My plants don’t look happy

[GrindMind]

So I’ve got 4 plants, all different strains, that I started from seed. I fed them like 3-4 days ago, and the 1-gallon fabric pots were feeling light, and the plants were looking a bit sad.

I thought, ‘alright, let me give them a good soak, and they’ll bounce back and start praying again.’ But now it’s been 3-4 days, and they still look pretty unhappy. The coco perlite mix is still a little moist, so I’m kinda stumped.

My only thought is maybe they’re root bound? I’ve seen people harvest in 1-gallon pots though, so I’m not sure. My plan was to transplant them into 3-gallon pots, but I figured it was too early.

Could this be a root bound issue, or am I missing something else?

 

[GrindMind]

I also noticed some weird tearing and deformities going on, not sure what that could be either. Maybe it’s related

 

[cage]

Did they recover at all when you watered?
Looks like too wet/compact medium at first glance, so missing oxygen from roots.

Never done coco, so maybe someone else can chime in on that part of the business.

 

[GrindMind]

Did they recover at all when you watered?
Looks like too wet/compact medium at first glance, so missing oxygen from roots.

Never done coco, so maybe someone else can chime in on that part of the business.

I fed them and then left for 3 days, I don’t believe that they recovered but I wasn’t here everyday to see. But, I doubt they would recover and then get back to the same point all within 3 days

 

[curious2garden]

I fed them and then left for 3 days, I don’t believe that they recovered but I wasn’t here everyday to see. But, I doubt they would recover and then get back to the same point all within 3 days

Coco is fertigated at least once a day and usually more then that. It's not supposed to dry out or dry back. If you dry out coco or water it like soil you precipitate the nutrients which burn the roots.

 

[Northstar831]

Soil probably to moist/compacted like previously stated but I also ran into this problem about ten years ago, the way I fixed it was I immediately went to Home Depot bought buckets and a lid cut a hole for the net pot and washed all soil off the roots to go DWC and never looked back way easier to monitor in my opinion

 

[GrindMind]

After looking into it more, I think you guys are right—my coco perlite mix is probably too compacted and messing with drainage.

I gave one of the fabric pots a little massage before feeding tonight to see if that helps in the next few days. If anyone’s got other tips or tricks, I’m all ears.

I also trimmed some of the bigger fan leaves and lowered the light intensity to around 300 PPFD across the canopy (it was at 450 before).

One upside is that I’m transplanting to bigger fabric pots this week, so I can make sure the mix isn’t as compacted. But do you think the current pots being compacted will mess with the grow for the rest of the run?


They looked a little better than this earlier in the day, but not much. They only started getting more drippy closer to lights out.

 

[MickFoster]

You're treating it like soil........coco is a drain to waste hydroponic medium.
Those plants should be fed at least once a day to substantial run off.
Never use plain water and never, ever let the coco dry.
Contrary to one of the above posts......a coco/perlite mix cannot become compacted.

 

[GrindMind]

You're treating it like soil........coco is a drain to waste hydroponic medium.
Those plants should be fed at least once a day to substantial run off.
Never use plain water and never, ever let the coco dry.
Contrary to one of the above posts......a coco/perlite mix cannot become compacted.

I'd disagree that I'm treating it like soil. I have a drain to waste configuration setup and every time I feed, I feed until substantial runoff. I feed with nutrients every time I water and I don't water until the top of the medium isn't dark in color, which is at the moment every 2nd day almost.

But, are you suggesting that I'm not watering enough which is what's giving me the symptoms that I'm experiencing? And if not, then what are you suggesting and what are my options to remedy the situation?

 

[MickFoster]

I'd disagree that I'm treating it like soil. I have a drain to waste configuration setup and every time I feed, I feed until substantial runoff. I feed with nutrients every time I water and I don't water until the top of the medium isn't dark in color, which is at the moment every 2nd day almost.

But, are you suggesting that I'm not watering enough which is what's giving me the symptoms that I'm experiencing? And if not, then what are you suggesting and what are my options to remedy the situation?

You said in your OP that it was 3-4 days since you fed and that the coco was dry on top but still a bit moist........that's treating it like soil. In this post you claim you don't water until the top of the medium isn't dark in color........that's treating it like soil.
Coco should remain saturated at all times and fed daily. You're in 1 gallon pots.......you should be feeding at least twice a day, maybe more.
Not sure what you mean by "I have a drain to waste configuration set up"?

 

[GrindMind]

You said in your OP that it was 3-4 days since you fed and that the coco was dry on top but still a bit moist........that's treating it like soil. In this post you claim you don't water until the top of the medium isn't dark in color........that's treating it like soil.
Coco should remain saturated at all times and fed daily. You're in 1 gallon pots.......you should be feeding at least twice a day, maybe more.
Not sure what you mean by "I have a drain to waste configuration set up"?

