First Closet Grow...NL with 600w HPS+ 4 CFL's

[mared juwan]

Yea, Ionic Boost is the shit. I use it starting week 5, so day 29. I do exactly what's on the label (3/4 tablespoon per gallon). To be honest I think it works a little better than AN Overdrive at almost 1/2 the price. Only reason I tried it is because I ran out of Overdrive and Ionic Boost was the only similar product at my hydro store. I finally got my replacement Overdrive but once I finish that bottle I'm going back to Boost. I've already gone back to the hydro store and bought a gallon of Ionic Boost because it was on sale

 

[Poon69]

Yea, Ionic Boost is the shit. I use it starting week 5, so day 29. I do exactly what's on the label (3/4 tablespoon per gallon). To be honest I think it works a little better than AN Overdrive at almost 1/2 the price. Only reason I tried it is because I ran out of Overdrive and Ionic Boost was the only similar product at my hydro store. I finally got my replacement Overdrive but once I finish that bottle I'm going back to Boost. I've already gone back to the hydro store and bought a gallon of Ionic Boost because it was on sale

I'll leave it another week then as this is the beginning of week 4 (well about day 24 i think) and i still have some bloom shit made up and ph'd in my watering can. Can I add the boost to the bloom?? i.e. give them both? or should i stop with the bloom now?

Took some pics earlier but completely forgot to size up that leaf for ya. I might whip a ruler against it later. It really is a beast tho lol. Have stripped a few of thge lower branches off too, but only a few for the minute. They seem to be dying away towards the bottom where they don't have any light, so I'll just pick em off as and when.

 

[Poon69]

Took em out the closet earlier and finally figured how to work my camera properly!!! Granted,.. it wasn't fuckin rocket science... I just had to take em out of the direct light and adjust the setting,.. but hey i'm there now lol. SO here we are, the latest pics of the bud in all it's glory! I JUST WISH IT WOULD GROW QUICKER

Pics from above each plant (incl. trainers!! lol)


Pics from side of 3 plants (forgot the other 2!)


Top colas


Other pics

 

[Poon69]

I kinda neglected the sensi skunk a little this week, and paid the price. I think I got a bit excited with all the bud forming on the NL that I completely forgot the Sensi skunk existed!! Well, they really badly needed water and the upshot is that several of the lower leaves died. They've barely grown an inch in the last week too. I got to it on Saturday and gave them their much-needed water and they picked up almost instantly. Within 2 hours all the leaves were pointing skyward again PHEW! So I transplanted them yesterday after removing a lot of the dead leaves and reshuffled the veg cupboard a bit to accomadate. I should be able to easily adjust the lights up n down now as and when they need it. Good thing is, by this morning I can see that the new leaves coming from the top have definitely grown. But as I said, they've lost ALOT of the lower leaves so they actually look smaller!! Coming next,.. I'm gonna use wrapping paper (the white back side obviously lol) to line the inside of the veg cupboard to reflect more light.



I'll keep this updated regularly over the next few days to keep ya informed of their progress.

 

[mared juwan]

Looking killer, man. What do you mean by the lower branches dying? What do they look like exactly?

Look at my Mared original masterpiece below LOL

When I do my trimming I leave all branches with budsites that have reached the top 1/3 of the plant. If the end of the branch has made it to the top but the lower portion is at the bottom I trim off everything below one third and leave the rest. Just want to make sure you don't trim anything with potential for a fat bud.

 

[Poon69]

Looking killer, man. What do you mean by the lower branches dying? What do they look like exactly?

Look at my Mared original masterpiece below LOL

When I do my trimming I leave all branches with budsites that have reached the top 1/3 of the plant. If the end of the branch has made it to the top but the lower portion is at the bottom I trim off everything below one third and leave the rest. Just want to make sure you don't trim anything with potential for a fat bud.

That's quality mate that is exactly what I meant when I asked about stripping the branches. I'll get onto that.

The ones I said were dying, are basically some of the very first sets of leaves the plant made. They are just yellowing all over and don't bother to pick themselves up towards the light now. You can see that they get very little light at the bottom so I'm presuming it's that. It's only at the very bottom, and only really the much older leaves. Sound good to you??

 

[mared juwan]

OK yea sure if the lower-most leaves are dying nothing to worry about. Just want to make sure it's not the pistils at the budsites dying because that is serious problem.

 

[Poon69]

na no pistols it's def just leaves. To be honest, I think it's the leaves which were affected when I had deficiencies 3 or 4 weeks ago. I worked oout the deficiency from the red stems and it seems to be those leaves which are giving up the ghost now. The ones still with a red streak down the leaf stalk. +reps to you too mate for that diagram. Good to know people who have the time to help others.

