International Property Rights

[lynchburgball]

What do you all think about the idea that capitalism is an ineffective method in most areas of the world? why does it thrive in the West and fail everywhere else? Hernando DeSoto's book...but seriously?? Capital systems fail in all sub-par nations and is that our fault (yes, i'm USA)? Property rights systems is explored by DeSoto as the reason for Capitalism's failure in so many nations.

any ideas?

 

[lynchburgball]

oh...i forgot not to post anything in the politics section not related to drug laws or the upcoming election. how much pot is grown in columbia????

 

[medicineman]

oh...i forgot not to post anything in the politics section not related to drug laws or the upcoming election. how much pot is grown in columbia????

Post anything you want as long as it is political in nature. I hardly ever post about marijuana laws. I like your first post better. I'll have to look into this one, it might be interesting. All the right wingnuts think Capitalism is the only worthwhile plan for the world. It might be that they are more heavily invested in such ventures, DUH, it is always the rich capitalist, or wannabees that extoll the virtues of capitalism. The poor bastards working their asses off just to feed their family @ minimum wages might have differing opinions. 50+ million working poor. They make just enough to exclude them from any government assistance like Medical, food stamps, rent assistance etc.

 

[ViRedd]

So, what's the premise of your argument, lynch? Are you saying that countries recognizing the right to private property are more successful than one's who don't?

Vi

 

[lynchburgball]

So, what's the premise of your argument, lynch? Are you saying that countries recognizing the right to private property are more successful than one's who don't?

Vi

i very much am saying that countries without sufficient property laws and credible enforcement of those laws will suffer when trying to create a successful Capitalistic economy. This is directly because without property laws Capital, the physical dimension of assets as well as their potential to generate surplus value, cannot be created.

consequently, the black markets of many of these nations are thriving and are self-regulated as far as honesty and good business goes.

what i mean is, if these countries were given a chance to establish the means to enforce property law, which is no easy task, the global economy may become more diverse and certainly worth studying.

i'm not really arguing though. i read this desoto book and it really makes the trick to making capitalism work seem so simple and these failing nations have ridiculously bogged down bureaucracies and policy enactment.

maybe, what does this say about Capital itself in a global market?

and/or

can there be a fully united capitalist planet?

 

[Dankdude]

can there be a fully united capitalist planet?

No every player wants an advantage over the other.... Look at China.

 

[ViRedd]

The reason the United States has been so successful is because of the very reason that we recognize private property rights. Those governments/countries who do not recognize private property rights are, or will eventually, fall into police state status.

Vi

 

[lynchburgball]

The reason the United States has been so successful is because of the very reason that we recognize private property rights. Those governments/countries who do not recognize private property rights are, or will eventually, fall into police state status.

Vi

doesn't that make it so simple though? why can't these areas take a peek at property rights and work on fixing that? if it's JUST that easy, then fuck it. alliances should be formed to reformat willing individual states' economies.

we could divert $$ from Bush Doctrine-related things and start a brand new global economy stimulation division. stop bombing and start planning. i know it's not black and white like that at all.

the future seems to be with china's dominance and our decline. market competetion nearly promises this. if we aren't king of the hill any more, the rest of the world's economic performance would seemingly help us out.

i know everyone is talking global economy but it must be tightened up from bottom to top. not to be interchangeable, instead imagine well established infrastructures, markets, airports in all areas of the world because of a massive effort to stop spreading Liberty and start spreading proper formulas for Capital creation and good bureaucracy?

 

[Dankdude]

lynchburgball, what most don't understand (including Vi and Med) is that Bush/Cheney and company is that their aim is to bring about a one world Government.

 

[medicineman]

lynchburgball, what most don't understand (including Vi and Med) is that Bush/Cheney and company is that their aim is to bring about a one world Government.

Believe me Dank, I am fully aware of that. A one world government controlled by elites with a new low standard of living for everyone, Except them.

 

[lynchburgball]

lynchburgball, what most don't understand (including Vi and Med) is that Bush/Cheney and company is that their aim is to bring about a one world Government.

well bush/cheney can suck balls for all i cares, ya know. i'm not even sure if i agree with you about them wanting one global govt.

beyond that, i mean for the PHUCKED up cities and villages in the carribbean islands and africa, u name it, these people are miserable and stuck in perpetual poverty. until their governments can secure property rights to advance their economic stature as a state, they need HELP. that's what i mean.

by helping these nations, creating a more benevolent/supportive union of countries, could create a more harmonious balance among all. i'm talkin about our freakin kids man!!

