When to start watering to run off coco coir help

medidedicated

Well-Known Member
I use this one. Then I use this site to convert to ppfd. I select red blue white led and then convert. When the app says diffuser needed its just a piece of printer paper you put over the camera lenz.

Any printer paper will do.


People say take with a grain of salt its not quite a ppfd meter but its something.
 

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EH40veg

Active Member
I use this one. Then I use this site to convert to ppfd. I select red blue white led and then convert. When the app says diffuser needed its just a piece of printer paper you put over the camera lenz.

Any printer paper will do.


People say take with a grain of salt its not quite a ppfd meter but its something.
Cheers mate will try that with the paper then and see how it does, just fed them again and they seem happy now.

Been starting to see some roots poking out the bottom of the pot how long do you think it will be until they are root bound / I need to transplant them. Got 7.5L pots to size up to next
 

medidedicated

Well-Known Member
They can be right now or in a week would help bind up the coco so you can transplant easier. I dont transplant anymore but used to do solo cup for one week then transplant.
 

medidedicated

Well-Known Member
By the way that app says low battery its just a way to say it died and to pay to recharge it. Kinda cheesy but I just delete and re download to use it for free. It lasts like a few days.
 

EH40veg

Active Member
By the way that app says low battery its just a way to say it died and to pay to recharge it. Kinda cheesy but I just delete and re download to use it for free. It lasts like a few days.
Hey mate I put the bigger light on last night and this morning the plants are drooping you think it’s too much light for them?

Lights are just going to go off in 10 mins if that makes a difference.
 

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EH40veg

Active Member
Not sure if they’re just maybe needing fed as they’re getting bigger and starting to take the nutes faster, as they feel pretty light
 

medidedicated

Well-Known Member
You said you washed your coco? To get the peat out so it dont waterlog? Idk my plants never droop amd when its the light I get purple leaf stems and stems and the leafs start to show patterns.
 

EH40veg

Active Member
You said you washed your coco? To get the peat out so it dont waterlog? Idk my plants never droop amd when its the light I get purple leaf stems and stems and the leafs start to show patterns.
Nah I never washed it mate but it was a pre bought mix 70/30 think it was already washed been told most decent brands buffer it before. But yeh I’m not sure tbh I just noticed it this morning once I put this new light up.

Maybe they just need fed when lights come on as felt sort of light and they’re starting to get bigger, this pic I sent was just 5-10 mins before the lights went off.
 

medidedicated

Well-Known Member
Hmm. Yea thats weird idk because now I think about it mine never droop. Only freshly planted clones as they get used to the sudden change which only takes a day.
 

EH40veg

Active Member
Hmm. Yea thats weird idk because now I think about it mine never droop. Only freshly planted clones as they get used to the sudden change which only takes a day.
Aye mate I’ll see what they look like come lights on, I doubt it’s the light like you said there isn’t any marks on the leafs and it’s at the lowest setting it can go - 250w about 25-30 inches away from plant.

Probably feed them to run off and see how they do, could just be that as I’m still giving them about 200mls the same as when they were small and they’ve double or tripled in size by then, maybe they’re wanting a bit more water.
 

medidedicated

Well-Known Member
They should be fed to good runoff regardless of age, youre only replenishing the coco. I only notice they start to physically water differently as they fill in the pots and are few weeks into flower.

Even then its not that it needs more or less water each feed. More like they just need to be feed slower so they dont spill out the tops or in fabric pots, for the water to gush out the top instead of the very bottom.

The droop beats me thats more a soil and any method requiring dryback. My leaves are always perky. Unless I somehow for example unplug pumps forget to plug back in.

48 hrs later I know I messed up when theyre drooping and indeed that was the problem. The coco was bone dry. Almost killed a mother plant I have.
 

EH40veg

Active Member
They should be fed to good runoff regardless of age, youre only replenishing the coco. I only notice they start to physically water differently as they fill in the pots and are few weeks into flower.