 

[Twisted Nibbz]

I've been readin that if I chop some of the excess branching all around the bottom It'll promote more growth n food n shit to the upper buds. What's anyones opinion on this?? My plants are really bushy and there's definitely not enough light gettin right to the bottom. But there's shoots from the bottom which def have bud growing (albeit at a slower rate). If I prune these small slow-forming buds, will the tops ones grow more quickly and ultimately be bigger? I don't wanna lose any bud!!! lol. Should I do some pruning around the bottom of all the plants or should I just leave em be and not fuck around with 'em? That's been my theory so far,.. and to be honest it's worked pretty well. There's pics on the above posts to see how bushy they are.

PHUCK YEA, BRO!! My bad, haven't checked in for a while. Your shit is looking Primo. That leaf on the left in the last pic looks the size of a basketball!! Can you put something recognizable close to it so I can see just how big that shit is? I didn't catch your nute lineup. Now would be the time to start adding a bloom booster. Something with low or zero N and very high P-K. The best ones I've used are AN overdrive which is 1-5-4 and Ionic Boost 0-5-6. I also hear AN Hammerhead 0-9-18 does incredible stuff. You want to reduce the dosage of your base nute to cut N and boost P and K through the roof for super fat buds.

And I think you know my answer to the pruning question. My plants are even more spaced apart than yours and I still chop the bottom 1/3 off. Those bottom buds will grow long pistils for sure but they will never have the green bud material swell up around them. I'm telling you from experience, getting rid of those bottom buds will make the tops ones fatter. My bottom branches on my present plants are like the top colas from my first plants.

Thanks Mared! I'm crossing my fingers for a harvest like yours! I'm pleased that mine are looking pretty similar to yours at the same stage. and yeah that leaf is a monster! I'll get a pic of it by a football so u can compare

I'm using the Ionic range of nutes. Used the 'Grow' formula from about 2 weeks, then moved to 'Bloom' about 3 weeks ago. I have the 'Boost' also, but thought it was for the last 2 or 3 weeks. Should I be using it now then Mared?

And cheers for the definitive answer on pruning. I'm still a tad scared to do it, especially with this being my first grow, but think I'm gonna have to. Thing is, on a couple of plants (especially the best one - nearest right on pics and REALLY green) from the very first node there is shoots going right to the top of the plant with decent buds on them. I don't wanna be chopping those,.. but should i strip them a bit and get rid of the poor bud sites coming off the main shoot??

na no pistols it's def just leaves. To be honest, I think it's the leaves which were affected when I had deficiencies 3 or 4 weeks ago. I worked oout the deficiency from the red stems and it seems to be those leaves which are giving up the ghost now. The ones still with a red streak down the leaf stalk. +reps to you too mate for that diagram. Good to know people who have the time to help others.

Hows do's? Mared fella why on gods green earth would ya trim em all up???? whats the point of cutting off valuable budsites when you can supply them with light and get more bud? not sayin your wrong or out my mate but just never seen the point in it.

If i were you Matt ide get some of the little tiny metal screw in hooks and screw a load in ya walls and tie up your main cola's to the left or right or whatever direction you need to allow more light to the sites below! Yeah by all means cut off some of the leaves and what not but dont waste budsites!Bend your existing cola's out the way to make more! i aint a pro but i know thats what ill be doin!

Oh yeah ive just seen your sensi.... I thought mine were growin a little slow but now ive seen yours im propper shocked! The bagseed ive got is about the same stage as your sensi my NL is goin fuckin doolally. lol im just puttin some pics and news up tonight ave a scan mate see what ya fink!

Rave Safe
Nibbzy

 

[Twisted Nibbz]

oh ahhh great stuff to hear about the ionic stuff looks like im gonna be goin to my local hydro store as them useless cunts on ebay never reply to your messages lolllllllll sorry to any women readin that may have been affended by that word b ut there is not other word to describe em! lol

 

[Poon69]

Hows do's? Mared fella why on gods green earth would ya trim em all up???? whats the point of cutting off valuable budsites when you can supply them with light and get more bud? not sayin your wrong or out my mate but just never seen the point in it.

If i were you Matt ide get some of the little tiny metal screw in hooks and screw a load in ya walls and tie up your main cola's to the left or right or whatever direction you need to allow more light to the sites below! Yeah by all means cut off some of the leaves and what not but dont waste budsites!Bend your existing cola's out the way to make more! i aint a pro but i know thats what ill be doin!