 

[7xstall]

beyond that, i mean for the PHUCKED up cities and villages in the carribbean islands and africa, u name it, these people are miserable and stuck in perpetual poverty. until their governments can secure property rights to advance their economic stature as a state, they need HELP. that's what i mean.

by helping these nations, creating a more benevolent/supportive union of countries, could create a more harmonious balance among all. i'm talkin about our freakin kids man!!

in the past i worked on a project very close to Mr. De Soto, i actually have two copies of the mystery of capital from him.

look up Limón REAL, that's the kind of thing i think you're talking about...

i completely agree with his position that property rights establish all other material rights and liberty.

i also agree with Dank about the new world order. when entrusted with power it is the obligation of the corrupt, ruling elite to seek more power and more ways to coerce their subjects. since the frontal assault on American resilience by FDR and his creation of the welfare/warfare state we have seen many means of this coercion; prohibition of things, global cooling, global warming, terrorism, the call for socialist health care, arms race, etc, etc, etc.... each of these methods are a way to infringe on property rights in one way or another, it's very interesting how it's all relative.




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[medicineman]

also agree with Dank about the new world order. when entrusted with power it is the obligation of the corrupt, ruling elite to seek more power and more ways to coerce their subjects. since the frontal assault on American resilience by FDR and his creation of the welfare/warfare state we have seen many means of this coercion; prohibition of things, global cooling, global warming, terrorism, the call for socialist health care, arms race, etc, etc, etc.... each of these methods are a way to infringe on property rights in one way or another, it's very interesting how it's all relative.


1.Just out of curiosity, answer me a couple of things.How do you compare the welfare state to the warfare state in the same sentence, if fact referring to them as one in the same.
2. Socialist health care and the arms race being connected.
3 Global warming and terrorism being connected
I think you are delusional
.

 

[lynchburgball]

when entrusted with power it is the obligation of the corrupt, ruling elite to seek more power and more ways to coerce their subjects.

obligation is an odd word to use there. we could elect officials that are not shit heads. we totally could. party politics, although it encourages political/civic engagement, sucks shit b/c it employs the well-off, not particularly qualified (other than having a name and image) often as running candidates for offices. i'm not saying all elected officials are dingbats. we didn't expect to vote in ruinous leaders but we did. it's history. we oughtta learn from that...learn that the system we have produces inneffective leadership and administration.

but how do we make sure we elect "good, honest" candidates who aren't obligated to seek more power? systemic changes are needed constitutional conventions are probably needed. impeachments are certainly needed in these United States.

 

[7xstall]

"obligation is an odd word to use there"



not in the sense of the purpose of the corrupt. all of the popular politicians are corrupt.

people will intentionally vote for the corrupt at long as they hear what they want to hear... all the politicians have to do is sell empty promises to a simple minded, self-absorbed majority.

if you want to have better politicians we need smarter people, people who won't vote for a flip flopper, ever!! you lie, you die - that should be the foundation of politics but the people forget or don't want to be bothered by facts.

anyway, if people don't make a good decision this election there will be a major revolution soon. some state is going to stand up for itself, the feds are going to march in and there will be war, again. the pressure is building.





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[medicineman]

"obligation is an odd word to use there"



not in the sense of the purpose of the corrupt. all of the popular politicians are corrupt.

people will intentionally vote for the corrupt at long as they hear what they want to hear... all the politicians have to do is sell empty promises to a simple minded, self-absorbed majority.

if you want to have better politicians we need smarter people, people who won't vote for a flip flopper, ever!! you lie, you die - that should be the foundation of politics but the people forget or don't want to be bothered by facts.

anyway, if people don't make a good decision this election there will be a major revolution soon. some state is going to stand up for itself, the feds are going to march in and there will be war, again. the pressure is building.


.

War, there are already too many wars. Do you think the complacent overweight middle age idiots are going to get out of their recliners, pick up a weapon and go to war against a fully equiped laser sighting, night visioned 'cluster bombing, napalming, military. Yeah, a deer rifle against helicopter gunships and tanks. I don't think so. You'd have to have a coup, an inside revolt where the army disobeys the commanders and kills them off and joins the people in the streets. Do you think that will ever happen here in nerdville? I think Not. Although, I'm, ready to join, just let me know when to get out of my recliner~LOL~.

