Please help with the problem of self-rising pH in water

arakawa

arakawa

Member
As the title says I have a mazuma brand water purifier with the parameters and features below.
My machine parameters are at the end of the article
My water has a high alkaline pH 8.2 I use a solution to reduce the pH to 6.5 then overnight I measure my pH back to 8.2 as it was at the beginning.I tried opening the lid of the water tank and leaving it for 24 hours and then using a pH reducing solution but the pH still increased on its own.
i tried searching a lot on google and forums but no solution
We hope you help
5-step water filtration system with UV light disinfection system
- Filter tube made of HDPE plastic, durable and rust-proof
- UV tube made of stainless steel grade 304, does not rust and can withstand the heat of light Can UV
- Doesn't cause the water to have a burning smell
- Suitable for filtering water for consumption Can be used for families of 4-6 people
- Step 1 Carbon filter, filter sediment, turbidity, absorb color, odor, taste, chlorine, various organic substances. contaminated with water at a resolution of 10 microns
- Step 2, resin filter Removes limestone and reduces water hardness. Anti-scale
- Step 3 Ceramic Filter filter germs in water at a resolution of 0.3 microns
- flow rate 120 liters / hour (120 liters at water pressure 30 psi or 2 Bar)
 
MissinThe90’sStrains

MissinThe90’sStrains

Well-Known Member
rkymtnman said:
once you add nutrients, it will hold pH better than RO water alone
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This water is highly filtered, but according to the micron size of the advertised filter, it’s not RO. The holes are way too big. Here’s a quick bit about filtration and micron sizes: https://www.safewater.org/fact-sheets-1/2017/1/23/ultrafiltrationnanoandro.

OP, have you measured the amount of dissolved solids in your water before filtration and after ? You might still have pretty hard water, or water that’s had a lot of buffers added to keep it alkaline, that haven’t been filtered out. There’s a neat thread about this on the Organics forum, that talks about a similar issue - water ph going back up after being treated - due to calcium carbonate having been added to the water during treatment. In short, the thread talks about limiting any added calcium, and adding sulfur (in the way of langbeinite) to help counter it. I’d I manage to find the exact spot again I’ll link it, but I found it by accident last night, using the roll it up search feature for info about “langbeinite“.
 
arakawa

arakawa

Member
MissinThe90’sStrains said:
This water is highly filtered, but according to the micron size of the advertised filter, it’s not RO. The holes are way too big. Here’s a quick bit about filtration and micron sizes: https://www.safewater.org/fact-sheets-1/2017/1/23/ultrafiltrationnanoandro.

OP, have you measured the amount of dissolved solids in your water before filtration and after ? You might still have pretty hard water, or water that’s had a lot of buffers added to keep it alkaline, that haven’t been filtered out. There’s a neat thread about this on the Organics forum, that talks about a similar issue - water ph going back up after being treated - due to calcium carbonate having been added to the water during treatment. In short, the thread talks about limiting any added calcium, and adding sulfur (in the way of langbeinite) to help counter it. I’d I manage to find the exact spot again I’ll link it, but I found it by accident last night, using the roll it up search feature for info about “langbeinite“.
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Thank you very much for sharing this information. I have searched a lot on google with no solution. I tried to google about organic forums but there is no such domain name.Only organicbc.org do you mean this forum ? After going to the forums and searching the forums by keyword langbeinite ?
- I have not tested the dissolved solids in the water before and after taking the water sample from the purifier as you say.Does the solids in the water have much of an effect on the auto-rising pH?
Thank you have a nice day
 
Gemtree

Gemtree

Well-Known Member
I just had this problem today with trying tap water and veg bloom tap. Ph was at like 8 after nutes and took a ton of ph down. Gonna try 50/50 next or just ro and Jacks some more. Trying to waste less ro runoff. There’s a simple ro filter on Amazon for around 60 or 70 or you can get just the filter it’s 1/4 tube like the rest
 
MissinThe90’sStrains

MissinThe90’sStrains

Well-Known Member
arakawa said:
Thank you very much for sharing this information. I have searched a lot on google with no solution. I tried to google about organic forums but there is no such domain name.Only organicbc.org do you mean this forum ? After going to the forums and searching the forums by keyword langbeinite ?
- I have not tested the dissolved solids in the water before and after taking the water sample from the purifier as you say.Does the solids in the water have much of an effect on the auto-rising pH?
Thank you have a nice day
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Yes, I have a habit of searching old threads here for info, and was just using the basic search feature when I went down a rabbit hole of reading again. I was reading through a thread and it discussed your specific issue. They said it was because of the calcium carbonate added to the water in the treatment process, acting as a ph buffer. They’d treat the ph, and then the ph would rise again the next day after it had already been corrected. The test for dissolved solids isn’t going to tell you exactly what’s in your water, but if your water is really hard, itl give you an idea of what your issue might be.