Oh yeah ive just seen your sensi.... I thought mine were growin a little slow but now ive seen yours im propper shocked! The bagseed ive got is about the same stage as your sensi my NL is goin fuckin doolally. lol im just puttin some pics and news up tonight ave a scan mate see what ya fink!

I'm gonna have to give em a lil trim I think nibbz. There's just NO room in my closet anymore. If i tie the colas to the left or right, they will then be blocking several other sites which are currently doing really well. If you look at the pics from above in my previous posts, u can see that there's ALOT of exposed bud sites around the top of the plant. The ones I'm gonna trim are the tiny ones near the bottom. You can see they are trying their lil asses off to flower, but they just ain't gettin nowhere. Barely sprouting any hairs, just very minute buds. And seeing as slowly (but surely) the lower leaves are dying off due to lack of light, I'd rather the plants focus their energies on all the bud sites which are exposed at the tops. Don;t get me wrong, I'm not gonna take off much at all. But definitely a lil. There's a lot of junk at the bottom which has NO bud at all.

And yeah the sensi really went down hill. My own fault, I neglected 'em. I took off a good two nodes of leaves at the bottoms which had died and just buried em deeeper when I transplanted and they are picking up right as rain now. They just need a little more time. But seeing as my hps is tied up in the flower closet for at least another 6-7 weeks, I'm gonna be vegging the sensi for that long so any slow in growth isn't necessarily a bad thing.

I'll check your pics now mate.

 

[mared juwan]

Yea, just to be clear. I'm am suggesting to cut off all budsites without access to light and potential for big growth. It's hard to decide which these budsites are on your first grow so I'm trying to help out with that decision. I promise you that the loss of these underperforming budsites will be more than made up for by the gain you will see in the top budsites. The plant must direct energy to EVERY budsite yet they all do not have the same potential for growth. By removing the weaklings we can make sure the energy is used where it will count the most.

Maybe my extent of trimming is a bit aggressive for the first timer but over a year of growing I have gotten more and more extreme with my lollipopping and the results are better every time. Another thing no one tells you is that a fatter bud has more flavor and aroma than a smaller bud so two 5-gram colas are not the same as one 10-gram cola. The bigger cola will be more flavorful and potent. So with my method you are creating a better quality finished product as well.

 

[Twisted Nibbz]

The bigger cola will be more flavorful and potent. So with my method you are creating a better quality finished product as well.


See that i would have to disagree with flavourfull and smelly yes potent im not so sure! I find the bigger the bud the less potent but i suppose its down to strain and grow enviroment infact 90% of the flavour, smell and potency is down to the way we grow it and there is probably about 10% that is actually controlled by the plant and the soil etc etc. Im not discounting anything you say my friend because i take on board EVERYTHING that people tell me and usually try most aswell. You hae given some crakcin info infact. keep up the good work!

Matt my pc is fuckin really startin to blag my head! lol you should see NL1 now mate its at least a foot tall a right lil corker but the fuckin stupid shitty bastardin crappy mongy arsehole pc wont let me upload out.... time for a new one in january sales i think lol!

ill drop ya a message when i get it too work!

 

[mared juwan]

The bigger cola will be more flavorful and potent. So with my method you are creating a better quality finished product as well.


See that i would have to disagree with flavourfull and smelly yes potent im not so sure! I find the bigger the bud the less potent but i suppose its down to strain and grow enviroment infact 90% of the flavour, smell and potency is down to the way we grow it and there is probably about 10% that is actually controlled by the plant and the soil etc etc. Im not discounting anything you say my friend because i take on board EVERYTHING that people tell me and usually try most aswell. You hae given some crakcin info infact. keep up the good work!

You know this is the topic that probably gets me into the most controversy on this site. It's hard to debate about what buds "might have been" had you done something differently. I just know that the few times I have left the bottom budsites, I ended up looking at scraggly, leafy buds that were a pain in the ass to trim and never really matured totally. When I remove the budsites that I predict will turn out this way, the remaining ones blow up in size. This is especially true when the plants are packed closely together, such as in Poon's case. So I don't want to try to persuade or advocate one method over another, just share my experience and the reader can make up their own mind. Maybe Poon should try trimming half the plants and leave the others completely natural. I would be very interested to see the result.

Twisted, it's nice to find someone who will disagree in a thoughtful and respectful way and I appreciate your opinion. I certainly hope I don't sound like I think I know everything, it's just that on this topic the evidence I've seen has been very clear to me and not only with my own plants. That being said, there are strains that respond a lot better than others to this technique but I'm of the opinion that there are very few that would actually be affected negatively - mostly autoflowers. Peace, Love, Respect.

