Uncle Ben's Topping Technique to Get 2 or 4 Main Colas

[born2killspam]

Which hormone?? Which plant?? There is a ton of info on the net, and alot of anecdotal experiments.. Just google the hormone name, the results will come..

Edit: Oh I get it, you're interested in the auxin responses associated with topping..

 

[Ganga Grower]

Would this work on a plant 12/12 lighting from the seed, or would it have troubles due to the lack of vegetative time?

 

[monkz]

yo ub i wana keep a plant as a mother, im thinkin of keeping the plant which would grow 16tops if i put it in flowering, the reason for this is that i assume there would be more outputs for me to clone in the future from this plant than from a plant which is not topped at all... am i correct?

 

[billdo]

best

thread

ever

 

[billdo]

best

thread

ever

 

[Uncle Ben]

yo ub i wana keep a plant as a mother, im thinkin of keeping the plant which would grow 16tops if i put it in flowering, the reason for this is that i assume there would be more outputs for me to clone in the future from this plant than from a plant which is not topped at all... am i correct?

Experience is the best teacher. Try it......

 

[born2killspam]

How many clones will you need? Whats your grow area like?

 

[lurkmaster]

I read through about the first 10 pages or so and started getting tired of sifting through posts to see if anyone asked this, so I figured I would just ask. (sorry if its a repeat)

How do you define a main cola...?

If you top a plant at the second node, and get 4 'main' colas are those really going to be the same size as the main cola would have been on the plant if you didn't top it?

Do you get as many smaller shoots when you top it versus when you just let the plant do its thang?

How much more do you yield (relative %) by topping to get 2/4 colas versus leaving it alone?

I am interested in this, but I am a little bit skeptical about it (probably for no real reason)

Its just the concept that you are somehow duplicating whats supposed to be the single largest part of the plant that I'm unsure about, just doesn't seem like if you split it up into multiple 'main' colas that you would really have an increase in yield that is proportional to the # of main colas... (2 main colas would mean you would get double the bud you would have gotten off one main cola)

So I guess it all boils down to this one... do you sacrifice any other part of plant growth when the plant focuses its resources on making multiple main colas?

 

[born2killspam]

All else equal, no they won't be as big as a single could have been, but they'll be well more than 1/4 that, and when topping for four of them, they'll resemble a main cola a hell of alot more than they will a nug..
About your other questions, anything above the snip should grow as if it was unsnipped.. At the tip of any shoot, auxin is created, and it travels downward, telling the plant to dedicate its resources to growing tall so it can compete for light in nature come flowering time.. Snipping the top cuts off the auxin supply, and cuts off that message causing the plant to grow bushy instead.. But each new shoot will have a new supply of auxin and tries to act as if its the only top.. If you snip those, you can follow the downward path and see what 'might' be affected, but results won't be as predictable/uniform.. Those are the gems of UB's technique..

 

[lurkmaster]

All else equal, no they won't be as big as a single could have been, but they'll be well more than 1/4 that, and when topping for four of them, they'll resemble a main cola a hell of alot more than they will a nug..
About your other questions, anything above the snip should grow as if it was unsnipped.. At the tip of any shoot, auxin is created, and it travels downward, telling the plant to dedicate its resources to growing tall so it can compete for light in nature come flowering time.. Snipping the top cuts off the auxin supply, and cuts off that message causing the plant to grow bushy instead.. But each new shoot will have a new supply of auxin and tries to act as if its the only top.. If you snip those, you can follow the downward path and see what 'might' be affected, but results won't be as predictable/uniform.. Those are the gems of UB's technique..

Thanks for the quick response.


Also....



A few more questions just popped into my head..

I was planning on throwing my plants into flower when they hit around 8" (Given that I will have very tight node spacing, I hit node 9 at 8" last grow)

If I top my plant should I just veg it until the new tips are the desired height? Or throw it into flower right after I top it..?

Do I need to veg my plants after I top it for [some interval] before I can put it into flowering? Or is it good to go whenever..?


And lastly...

Is vertical growth in flowering affected by topping?

 

[born2killspam]

I'm a firm believer in waiting until nodes begin to alternate before flipping unless lolipopping is the goal.. Its a sign of sexual maturity of sorts, but damn node 9, 8"? They should be alternating already.. I'm quite impressed actually, what strain??
When to flip is a SERIOUS learning experience that differs with every seedling.. DEFINATELY DON'T wait until they're desired final height, but amount of stretch in flower can vary drastically..
If you got no clue at this point in time, and aren't afraid of running out of vertical space then a good starting point would be to snip, then 7-10 days later, flip them.. Thats definately enough time to get the plant back to routine so it can make the most of its flowering period..
As for your last question, thats hard to answer absolutely, but generally no since you aren't cutting during 12/12 at all..The fact that further topping yields unpredictable results eludes to the fact that things aren't exactly the same as before though..

 

[lurkmaster]

I actually have no clue as to what the strain was, I'm damn sure that it was a heavy indica though. It was just a bagseed from some unknown dank I picked up that ended up having seeds in it, wasn't a very memorable smoke though, only picked up a gram and smoked it pretty much right when I got it along with some other shit my buddies had.

Was working with ~17,000 lumens in 2 sq feet of space (1'x2').

I had my cfls about 3" away from my plants, most of the nodes were less than an inch apart.

