i’ll not buy another led until..

i’d be willing to pay 10-20% extra to cover the build and shipping costs of bigger heatsinks

  • yes

    Votes: 14 46.7%
  • no

    Votes: 16 53.3%

  • Total voters
    30

Hollatchaboy

Well-Known Member
no it doesnt so i have to drive it at 100% at which point i have 2 options either actively cooling it or shortening the diode lifespan considerably. thats my problem with it.
When you drive your vehicle.... do you drive it floored at all times? When you listen to your stereo.... do you have it cranked at all times? Many things are made for a max level, and a nominal level. Especially electronics.

Get a higher wattage light, and run it dimmed in your 4x4. Problem solved.
 

Lenin1917

Well-Known Member
Not everyone has the startup capital for high end lights, these budget lights are great if you’re trying to idk say start a small semi commercial op on nothing but a va disability check. One good harvest and they pay for their own expansion/upgrade. Maybe a few years down the line I’ll be able s to swing the fancy chilled tech 600s with 8200 diodes but until then these budget lights get it done and if one burns out in a year and I’ve got to drop another $300 to replace it I’m not gonna trip.
 

Kassiopeija

Well-Known Member
yes, many strange designs out there.
some are simply like that cause the prototype pcb oven wasnt any bigger or else.

one thing is what sells and one is what makes sense technically.
this not always goes hand in hand.

lets take a analogy to pc overclocking.
you can gain a 10 to 20% more speed by using lets ay 25 to 50% more power by rasing the core voltage.
does it make sense in real life? no for 99% it dont, they would be better of with a undervolted cpu running stock speed or slightly lower and using 25 to 50% less power then usual for almost the same performance.
for the first scenario you need lots efforts in your cooling system, may even water cooling or fancier.
for second, you are fine with the stock cooler which would run barely audible with a undervolted cpu.
so, no i wont spend money on the fancy cooling solution.

were speaking of mid power diodes here.
not COBs anymore.
theyre not really have much heat to transfer per given square mm compared to COBs or fast CPUs cores, thats a whole other league and really demands highly conductuve material in later cases.
mid power leds are... harmless especially when driven under specs, there isnt simply much to transfer.
its not really a lot watts per mm2 it is in real to coduct.
its in fact so low that a lot materials are good enough for this job.
And higher electrical conversion efficiency in diodes may account for less heat in the future, too. my 660nm run considerably cooler than the UVs.

But leaves need some warmth too the cellar tent grows are already too cold for LED
and the internetz say IR diodes are very inefficient
I can't even find 1500-2500nm diodes that would be the right wavelength to heat up water or sugars... just nightvision IR diodes 850-1050nm but that mostly just shines through
there needs to be a light that monitors leaf surface temps and adjusts it via IR so that the PAR light is used most efficiently

when we talk about extra bucks for a high quality light ;)
 

PadawanWarrior

Well-Known Member
When you drive your vehicle.... do you drive it floored at all times? When you listen to your stereo.... do you have it cranked at all times? Many things are made for a max level, and a nominal level. Especially electronics.

Get a higher wattage light, and run it dimmed in your 4x4. Problem solved.
Yes I floor it a lot. And my stereo is cranked to 11 most of the time. I turn it down at stoplights though so I'm not one of those guys though. It doesn't hurt speakers unless you're getting distortion. My stereo actually takes more power than my lights. It's like 1000 watts.
 

MICHI-CAN

Well-Known Member
Buy 2 times the light required and run at 45% max for a long time. And I hope you reduce loads to zero before electrifying. Volume to zero thing. Very hard on most electronics.
 

crimsonecho

Well-Known Member
When you drive your vehicle.... do you drive it floored at all times? When you listen to your stereo.... do you have it cranked at all times? Many things are made for a max level, and a nominal level. Especially electronics.

Get a higher wattage light, and run it dimmed in your 4x4. Problem solved.
when i buy a vehicle i expect to run it floored whenever i want without any problems and otherwise i wouldnt buy that car. if i was feeding off the music i’d probably crank the stereo up too :)

max level should still mean safe for the fixture and its components. you’d be really pissed if your car blew up when you floored it because that level of gas is not nominal.

why when i say these lights should be built better you guys say other stuff is not properly built either.
 

crimsonecho

Well-Known Member
Not everyone has the startup capital for high end lights, these budget lights are great if you’re trying to idk say start a small semi commercial op on nothing but a va disability check. One good harvest and they pay for their own expansion/upgrade. Maybe a few years down the line I’ll be able s to swing the fancy chilled tech 600s with 8200 diodes but until then these budget lights get it done and if one burns out in a year and I’ve got to drop another $300 to replace it I’m not gonna trip.
yeah but the difference in price for a quality build on the low end would definitely be less than that 300 you’re gonna drop on that second light. its just a matter of buying the cheap shit vs treating them like blurples. people stopped using them and they stopped manufacturing them.
 