 

[Poon69]

Maybe Poon should try trimming half the plants and leave the others completely natural. I would be very interested to see the result.

well,.. Only one way to find out eh. All in favour of trimming a couple and leaving a couple?? I love experiments! And this one seems pretty worthwhile. I'll be back with updates as soon as I found a bit of time to trim em up.

 

[Twisted Nibbz]

yeah man damn right Matt get it on lets see the differenc!

Mared your welcome mate its nice too have people that can help out in all different ways everone works differently and the only way to get pukka bud is to learn from everyone! Good stuff my man and keep the suggestions cumin!! Matt get on it son!!!!! hahaha

 

[Poon69]

Been fuckin ill the last few days so not been on here much. But I bring bad news. I asked the missus to water the plants on Wednesday whilst I was at work, which she did for me. I'd already made up the feed so it wasn't too much to ask. But disaster struck!

Two of the plants (maybe 3) have caught the light whilst she took them out and burnt pretty badly! The top colas!! 1 of them was the best performer too! The original short n stubby! I've been keepin an eye on them for the last few days and whilst one seems to be recovering on the other side of the cola, short n stubby seems to have just stoppped growing at the top.

Don't get me wrong, all the other sites on all the plants are doing really welland growing like fuck, and there is still growth around the burnt top colas where they didn't touch the light, but obviously it was the absolute tops that caught so they haven't gotten much taller.

Pants eh. Oh well, these things happen and I can't be too hard on her and fingers crossed the whole top colas regain growth again soon. Hopefully it is just a setback rather than a complete top cola killer!

On the brightside, the sensi skunk has resumed normal speed!! Shot up big time in the last couple days and I gave them their first feed today. Started with about 1/3 strength although I'm fairly sure they could handle about half strength so I'll boost it up in about a week. I think I'll ultimately have to start flowering them with the CFL's. The NL isn't gonna be done for weeks and the sensi have gained about 2 inches in height since tuesday (5 days). If i veg them for another 4-6 weeks they're gonna be monsters and never fit in the flowering closet.

1 question tho, if I start to flower them (12/12) under the 4 26watt CFL's (2700k) for say 3-4 weeks, then move them under the 600w when it's free and continue 12/12, will the plants mind that?? I mean, if I'm trying to trick them into thinking it's autumn so they flower, and then I suddenly move them from 104w CFL light to a hps that's 6 x brighter (albeit still on 12/12), will the plants react and start to veg again? or at least slow the flowering down? Or will they love it being 6 x brighter??

Anyway, pics tomorrow. Will have a bit more time on my hands.

 

[mared juwan]

Damn, sucks about the light burn. I've had plants damaged before and it's enough to drive you crazy but my plants usually recover beyond my expectations so don't sweat it.

For the CFLs in 1st half of flower I would worry about them stretching excessively. My bet is they would stretch way taller than under the HPS. Plus you would be having to move the CFLs up like twice a day. Maybe you should top them.

 

[Poon69]

Damn, sucks about the light burn. I've had plants damaged before and it's enough to drive you crazy but my plants usually recover beyond my expectations so don't sweat it.

For the CFLs in 1st half of flower I would worry about them stretching excessively. My bet is they would stretch way taller than under the HPS. Plus you would be having to move the CFLs up like twice a day. Maybe you should top them.

Well they don't seem to be stretching at all at the minute. I keep the bulbs about an inch away n they seem alright. Would they stretch more when in flower then?? I guess so seeing as their growth rate picks up.

I was thinking about toppin them tho. What exactly does that achieve mared? And how much do I take off?? You know me,.. I like to get all the info lol. I'm worried I'll kill em without knowing exactly where to chop. Can I root the top after that?? I've got some Clonex rooting gel.

I've taken quite a bit off the bottoms of a couple of the NL plants too. Not loads, but a reasonable amount. Bit worried about doin too much to em now I've damaged the tops. Cheers tho mate

 

[mared juwan]

Hell yea, you must have noticed with your first plants how they stretch like crazy in first three weeks of flower and then stop. It's a response to the longer dark time. Most of the stretch occurs during lights off but if you have a significantly weaker light source during "daytime" than it will be amplified. I haven't flowered under CFLs ever but the more crowded my flower room is the more the plants stretch so I know that's a function of them having less light per plant.

As far as where to top, your guess is as good as mine. I've only had one topped plant before and that was because my dog ate the top. No bullshit. What happens is the two growth sites at the node below where you top become the top colas. Many people will say two medium top colas will yield more than a single but I like massive single colas anyway so no topping for me. But I don't have height issues like you will in three weeks if you keep vegging with no top.