Node 9 wasn't really fully matured though, it had just sprouted out of the top. It was an extremely dense, chubby plant with tons of growth shooting up from the secondary nodes. It was painful chopping it up after I found the ball sacs, I got my hands on some really really good genetics. A buddy of mine is growing my last seed from the batch, going to snag some clones from him later on for sure.

I had just been assuming the plants are going to be 3x the size they went into flowering when they are done.

Ideally, I have about 25" of max plant height including space for lights, without lights I have another 10" to go.

If my plants get too big I can always take out one of my shelving nodes and add another foot or so, but I don't have the mylar to cover that area so I'd have to buy some crap and re-organize my grow space again.

Right now I've got some big buddha blue cheese and paradise white berry fems growing. (indica dominant strains)

I was originally going to grow the last bagseed myself and LST the plant to get some extra yield (started this plant 2 weeks early in preparation for LST) But since it wasn't feminized and my other 2 seeds were, I didn't want to risk root entanglement in my res with the other plant if it went male so I just gave it to my buddy after 2 weeks.

 

[Uncle Ben]

I read through about the first 10 pages or so and started getting tired of sifting through posts to see if anyone asked this, so I figured I would just ask. (sorry if its a repeat)

How do you define a main cola...?

That was about 3 pages back.

If you top a plant at the second node, and get 4 'main' colas are those really going to be the same size as the main cola would have been on the plant if you didn't top it?

If the root system is healthy, large, efficient, etc...... they should be, it's all relative. Whether you have one main cola or 4, flower production is relative to your root mass and health, same goes with the foliage. Just a thought, you guys should really focus only on a plant's roots and leaves.

I am interested in this, but I am a little bit skeptical about it (probably for no real reason) Its just the concept that you are somehow duplicating whats supposed to be the single largest part of the plant that I'm unsure about, just doesn't seem like if you split it up into multiple 'main' colas that you would really have an increase in yield that is proportional to the # of main colas... (2 main colas would mean you would get double the bud you would have gotten off one main cola)

You've got nothing to lose. Do the drill with a control group and come to your own conclusions.

Good luck,
UB

 

[lurkmaster]

If the root system is healthy, large, efficient, etc...... they should be, it's all relative. Whether you have one main cola or 4, flower production is relative to your root mass and health, same goes with the foliage. Just a thought, you guys should really focus only on a plant's roots and leaves.



You've got nothing to lose. Do the drill with a control group and come to your own conclusions.

Good luck,
UB

Great info man, didn't really think about that.

I am definitely going to be topping my current plants at node 2 when they get a little bigger.

 

[Mahoney]

Hey UB thanks for all the help! I topped them all two days ago and am surprised that it didn't seem to have any noticeable negative effect...

The new 'colas' are going great guns. This is my first grow and it's great to see so much happening so fast - it's fascinating. I think I have found what I want to do for the rest of my life.

Props to ya UB! I'll think of you when I fire up my first homegrown!

 

[CommieChase]

Great thread UB! +Rep! Just a question about growing sativas in small spaces using this technique. How tall would a sativa grow (pretty pure hybrid; Super Silver Haze, JillyBean, ect.) if you top at the 2nd node for 4 colas? I have 5' 3"H to work with, and am looking into growing sativas. Also, what about pruning? Do you recommend it, or is it not needed when using this topping method? Thanks for the help!

 

[born2killspam]

IMO for sativas, 5' is enough to pull it off, but not enough to pull it off without alot of effort.. Can't exactly let them grow much beyond 3' in that space..
Also, 90% of my indoor experience is with clones, and they tend to be easier on height issues.. Beginner growers are surely going to need more vertical space than the bare minimum, its almost clockwork.. As you learn your indoor plants, each crop tends to get shorter, and stouter..

 

[Uncle Ben]

Hey UB thanks for all the help! I topped them all two days ago and am surprised that it didn't seem to have any noticeable negative effect...

Of course not. Not trying to be difficult, but why would you think the act of topping would be harmful to a plant's health? You're not chopping off the hands of a concert pianist.

The new 'colas' are going great guns. This is my first grow and it's great to see so much happening so fast - it's fascinating. I think I have found what I want to do for the rest of my life.

Props to ya UB! I'll think of you when I fire up my first homegrown!

Great to hear things are working out for you!

Good luck,
UB

 

[Jerry Garcia]

Hey UB,

Thanks for the great thread. Good stuff.

I'm about to top two of my girls as an experiment (I'm on my first grow, so it's all one big experiment I guess): one has 6 nodes, one has 7.5ish. The one with 6 should be fine, but what about the 7? Can I still get 4 colas? You said ~20 pages back that topping after the plant has 5-6 nodes will not necessarily produce the results you outlined, but it still could, right? I'm just going to do it anyway I think.

 

[Uncle Ben]

Hey UB,

Thanks for the great thread. Good stuff.

I'm about to top two of my girls as an experiment (I'm on my first grow, so it's all one big experiment I guess): one has 6 nodes, one has 7.5ish. The one with 6 should be fine, but what about the 7? Can I still get 4 colas? You said ~20 pages back that topping after the plant has 5-6 nodes will not necessarily produce the results you outlined, but it still could, right? I'm just going to do it anyway I think.

Top above the 2nd node whether you have 4, 6, or 8 nodes.

Happy experimenting, Igor,
UB