 

[7xstall]

also agree with Dank about the new world order. when entrusted with power it is the obligation of the corrupt, ruling elite to seek more power and more ways to coerce their subjects. since the frontal assault on American resilience by FDR and his creation of the welfare/warfare state we have seen many means of this coercion; prohibition of things, global cooling, global warming, terrorism, the call for socialist health care, arms race, etc, etc, etc.... each of these methods are a way to infringe on property rights in one way or another, it's very interesting how it's all relative.


1.Just out of curiosity, answer me a couple of things.How do you compare the welfare state to the warfare state in the same sentence, if fact referring to them as one in the same.
2. Socialist health care and the arms race being connected.
3 Global warming and terrorism being connected
I think you are delusional
.

welfare/warfare state: both are government centric (vs. liberty centric) states. bureaucracy based, highly entangling forms of efficient waste and public manipulation.

socialist healthscare/arms race: both are great tools for pandering politicians to wave in front of googoo eyed "fans" to avoid focusing on how to get our government beast back in the cage and put it on a diet.

global warming/terrorism: see socialist healthscare/arms race.

am i delusional or demented? personally, i'd rather be delusional because the idea of being in an exorcism is not as attractive as having imaginary friends or hallucinations...





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[medicineman]

welfare/warfare state: both are government centric (vs. liberty centric) states. bureaucracy based, highly entangling forms of efficient waste and public manipulation.

socialist healthscare/arms race: both are great tools for pandering politicians to wave in front of googoo eyed "fans" to avoid focusing on how to get our government beast back in the cage and put it on a diet.

global warming/terrorism: see socialist healthscare/arms race.

am i delusional or demented? personally, i'd rather be delusional because the idea of being in an exorcism is not as attractive as having imaginary friends or hallucinations...





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Well, demented or delusional that post is crap and you know it. You cant compare warfare to wellfare by any stretch of the delusional imagination you seem to live in. Global warming is a fact of nature, terrorism is a condition imposed on man by man, where is the conection, you're losing it man, better lighten up on the smoke, Socialist health care (Taking care of the nations sick) Arms race (trying to one up the competition by my dick is bigger than your dick mentality). None of your comparisons make sense to any cohesive observation. Smoke another one.

 

[7xstall]

War, there are already too many wars. Do you think the complacent overweight middle age idiots are going to get out of their recliners, pick up a weapon and go to war against a fully equiped laser sighting, night visioned 'cluster bombing, napalming, military. Yeah, a deer rifle against helicopter gunships and tanks. I don't think so. You'd have to have a coup, an inside revolt where the army disobeys the commanders and kills them off and joins the people in the streets. Do you think that will ever happen here in nerdville? I think Not. Although, I'm, ready to join, just let me know when to get out of my recliner~LOL~.

just keep your seat, med!

the federally sponsored state militias/national guard shouldn't be forgotten about. military enlistment stats are also in the favor of states which have historically been more "independently" leaning. if this does go down while we're alive it will not be simply the Army vs. the rest of us, many of "them" will be joining "us".

the new generations are starving for leaders with vision and true compassion, they get no credit for the depth of their appreciation for freedom. the pre-packaged, retail politicians are seen for what they are and i have no doubt that these generations would not hesitate to stand up and fight for a worthy cause. if liberty is not such a cause then may our nation die a quick death and may our tombstone stand as a warning to greater nations to come that government is never the answer for a decent people.






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[7xstall]

Well, demented or delusional that post is crap and you know it. You cant compare warfare to wellfare by any stretch of the delusional imagination you seem to live in. Global warming is a fact of nature, terrorism is a condition imposed on man by man, where is the conection, you're losing it man, better lighten up on the smoke, Socialist health care (Taking care of the nations sick) Arms race (trying to one up the competition by my dick is bigger than your dick mentality). None of your comparisons make sense to any cohesive observation. Smoke another one.

wow, i hope you can shoot straighter than you read! if not, better send your guns to me so they can be put to good use.

welfare and warfare are the same in terms of the costs to society. one groups funds the other group's demise.

global warming is real, so lets not try to make an enterprise out of telling people how to live their lives to cope with it. seriously, it happens, we're a planet circling an immense nuclear fusion reactor and the temps will change from time to time... look at mars, venus. we don't have a say in some things and this is one of them.

terrorism is also just another easy sell for the government. we're here to help! lol no thanks.

socialist healthscare, we're here to help! no thanks, again!

arms race, we're here to help! ummm, no, let's not!

can't you see that it's all about desperate government pigs trying to "rescue" us dumb people from phantom BS????

fork it over med. all of it. you don't need your liberty anyway, not when you've got a comfy recliner and a tv...







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