Frank Nitty

Well-Known Member
who said 200 bucks for pc fans? wtf are you talking about :)

first of all do you think all heatsinks are equal? secondly you may not want to have fans on top of your lights where the fins are located which is just gonna push hot air onto your canopy and who the fuck said the heat dissappears? you’re just talking nonsense to cover for your strange “yes it does run cool when i actively cool it” statement.

who the fuck argued about that? did you once read in this thread where i said no you cant actively cool it yourself with fans and shit? you dont wanna pay 200 or whatever for doubling the lifespan for your fixture, fine. enjoy your cool to the touch boards :)

meanwhile i think thermal management should be a priority for any light manufacturer and i guess we gotta have to agree to disagree on that one lol
Woof woof!!! Down boy,down!!!
 

Hollatchaboy

Well-Known Member
Yes I floor it a lot. And my stereo is cranked to 11 most of the time. I turn it down at stoplights though so I'm not one of those guys though. It doesn't hurt speakers unless you're getting distortion. My stereo actually takes more power than my lights. It's like 1000 watts.
Right, I understand that, but your amp is made for a max level, and a nominal level. Past nominal is when total harmonic distortion starts to come into play.
 

PadawanWarrior

Well-Known Member
I have some junk JBL and Onkyo about 2000 watts. What is quality now? LOL.
You're talking about Max watts. I go by the true RMS wattage. I have a JL W7 and a JL 500/1 for my sub. An alpine 350 watt for my rear Infinity speakers. And a 100 watt Kenwood for the front Infinity's. And my deck is an older Alpine that only has pre-amp outputs (no internal power). I can control each set individually.

I like it loud, but also super clean. I'm kinda an audiophile.
 

MICHI-CAN

Well-Known Member
You're talking about Max watts. I go by the true RMS wattage. I have a JL W7 and a JL 500/1 for my sub. An alpine 350 watt for my rear Infinity speakers. And a 100 watt Kenwood for the front Infinity's. And my deck is an older Alpine that only has pre-amp outputs (no internal power). I can control each set individually.

I like it loud, but also super clean. I'm kinda an audiophile.
Just clean a street over is all.
 

cobshopgrow

Well-Known Member
yeah for example what is fine? i know they work fine. again the output of these light will diminish to about 80% after 4 years. even then they would work fine but why not design better units to begin with.

spread out the diodes sure, drive them softer yes, some doesnt agree fine but bigger heatsinks or atleast better heatsinks with more fins maybe fins extending from the sides as well between the bars etc etc. if you have to hang fans to blow on your fixtures to keep it cool how is that different than using pc fans?

what i’m asking is why cant i run them at 100% in a tent with just my exhaust fan running. isnt anyone else bothered by this?



i dont think pc overclocking applies 100% to this situation because a typical pc user as you suggested will not notice the difference but they would notice 4 years. mars says for example lifespan of 50000hrs lets say thats q80. thats still about 6 years at 24hrs on. so saves you 2 years at 24hrs on. this is noticable. this is 50% lifespan increase. if you densely pack these diodes i dont think you’ll see drastic differences between mid wattage cobs as 1830s i’ve been using and those were getting seriously hot without pc fans.



thats the deal, since the low end manufacturers dont produce this shit you’re at the mercy of the high end tier and those lights are more expensive because people say shit like mars hydro fc 6500 runs cool to the touch and works well instead of saying it runs hot as a mf and i’d steer away from anything that runs this hot because the typical lifespan quoted for diodes will not apply to these fixtures etc etc.
youre basing your estimations on what migro guessed in a youtbue video.
nothing wrong with that, it gives the direction and tells us some but its no absolute number.
most people here struggle to give 100% on their given area, so their fixtures will last way longer.
also consider that most of the people here would have replaced their fixture within 4y.
4y is a long time for diodes.
with corona and the ukraine war, update rates on diodes became slower, still 4y is a long time for a LED.
and youre still at 80% output.
am using my EB3 bridgelux now since 3y quite constant and measure with a spectrometer.
do underive them heavily, havent noticed any loss in output.
bigest losses will be due to dirt or nicotine stuck to them.
they hardly have seem temps above 30c as bare pcbs without heatsinks,i expect them to last years more but would buy EB4 or 5s if theyre out finally.
simply for power saving reasons which are important atm.

even if you place mid power diodes almost next to each other (which is stupid) youre not going to gain the density of a COB.

when comparing COBs and mid power leds see the typical power used per area.
huuuge difference there, never forget that, do the math.
 

crimsonecho

Well-Known Member
Old School
treated me fine just didnt fit well in my new setup of 4 20 gallon plastic pots and multi strain grows. plus it was getting old at this point. 4 years old. but seeing the plug and play stuff out there i definitely think hey maybe i should have renew the diodes changed out the fans and let it rip!
i havent thrown it away or anything i may return back to using it after this next grow with the new fixtures.
 
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