Even then its not that it needs more or less water each feed. More like they just need to be feed slower so they dont spill out the tops or in fabric pots, for the water to gush out the top instead of the very bottom.

The droop beats me thats more a soil and any method requiring dryback. My leaves are always perky. Unless I somehow for example unplug pumps forget to plug back in.

48 hrs later I know I messed up when theyre drooping and indeed that was the problem. The coco was bone dry. Almost killed a mother plant I have.
Aye I know mate been feeding them to run off but the runoff has been decreasing slightly, that’s what had me thinking they could do with a little more, plus with the leafs drooping, I dk that’s my only thought really now if it’s not the light that’s they’re hungry / thirsty.

And yeah mate I’m feeding them slow the run off is coming out the bottom, not pouring over the top.
 

medidedicated

Well-Known Member
There can be quite the difference in dryback every 24 hrs as conditions vary daily. Some days might be lower RH than others, higher temps etc.

When you feed in flower more often it should be before it gets too dried out and if so it shouldnt matter. Just a good indicator that it was a good time to feed again.

Just dont let it get bone dry but dont feed too soon and too often.

Otherwords your frequency is good at that point. Youre not watering one extra time a day that wasnt necissary like I was.

Its good you noticed that though, it took time for me to realize that with hand feeding. That alone helps to determine how many times to feed a day. Its just overkill in veg state.

The plant is just chuggin along buildin nodes and roots at a slow but productive pace. It tends to go into overdrive in flower. Which some I guess still get away with only feeding twice a day.
 

EH40veg

Active Member
There can be quite the difference in dryback every 24 hrs as conditions vary daily. Some days might be lower RH than others, higher temps etc.

When you feed in flower more often it should be before it gets too dried out and if so it shouldnt matter. Just a good indicator that it was a good time to feed again.

Just dont let it get bone dry but dont feed too soon and too often.

Otherwords your frequency is good at that point. Youre not watering one extra time a day that wasnt necissary like I was.

Its good you noticed that though, it took time for me to realize that with hand feeding. That alone helps to determine how many times to feed a day. Its just overkill in veg state.

The plant is just chuggin along buildin nodes and roots at a slow but productive pace. It tends to go into overdrive in flower. Which some I guess still get away with only feeding twice a day.
Yeah true mate especially with change in lights could change the conditions, been trying to change the intake / outtake to suit temps / humidity.

Thanks mate, but I’m measuring the runoff in a 2L jug so it’s quite easy to see.
 

medidedicated

Well-Known Member
Nice yea I noticed with hand watering and then auto feeding when figuring out how often to water. That it takes longer to puddle if Im feeding the right time.

It tends to absorb it for half the feed then puddles up and starts running off. Thats when I stop when good runoff runs off.

With that logic I was overwatering 8x a day but now I do 6x and saving lots of water. I have yet to see how it feeds as it switches to flower.

I forget I only did 8x a day due to pots over filled with coco and being plastic it will just overspill out the top. I got rid of those and didnt need to do that anymore.
 

EH40veg

Active Member
Nice yea I noticed with hand watering and then auto feeding when figuring out how often to water. That it takes longer to puddle if Im feeding the right time.

It tends to absorb it for half the feed then puddles up and starts running off. Thats when I stop when good runoff runs off.

With that logic I was overwatering 8x a day but now I do 6x and saving lots of water. I have yet to see how it feeds as it switches to flower.

I forget I only did 8x a day due to pots over filled with coco and being plastic it will just overspill out the top. I got rid of those and didnt need to do that anymore.
Aye mate that’s sort of what I’m doing just watering til I start to get decent run off then watering again when they feel light normally a day.

I’ve just gave them a watering their gave them all 250ml each this time but got about 25-30% runoff is that bad or?
 