Just to clarify, when I say drain-to-waste, I mean that all my runoff gets pulled out with the FloraFlex drainage system and tossed. I know some folks collect and reuse their runoff, so I just wanted to clear that up

About keeping the medium saturated and feeding twice a day, I’ve read a lot of conflicting stuff. Some say 1-2 times a day at the stage I’m in, but then others say to wait until the top starts to dry a bit and use the ‘knuckle rule.’

When I was feeding every day, I noticed droopy leaves, which made me start researching. Some things I found suggested I was overwatering, leading to too much moisture and not enough oxygen for the roots.

Now that I’ve been waiting a bit longer between waterings and still seeing droopy leaves, you’re saying I should water more often. You can see how this gets confusing, right?

I really just want to figure this out and I’m open to trying whatever’s recommended. At the end of the day, we all just want the same thing—healthy plants growing in the best conditions.

 

[MickFoster]

Just to clarify, when I say drain-to-waste, I mean that all my runoff gets pulled out with the FloraFlex drainage system and tossed. I know some folks collect and reuse their runoff, so I just wanted to clear that up

About keeping the medium saturated and feeding twice a day, I’ve read a lot of conflicting stuff. Some say 1-2 times a day at the stage I’m in, but then others say to wait until the top starts to dry a bit and use the ‘knuckle rule.’

When I was feeding every day, I noticed droopy leaves, which made me start researching. Some things I found suggested I was overwatering, leading to too much moisture and not enough oxygen for the roots.

Now that I’ve been waiting a bit longer between waterings and still seeing droopy leaves, you’re saying I should water more often. You can see how this gets confusing, right?

I really just want to figure this out and I’m open to trying whatever’s recommended. At the end of the day, we all just want the same thing—healthy plants growing in the best conditions.

I've been growing in coco for decades. The knuckle rule is for soil, not coco. You can't over water in coco with plants that size in a 1 gallon pot......and no Coco grower that I know reuses the run off. Coco still contains 30% oxygen when totally saturated, and with perlite, even more. Feeding to run off replenishes the nutes, pulls in fresh oxygen to the roots, and prevents salt build up.
Perhaps this will help........cocoforcannabis.com.
Good luck and welcome to RIU.

 

[GrindMind]

I've been growing in coco for decades. The knuckle rule is for soil, not coco. You can't over water in coco with plants that size in a 1 gallon pot......and no Coco grower that I know reuses the run off. Coco still contains 30% oxygen when totally saturated, and with perlite, even more. Feeding to run off replenishes the nutes, pulls in fresh oxygen to the roots, and prevents salt build up.
Perhaps this will help........cocoforcannabis.com.
Good luck and welcome to RIU.

Appreciate the info and the confidence boost. I’ll start feeding more often to keep the coco more saturated like you suggested. Also, thanks for the link—looks like I’ve got some reading to do. I’ll update this thread with how things go. Fingers crossed!

 

[GrindMind]

It’s only been about 24 hours, but with more frequent feedings, I can already see some improvement. Still a work in progress, but we’re getting there. Big thanks to everyone for the advice and sharing your knowledge!

 

[kmog33]

Root bound or too much/little water

 

[GrindMind]

Root bound or too much/little water

This is coco

 

[Zogs]

Now that I’ve been waiting a bit longer between waterings and still seeing droopy leaves, you’re saying I should water more often. You can see how this gets confusing, right?

I really just want to figure this out and I’m open to trying whatever’s recommended. At the end of the day, we all just want the same thing—healthy plants growing in the best conditions.

When you do your research make sure you are comparing apples to apples and it won't be so confusing. I'll double down on what @MickFoster said, coco likes it's water. You're going to find similar conflicting info when it comes to things like PH and fertigation frequencies ect. The coco link he posted will get you covered for that and more. It's pretty much the bible for coco growers. Coco isn't hard, in fact, I would ague it's easier than soil. You just have to know a few coco rules.

 

[GrindMind]

When you do your research make sure you are comparing apples to apples and it won't be so confusing. I'll double down on what @MickFoster said, coco likes it's water. You're going to find similar conflicting info when it comes to things like PH and fertigation frequencies ect. The coco link he posted will get you covered for that and more. It's pretty much the bible for coco growers. Coco isn't hard, in fact, I would ague it's easier than soil. You just have to know a few coco rules.

Coco definitely loves its water. I got my fertigation setup to feed three times daily now and I still sometimes feed by hand in between, my plants have never looked happier. @MickFoster was a blessing for me, I don’t know if it was what he said or how he said it that resonated with me, but he was at the right place at the right time for me. Thanks again Mick.

 

[GrindMind]

You're treating it like soil........coco is a drain to waste hydroponic medium.
Those plants should be fed at least once a day to substantial run off.
Never use plain water and never, ever let the coco dry.
Contrary to one of the above posts......a coco/perlite mix cannot become compacted.

I get it now and totally agree—I was definitely treating the coco like soil before. Appreciate the advice!

Quick update: it’s been 3 days since I started heavily fertigating daily, multiple times a day, and honestly, my plants have never looked healthier. Thanks for steering me in the right direction!