiments like yours, compounded with others done by trustworthy growers can actually yield usable data.. Look at the progress made since indoor growing began..

Excellent points! I agree about genetics playing into the equation quite a bit.
I've grown strains that will grow male flowers if you use a flash while taking pics during the dark period ...and I've grown strains that are completely impervious to light leaks of great severity. When I started noticing traits like that is when I started testing.
It's funny; I always think of MythBusters every time I run one of my little tests. I feel akin to their testing techniques, i.e. patently flawed but potentially interesting to the lowest common denominator.
I'm running one right now to see if (given my particular environmental conditions) there are any negative effects to growing in translucent plastic pots. I feel like I've been told for years that it will harm my plants so I've been afraid to bother trying.
Cheers to Cannabis MythBusting!

 

[born2killspam]

Yea, when MythBusters get positive results, things can be interesting, it just pisses me off when they declare something impossible because they couldn't get the million little nuances to come together in their three meager attempts.. Salsa escape, and poppy-seed bagels are my favorites I think.. Are you running a control plant(s) with thislight-poisoning trial?? I always meant to run the same test when I was actively growing, but never got around to it.. I do know that clones really don't like sitting in cubes too long with light getting to the popped roots though..
Uncle Ben ran some cool experiments on root pruning via various methods.. (A few of his experiments have been stolen and published in books.. ) Perhaps he's played around with light at the roots too.. He's a master grower, and respects the scientific method, so I trust his results as much as any data I find on LinkingHub/SpringerLink etc..

Oh, and some sativas are pretty much monocious, they herm under the bestest conditions.. Perhaps because they evolved in an area where its close to 12/12 all year.. Male/Female in plants is new to evolution (and a bad description of the way things are at that.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabis#Mechanisms_of_sex_determination), so all plants have a history of hermism that they can still revert to..

 

[born2killspam]

Its like Creationism applied to botany..

 

[t@intshredder]

Its like Creationism applied to botany..

I just "feel" like God created the universe and all living creatures that exist in it. Also, carbon dating is impossible under God's rule so I know for a fact that dinosaurs and humans lived together in perfect harmony.
"To an extreme that was my logic." Classic.

 

[born2killspam]

Yea, just total disregard for info/data sitting right in front of them.. Having faith that the way they feel is best, is infact the best..

 

[t@intshredder]

Yea, when MythBusters get positive results, things can be interesting, it just pisses me off when they declare something impossible because they couldn't get the million little nuances to come together in their three meager attempts.. Salsa escape, and poppy-seed bagels are my favorites I think.. Are you running a control plant(s) with thislight-poisoning trial?? I always meant to run the same test when I was actively growing, but never got around to it.. I do know that clones really don't like sitting in cubes too long with light getting to the popped roots though..
Uncle Ben ran some cool experiments on root pruning via various methods.. (A few of his experiments have been stolen and published in books.. ) Perhaps he's played around with light at the roots too.. He's a master grower, and respects the scientific method, so I trust his results as much as any data I find on LinkingHub/SpringerLink etc..

Oh, and some sativas are pretty much monocious, they herm under the bestest conditions.. Perhaps because they evolved in an area where its close to 12/12 all year.. Male/Female in plants is new to evolution (and a bad description of the way things are at that.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabis#Mechanisms_of_sex_determination), so all plants have a history of hermism that they can still revert to..

Salsa escape was an incredible episode. I think my favorite was the recreation of Archimedes' death ray.
I have 6 lowryder 2s setup in translucent 32oz deli containers and 6 lowryder 2s setup in 32oz deli containers I've painted black. They are all 3 weeks into flowering, and in 2 separate rooms with the same light coverage(600w Eye Hortilux bulbs, same reflectors, same location under the lights).
I've read much of Uncle Ben's work and give him and yourself props for not just relying on scientific readings but actually implementing tests for himself. I'm still subscribed to his thread on topping for 2/4 colas. It kills me that even after 6 months and 16 pages of amazing information, people still ask "so where do I cut?" on that thread.
I appreciate all the knowledge you've brought to that thread as well. It's one of my favorites on the site.
I never realized sativa's were near monocious as you had mentioned. I have some full moon's growing which is a close to 100% sativa hybrid. I should use those for my next light leak tests.

 

[born2killspam]

BTW MESSSA, don't worry too much about instantaneous meter speed with meter readers.. Things like electric stoves, and hotwater, and laundry can really suck the juice, and will dwarf the usage of any grow-room that wouldn't put up red flags running 12hrs+/day.. I guarantee no flags go up using less than 2kW, probably higher, but if you should happen to have a security leak on another front, things can get pretty obvious pretty fast if LEO's start snooping.. Really though if LEO's are snooping they're probably just looking for icing on the cake, and they'll either find something, or make something up..

 

[born2killspam]

I just like reasons and explanations and answers.. You know that 'Why?' stage toddlers go through, well I've been stuck in that for 30yrs or so..

 

[stopcallingmedude]

born2kill and taint, thanks for the info gentlemen. i appreciate your help. i'll be pming you born2kill, i'd like to read that article. thanks again!

 

[born2killspam]

Got no pm as of yet..

 

[born2killspam]

We'll really have to up the strategy when that smart metering crap comes to us.. A 3kW grow is about as big as I'd want in order for me to feel safe.. I ran my lights at night too, but that was for convenience (insomnimaniac), and also to combat summer temps..
The only incident I know of where LEO came due to a power flag wasn't related to growing at all.. It was because my buddy in Thunder Bay had his grand daughter coming to stay with him, so he cranked the pool heater really early, and instantly tripled his otherwise puny power usage.. He came home for lunch, plain-clothes RCMP approached him at his door, stated their cause, asked to search, did not present a warrant (I dunno if they had one really).. Anyways he just said he wanted to go inside first to make sure his wife was decent, they were cool with that, and 10 minutes of walking around chatting and popping doors open to peek into rooms they were gone..
Don't get me wrong, that is NOT smart practice, but it worked out fine for him..

 

[stopcallingmedude]

so born2kill do you think this would be a decent way to switch the light schedule:

day 1: on 6am - off 6pm
day 2: on 8am- off 8pm
day 3: on 10am - off 10pm
day 4: on 12 noon - off 12 midnight
day 5: on 2pm - off 2am
day 6: on 4pm - off 4am
day 7: on 6pm - off 6am

so each change is 14 hrs of light and 12 hours dark and the schedule would be changed in one week. thoughts?

 

[born2killspam]

Look at those numbers again dude.. Swap it and it sounds fine..

 

[Consciousness420]

good question .. I had to do this with a grow a year ago and from then on I always start a new grow so that I have lights off during the day and on during the night when Im at home sleeping.. BUT what I did was I gradually transitioned them over to a new schedule.. DO NOT simply cut lights one day then start a completely new 12/12 schedule the next day, the info about the chemical light triggers is factual and you may wind up with hermies and/or low potency bud with some seeds if you dramatically alter their light schedule.. I basically just changed the timer each day by 1/2 hour and after 10 days the entire start/stop schedule was 5 hours behind, then another 10 days later it was 10 hours behind and I finally arrived at my changed schedule in another day or two.. this way, the plants don't realize any effective day/night change but you over time are able to slowly trick transition them into a more comfortable schedule that works for you. (only takes at most 24 days for a 12 hour shift).. no problemo .. cheers