EH40veg

Active Member
Boring stuff:

Plants can be trained to take a pretty high EC. In order for the plant to get water from outside its roots (the coco) to inside its roots, there needs to a higher concentration of dissolved solids inside the water of the root cells than outside the roots because water molecules flow from lower dissolved solids to higher dissolved solids (osmosis) to reach equilibrium in dissolved solids on both sides.

How a plant manages this is it produces sugars to increase the dissolved solids inside the roots so that water can flow from the high EC water into the roots. If the EC outside the roots gets too high too quickly and it can't manufacture enough sugars quickly enough, then water will actually get sucked out of the roots because water travels from lower dissolved solids to higher dissolved solids, even if it's not in the direction we want.

Relevant stuff:

All of that is to say that if one gradually keeps increasing the EC, the plant will continue to manufacture more and more sugars to process the high EC feed.

This is why some people can feed as high as 3.0 EC and why some cannabis nute lines will show pretty high EC schedules in their charts - that, and because it sells more nutes :D.

However, when it's manufacturing more and more sugars to ensure it can get water from high EC feed, it's expending energy on doing that. It only has so much energy per day and we want as much of that energy as it can to be put toward growth. If the EC is kept at the EC that the plant has come to expect, then it can focus its energy toward growth.

The nice thing about checking your runoff EC is it will tell you. If you bump it up to 1.7 and the runoff starts coming out at 2.2, then you're getting into a danger zone. The plant will likely not exhibit any problems visually yet, so if one isn't monitoring runoff EC, they might be inclined to keep bumping it up rather than taking remedial action and then be surprised when the plant goes to shit.
Hey mate I just checked the runoff in a clean pot went in this time as 1.0 EC and when I checked it on the way out it was .7, should I up the feed a little bit to 1.2 or 1.3 EC?
 

medidedicated

Well-Known Member
With 72F and 65rh I doubt they need more than just once a day feed so Im sure its fine no matter what the runoff collect appears to be.

I havent thought about doing that I just kept feeding them until runoff. I could notice how much it dried back based on feeding, waiting a moment, feed again.

Then eventually it puddles up and have to wait longer but now theres some runoff and almost done. One or two more dumps of water and done.

The runoff should just be decent in the collection bin or however your doing things. Like now, my runoff bin is unusually low and not accumilating.

Im not doing anything more than making shre enough runoff is there. Will probably accumilate again when I have 5 more plants running off.

Im just in a transition mode 2/3rds my tents empty in flower room. Upgrading tents lights everything.

Anyway, so once a day should be fine and this early it shouldnt even be puddling, thats when the very top has enough roots to do so.

In short youre fine Id just keep doing what youre doing and not worry. Just make sure each plant has enough runoff to avoid salt build up.

What will help more than anything I described is measuring runoff ec from each plant. If your doing ok you should have almost equal input vs output.

Maybe .1-.3 points higher at most before adjusting something like how long they runoff for. A simple trick to avoid any elaborate practice is just feed the son of a guns to decent runoff.

Decent to us should mean substantial to a new grower so they dont skimp. Just try over doing it, just not too many times a day and you should be fine.

It wont harm it giving it substancial runoff but doing that 8x a day or more may like it badly bit me for doing that.

I switched my veg plants from 2x to 1x a day. Helps with root aphids and gnats which can screw you over all year long. Idk how commercial ops do it.

Edit to add you can add one more feed per day to help lower high ec runoff. But I didnt find that to fix a deficiency or low ec runoff.
 
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medidedicated

Well-Known Member
Hey mate I just checked the runoff in a clean pot went in this time as 1.0 EC and when I checked it on the way out it was .7, should I up the feed a little bit to 1.2 or 1.3 EC?
Hmm. Theyre pretty young to be that hungry and low root density. But yes that usually means so.

That member has a good guide they share for what they do exactly but its pretty much make sure runoff is good and up it by about that much and wait a couple weeks. Check again. Repeat.

I did that till I was as high as 1.8ec. My tap ec is .5.
 
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