Edit - here, read this thread and go from there - https://www.rollitup.org/t/calcium-carbonate-caco3.1066970/page-5#post-17303706. Roll it up has been going for well over a decade, and its a great resource for info.
 
P

pahpah-cee

Well-Known Member
I’m in the same boat. My water is liquid lime essentially. I did the langbeinite trick last run and it worked for me.

I have a few hundred gallons of soil that I built without dolomite lime. I want to throw it all in a large fabric pot and see how it goes with tap only but I’m also terrified. I don’t want to use a RO to water it’s so wasteful.
 
Hollatchaboy

Hollatchaboy

Well-Known Member
pahpah-cee said:
I’m in the same boat. My water is liquid lime essentially. I did the langbeinite trick last run and it worked for me.

I have a few hundred gallons of soil that I built without dolomite lime. I want to throw it all in a large fabric pot and see how it goes with tap only but I’m also terrified. I don’t want to use a RO to water it’s so wasteful.
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Wasteful how? The wastewater from the ro can be used for many things like the washing machine, toilets, watering grass, etc. You don't have to send it straight to drain.
 
P

pahpah-cee

Well-Known Member
Hollatchaboy said:
Wasteful how? The wastewater from the ro can be used for many things like the washing machine, toilets, watering grass, etc. You don't have to send it straight to drain.
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I’d wager 99% of all RO systems installed inside homes aren’t recycling the wasted water. Mine doesn’t. I’m also not going to create some extensive recovery system that redirects my water to my toilet. Every 6months you’re throwing away filters too. Water is a finite resource.
 
Hollatchaboy

Hollatchaboy

Well-Known Member
pahpah-cee said:
I’d wager 99% of all RO systems installed inside homes aren’t recycling the wasted water. Mine doesn’t. I’m also not going to create some extensive recovery system that redirects my water to my toilet. Every 6months you’re throwing away filters too. Water is a finite resource.
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I get it. It's more inconvenient, but ro is almost a necessity when growing hydro.

I haven't changed filters in just over a year. Still only have 10ppm.
 
Fish scale

Fish scale

Well-Known Member
The reason why the PH raises back to it's original value is because tap water has alkaline buffers which make the water rise back to it's original value over the course of a few hours.
 
zeem

zeem

Well-Known Member
Fish scale said:
The reason why the PH raises back to it's original value is because tap water has alkaline buffers which make the water rise back to it's original value over the course of a few hours.
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Do those alkaline buffers make it through a common Tall Boy with sediment and KDF filter?

I use municipal tap water that has historically been under 50 PPM. Probably pretty good but likely has chloromine.

Medium is soil.

Reservoir is showing constantly rising pH like described above.

Only additive is pH Down.

What is the best pH Down that is reasonably easy to obtain and use?

Thanks!
 
Hollatchaboy

Hollatchaboy

Well-Known Member
zeem said:
Do those alkaline buffers make it through a common Tall Boy with sediment and KDF filter?

I use municipal tap water that has historically been under 50 PPM. Probably pretty good but likely has chloromine.

Medium is soil.

Reservoir is showing constantly rising pH like described above.

Only additive is pH Down.

What is the best pH Down that is reasonably easy to obtain and use?

Thanks!
Click to expand...
If just using plain water, no need to ph it, in soil.
 
Reekwind

Reekwind

Member
I'm not a hydro grower but one of my friends had this problem way back in the day, and figured out he had to get the pH down to 4 to hit pH 6 after 24 hours
 
R

Roguedawg

Well-Known Member
Zeem there will be some point that you can decrease the pH to( like pH 5.6 often) that will stop the pH from rising as much. In soil I wouldnt worry about it, just watch for the pH rising in the media which is where the pH really matters. Using a fert with a portion of the nitrogen in the NH4 form would help keep the pH in the media from rising. Either add acid with the NO3 , or dont adjust tthe pH and use some NH4, either way or a combination will work.
 
zeem

zeem

Well-Known Member
Hi Hollatchaboy, Roguedawg,

Upon closer inspection it seem I was in too much of a hurry to avoid inadvertently hijacking a hydro thread. I had only "rising pH" on the brain.

I just notice that my reservoir water is constantly rising above where I thought that I had set it with the "P" of NPK.

Yes, I am in soil, amended with DTE organics & worm castings.

Thanks for the suggestions and questions.

My last chemical nutes is gonna be the AN pH down. I'm just going to stop putting it into the reservoir that waters the soil; and see if things improve.
 
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